Hello Everyone,
Does a Christian have God's approval to end their life if the are terminally sick?
Thank you,
Hope12
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Hello Everyone,
Does a Christian have God's approval to end their life if the are terminally sick?
Thank you,
Hope12
I don't know. Personally I think that is between the individual and GOD
I don't think anyone has the right to take their own life. However, I am not opposed to someone being made comfortable if they are suffering.
Do I think that if someone did choose to end their suffering that they would automatically go to hell? No way. As long as they have put their trust in the Lord Jesus Christ there is nothing they can do to lose their salvation.
Hello,Quote:
Originally Posted by classyT
I agree that no one has the right to take their own life. To be made comfortable is good however I believe that to take a persons own life or even a doctor taking a life of someone terminally ill is wrong and not approved by God. I do not believe hell to be a place of eternal tourment but -the common grave that all people who die go -to.
Thank you,
Hope12
Palliative care.
Anyway, I think we should all do our best to love and comfort individuals that are sick and ill.
The thing is medicine and medical science have so many medications and other ways to comfort people in pain so it is not has hard.
Never want to see anybody suffer but people do get sick or ill and grow older with more health problems.
For myself personally to be kept alive by a machine if that is the only thing that is keeping me alive. Do you think my wishes of pulling the plug and letting me go. Do you think that means I am going against Gods wishes?
I think there are so many grey issues that could come up with this debate. You can certainly feel for the family involved or people involved in care to carry through with the wishes of somebody.
You know what though, we are NOT to JUDGE. Whether God is understanding of it or not, or is it wrong or not. None of us will really know will we.
The bible does not give us the right to take our own life, the body we are told is the temple of the holy spirit, so taking ones own life is against God's will.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck
God gave us life and when he's ready to take us it will be his choice not ours.
Trust in him and know he makes no mistakes. You are in my prayers and I wish I could give you words of comfort. Blessings... Kit:)
So is watching porn and masturbating if you go with the "body being God's temple thing" I don't think God is thrilled with that either. We do a lot of things that abuse the temple. Over eating being another one. Some could say controlling conception is abusing the temple too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck
When terminal people are suffering I see no problem with easing them in to death, which is a continuation of life when you think about it. But that's between that person and God.
Having baby after baby, being pregnant multiple times, is abusing the body too plus depriving each child of individual attention and parenting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Homegirl 50
Some could say that getting perms and wearing makeup and using hair color and painting one's nails are all abuses of the body.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Homegirl 50
Homegirl... yes those things are wrong... but the OP was speaking of someone taking a life if they are terminally ill. I don't think it's up to anyone to take their life. God has a plan... none of us know what it is..
I certainly am not questioning your beleifs.. but God is in control and he should be the one who takes us home when it's our time. Blessings to you... :)
I think it's even more than that. Being sick and even dying and how one handles those two situations can be a powerful witness to the walking-around living. I was in the hospital three times last fall, and could tell you stories until the cows come home. Pull up a chair... :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitkat22
It's hard to sit and watch someone die... I know... I prayed for God to please let my Dad live. I prayed with everything I had. When he finally took him home.. it took me years to realize he took him to his reward. He wasn't in constant pain anymore. God took him when it was time. Thanks WG... I hope we get to share some of our stories someday... Hugs and love to you... KittyQuote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
I agree that how we handle death and illness can be a witness to the living but I also believe that if you don't have the whatever it takes to suffer, what you chose to do is between you and God.
And to use the "body is God's temple" excuse doesn't wash because we do a lot of things that abuse that temple, including having more kids that we can take care of.
I believe the body is God's temple, but we cannot say that applies to one instance and not another. We don't have the power or the right to pick.
I would like to think that if I were in that position that I could go gracefully or if someone close to me were, they could go gracefully, but if they cannot, if they have had a talk with God who am I to say what God's answer was. I am of course only speaking of terminally ill people.
We're all terminally ill. The minute we're born, we're on our way to the grave.Quote:
Originally Posted by Homegirl 50
I have a very high pain threshold. What might hurt you might not phase me. So suffering is relative.
