Ask Me Help Desk - The Christian named Hannity

Quote:

Originally Posted by classyT

Skell

Please don't answer for me....you don't know me. i already apologized to ex for "hijacking" his thread..if he didn't have a problem..why do YOU? OH! i know... it is because I'm a Christian! (oops did i go and answer for YOU?) AND because i don't dislike Hannity. NK used the word "upstanding".. and I repeated it. Honestly? I don't KNOW Hannity nor what kind of person he REALLY is. I am NOT willing to stand in judgement of anyone for a comment. Last time I checked this was America and we could voice our opinions...right or wrong, politically correct or not.

What? Sorry I'm not really following.. Where did I answer for you? I used your words only. I was asking questions which you don't seem to want to answer.

And I haven't argued the point that he can't voice his opinion. Where have I made that argument? I simply said that he thinks torture is good, yet you still feel he is an upstanding person. Why is that?

Rapists think rape is good. I'm sure that would disqualify them from the upstanding person tag. No?

Can't you see the question being asked?

Quote:

Originally Posted by classyT

WG,

You can't have it both ways .....our nation has fought and won wars

Yeah, but we were attacked most of the time, so it was self-defense. And, until Mr. Bush came along, we did our best to avoid war ALL of the time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by classyT

Good Grief, if you are stupid enough to come to our country and kill our people....let me rephrase..TORTURE and KILL our people...well you get what ya get. Last i check THEY still have BREATH!

Hello Tessy:

I have no problem with retribution or revenge. But, let's call it what it is and not wrap it up hypocrisy. You can't have it both ways. Either it's NOT torture, because doesn't hurt, and we're the good guys (we'd NEVER torture). Or it hurts them a lot, and they DESERVE it.

excon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skell

What? Sorry i'm not really following.. Where did I answer for you? I used your words only. I was asking questions which you don't seem to want to answer.

And i havent argued the point that he can't voice his opinion. Where have i made that argument?? I simply said that he thinks torture is good, yet you still feel he is an upstanding person. Why is that?

Rapists think rape is good. I'm sure that would disqualify them from the upstanding person tag. No??

Can't you see the question being asked?

Re read your comments to me skell. You asked a question to me and answered it yourself... I'm not that hard to follow.

I'm not going to defend why I like Hannity.. maybe I just think he is really CUTE.:rolleyes:

Quote:

Originally Posted by excon

Hello Tessy:

I have no problem with retribution or revenge. But, let's call it what it is and not wrap it up hypocrisy. You can't have it both ways. Either it's NOT torture, because doesn't hurt, and we're the good guys (we'd NEVER torture). Or it hurts them a lot, and they DESERVE it.

excon

Ex,

Honestly, I don't KNOW if waterboarding is torture.. some people say it IS.. others say it isn't. ALL I DO KNOW... is they get to LIVE. Our people didn't get that courtesy... Under the Law of Moses ( your Jewish right?) it was an eye for an eye.. sos the way I see it... WE ARE THE GOOD GUYS.. they are still alive and kicken. The best part is, we have people right here in the good ol USA that are all concerned about their "rights" That's fine. That is why I love American... you are free to do that. Funny though, their people were dancing in the streets when ours were TORTURED AND DIED. Oh yes... we are INDEED the good guys.

Hello again, Tessy:

Couple things...

Of course, waterboarding is torture... It's like porn... It either IS porn, or it's NOT. It can't NOT be porn because he only went in 10% of the way, but definitely porn when he goes in 15%. To parse porn that way is ridiculous, isn't it??

Same thing with torture. It can't NOT be torture to be waterboarded for 39 seconds, but definitely torture when waterboarded for 40 seconds. It makes no sense at all.

Like I said above, I have no trouble with retribution. But, let's NOT make a mockery of the law in order to do it.

You SEEM to be coming around.

excon

Exy,

I don't know... are they mamed afterwards? Do they have burns on them so bad they can't be recognized? Is there ONE scar left on their bodies. Are their bones broken and laying in a heap under ton of rubble... I don't know what the definition of torture is... I kind of know what it looks like AFTERWARDS.

Fyi... dude... porn IS torture... UGH :)

torture - Definition from the Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary

Leave Porn alone, Porn has enough trouble on it's own! :P

Quote:

Originally Posted by galveston

Do you understand crucifixion, or are your comments pure hyperbole?

Hello gal:

You seem compartmentalized... Let me see if I can undo that...

In your compartment, they were waterboarded, and that, by itself, can't be torture... They were put in a box, and that, by itself isn't torture. They were not allowed to sleep, and that's not torture. They were subject to all sorts of terrible things, that each one, in and of themselves, aren't torture...

