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gubbymj · Jul 8, 2008, 11:56 AM

OK... the pole was put there to stop people from going over a curb. You CANNOT see this pole if you are in a mini-van, suv or other type of "taller" vehicle. The curb it's on is only 5 in. tall and would not have hurt my van in anyway. BUT now that I didn't see this pole, it scraped the side of my mini-van a nice orange color, took part of the trim off and my power slidng door won't close by itself.
The restaurant filled out a report, etc... and the manager said that I was the 3rd person, so far, this summer that has hit/scraped that pole. She was faxing it to their HR dept. and someone was supposed to call me.
The police were notified and also filled out a report, etc...
This happened July 2... still no call from the restaurant.

Now... is this all still my fault, since the pole IS NOT visible from my point of view in my van? Would their insurance have to cover the damage to my vehicle, or am I on my own?

N0help4u · Jul 8, 2008, 12:01 PM

Maybe you should go through your insurance company. Try calling them and then telling them if you don't hear some progress you are going to your insurance company to deal with it. Those turns in drive thru's are tight enough without adding more obstacles.
Three people sounds like it is their problem and not your fault.

ScottGem · Jul 8, 2008, 12:03 PM

You should definitely call your insurance carrier and file a claim with them. Let them go after the restaurant's insurer.

Alty · Jul 8, 2008, 12:03 PM

If you decide to go through your insurance company you will have to pay the deductible. Get an estimate done, if the cost to repair is less then the deductible, then it isn't worth it to go through your insurance company. :)

gubbymj · Jul 8, 2008, 12:09 PM

Originally Posted by Altenweg

If you decide to go through your insurance company you will have to pay the deductible. Get an estimate done, if the cost to repair is less then the deductible, then it isn't worth it to go through your insurance company. :)

So, even if they are found at fault and their insurance would cover the repairs, I would still have to pay my ded. To my ins. Sorry... but I am dumb when it comes to ins.! :confused:

ScottGem · Jul 8, 2008, 12:11 PM

No, if they are found to be fully at fault, then their liability coverage should pay. You may have to lay out the deductible, but you would be reimbursed.

andy graham · Jul 8, 2008, 12:28 PM

Originally Posted by gubbymj

OK...the pole was put there to stop people from going over a curb. You CANNOT see this pole if you are in a mini-van, suv or other type of "taller" vehicle. The curb it's on is only 5 in. tall and would not have hurt my van in anyway. BUT now that I didn't see this pole, it scraped the side of my mini-van a nice orange color, took part of the trim off and my power slidng door won't close by itself.
The restaurant filled out a report, etc...and the manager said that I was the 3rd person, so far, this summer that has hit/scraped that pole. She was faxing it to their HR dept. and someone was supposed to call me.
The police were notified and also filled out a report, etc...
This happend July 2...still no call from the restaurant.

Now...is this all still my fault, since the pole IS NOT visible from my point of view in my van? Would their insurance have to cover the damage to my vehicle, or am I on my own?

I did same thing in mac donalds last year and the police told me cause it was a privitely ownd by mac donalds they would have to take me to small clames court you don't have a leg to stand on you will not get anything for it at all right it off I did

N0help4u · Jul 8, 2008, 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by andy graham

I did same thing in mac donalds last year and the police told me cause it was a privitely ownd by mac donalds thay would have to take me to small clames court you dont have a leg to stand on you will not get anything for it at all right it off i did

That doesn't sound right. Once again the po-po at their finest :rolleyes:

gubbymj · Jul 8, 2008, 02:28 PM

Originally Posted by andy graham

I did same thing in mac donalds last year and the police told me cause it was a privitely ownd by mac donalds thay would have to take me to small clames court you dont have a leg to stand on you will not get anything for it at all right it off i did

Ouch!! See, the police officer that came and filled out the report, for me, said to the manager that the pole should mean nothing... that they should be more worried about the damage done to my vehicle...
So hearing him say that, it made me think that the restaurant needs to cover the damages... I don't know... :confused:

JudyKayTee · Jul 8, 2008, 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by gubbymj

OK...the pole was put there to stop people from going over a curb. You CANNOT see this pole if you are in a mini-van, suv or other type of "taller" vehicle. The curb it's on is only 5 in. tall and would not have hurt my van in anyway. BUT now that I didn't see this pole, it scraped the side of my mini-van a nice orange color, took part of the trim off and my power slidng door won't close by itself.
The restaurant filled out a report, etc...and the manager said that I was the 3rd person, so far, this summer that has hit/scraped that pole. She was faxing it to their HR dept. and someone was supposed to call me.
The police were notified and also filled out a report, etc...
This happend July 2...still no call from the restaurant.

Now...is this all still my fault, since the pole IS NOT visible from my point of view in my van? Would their insurance have to cover the damage to my vehicle, or am I on my own?

I investigate accidents - unfortunately, this is not one of "mine."