[QUOTEI would like to think that if I were in that position that I could go gracefully or if someone close to me were, they could go gracefully, but if they cannot, if they have had a talk with God who am I to say what God's answer was. I am of course only speaking of terminally ill people.[/QUOTE]
I've always said if I were in a terminally ill state I wouldn't want to linger.. but I wouldn't want to take my life. I know God has a reason for me being kept alive even though I would be in pain. I would hope I would go into a coma as my dad did and wake up in heaven. I think suicide is a sin.. it's making decisions for yourself that only God should make... Hugs Homegirl... Kit
Actually, you probably wouldn't be in pain. There are some very lovely pain meds out there now. Very lovely. If you're in pain, it might be more emotional or spiritual, rather than physical -- if you are even aware of what's going on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitkat22
Suffering is relative, but I would not say that to a young person suffering and at the end of life.
Yes we are all dying but I would not say that to a person with pancreatic cancer in pain and at the end of life.
I don't think there is anything wrong with easing that kind of pain if that is what that person has asked, and who am I to say that person did not have their talk with God?
One thing about God He deals with us where we are and individually. What He holds one person to, he may not the next one.
I know that life is sacred and I respect the sanctity of life, I'm just saying there are times when things may be between one person and God.
And if that is the case that is fine!Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
I don't think people ought to have to suffer like that if that suffering can be eased. I guess that is what I'm saying. People ought to be able to die with dignity. There is noting dignifying about unnecessary pain unless that is their wish.
Only God knows the heart of man and only He knows how much we can bear.
I think the Bible is the same for all of us. He didn't make a different set of rules for different people.
Lets just agree to having different ideas. You and I have a right to have different opinions. Blessings... Kit
Let me put this question another way, Is murder against Gods will? Is suicide the same as murder?
Quote:
Originally Posted by 450donn
I think murder is against Gods will and if you commit suicide it is taking a life.. your own and that is murder. What do you think?
Is killing in self defense murder?Quote:
Originally Posted by 450donn
Will God understand and forgive suicide if someone is in insufferable pain with a terminal illness?Quote:
Is suicide the same as murder?
Is being mentally ill and committing suicide forgivable?
Murder is when you kill somebody else and you have somebody else's blood on your hands.
Not yourself.
Many people are brought up and taught that if you commit suicide then your automatically placed in hell. The thing is there are many things that are discovered now about suicide, like mentally ill, problems with the brain and chemical imbalances and so much more.
Exactly!Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesushelper1976
Hope12,Quote:
Originally Posted by Hope12
And what authority do you use to base your beliefs? Out of curiosity.
She is a Witness. The interpretation of what Hell is.Quote:
Originally Posted by classyT
I didn't say He has a different set of rules for different people. I said he deals with us individually. There are things He may lead one person to do and not another.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitkat22
But I will respectfully agree to disagree.
Also many people interpret the bible in many different ways but the bible is written in a way which it calls people in different ways. It is not as black and white like a lot of people like to believe it is. I agree with you Homegirl.Quote:
Originally Posted by Homegirl 50
Joe
Quote:
Originally Posted by classyT
One of the prayers I learned growing up said Jesus descended to hell and on the third day he rose again.
Well if he descended to hell, does that mean Jesus was in hell or the grave. Also Jesus spoke to the thief as they were dying on the wood, was what? Today you will be with me in Paradise. Does that mean Hell is paradise lol.?
Lutherans (and other Protestants?) -- Jesus visited Hell to proclaim His victory over deathQuote:
Originally Posted by Jesushelper1976
Jehovah Witnesses -- Jesus was in the grave
Hello,Quote:
Originally Posted by classyT
God's word the Bible. No greater authoity can be found.
Hope12
Hello,Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesushelper1976
Definition of suicide and murder:
su•i•cide
1.the intentional taking of one's own life.
2. a person who intentionally takes his or her own life.
3. . to kill (oneself).
4. The act or an instance of intentionally killing oneself.
mur•der /ˈmɜrdər/ Show Spelled[mur-der] Show IPA
–noun
1, to kill by an act constituting murder.