The only way you could come with that conclusion is because you buy the parsing of the word torture. Ok, if I were to take THAT argument at face value, then numbers, instead of the act itself, ARE important. After all, they've determined that some amount of seconds of waterboarding isn't torture, and if one goes beyond that, it's torture. (By the way, how could anybody come up with THAT conclusion?? )

So, if some number, that which if gone beyond, is torture, then I'd ask you, if ONE waterboarding isn't torture, would being waterboarded 68 times in one month be torture??

Speaking of your compartment, you're right, I don't know about crucifixion. But, I don't think that was the only torture Jesus endured. I think he was brutalized long before he was hung on the cross. According to you, the stuff that happened BEFORE he was crucified, isn't to be considered, and if it is, it couldn't be called torture, because crucifixion is torture.

excon

Quote:

Originally Posted by excon

Hello gal:

You seem compartmentalized.... Lemme see if I can undo that...

In your compartment, they were waterboarded, and that, by itself, can't be torture... They were put in a box, and that, by itself isn't torture. They were not allowed to sleep, and that's not torture. They were subject to all sorts of terrible things, that each one, in and of themselves, aren't torture...

The only way you could come with that conclusion is because you buy the parsing of the word torture. Ok, if I were to take THAT argument at face value, then numbers, instead of the act itself, ARE important. After all, they've determined that some amount of seconds of waterboarding isn't torture, and if one goes beyond that, it's torture. (By the way, how could anybody come up with THAT conclusion???)

So, if some number, that which if gone beyond, is torture, then I'd ask you, if ONE waterboarding isn't torture, would being waterboarded 68 times in one month be torture???

Speaking of your compartment, you're right, I don't know about crucifixion. But, I don't think that was the only torture Jesus endured. I think he was brutalized long before he was hung on the cross. According to you, the stuff that happened BEFORE he was crucified, isn't to be considered, and if it is, it couldn't be called torture, because crucifixion is torture.

excon

Don't be ridiculous! I am well aware of the brutalization that Jesus endured before His crucifixion. Are you saying that a Gitmo waterboarding is equal to a Roman flogging?

The reason 39 seconds of water is not torture, while 45 seconds may be is that the guy has to BREATHE sometime. If continued long enough, he would actually drown, and that WOULD be torture. Your definition of torture is unrealistic. I hear that some of the male employees of Fox news were waterboarded. They volunteered for it to make a point.

No Gal that would be murder.

Quote:

Originally Posted by galveston

If continued long enough, he would actually drown, and that WOULD be torture.

So it's only torture when they die? That's your definition?

Quote:

Originally Posted by galveston

I hear that some of the male employees of Fox news were waterboarded. They volunteered for it to make a point.

Fox News demonstrates waterboarding Video

Oh you mean the one where:
1. the reporter had no reason to fear death - he knew he was in a controlled environment.
2. Did you notice how gentle the interregators were? I can't say this for sure, but I'm guessing the CIA is a little more foreceful - I'm assuming they use more than a turkey baster to drop water in someone's nose.
3. As soon as this guy yelled out "stop," they immediately stopped. Do you think actual interregators do that? If this isn't torture, would Fox and friends consider it torture if you continued to do this after being begged to stop.

They guy on fox news even called it torture

Quote:

Originally Posted by galveston

They volunteered for it to make a point.

Hello again, gal:

THAT video??

When asked, by the anchor, "do you consider this technique to be torture, you've experienced it?", the Fox employee said, "I don't see how you could consider it anything else."

THAT point?

excon

Just jumping in for a minute.

Waterboarding - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Long term effects of waterboarding are panic attacks, depression and PTSD. Also there is a large possibility of death, damage to the lungs, broken bones from fighting against restraints.

If that's not torture, I don't want to know what is.

For those of you that think it's okay, that it isn't torture, well then, volunteer to have it done to you, not just a wussy attempt either, but a full on, no choice, interrogation, using this method. If you can look us in the face afterwards and say it isn't torture then I'll let it drop, until then, you don't have any idea what you're talking about.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeedKarma

So it's only torture when they die? That's your definition?

Fox News demonstrates waterboarding Video

Oh you mean the one where:
1. the reporter had no reason to fear death - he knew he was in a controlled environment.
.

EXCELLENT POINT!! You got it! Congratulations!

It was a controlled environment at Gitmo too. Only the waterboardee didn't KNOW that UNTIL Obama told them so!!

So now the intellegence people can say "pretty please". Lots of luck learning anything that way.

I still say your idea of what constitutes torture is ridiculous.

Quote:

Originally Posted by galveston

EXCELLENT POINT!!! You got it! Congratulations!

It was a controlled enviornment at Gitmo too. Only the waterboardee didn't KNOW that UNTIL Obama told them so!!!

