Yeah you can't prove that something doesn't exist
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Yeah you can't prove that something doesn't exist
That wasn't the point he was making.Quote:
Originally Posted by N0help4u
:D the point I was making
"You can't prove that something doesn't exist".
It all depends on WHAT does not exist. And WHERE that does not exist.
If you mean the existence of God, and you describe God as being fixed to heaven and add a couple of restricting parameters (as for instance where that heaven should be located), than it is possible to prove that God does not exist by simply going to that location and finding that on that spot there is no heaven - so there can be no God.
But as Christians can not even specify where heaven should be located, and also can not guarantee that God is restricted to that heaven, there are so many unknowns build in to the God existence claim, that it become impossible to prove God does not exist.
There is no need to prove that God does not exist. Why should anybody want to do that? It are the Christians who can not even prove that God exists. And that on itself is already more than enough for me to support the view that the existence of God is extremely doubtful, and so far has failed any support.
:rolleyes:
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My last point in this thread because this is starting to get silly.Quote:
Originally Posted by N0help4u
You seem to think that because something can neither be proven nor falsified that this necessarily means there is a 50/50 chance it is true. Either there is a God or there's not, right? 50/50... But this is a HUGE error in logic! It shouldn't take much thinking on your part to see why. Good luck with it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Credendovidis
At least I am rational enough to admit that there is no 100% factual evidence for my beliefs. Unlike you who sends mixed messages... you admit the is insufficient evidence to qualify the big bang theory as fact but when I say you BELIEVE in the big bang you start to friek out and say you don't "believe" you 'Know" it is a fact... lol
So until you man up and admit you BELIEVE in a Big Bang, I will continue to ask you for factual evidence for a big bang. ;)
A lot of bull waste, sassyT !Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyT
I do not believe in what is popularly called the Big Bang. There is no need to believe that, as there is ample evidence that the BB happened, about 14,3 Billion years ago. Lot's of different cross supporting evidence for that.
Note : the Big Bang was NOT a gigantic explosion. It was a phenomenal fast, very short, and sudden expansion of space-time.
It is YOU who keeps twisting words. I never claimed the Big Bang to be a huge explosion, nor that is is a fact. I always have stated that there is a lot of objective supporting evidence that the BB happened, though there never will be a 100% total coverage of everything that was involved in that event.
It is YOU who keeps stating that I believe in the BB, although so far you have never been able to objectively support that wild claim.
It is YOU who keeps posting lies and untruths about what I posted in the past. I have repeatedly corrected you when you posted such lies and untruths. Still you keep posting them.
sassyT : you have claimed several times to have some sort of degree in Biology. I asked you where and when you obtained that degree. You never addressed that. So I have to assume that that was another lie...
Your approach to the ways scientific research works, and to how scientific evidence is obtained and supported seems also to confirm my assumption...
:D :D :D :D :D
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[QUOTE]You are really confusing me now.. :confused: So what do you BELIEVE in? How do you figure we came into being?Quote:
Originally Posted by Credendovidis
.
You don't have to be ashamed of your belief in a big bang now. You did say life came from a big bang and now you are changing your statement because you realise how ridiculous the theory is. Whatever :rolleyes:Quote:
It is YOU who keeps twisting words. I never claimed the Big Bang to be a huge explosion, nor that is is a fact. I always have stated that there is a lot of objective supporting evidence that the BB happened, though there never will be a 100% total coverage of everything that was involved in that event.
It is YOU who keeps stating that I believe in the BB, although so far you have never been able to objectively support that wild claim.
It is YOU who keeps posting lies and untruths about what I posted in the past. I have repeatedly corrected you when you posted such lies and untruths. Still you keep posting them.
Again that is your BELIEF which has no materal effect on the fact that I am doing my masters in Biology. Unlike you I am aware of all the unknowable assuptions used in sceintific theory and therefore I do not believe it to be TRUTH as you do. So just because I do not share the same FAITH you have in the unproven assuptions of some theories, does not make me less of a science major. :rolleyes:Quote:
sassyT : you have claimed several times to have some sort of degree in Biology. I asked you where and when you obtained that degree. You never addressed that. So I have to assume that that was another lie...
Your approach to the ways scientific research works, and to how scientific evidence is obtained and supported seems also to confirm my assumption...
Like I said Cred doesn't want to answer what he believes just what he does not believe on existence.
