[calicalicali]

2 months ago I changed the heater elements to a Rudd PE80-2 water heater. It went well, but due to a high water bill than usual we have determined that there is water leaking out through the T&P, it is attached to a pipe that goes into the ground. Turning off the cold water valve, the water meter stops running, the pipe is almost as warm as the hot water pipe. We had to use the T&P when emptying and then when filling the tank... why is this happening... is it a bad valve? Or too much pressure, can I relieve the pressure?

Thanks,
Carlos

[450donn]

Since this is a temp and pressure relief valve it can be either or simply a bad valve. First try simply opening and then closing the valve. Might be s as simple as a bit of dirt trapped under the seat. Replacement costs maybe 10 dollars and takes all of ten minutes to change.

[afaroo]

Hello Carlos,

FYI the T&P valve will leak for the following reasons,
1. If your water heater gas valve is set at high temperature setting and the water temp. Is high good temp, setting is approximately. 120 degrees F.
2. If the water pressure is too high normal pressure is 45 to 60 psi
3. If the T&P valve fails.
Check the water pressure with a pressure gauge, and check the gas valve for setting if all is good, replace the T&P valve, if you need help with how to replace the T&P valve get back to us, see the images, Good Luck.

[Milo Dolezal]

Once T&P valve leaks, it usually has to be replaced with new valve. They are inexpensive and are easy to install...

[afaroo]

I Agree with Milo, once the T&P starts leaking you have to change, but you still need to check the water pressure and the temperature, here is how to change the T&P valve.

1. Set the gas valve at pilot position.
2. Turn the water off at the cold water supply line going into the tank.
3. Attach a garden hose to the drain spigot at the bottom of the tank, open a nearby hot water faucet for air, and drain the tank down a bit (below the T&P valve level). Close the drain spigot.
4. Disconnect the drain pipe from the T&P valve, and unscrew the valve counter-clockwise with a pipe wrench.
5. Wrap 2-3 flat wraps of Teflon tape clockwise only as the threaded end of the T&P faces you (or use pipe compound), and screw it back in tightly and reconnect the drain pipe to it.
6. Turn the water back on.
7. When you have a solid water flow (no air) coming from that nearby hot water faucet, turn the gas valve to your desire setting, Good Luck!

John

[calicalicali]

Hi:
First of all: Thank you very much for your prompt answers!!

I understood all you said. I must clarify something, it is an electric unit. Since I do not have a meter pressure, what I did was: Paid really good attention to the pressure of the water coming out and also I counted the number of turns it took me to close the cold water valve and after changing the heater elements I reverse the procedure. Also we have always set the thermostat to its lowest setting, south Florida.. you know!

Now, it was my first time ever doing this so I asked the sales person at the supplier store for recommendations and he told me to use the relief valve while emptying and filling the water tank to allow air to pass through, so that was the only 2 times I ever touched it, I did noticed though that I had to wiggle the handle to make it stay in place, vertical that is, since the bit of water coming out of it was making it slippery... I do not know if that was normal or not.

So the question is that maybe I should have not used the valve but a hot water faucet instead as one of you had mentioned. I thought that since there is no way to know when the water tank is filled to its right capacity, that maybe I put too much water in it and plus the extra pressure due to the heaters, that too much pressure had built up, and so this morning I emptied the tank a bit, probably a foot from the top and refilled it using the hot water faucet during both procedures But still we can hear the water going somewhere.

Now the situation of the pressure valve and the pipe attached to it is not going to be easy for me to change, the pipe leaves the pressure valve goes to the edge of the tank, makes a sharp turn down and a right turn into the wall. The way the valve is connected to the pipe is buy using a small extension pipe soldered to the union thread and then a coupling to catch the pipe also soldered at both ends, therefore the only way to unscrew the valve will be by unsoldering this contraption. Whoever did this had reasons to believe that this valve will not ever go bad... wishful thinking.

Question: how much you think we will be charge to do this?

Another question is: what about if it is not the valve but a broken hot water pipe somewhere around the house, not visible. Is this possible?

Sorry for my long mail, and sorry if I am not using the right wordings to explain the contraption.

Thank you all!

Carlos

[afaroo]

Here is what you need to do, put your hand on pipe connected to T&P valve approximately a foot away if it is hot then this will tell you that the valve leaking and needs to be replaced.