The rule of thumb in NYS is whether a "reasonable person exercising reasonable care ..." would have struck the pole. I don't understand where it was. Could you see it as you approached it? I would venture a guess that's that why it was painted orange.

The insurance company is going to argue that 3 people have scraped it - and X people have not. Been there, heard that.

N0help4u · Jul 8, 2008, 02:37 PM

I'd say they do
Police do not know the law unless it directly pertains to them or procedure.
Big business will often try to get out of being at fault and often because they are big business they will.
Over some (relatively minor to them) car damage I would think they would make this right for you and not give you a problem. They will try and let it go hoping you forget about it or that it is a lost cause but you need to go to your insurance company. Once an insurance company is involved they don't mess around and you SHOULD win.

The pole was newly put there right? And they had no warning and it was hidden from site and most likely wouldn't have any chance of avoiding it once you got around the corner and saw you cut close right? Three people have scrapped from the time it was put up that should say something,

Once you go after them for something minor to their pocket books they often would rather pay up and get it over with than drag it through court.

Fr_Chuck · Jul 8, 2008, 02:58 PM

I would say that a pole just sitting there? Hard to blame the store for you hitting their pole, in fact they could ask for you to fix any damage to their pole.

Turn it into your insurance, if they do get something from their insurance, but I would not hold my breath on it

gubbymj · Jul 8, 2008, 03:13 PM

Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck

I would say that a pole just sitting there ?? hard to blame the store for you hitting thier pole, in fact they could ask for you to fix any damage to thier pole.

Turn it into your insurance, if they do get something from their insurance, but I would not hold my breath on it

Yeah, see the thing is... the pole IS NOT VISIBLE when you are in a taller vehicle. If they put a pole there to protect a curb... shouldn't it be tall enough for all vehicles to see?

JudyKayTee · Jul 8, 2008, 03:36 PM

Originally Posted by gubbymj

Yeah, see the thing is...the pole IS NOT VISIBLE when you are in a taller vehicle. If they put a pole there to protect a curb...shouldn't it be tall enough for all vehicles to see?

You didn't answer my question which will make the difference - could you see the pole as you approached it? Was it somehow hidden?

The insurance company is going to pay or not pay based on what a reasonable person would do - how many people pass that pole every day? How many people hit the pole? It's painted a bright color for a reason.

And here is what I would find out - how fast were you going to do that kind of damage? How wide is your vehicle? How wide is the traffic lane?

I see problems for you - but submit it and see what happens and come back and let us know.

J_9 · Jul 8, 2008, 03:43 PM

Judy, wouldn't this be a case of Open & Obvious? By that I mean that the pole is out in the open and it is painted orange so as to attract attention.

I had a case once where a person tripped over a rather large crack in the sidewalk, the crack, although she did not see it, was considered open and obvious.

Alty · Jul 8, 2008, 03:46 PM

I would take some pictures of this pole, take a measuring tape along to show how tall it is, also where it's situated, that might help you if there's a dispute, it could also harm you though.

N0help4u · Jul 8, 2008, 03:48 PM

Altenweg has a good idea only I would video tape going around the corner of the building from the driver seat to show how it is hidden until you get around the corner---as well as the photos.

gubbymj · Jul 8, 2008, 04:17 PM

The pole is actually painteed RED to match the exterior of the restaurant... it's NOT ORANGE... but on my vehicle, it shows up as orange.

IT was NOT visible to me WHATSOEVER. If it was, there would be no way I would hit the dang thing. I have NEVER been in any kind of accident or had any damage done to my vehicle, before, and consider myself to be very attentive... but the pole WAS NOT VISIBLE!
The drive-thru is VERY narrow... you do have to make a sharp turn to the right to avoid hitting the building, once you leave the drive through. It just happens that I didn't see the pole and my Ford Windstar mini van does not turn on a dime...

N0help4u · Jul 8, 2008, 05:13 PM

I understand what you mean and I have gone up over the curb on the sharp turn with the narrow drive through. I can't imagine getting around the corner and finding myself in a pole.
I have seen those ones they aren't even 3 ft tall but they can do a lot of damage.

JudyKayTee · Jul 8, 2008, 06:10 PM

Originally Posted by Altenweg

I would take some pictures of this pole, take a measuring tape along to show how tall it is, also where it's situated, that might help you if there's a dispute, it could also harm you though.

And the insurance company has undoubtedly already done so - your own photos won't hurt but amateur photos and videos (and secretly recorded video) is usually of no value because they are exactly that - amateur photos/videos/measurements.

If the OP reports the accident to his/her insurance company and that company entertains the claim they very well may do their own investigation - depends on the insurance company.

I'm not saying a licensed investigator has any big secrets - just high tech equipment, know what to photo (and what not to photo as Altenweg said).

It's going to come down to how many similar vehicles pass through that area every day/week/month and how many hit the pole - in my opinion.

I will also tell you that I have done more than a few slip and falls at McDonalds - they have lousy gutter systems or no gutters at all as well as those dreaded indoor playgrounds - and McDonalds most definitely does NOT cave under pressure.