I'll tell you what I think. Again this is what I think and I maintain that thinking is different than believing because if evidence is presented that is contrary to what I think I will change my ideas.
I think the big bang is the best model of the universe to explain the way it is today.
I think evolution is the best model to explain how you get from a single cell to a more complex organism.
I think that we currently don't have a theory with enough evidence to claim a definitive theory on abiogenesis. I think we will have one some day though.
If we find new evidence or someone comes up with a different theory that better explains the evidence I might change what I think. Ideas change in the face of evidence. That is the great thing about ideas is that they can change.
Good for you!Quote:
Originally Posted by michealb
I think The Big bang is a Hoax given that there are many scientific problems with the theory.
I think evolution is a farce given the strugling fossil evidence and the fact that a not single mutation resulting in adding new information has ever been observed in nature or in a lab. This is just one of the many unproven assuption the theory depends on.
How can the big bang be a hoax? Are you trying to say that the scientist aren't observing what they say they are observing and scientists world wide are all going along with it. I can also say that there isn't a single scientific problem with the big bang because if there was the theory would be altered so it didn't have any problems that how theories work. There might be unknowns which when they become known might change the theory but it's still a good idea to theorize even in the event of unknowns. Also what is the alternate theory that you prefer given the evidence at hand?Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyT
Bacteria make major evolutionary shift in the lab - life - 09 June 2008 - New Scientist
Now that evolution has occurred in a lab are you going to change your line of thinking?
Cred says he does not believe in the big bang so it doesn't sound like people who follow science can even agree.
Compliments of the supporting evidence post by Cred:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Credendovidis
I have no religious beliefs. But if you insist on an answer I would say that my personal preference goes to logic and ratio.Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyT
Why would I be ashamed of my personal preference? I do not believe in "a" Big Bang.Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyT
A total lie : I have never stated that. I challenge you to state where and when I posted that : you can't !!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyT
You repeatedly stated in May 2008 that you HAD a degree in Biology. So you lied than. And you frequently lie here too, and besides that you keep twisting words, post untruths, and make false statements.Quote:
Re. sassyT's claims to have a degree in Biology.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyT
:D ;) :p :rolleyes: :D
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Did she specify masters?
SOME OTHER types of biology degrees
Associate degree, biology Minor, bachelor of Arts in Biology, Bachelor of Science in Biology
There is not one single scientist or well-informed amateur (like me) who BELIEVES in the Big Bang.Quote:
Originally Posted by N0help4u
Belief is related to assumptions for which there is no support at all - like religious claims.
Science is based on verifiable and objective supportive data , i.e. in facts.
:D :D :D :D :D
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Michaelb's argument is that the big bang did exist and you claim otherwise that is my point
***correction: is how he fits his sciencifically inclined beliefs to the earths existence
STILL it is two different beliefs based on scientific beliefs
Quote:
Originally Posted by michealb
She stated that she HAD a degree in Biology. SO SHE LIED!!Quote:
Originally Posted by N0help4u
:rolleyes:
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Incorrect. You either can not read or you have comprehension problems.Quote:
Originally Posted by N0help4u
He clearly stated :
I'll tell you what I think.
Again this is what I think...
I think the big bang is...
I think evolution is...
I think that we currently...
Conclusion : he never stated that the Big Bang did exist or that evolution is... He clearly mentioned 5 X that he thinks that...
Note : to think is NOT the same as "it is".
:rolleyes:
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[QUOTE]Okey so based on your "logic" and "ratio" how did the universe and life come into being?Quote:
Originally Posted by Credendovidis
So you believe in THE big bang :confused:Quote:
Why would I be ashamed of my personal preference? I do not believe in "a" Big Bang.
I have a bachelors degree DUH!Quote:
You repeatedly stated in May 2008 that you HAD a degree in Biology. So you lied than. And you frequently lie here too, and besides that you keep twisting words, post untruths, and make false statements.
:rolleyes:
I corrected that **probably while you were typing your reply**
BUT it is still what he believes based on his scientific beliefs and
It IS different than your scientific beliefs SO your beliefs do differ.
[QUOTE=sassyT]Quote:
I have a bachelors degree DUH!
