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Originally Posted by classyT

Skell

Please don't answer for me....you don't know me. i already apologized to ex for "hijacking" his thread..if he didn't have a problem..why do YOU? OH! i know... it is because I'm a Christian! (oops did i go and answer for YOU?) AND because i don't dislike Hannity. NK used the word "upstanding".. and I repeated it. Honestly? I don't KNOW Hannity nor what kind of person he REALLY is. I am NOT willing to stand in judgement of anyone for a comment. Last time I checked this was America and we could voice our opinions...right or wrong, politically correct or not.

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What? Sorry I'm not really following.. Where did I answer for you? I used your words only. I was asking questions which you don't seem to want to answer.

And I haven't argued the point that he can't voice his opinion. Where have I made that argument? I simply said that he thinks torture is good, yet you still feel he is an upstanding person. Why is that?

Rapists think rape is good. I'm sure that would disqualify them from the upstanding person tag. No?

Can't you see the question being asked?

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Originally Posted by classyT

WG,

You can't have it both ways .....our nation has fought and won wars

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Yeah, but we were attacked most of the time, so it was self-defense. And, until Mr. Bush came along, we did our best to avoid war ALL of the time.

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Originally Posted by classyT

Good Grief, if you are stupid enough to come to our country and kill our people....let me rephrase..TORTURE and KILL our people...well you get what ya get. Last i check THEY still have BREATH!

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Hello Tessy:

I have no problem with retribution or revenge. But, let's call it what it is and not wrap it up hypocrisy. You can't have it both ways. Either it's NOT torture, because doesn't hurt, and we're the good guys (we'd NEVER torture). Or it hurts them a lot, and they DESERVE it.

excon

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Originally Posted by Skell

What? Sorry i'm not really following.. Where did I answer for you? I used your words only. I was asking questions which you don't seem to want to answer.

And i havent argued the point that he can't voice his opinion. Where have i made that argument?? I simply said that he thinks torture is good, yet you still feel he is an upstanding person. Why is that?

Rapists think rape is good. I'm sure that would disqualify them from the upstanding person tag. No??

Can't you see the question being asked?

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Re read your comments to me skell. You asked a question to me and answered it yourself... I'm not that hard to follow.

I'm not going to defend why I like Hannity.. maybe I just think he is really CUTE.:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by excon

Hello Tessy:

I have no problem with retribution or revenge. But, let's call it what it is and not wrap it up hypocrisy. You can't have it both ways. Either it's NOT torture, because doesn't hurt, and we're the good guys (we'd NEVER torture). Or it hurts them a lot, and they DESERVE it.

excon

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Ex,

Honestly, I don't KNOW if waterboarding is torture.. some people say it IS.. others say it isn't. ALL I DO KNOW... is they get to LIVE. Our people didn't get that courtesy... Under the Law of Moses ( your Jewish right?) it was an eye for an eye.. sos the way I see it... WE ARE THE GOOD GUYS.. they are still alive and kicken. The best part is, we have people right here in the good ol USA that are all concerned about their "rights" That's fine. That is why I love American... you are free to do that. Funny though, their people were dancing in the streets when ours were TORTURED AND DIED. Oh yes... we are INDEED the good guys.

Hello again, Tessy:

Couple things...

Of course, waterboarding is torture... It's like porn... It either IS porn, or it's NOT. It can't NOT be porn because he only went in 10% of the way, but definitely porn when he goes in 15%. To parse porn that way is ridiculous, isn't it??

Same thing with torture. It can't NOT be torture to be waterboarded for 39 seconds, but definitely torture when waterboarded for 40 seconds. It makes no sense at all.

Like I said above, I have no trouble with retribution. But, let's NOT make a mockery of the law in order to do it.

You SEEM to be coming around.

excon

Exy,

I don't know... are they mamed afterwards? Do they have burns on them so bad they can't be recognized? Is there ONE scar left on their bodies. Are their bones broken and laying in a heap under ton of rubble... I don't know what the definition of torture is... I kind of know what it looks like AFTERWARDS.

Fyi... dude... porn IS torture... UGH :)

torture - Definition from the Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary

Leave Porn alone, Porn has enough trouble on it's own! :P

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Originally Posted by galveston

Do you understand crucifixion, or are your comments pure hyperbole?

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Hello gal:

You seem compartmentalized... Let me see if I can undo that...

In your compartment, they were waterboarded, and that, by itself, can't be torture... They were put in a box, and that, by itself isn't torture. They were not allowed to sleep, and that's not torture. They were subject to all sorts of terrible things, that each one, in and of themselves, aren't torture...

The only way you could come with that conclusion is because you buy the parsing of the word torture. Ok, if I were to take THAT argument at face value, then numbers, instead of the act itself, ARE important. After all, they've determined that some amount of seconds of waterboarding isn't torture, and if one goes beyond that, it's torture. (By the way, how could anybody come up with THAT conclusion?? )

So, if some number, that which if gone beyond, is torture, then I'd ask you, if ONE waterboarding isn't torture, would being waterboarded 68 times in one month be torture??

