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GaDolphin · Mar 10, 2009, 05:26 PM

I have a Payne unit that was installed about 4 and a half to 5 years ago. It/s a Model # PH10JA048-B, with a 1/4 hp GE motor (#5KCP39FGS0715).

The outside motor that operates the a/c unit is not running. I'm not sure if the unit is still under warranty, and don't want an excessive service bill. I am getting power to the unit; I can here the relays click, etc. when the breaker is turned on, but the motor in the top of the unit is not running. Any ideas?

hvac1000 · Mar 10, 2009, 09:45 PM

Try turning the fan blade with a stick while it is supposed to be running. If it runs consider replacing the run capacitor for the motor. If not check to be sure that 220/240 volts is getting to the motor when it is supposed to be running.

GaDolphin · Mar 11, 2009, 07:00 PM

Thanks. I didn't have a multi-meter here yesterday. I checked the voltage, and wasn't getting sufficient power to the motor. Went back to the breaker, and $10 and a trip to Home Depot later, I have cool air again. Thanks for the help!

dhaniyal · Apr 30, 2009, 11:36 PM

Hi,
I have the same problem.
I also found my out side fan was not running after our home started warming up today.
I used a stick to turn it couple of times and it started working normally for one cycle.
When the unit came on again I checked the fan and it was not running even after several tries it dindn't work.
Condenser unit became very hot so I turned the a/c off.
I lifted top grill and touched the motor it was very hot (Is it normal?)

I waited few hours and turned the unit on again it didn't came on immediately but after 20 minutes it came on I went out to check the condenser fan and it was not springing I used stick and it worked again ( at least for now)
Is my outside motor bad or it's the capacitor?
I see two capacitors there but which one is for the motor?
Which breaker you guys are talking about is it in the home circuit breaker panel or a/c units have some other breakers too?
Any help will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Dhaniyal

hvac1000 · May 1, 2009, 03:40 AM

Originally Posted by dhaniyal

Hi,
I have the same problem.
I also found my out side fan was not running after our home started warming up today.
I used a stick to turn it couple of times and it started working normally for one cycle.
When the unit came on again I checked the fan and it was not running even after several tries it dindn't work.
Condenser unit became very hot so I turned the a/c off.
I lifted top grill and touched the motor it was very hot (Is it normal?)

I waited few hours and turned the unit on again it didn't came on immediately but after 20 mins it came on I went out to check the condenser fan and it was not springing I used stick and it worked again ( at least for now)
Is my outside motor bad or it’s the capacitor?
I see two capacitors there but which one is for the motor?
Which breaker you guys are talking about is it in the home circuit breaker panel or a/c units have some other breakers too?
Any help will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Dhaniyal

It could be the capacitor OR the motor. I usually test the capacitor with a digital capacitor tester or replace on a temporary basis it if I have a known good one of the same size handy for testing purposes. Other means of testing will not give a real true test result as we found out years ago.

Usually the condenser fan motor will be a 5,7.5, or 10 MFD and if it is separate from the compressor capacitor will be smaller in height and width.

If the outside unit is a older one it might be better to just replace the motor with the Same size,voltage,horse power, and rotation. Also be sure to replace the motor run capacitor with a new one of the exact size needed for the new motor. In other words under no circumstances use the old capacitor with the new motor since it is possible the old capacitor is weak.

dhaniyal · May 1, 2009, 11:30 AM

Thanks for your reply.
The unit is York and it's about 4 1/2 years old.
Motor part # is 024-27596-000 (model# K55HXKWA-9803)
Big capacitor is 5/60 uf (024-25033-000
Small one, I can't find any power values but its 235-0421-04 (88-108 MFD 330 VAC).
Motor is getting real hot and probably it's shutting the system off.
It is probably still covered under warranty but their tech will come on Monday and then another day or two for the motor if they don't have it in stock.
I looked at it. It look fairly simple to change but I leave it for the pros, its getting hot here in Houston and with young kids at home I do not want to take any chances and end up in a hotel to beat the heat.
I have another tech coming at 5 (may be).
I gave him the part # for the motor and hope he will show up with the part.

hvac1000 I have one question for you.
Can a bad capacitor cause a motor to overheat or you think motor is bad?
Thanks

hvac1000 · May 1, 2009, 11:57 AM

Small one, I can't find any power values but its 235-0421-04 (88-108 MFD 330 VAC).

This is a start capacitor for the compressor.

Big capacitor is 5/60 uf (024-25033-000

This is a dual run capacitor. Does the fan motor AND the compressor and is expensive.

Can a bad capacitor cause a motor to overheat or you think motor is bad?

It could be both the motor and capacitor are bad. You will find out when the service person arrives.

dhaniyal · May 1, 2009, 12:54 PM

Thanks for your answer and reply.
You are great help I see your support and tech advise all over this forum.
God bless you.
I will post whatever Tech finds out and how he fixes the problem.
Take care.
Dhaniyal

hvac1000 · May 1, 2009, 01:17 PM

A smart person would have there warranty information available and read it before the service person comes. This way you will know exactly what to expect it to cover and be able to produce it to the service person upon request.

dhaniyal · May 3, 2009, 11:19 PM

You are right about warranty.
I called another tech since the company who installed the system originally could not send a tech before Monday afternoon and my home was getting very hot.
I gave the other tech motor part # etc so he can bring the motor with him.
He showed up around 6 pm on Friday, first thing he did is check the capacitor and found run Capacitor (5/60) was bad.
Just like you said initially if the motor starts spinning with a stick then it’s the capacitor (excellent).
He replaced the capacitor load tested motor, compressor and checked Freon pressure by hooking gauges and found no other problems.
He had a new motor with him and I asked him that I'm not comfortable with old motor but he said the motor is okay, it got overheated but still serviceable.
He said he can return the motor but not going to replace if I don't need one (very honest guy).He charged me very nominal fee and I tried to give him some extra tip but he refused (I know just the capacitor he replaced cost between $35 to $45)

HVAC100! You recommended in another thread that I should get my blower motor load tested with full load to make sure its drawing correct amps otherwise it will also die a slow death.(since I had my 3 years old 1hp 3 speed blower motor failed once).
I asked this tech to load check upper unit also which he did.
Current draw at high speed was 9 amps and the motor is rated for 12.2 he said its seems okay but since he do not have current draw chart or info for that particular motor He can't say it with 100% assurity. (I’ll try to post this in actual thread also)

My question to you Haav1000!
Is 9 to 9.1 amps okay for 1hp 12.2 amps rated motor or its too low?

hvac1000 · May 4, 2009, 02:48 AM

My question to you Haav1000!
Is 9 to 9.1 amps okay for 1hp 12.2 amps rated motor or its too low?

9,10,11,12, amps is good since the motor is rated for any load below 12.2 BUT it is always nice to have a motor draw less than the rate it is listed for. If the unit is working well and it is drawing 9 amps leave it alone.

It seems the service man did you a good job hopefully the motor will last a long time. Make sure to keep your receipt for this service that was just performed.

dhaniyal · May 4, 2009, 03:46 AM

Thanks for all your time and excellent support.
Dhaniyal