:rolleyes:
You lied then :rolleyes:
[QUOTE=N0help4u]Lol.. I guess credo is confused again.. I have a bachelors degree already and am currently working on my Masters.Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyT
No, I am not confused. But I only can base my approach on the statements you post on this website...Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyT
So can you tell me on which "Biology Nursery School" (and when) you obtained that bachelors degree? Any specifications?
:D :rolleyes: :p ;) :rolleyes: :D
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[QUOTE=sassyT]Why do you think this is a question that must be answered at this time? What's wrong with, 'I don't know'?Quote:
okey so based on your "logic" and "ratio" how did the universe and life come into being?
Scientists are working on it. In the meantime, the best answer is that no one is sure about first cause. And that's my biggest problem with many religious people. They arrogantly imagine that they are VERY sure about questions, which no one could possibly have the answer to. You won't trust educated scientists using state of the art instruments, but you'll believe a 2000 year old book written by men who didn't even know the shape of the planet they were standing on. Go figure.
Even if there wasn't a single fossil to go on, the evidence for evolution is overwhelming! I honestly don't know how you are about to become a biologist, but you should keep these ridiculous assertions to yourself. Otherwise, you are sure to be laughed out of the workplace. That is, if you somehow manage to land a job in this field in the first place (which you almost certainly won't if you spout this kind of stuff to a prospective employer).Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyT
True very true with many careers you have to keep your personal beliefs to yourself and go along with the status quo unless you can find a job in your field that follows your same belief system.
So as a biologist it's OK for sassy to assert that all species of animals and plants arrived on earth at the same time? What kind of job does one get as a biologist with that mindset?Quote:
Originally Posted by N0help4u
If Credo doesn't know he should just admit and say so... instead of claiming that a big bang created the universe. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by lobrobster
Good, so if you are not even sure why do you expect me to believe in an unproven big bang theory?Quote:
Scientists are working on it. In the meantime, the best answer is that no one is sure about first cause.
I don't have the answers but I have faith in a God I know exists based on my personal experience with him. If you don't believe in him, fine, I couldn't care less.. believe me... but just leave us believers alone. Don't come on religious forums to promote your own faith in unproven scientific theories and try and pass them off as facts.Quote:
And that's my biggest problem with many religious people. They arrogantly imagine that they are VERY sure about questions, which no one could possibly have the answer to.
I know everything there is to know about evolution and the big bang and I know it enough about it to know that there are a lot of scientific problems with the theories that make their validity virtually impossible.
The only thing holding theses tattered theories together, is desperate athiests like yourself who want to hold on to the notion, despite lack of evidence, because the alternive (God) is not acceptable to your athiestic doctrine.
Yes you are right I don't share the same trust and faith you have in scientific theories that have not been proven to be TRUE. I do however have faith in a God who used over 40 different men who lived in totally different times and locations, and yet came up with a word that was consistent.Quote:
You won't trust educated scientists using state of the art instruments, but you'll believe a 2000 year old book written by men who didn't even know the shape of the planet they were standing on. Go figure.
And just as an FYI the Bible, thousands of years ago, had already established that the earth was spherical in the book of psalms, while scientists just a few hundred years ago were afraid to fall off the edge of the earth.
Scientists are only now beginning to catch up with scientific principles the Bible had already established THOUSANDS of years ago.
I think the bigger question is, why would one want to become a biologist with that mindset? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Maybe I should become a nun...
I'm on my way to teaching others about the benefits of religion. I'm currently getting a PhD in Religious studies.Quote:
Originally Posted by jillianleab
Lol... As far as I remember believing in a mythical one cell creature that crawls out of a promordial vegie soup and morphs into everything we see today, is not a prerequisite to being a biologist. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by jillianleab
But biology and evolution are NOT belief systems, no matter how hard and often you insist that they are.Quote:
Originally Posted by N0help4u
Biology is not a Belief because it consists of studies done on things that can be observed tested and repeated... but the evolution is a belief system.Quote:
Originally Posted by lobrobster
Did I say they were the same thing??Quote:
Originally Posted by lobrobster
I have no idea how you managed to twist that when all I was doing was agreeing with you
Therefore you must be contradicting yourself,
Seems to me you must be saying they are the same thing then
Quote:
Originally Posted by N0help4u
I don't know why these Darwinists like to quate evolution with Biology. :rolleyes:
It is not the same thing.