Speaking of your compartment, you're right, I don't know about crucifixion. But, I don't think that was the only torture Jesus endured. I think he was brutalized long before he was hung on the cross. According to you, the stuff that happened BEFORE he was crucified, isn't to be considered, and if it is, it couldn't be called torture, because crucifixion is torture.

excon

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Originally Posted by excon

Hello gal:

You seem compartmentalized.... Lemme see if I can undo that...

In your compartment, they were waterboarded, and that, by itself, can't be torture... They were put in a box, and that, by itself isn't torture. They were not allowed to sleep, and that's not torture. They were subject to all sorts of terrible things, that each one, in and of themselves, aren't torture...

The only way you could come with that conclusion is because you buy the parsing of the word torture. Ok, if I were to take THAT argument at face value, then numbers, instead of the act itself, ARE important. After all, they've determined that some amount of seconds of waterboarding isn't torture, and if one goes beyond that, it's torture. (By the way, how could anybody come up with THAT conclusion???)

So, if some number, that which if gone beyond, is torture, then I'd ask you, if ONE waterboarding isn't torture, would being waterboarded 68 times in one month be torture???

Speaking of your compartment, you're right, I don't know about crucifixion. But, I don't think that was the only torture Jesus endured. I think he was brutalized long before he was hung on the cross. According to you, the stuff that happened BEFORE he was crucified, isn't to be considered, and if it is, it couldn't be called torture, because crucifixion is torture.

excon

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Don't be ridiculous! I am well aware of the brutalization that Jesus endured before His crucifixion. Are you saying that a Gitmo waterboarding is equal to a Roman flogging?

The reason 39 seconds of water is not torture, while 45 seconds may be is that the guy has to BREATHE sometime. If continued long enough, he would actually drown, and that WOULD be torture. Your definition of torture is unrealistic. I hear that some of the male employees of Fox news were waterboarded. They volunteered for it to make a point.

No Gal that would be murder.

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Originally Posted by galveston

If continued long enough, he would actually drown, and that WOULD be torture.

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So it's only torture when they die? That's your definition?

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Originally Posted by galveston

I hear that some of the male employees of Fox news were waterboarded. They volunteered for it to make a point.

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Fox News demonstrates waterboarding  Video

Oh you mean the one where:
1. the reporter had no reason to fear death - he knew he was in a controlled environment.
2. Did you notice how gentle the interregators were? I can't say this for sure, but I'm guessing the CIA is a little more foreceful - I'm assuming they use more than a turkey baster to drop water in someone's nose.
3. As soon as this guy yelled out "stop," they immediately stopped. Do you think actual interregators do that? If this isn't torture, would Fox and friends consider it torture if you continued to do this after being begged to stop.

They guy on fox news even called it torture

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Originally Posted by galveston

They volunteered for it to make a point.

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Hello again, gal:

THAT video??

When asked, by the anchor, "do you consider this technique to be torture, you've experienced it?", the Fox employee said, "I don't see how you could consider it anything else."

THAT point?

excon

Just jumping in for a minute.

Waterboarding - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Long term effects of waterboarding are panic attacks, depression and PTSD. Also there is a large possibility of death, damage to the lungs, broken bones from fighting against restraints.

If that's not torture, I don't want to know what is.

For those of you that think it's okay, that it isn't torture, well then, volunteer to have it done to you, not just a wussy attempt either, but a full on, no choice, interrogation, using this method. If you can look us in the face afterwards and say it isn't torture then I'll let it drop, until then, you don't have any idea what you're talking about.

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Originally Posted by NeedKarma

So it's only torture when they die? That's your definition?


Fox News demonstrates waterboarding  Video

Oh you mean the one where:
1. the reporter had no reason to fear death - he knew he was in a controlled environment.
.

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EXCELLENT POINT!! You got it! Congratulations!

It was a controlled environment at Gitmo too. Only the waterboardee didn't KNOW that UNTIL Obama told them so!!

So now the intellegence people can say "pretty please". Lots of luck learning anything that way.

I still say your idea of what constitutes torture is ridiculous.

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Originally Posted by galveston

EXCELLENT POINT!!! You got it! Congratulations!

It was a controlled enviornment at Gitmo too. Only the waterboardee didn't KNOW that UNTIL Obama told them so!!!

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Actually I don't get it I guess. Can you explain it? What did Obama have to do with the waterboarding?

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Originally Posted by classyT

Re read your comments to me skell. you asked a quesion to me and answered it yourself....i'm not that hard to follow.

I'm not going to defend why I like Hannity..maybe i just think he is really CUTE.:rolleyes:

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As I said, I used your words. Your answer...

Never mind...

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Originally Posted by galveston

I still say your idea of what constitutes torture is ridiculous.

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What about your FOx News guy that was making your point? He thinks its torture.. Oh, his point isn't relevant now I gather?