To answer you question that the valve that who ever installed believed that valve would not go bad is wrong idea, the valve goes I changed mine a few months ago, I hide the same problem it was one line connected to the valve by soldering I will show the picture how I did for you I would suggest to install a Sharkbite coupling, cut the pipe and install the Sharkbite coupling see the picture below, Good Luck.

John

[calicalicali]

Thank you John!

Yes, the pipe is warm, as warm as the hot water one.

Tour case is very similar indeed, but look at the pics attached there is no room for much. Can you suggest were to cut? How will I connect the sharkbite coupling?

Sorry to keep asking.

Carlos

[calicalicali]

John:
The second pic needed to be turned vertical... sorry.

Carlos

[KISS]

Cut the pipe with the t&P in two places. One just past the coupling and another at the T&P.

If there is enough room you can use a union, but the easiest way is:

Remove valve
Clean up the end of the remaining pipe.
Put a coupling (repair coupling) without the stops (the line or indent) on the remaining pipe.

Screw in the T&P with teflon tape.

Near the end of the turning of the T&P just before it lines up figure out the length of the small pipe required and solder that small pipe into the male adapter.

Thread that using teflon tape.

Move into place. Slide repair coupling over the joint.

Solder

Remember: That the pipe threads need to go about 2-3 turns past finger tight.


Those solder joints are horrible, but I've seen worse.

[Handyman2007]

The T&P valve should never be used as a "valve"! It is strictly dewsigned as a safety device. If you need to get the water to drain faster when doing sefvice on the water heater tank, siply open one of the hot water spigots anywhere in the hot water line(bathroom sink, kitchen sink,etc)

[afaroo]

Thanks for the pictures it a good visual and pictures help. Now know for sure that the T&P valve is leaking and you have to replace it, look it your attach picture cut it where I indicated for you and remove it from the T&P valve, if you can do soldering go get a union like mine see the picture and replace it, if you can not do soldering then mange to install a Sharkbite fitting as I indicated early, You must replace the T&P valve as soon as possible, good luck.

John

[afaroo]

[QUOTE=Handyman2007;1440171]The T&P valve should never be used as a "valve"! It is strictly dewsigned as a safety device.

You are 100% correct that T&P valve is designed for as a safety device. But the manufacturers recommend open it if needed when you are flushing your water heater or in case you want to release the water pressure from the water heater.
Failure of the T&P valve will cause an explosion see the link, Below, Thanks.

John

[KISS]

John:

I disagree with your picture/reasoning. After you cut once as you said, unscrewing will back into the pipe. Simply won't work. You have to cut in TWO places.

[afaroo]

John:

I disagree with your picture/reasoning. After you cut once as you said, unscrewing will back into the pipe. Simply won't work. You have to cut in TWO places.

You are correct but the T&P valve can be turned counter clock wise and it will give the room to remove the pipe, you don't need to cut it 2 places Thanks.

Regards,
John

[KISS]

I guess your right, because the other side will usually give a little.

[afaroo]

I guess your right, because the other side will usually give a little.

I am glad that you realized it, Thanks.

John

[KISS]

My luck, I'd have to loosen a few clamps and the fasteners would strip. Trusty Dremel or Multimaster would work fine. The latter being much less work,

[calicalicali]

Hi John and all you guys:
Hope you all have a better 2009!!
First, I got derail and I had to do it a bit every time, just got to busy all of a sudden... but thanks for all the info.
John, I mostly followed your advice, it was a bear, is done and guess what: after I cut off the pipe I open the valve and there was not water leaking through it, put full pressure power on and all of that and the meter was still running. So I changed it anyway and that is that.
Now using my mechanic's stetoscope I follow the hot pipe to the best of my ability and the noise of the running water is more pronounce in the kitchen, closing all valves to the dish washer, faucets it still running so my guess is that it is escaping somewhere inside the walls and into the sub floor because there are no marks or humidity anywhere to be seen.

So I also guess that it is time to look for professional help... don't you think? I do not know what else I can do, nor I can follow the pipes to everywhere, my height and poor back just do not go!

Question:
Can I turn the AC on and close the cold water valve, so just to have it warm when needed? When I do that the heater makes lots of noises and though it has a brand new safety valve installed I am still afraid hearing all those cracks and pops inside the unit.

Thanks again all of you... I have to get to work but I will check in later on!

Sincerely,
Carlos