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Originally Posted by Credendovidis

The initial order was for pagan temples. But fanatical "christians"

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Where's your source? Do you believe without OE? This is just your BELIEF!

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could not let that source of knowledge in the Library go, and burned it down too.

Till the 17' century that burning of goods and people kept a general trademark of "christianity". And till deep in the 18' century "christianity" tried to keep the cork on the scientific bottle. Fortunately they failed.

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Where's your proof? This is just your BELIEF!!

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There is loads of support. Hundreds. I just took Wiki as that turned up as first link. Anyway : still better than your source : a book, poorly copied and translated, written by paysants, selected a couple of hundred years later by involved believers themselves (what validity provides that ?), and without any evidence that there ever was any inspiration.

:D :rolleyes: :p :) ;) :D

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Where's your support? This is just your BELIEF!!

Sincerely,

De Maria

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Originally Posted by Galveston1

Yes, Michealb, everyone will bow before Jesus and admit that He is Lord. Even you. Doesn't that just chap you? Now, me, I don't mind. I already do that.

Come on over to this side, I gaurantee you won't be disappointed!

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You're an angry Christian aren't you Galveston? It just irks you to no end that you can't prove God through the bible.

You remind me a lot of the people I went to school with. Very "My way or the highway" mind set.

Why can't we just accept people for who and what they are? Is that really so hard? Do we really have to belittle, is it that important to prove ourselves right?

I guess so, because now I'm doing it too, but not to prove I'm right. :(

De Maria,
Cred continues to prove that he also has beliefs.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

You're an angry Christian aren't you Galveston? It just irks you to no end that you can't proove God through the bible.

You remind me alot of the people I went to school with. Very "My way or the highway" mind set.

Why can't we just accept people for who and what they are? Is that really so hard? Do we really have to belittle, is it that important to proove ourselves right?

I guess so, because now I'm doing it too, but not to proove I'm right. :(

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You are wrong about the angry part. I state things forcefully in hopes of stimulating some thought processes.

And what makes you think that I haven't thought about what you've said, or studied the bible and church? Believe me, I have.

Galveston, in the end, isn't it more important that you are a good person then a God fearing person? I think so.

I've said it before, not everyone can be right about God, or religion, someone has to be wrong. There are so many different beliefs, and everyone believes that they are right in what they choose. There are so many books that claim to be the only way to God, which book is right, are any of them?

In the end, believe in God, don't believe, be Catholic, Muslim, Lutheran, Mormon, whatever, but just do your best to be a good person, live a good life, because that's all that matters in the end. If the Aethists are right and there is no God, no heaven, then yes, I will be disappointed, but if I'm right and all good people will go to heaven, even the Aethists, well, that's the heaven I want to go to.

I believe in God, but I don't believe we will be punished if we don't follow a certain book or certain religion. After all, he didn't exactly make it easy to decide which way is right. ;)

Altenweg your missing the point of religion. Not being a good person is forgivable however not believing in their religion is not.

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Originally Posted by michealb

Altenweg your missing the point of religion. Not being a good person is forgivable however not believing in their religion is not.

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I guess I am missing the point, probably because I don't believe in organized religion. If not being a person is forgivable, then does it matter if you believe in God or not? I guess it does if you believe in the bible and church. I am a Deist, so my beliefs are very different then others that believe in God. I don't follow the bible, nor do I go to church. I don't belong to a specific "religion" although I do have a specific faith, unlike anyone I know.

Not everything I believe can be lumped into a neat word like Deism, it's the closest word to describe what I believe. I believe in a kind, caring, forgiving God, and if we are all "God's children" then we will all go to heaven, because no parent would turn their back on their child just because he went down the "wrong path".

We really have strayed off the topic folks, and I apologize again to SassyT.

I think we should get back on topic. :)

Peace

Well, where we have gone in this thread is a natural progression. Sassy makes a point, those who don't believe the Bible begin to say that it is no evidence at all, and here we are.
Some do not understand the Christian mind-set. It is strongly missionary. I'll try to explain.
I am on a highway at night, and I have information that I accept as reliable that a bridge over a gorge is out, and it is just over the hill. Cars are approaching at high speed. What are my options? I can either try to flag down the drivers and warn them of the missing bridge, or I can let them speed by and die. Now if this were literal, and I did nothing, I would be guilty of at least criminal neglect, and could be prosecuted if proven. I do not want to have to answer to my God for deliberately letting people be eternally lost. I say what I say, not because I hate, but because I have a genuine concern for you. You may not agree with this, but you shouldn't judge me as a hater.

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Originally Posted by Galveston1

Well, where we have gone in this thread is a natural progression. Sassy makes a point, those who don't believe the Bible begin to say that it is no evidence at all, and here we are.
Some do not understand the Christian mind-set. It is strongly missionary. I'll try to explain.
I am on a highway at night, and I have information that I accept as reliable that a bridge over a gorge is out, and it is just over the hill. Cars are approaching at high speed. What are my options? I can either try to flag down the drivers and warn them of the missing bridge, or I can let them speed by and die. Now if this were literal, and I did nothing, I would be guilty of at least criminal neglect, and could be prosecuted if proven. I do not want to have to answer to my God for deliberately letting people be eternally lost. I say what I say, not because I hate, but because I have a genuine concern for you. You may not agree with this, but you shouldn't judge me as a hater.