Very intertwined:Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyT
Graduate Biology Program
Sassy you also never answered my question about the fact that evolution has been proven in a lab. If you are now going to change your line of thinking or are you going to ignore evidence and go with your religious ideas instead?
Bacteria make major evolutionary shift in the lab - life - 09 June 2008 - New Scientist
I don't expect you to believe in the big bang. I'm not sure what I believe about it (so, I don't know is my answer). I do however, trust what leading scientists say. There are now several different theories some having to do with multi-verses and 11 dimensions. My stance is wait and see. It's also possible we may never have an answer to first cause or a-biogenesis.Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyT
There you go again. You don't know God exists. You have faith God exists. To claim that you have some definitive knowledge or experience that no one else has, is arrogant. This knowledge and experience you speak of, has somehow slipped by the millions and millions of Muslims, Jews, Hindus, atheists, etc.Quote:
I don't have the answers but I have faith in a God I know exists based on my personal experience with him.
I have no problem leaving people like yourself alone. You are obviously proud of your ignorance and wear it like a badge of honor. There is nothing I or anyone else can do for you. But there are some (including myself), who seek to move beyond our ignorance and I certainly will not sit idly by while you try and dumb down these people with your incorrect and uneducated rants.Quote:
but just leave us believers alone. Don't come on religious forums to promote your own faith in unproven scientific theories and try and pass them off as facts.
You say you are studying to become a scientist, yet don't even understand the purpose or process of science. Nothing is ever proven in science. If you need to PROVE things then take up mathematics. Science is about finding the best possible theories to explain things. This is done through making predictions and trying to falsify previous theories. So far, evolution is the best possible explanation for the diversity of life and has yet to make a single bad prediction or be falsified.
Seriously Sassy, you are exposing yourself to be a charlatan. It is incredibly doubtful that you know anything about science, let alone studying to work in the scientific field of biology.
[QUOTE]lol why do You equate my disbelief in the validity of such unproven thoeries like the big bang with ignorance... lol i don't get it. If you took time out and did some research instead of just taking everything you are fed at face value, you would actually find that there are many scientific problems with the theory that make it virtually impossible.Quote:
Originally Posted by lobrobster
LIke i said before i am not ignorant about these subjects, i have studied this at great length and have come to the conclusion that the likely hood of them occurring is zero. So i just don't believe in them. You do. I don't! Why does that bother you? :confused: :rolleyes:
That is not true. Science is the effort to discover, understand, or to understand better, how the physical world works, with observable physical evidence as the basis of that understanding. Theories on origin can not be science for the simple reason that we cannot observe history. The origin of the universe, life and mankind all took place in the past and cannot be studied or repeated in the laboratory. I don't know why that is hard for you to accept.Quote:
You are becoming a scientist and don't even understand that you do NOT try and PROVE things with science! Nothing is ever proven in science. If you want to PROVE things take up mathematics. Science it about find the best possible theories to explain things. This is done through making predictions and trying to falsify previous theories.
It has been falsified many times but like i said, this theory has too many desperate athiests clinging to it despite the fact that it is biologically impossible.Quote:
So far, evolution is the best possible explanation for the diversity of life and has yet to make a single bad prediction or be falsified.
The hidden truth that evolutionists have seldom openly acknowledged is that mutations are genetic mistakes that fail to provide a logical answer to the question as to what fuels the evolutionary development. In fact mutations can not possibly explain the biological diversity in our world. The problem is simply that mutation by definition are rare errors in a the copying of the genetic code. They are genetic mistakes and as a result are almost always negative or neutral in their effect. Evolutionist do admit to this fundamental flaw in their theory but it is never publicized.
Scientists have never observed a single mutation in the laboratory in nature that adds information to an organism. Coping errors through mutation cannot possibly add new information as the theory of evolution demands.
The fact it that the theory depends entirely upon the unobserved and unproven assumption that random mutations over long periods will result in beneficial improvements in a species vial added information that will be carried in ot future generations because they provide an enhanced opportunity for "survival of the fittest" However scientific research contradicts this underlying assumption of evolution that accidental mutations could ever produce improvements in a species, let alone a transformation to an entirely new species
Again just because i don't share the same FAITH you have in unproven theories does not make me less of a science student. :rolleyes:Quote:
Seriously Sassy, you are exposing yourself to be a charlatan. It is incredibly doubtful that you know anything about science, let alone studying to work in the scientific field of biology.
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