[she211]

So I'm getting proposals from different company's and contractors. I currently have a very old? 1972ish oil furnace made by Mueller, and out side is 23 year old Trane. Both are working, but not very efficient. I love the warmth from my oil furnace, and want to replace it with another one. I'm looking to replace outside A/C unit with a Heat Pump to have a dual system. Here are some of the quotes:

Sears: Carrier funace 58CMA105 Heat Pump 15 SEER 2.5 ton w/R-410A
installed: $10,167

Home Depot(Logan AC/Heat) TRANE dual system Oil Furnace/14 SEER 2.5 ton R-410A
installed: $10,500

Recker&Boerger: Armstrong LUF80C57/72D121F86 Heat Pump 4SHP13LE30/EU1P36BN/1F95-1277/34 38 30 2.5 ton 15 SEER
installed: $8,600

Four Seasons: Bryant System Oil furnace with 13 SEER 2.5 ton Heat Pump
installed $6,800

Hufford Heating & Air: Carrier 58VMR105-1-12 w/auto humidifier
Heat Pump Goodman SSZ16024 R-410A 16 SEER 9.5 HSPF
installed $ 7,800

New Climate Heating & Cooling: Lennox Signature Series 83% variable speed oil furnace 023Q3/4-105/120 with Lennox Elite 14 SEER Heat Pump XP14-030
installed $ 7,085 (includes a Lennox WB-18 power style whole house humidifier and Lennox Merv 16 filter media air cleaner)

Okay, this is all the proposals I have thus far! I'm liking the Lennox system? What do you all think?
I live in southern Ohio, in a Cap Cod style home, that has the attic converted unto a master bedroom w/half bath. (full basement) approx 2300 sq ft total.
Thanks, Lisa

[hvac1000]

I know Recker and Boerger. See if they will be more competitive. Like bid a 13 SEER instead of a 15 SEER. Then show them or tell them of the other prices and see if they will come down a bit.

Stay away from Home depot and Sears. They have independent contractors do the install and they might not be there next week if you know what I mean.

I wonder if old man Hufford is still alive or if his kid is now doing the work. The problem dealing with small independent companys is that if someone dies they close up or go out of business. Be very careful of that.

Never heard of New Climate in the Southern Ohio area.

Four Seasons has been around a bit but here again how long are they going to be in business.

Recker and Boerger will be competitive if you work them and they are a rather big company that is not going out of business soon. Used to play cards with Al senior in the 70s and 80s.

Price is not everything.

[wmproop]

Around here the few Lennox dealers left can`t get any local parts, they all have to be ordered and this leaves you in the cold "waiting",, so beware of Lennox

[MarkwithaK]

"Four Seasons" must be a popular name for an HVAC company :p. There is a local company here by that name and if the quality of workmanship is the same then run far and fast.

I agree with the comment about staying away from Lennox equipment.

[she211]

Yes, Thomas Hufford is still alive! He does proposals, and leaves the rest of the business to his Son. I think he told me they were 4 generations HVAC family. As for R/B quote I will get a more detailed proposal, this was generated online, and followed up by a guy named Allen? The furnace was smaller in BTU comparison to other quotes. So their price will go up on actual proposal, right? The Lennox guy says there is a warehouse in springdale area? Springfield? Somewhere he in Ohio! I agree about Home Depot, and thought the Sears guy was way to pushy... buy tonight get 5% off... told him to leave! I have a friend that does this stuff on the side and was going to install a tempstar oil furnace and goodman heat pump, for $6,200. I trust him, he's kept my old furnace working thus far. I just wasn't sure about a friend installing something so major. Could cause problems if things went wrong! That's why I started looking into other contractors to do the job. So hard to keep everything even when comparing units.
What makes one unit better then the other when they are made by the same manufacture? Armstrong/Lennox Carrier/Bryant/tempstar Trane/American Standard Take the name off and the guts are the same? If not, how do you know which is better?

[she211]

Why is everyone against Lennox? Every where I look I find both good and bad comments on all brands? This does not make my search any easier! For every
Bad comment about a Lennox there is a good one, same goes for Carrier, Goodman, Trane, tempstar... My sister has a Lennox gas furnace, no problems to date. Like buying a car, not everyone will be the lemon, but every company makes one.

[hvac1000]

Lennox uses some brand specific parts in some of there units. That means that you are toast if the part you need is not in stock. Just what you do not want to hear at 2 AM at 10 below. LOL

There is good and bad with everything but some have less problems than others. The main item to be concerned with is the install. You can take the most expensive equipment and turn it to junk with the wrong installer. The same can be said for a low price unit with a good installer. It will work just fine with no problems.

My outside unit for the main part of the house was made in 1978 and runs like the day it was installed. It was a experimental Bryant/Carrier unit that I did some research and testing on for Carrier corp. When the testing was done they told me to keep the unit. They told me they were not going to produce the unit since it was to expensive to manufacturer. LOL I oil the fan motor every year and clean the coils every three years. The funny thing it works out to be a 10+ SEER which was unheard of in the day.

Good luck with your decission making. Dual fuel is the way to go and get the best 8000 series Honeywell thermostat to do all the control work.

Component

Options are available like outdoor air sensor etc to make it a real quality control package and it eliminates all that crazy duel fuel control stuff of old.

[KC13]

Opinions are just that, but what you will get from the professionals here is based upon experience and without ulterior motives (I haven't heard any sales pitches to you). I have been a service technician for nearly 19 years, and over that time I have performed service and/or repairs on quite a variety of equipment. As a result, I have had the opportunity to compare many different brands on virtually every level. Having said that, I'm not a fan of Lennox either, mainly due to the relatively high level of difficulty in performing service and/or repairs compared to most. To me their designs are somewhat left-handed and backward, and do not seem to take serviceability into account. Increased difficulty results in increased labor expenses to the homeowner. Add to that the limited availability of replacement parts, and Lennox becomes a somewhat questionable choice... in my opinion.

[hvac1000]

Why is everyone against Lennox? Every where I look I find both good and bad comments on all brands? This does not make my search any easier! For every
bad comment about a Lennox there is a good one, same goes for Carrier, Goodman, Trane, tempstar......My sister has a Lennox gas furnace, no problems to date. Like buying a car, not everyone will be the lemon, but every company makes one.

One item I forgot to mention is equipment sizing. In old times the equipment was usually sized one or two steps to large especially on the heating end. This was OK back then since fuel was cheap. Not so in today's world. The exact sizing of equipment is necessary today especially since the units (including oil furnaces) are more efficient. To large of a furnace will waste a lot of fuel oil and many HVAC companys still will not do a manual J on a home unless requested by the home owner.

A complete manual J will tell you exactly whet size furnace and A/C-Heat pump system you need to provide you with comfort while saving you the maximum amount of energy. I suggest you have one done so you have all the facts and no guess work is involved.

I saw all your bids but I did not see a mention of a manula J being done.

The below link explains a manual J.

EERE Consumer's Guide: Sizing Heating and Cooling Systems

[she211]

Thanks for the advice on the manual J thing. I will inquirer to all my bids and see which one did the M J. Good thing my furnace is working, and I'm not in a dire need at this time. I just want to understand what I'm buying, and why or what makes the unit I select the best I can get for my home, and future home heating and cooling savings.
I'll keep you informed, and will let you know what I decide on, give you guys one last chance to talk me out of something I don't need, or shouldn't buy.:p
Thanks again to all, and to all have a Merry Christmas!
Lisa

[hvac1000]

Merry Christmas to you also.

[whodey]

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[whodey]

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