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The problem is that while sassy may well be trying to tell us that the bridge is down, she's actually saying that the bridge is down because a giant snake came up from the depths and ate it. I therefore associate the fact that I know there are no such things as giant snakes, and even if there were they would not come out from hiding just to eat a bridge, with the actual statement of the bridge, and assume you to be untruthful about that as well. If she is performing missionary work, then she's doing it very poorly.

Galveston, I understand very well the mission that Christians have, but let me try to explain my way.

If the bridge is out and I know I can make it over, then what right do you have to tell me I'm wrong? Perhaps I'll take another path that you don't know about, that you have no idea exists, perhaps I'm just as informed as you, but choose to follow another road.

If someone wishes to be told about the Christian way, then by all means, preach, educate, and convert. But, if someone is quite happy with their way, even if it isn't the Christian way, then what right do you have to force your beliefs on them?

I'm not lost, not at all, I've found God, just in a different way than you've chosen, I've followed a different path.

But when you flag the person down and tell them the bridge is out when you really have no clue whether the bridge is out or not. Your pretty much just wasting everyone's time. Which isn't a crime but should be.

Michael, I'd never flag you down, that I can promise. As a Deist I have no mission to convert anyone to my way of thinking, I just want the right to think it, that's all. I'm tired of people telling me my belief isn't as strong because I'm not a Christian.

I respect everyone's right to believe what they wish, be it God, science, or the spaghetti monster. ;)

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Originally Posted by De Maria

Where's your source? Do you believe without OE? This is just your BELIEF!
Where's your proof? This is just your BELIEF!!!
Where's your support? This is just your BELIEF!!!

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There is ample proof for that, to be found in all libraries. Non-claiming historical reports of what happened politically and practically. With OSE - what does your OE means?

The validity of the Bible is a different matter.
It is based on a non-visible entity that sits on a cloud outside (!! ) our universe, that has perverted interests in every human beings sexual habits.
It is based on an entity that can create an entire universe in 6 days, but is unable to write, copy, translate, produce, nor distribute the operation manual for humanity itself, reason for that manual to be overloaded with faults, inconsistences, and contradictions.

But you have no problems believing in - and accepting - such an entity's existence.
However, that "christians" were ordered to destroy pagan temples and added the Library to that list of destruction has to be proven with OSE...

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by arcura

Cred continues to prove that he also has beliefs.

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As you meant RELIGIOUS BELIEF : The more you post nonsense like that, the more I will have to tick you on your fingers, dear Fred !

:)

To all here about this.
This is my learned opinion.
I believe that all paths do NOT lead to God.
Some actually lead away from God.
I also believe the bible and that the bible encourages followers to tell others about the Biblical God and the way to Him and His salvation.
Christians who do that are doing what they believe should be done.
That is not much different than this...
If I were a carpenter and saw someone building chair improperly, I would be a good person by helping that person build the chair correctly.
It is not a crime to attempt to help others.
However, it is not ethical to try to shove something down another's throat who does not want it.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

Cred must have his comments in his computer so he can click them to post. Repetitive. I again challenge him to present a contridiction in scripture of any significance. There are differences in numbers stated is some places, but it doesn't change the history or message presented. I like to shoot down hot air balloons.

Your comment about the universe being created in 6 days: You don't believe it and neither do I. NOWHERE does the Bible make any such claim.

The Bible NOWHERE says that God sits on a cloud or outside the universe.

God's interest in our sex lives is that we may live happy, disease free lives that provide the proper environment for our children to grow up in.

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Originally Posted by Galveston1

God's interest in our sex lives is that we may live happy, disease free lives that provide the proper environment for our children to grow up in.

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Why not just get rid of the diseases wouldn't that be easier? The very least he could do would be to make it so that if you follow the bible rules you don't get any diseases. Yet I openly mock gods existence and I'm as healthy as can be. How could any god that loves his followers allow me who openly mocks the possibility of his existence live yet kills an innocent child.

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?
- Epicurus Quotes

Why does he allow this? "because of man's rebellion against God's Word"

Sin entered the world through man. Not through god... Good job man. We cursed ourselves to suffering. We cursed ourselves to death. We cursed ourselves to disease. We, We, We, We, We,. From that point on every person on this planet was a sinner.

There is no such thing as innocent suffering. In the eyes of god we are all sinners and because of this fact, we are wretched. Now, good thing god sent his son to die on the cross (suffering terribly) to die for us who are evil. In his mercy, with grace, and faith he is willing to forgive us our sins and grant us eternal life.

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Originally Posted by Smoked

Why does he allow this? "because of man's rebellion against God's Word"

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That is what you BELIEVE...

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Smoked

Why does he allow this? "because of man's rebellion against God's Word"

Sin entered the world through man. Not through god....Good job man. We cursed ourselves to suffering. We cursed ourselves to death. We cursed ourselves to disease. We, We, We, We, We,....From that point on every person on this planet was a sinner.

Their is no such thing as innocent suffering. In the eyes of god we are all sinners and because of this fact, we are wretched. Now, good thing god sent his son to die on the cross (suffering terribly) to die for us who are evil. In his mercy, with grace, and faith he is willing to forgive us our sins and grant us eternal life.

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So let me get this straight you believe that a child who has done nothing wrong in it's life deserves to suffer because you feel he is wretched because of something you think someone 6 thousand years did.

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Originally Posted by Credendovidis

That is what you BELIEVE ....

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

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His question was "why does god allow"... you believe something different why don't you answer his question with what you believe instead of some nonsense that has no baring on the topic.