[philiose]

I have an old home, and what I think was the original toilet has finally bit the dust. I've been doing a little reading - the rough-in (distance from the wall to the closet bolts) is 14.5 to 14.75 inches (it's hard to measure exactly). There is a gap of about 3.5 inches from the wall to the top of the tank, which I've always worried about. It seems to me that if someone got too comfortable and leaned back, I'd have an expensive fix on my hands (which I do, and what I believed happened, but that's another story... )

I am assuming that the existing toilet was installed with a 12" rough-in, considering the gap between the top of the tank and the wall. I have a few questions:

Is 14.5 to 14.75 inches more than enough room to install a toilet with a 14 inch rough-in? I am going to have to special order a tank, and I don't think they'll let me return it.

Nothing in this house is level. Do you recommend shimming the toilet until it is level? If so, then with what?

Do you put plumber's putty around the base before you set it on the floor?

Many thanks, and any other helpful tricks and/or advice will be greatly appreciated!

[ballengerb1]

Lots of questions so we'll take them one at a time. 14 toilet should be perfect for you and the tank is likely reuseable only the base of the toilet is different. No caulk under the toilet but you do shim level with plastic shims from the plumbing department, do not use wood shims under any circumstance.

[speedball1]

Hey Phil,
Bob gave you good advice. Allow me to add my two cents.

Is 14.5 to 14.75 inches more than enough room to install a toilet with a 14 inch rough-in? I am going to have to special order a tank, and I don't think they'll let me return it.

If it were me I would replace with a 14" roughtoilet.
Kohler Wellworth Round-front Toilet, 14'' Rough-in w/ Right-handed Trip Lever - K-3433-RA

There is a gap of about 3.5 inches from the wall to the top of the tank, which I've always worried about. It seems to me that if someone got too comfortable and leaned back, I'd have an expensive fix on my hands

You're correct! This is not good! A installationnote: When you tighten the tank bolts leave 1/4" of play. If you crank them down tight and someone leans back it will crack the china around the bolts. The tank needs to flex a bit.

Do you put plumber's putty around the base before you set it on the floor?

No! We grout the base of the bowl with Dap White Tub and Tile Caulk. This does not hold anything in or contain leaks. It is done for cosmetic looks and to make the job look more professional.
Good luck and thank you for rating my answer. Tom

[EPMiller]

Speedball, Love that 14" of play in the bolts. :D:D However I REALLY disagree with the play business. I pull them down just snug. The toilets that have movement between the tank and bowl are the ones that we end up reinstalling when they leak. Usually within the first couple of months. If we are worried about the tank needing support, we just make up a block of styrofoam "blueboard" and brace the tank. Of course we are working with MH group homes and function trumps looks at times. You can also put small rubber washers between the tank and bowl and then crank it down because they eliminate china to china contact.

[speedball1]

Miller,

However I REALLY disagree with the play business. I pull them down just snug. The toilets that have movement between the tank and bowl are the ones that we end up reinstalling when they leak.

The above should have been 1/4" not 14". If you have to go back after a few months Then your men aren't installing them correctly or they're leaving too much play in the bolts. A properly installed tank rides on the spud washer and unlesss it's "snugged" doiwn so tight that you, indeed, have china to china contact you won't need rubber washers between tank and bowl.
It's simple! When a tank's snugged down so tight that there's no "flex"something's going to give. And as a rule it will be the area around the tank bolts. As a working foreman working five trucks of plumbers on a division called "The Meadows" complete with shopping mall We have installed hundreds of toilets over a 10 year period the way I've described. Number of call backs on those toilets? Zero! I rest mycase. Happy Thanksgiving! Tom

[EPMiller]

Speedball, I won't disagree with your results. I just know what we've experienced. The instructions for the brand of toilet we use says to pull the tank down against. I maybe can see a bit of play working on one of the 3 bolt tanks, but tank play has never worked for for us. And we've never had a broken tank callback.

And I knew what you meant with that 14", just struck me funny.

[mygirlsdad77]

Get a 14 inch rough toilet and follow install instructions to the tee. My bet says that there will be no play between tank and bowl(or very very minimal). As far as leveling the toilet(ballengerb, I believe we have had our differences on this before,lol), there are many ways to level a toilet on uneven floor. May be time to call for some help. Different plumbers have different ways of leveling toilets. They will most likely all work as well as the next, you can use silicone, or grout, or (PLASTER PARIS,LOL),this is for you ball,, Or you may look into having the whole floor leveled. All depends on what you are looking to achieve.

[Milo Dolezal]

We do not use shims too much to lever toilet bowls but if we have to we use plastic wedges ( sold in HD for about .20 cents each ). We always seal around the base of the toilet with water based Alex latex-based caulk (it actually contains some silicone as well ) . Even if you don't use wedges the caulk will do the trick: it makes soft cushion between bowl and floor, prevents rocking, seals against possible sewer gas escaping from sewer line, and also give you nice edge around the base.

[speedball1]

We always seal around the base of the toilet with water based Alex latex-based caulk (it actually contains some silicone as well ) . Even if you don't use wedges the caulk will do the trick: it makes soft cushion between bowl and floor, prevents rocking, seals against possible sewer gas escaping from sewer line,

The "operating phase" here is soft cushon. You don't want a soft cushon when your leveling a bowl. You want soinething you can pull down against. Back before plastic shims we used sheet leatto shim our bowls. A "soft cushon" will allow the bowl to rock and that's exactly what we're trying to prevent. Cheers, T%om