2. . to kill
—Related forms
self-murder, noun
self-murdered, adjective
3. n. 1.The unlawful killing of one human
4. To put an end to; destroy: .
To my understanding: “ Suicide is self-murder.” Having said this , remember what Jesus told the criminal dying next to him, found at Luke 23: 39 And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us.40 But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation? 41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss. 42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. 43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.:” KJV
Friends and families can take comfort in knowing that this man was unrighteous—a lawbreaker rather than a distraught suicide victim, guilty by his own admission. Why would Jesus say this to a terrible criminal? For what purpose will God awaken this criminal? So that He mercilessly can hold his past sins against him? No, for Romans 6:7, 23 we are told: “7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.” 23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.” KJV
Jesus died for all mankind. Families and friends of a suicide victim then can take comfort in reading Psalm 103:10-14 says: “10 He hath not dealt with us after our sins; nor rewarded us according to our iniquities. 11 For as the heaven is high above the earth, so great is his mercy toward them that fear him. 12 As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us. 13 Like as a father pitieth his children, so the LORD pitieth them that fear him. 14 For he knoweth our frame; he remembereth that we are dust.” KJV
Only God can fully understand the role of mental sickness, extreme stress, even genetic defects, in a “suicidal crisis,” The National Observer noted, “is not a lifetime characteristic [but] often a matter only of minutes or of hours.” Eccl. 7: “7 Surely oppression maketh a wise man mad; and a gift destroyeth the heart.” KJV
Someone who takes his own life deprives himself of the opportunity to repent of his self-murder. But who can say maybe that one driven to suicide might have had a change of heart his fatal attempt failed? Some murderers have changed and earned God’s forgiveness during their lifetime.—2 Kings 21:16; 2 Chronicles 33:12, 13. What about Manasseh and other’s such as King David? God, by means of Jesus death paid “a ransom in exchange for many,” It is within his right to extend mercy, even to some self-murderers, by resurrecting them and giving them the precious opportunity to “repent and turn to God by doing works that befit repentance.”—Matthew 20:28.
As far as the one who rashly took his own life is concerned, we humans cannot judge as to whether he will get a resurrection or not. How reprehensible was he? God alone searches our hearts and our thoughts.’ 1 Chronicles 28:9 We can be confident that ‘the Judge of all the earth is going to do what is loving, just, and right! Genesis 18:25. Who are we that we should judge?
Hope 12
Is that not what I said in my own words.
Except the self murder. That is twaddle talk.
Hope... You are in our prayers... Kit
Hello,Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesushelper1976
Hell when translated correctly means grave not a fiery torment,
The word “hell” to translated from the original Hebrew and Greek, Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words (1981, Vol. 2, p. 187) says: “HADES.. . It corresponds to ‘Sheol’ in the O.T. [Old Testament]. In the A.V. of the O.T. [Old Testament] and N.T. [New Testament], it has been unhappily rendered ‘Hell.’”
Collier’s Encyclopedia (1986, Vol. 12, p. 28) says concerning “Hell”: “First it stands for the Hebrew Sheol of the Old Testament and the Greek Hades of the Septuagint and New Testament. Since Sheol in Old Testament times referred simply to the abode of the dead and suggested no moral distinctions, the word ‘hell,’ as understood today, is not a happy translation.” Job prayed to go to hell, if that is true, did Job what to be tourmented? PJon 14:13
Job 1: 8 “And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?” Why did Job go to hell if he was perfect and upright?”
Because of the way that the word “hell” is understood today that it is such an unsatisfactory translation of these original Bible words. Webster’s Third New International Dictionary, unabridged, under “Hell” says: “fr[om].. . Helan to conceal.” The word “hell” thus originally conveyed no thought of heat or torment but simply of a ‘covered over or concealed place.’ In the old English dialect the expression “helling potatoes” meant, not to roast them, but simply to place the potatoes in the ground or in a cellar.
Just something to think about if Hell is a fiery place torment.
Hope12
Thank you we all need to pray for one another.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitkat22
Hope12:)
You still do not get it hope. I am talking, sharing and discussing.
Your so rigid in your thinking that there is no room for discussion.
Hello,Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesushelper1976
Maybe you can enlighten me? If I am so rigid in my thinking and you are so broad minded, you relize that all I am doing is stating Bible facts. Bible information is always open for discussion with me. What I understand I am sharing with others. That definitely I am sure leaves it open for more discussion.
Hope12
HelloQuote:
Originally Posted by Jesushelper1976
It is not my interpretation but what the scriptures say when translated from the original Hebrew and Greek text.
Hope12
Me too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hope12
The man in Luke 16:24 cries: ". . .I am tormented in this FLAME."
In Matthew 13:42, Jesus says: "And shall cast them into a FURNACE OF FIRE: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
In Matthew 25:41, Jesus says: "Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting FIRE,. . ."
Revelation 20:15 says, " And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the LAKE OF FIRE."
In Luke 16, Jesus Christ gives a frightening picture of hell:
22.. . The rich man also died, and was buried;
23 And in hell he lift his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father’s house:
28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. (Luke 16:22-28)
In Mark 9:46, Jesus Christ says about hell: "Where THEIR WORM dieth not, and the fire is not quenched."
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