Actually I don't get it I guess. Can you explain it? What did Obama have to do with the waterboarding?

Quote:

Originally Posted by classyT

Re read your comments to me skell. you asked a quesion to me and answered it yourself....i'm not that hard to follow.

I'm not going to defend why I like Hannity..maybe i just think he is really CUTE.:rolleyes:

As I said, I used your words. Your answer...

Never mind...

Quote:

Originally Posted by galveston

I still say your idea of what constitutes torture is ridiculous.

What about your FOx News guy that was making your point? He thinks its torture.. Oh, his point isn't relevant now I gather?

Watch the video.

YouTube - STILL Think Waterboarding Isn't Torture? Try it Bush

Still think it isn't torture?

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeedKarma

http://www.gearbits.com/images/thumbs-up.gif

How did you do that thumbs up thing?

I want to hear from the defenders of waterboarding. How they can justify that this is OK?

Nevermind, I ask this way before I read other post. So sorry.

[QUOTE=galveston;1719852]Your reply is kind of what I expected.

Quote:

What they give a pass for to their guys, they will demonize their opposition for, including all manner of vile and profane innuendos and will even manufacture stories if none are available.

Tell me a purely manufactured story please.

Quote:

Originally Posted by classyT

WG,

And just sos ya know.....WG...wWOULDjd....and wWILLjd..gonna be two different things in his Kingdom.

You lost me here. What will Jesus do in his kingdom?:confused:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Altenweg

Just jumping in for a minute.

Waterboarding - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Long term effects of waterboarding are panic attacks, depression and PTSD. Also there is a large possibility of death, damage to the lungs, broken bones from fighting against restraints.

If that's not torture, I don't want to know what is.

For those of you that think it's okay, that it isn't torture, well then, volunteer to have it done to you, not just a wussy attempt either, but a full on, no choice, interrogation, using this method. If you can look us in the face afterwards and say it isn't torture then I'll let it drop, until then, you don't have any idea what you're talking about.

Can't give you a greenie so I'll just say, Amen sista!:D

Quote:

Originally Posted by cozyk

You lost me here. What will Jesus do in his kingdom?:confused:

Cozyk,

The Lord Jesus came to the earth as a Lamb... he is coming back as a Lion and it ain't going to be good for the antichrist and his followers. He won't have to do more than speak and they will die. THEN during the 1000 year reign... The Bible says EVERY morning there will be judgement. Remember during that time there will be no hunger, wars or disasters... 1000 years of peace on earth , plenty of food, no sickness.( yes, people can live for 1000 years IF they abide by the Lord)... PLUS satan will be bound in the bottomless pit... ( therefore the devil DIDN'T make them do it) so there will be no reason to commit crimes. IF someone should outwardly commit sin during this period.. lets just say, they don't get to live to see the next morning.

Quote:

Originally Posted by classyT

Cozyk,

The Lord Jesus came to the earth as a Lamb...he is coming back as a Lion and it ain't gonna be good for the antichrist and his followers. He won't have to do more than speak and they will die. THEN during the 1000 year reign... The Bible says EVERY morning there will be judgement. remember during that time there will be no hunger, wars or disasters....1000 years of peace on earth , plenty of food, no sickness.( yes, people can live for 1000 years IF they abide by the Lord)...PLUS satan will be bound in the bottomless pit...( therefore the devil DIDN"T make them do it) so there will be no reason to commit crimes. IF someone should outwardly commit sin during this period..lets just say, they don't get to live to see the next morning.

Of course, Cozyk, keep in mind, that is an interpretation by only a small fraction of Christians.

WG.

I wouldn't call it SMALL that is YOUR "interpretation". I have NO idea what your take is on the 1000 year reign but I have read your posts that say the book of revelation has already happened... I would say THAT thought is held by a small fraction of Christians.

Cozyk,

I by NO means think I have the market on Christianity... I personally DO believe it is what the Bible teaches.

Quote:

Originally Posted by classyT

I wouldn't call it SMALL that is YOUR "interpretation".

Do you have any stats for us?

Quote:

Originally Posted by classyT

i would say THAT thought is held by a small fraction of Christians.

Not true. Check the stats for this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by classyT

IF someone should outwardly commit sin during this period..lets just say, they don't get to live to see the next morning.

Hello Tess:

Wow. Sounds like Bush on steroids. I certainly wouldn't want to live there. But, I guess I don't have to worry about that, do I? Wheeew!

excon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wondergirl

Of course, Cozyk, keep in mind, that is an interpretation by only a small fraction of Christians.

I think the key word here is "interpretation". We have seen on other threads that when something is left to interpretation, then you have no basis for factual truth. You only have YOUR own personal belief formed through your own perspective .

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wondergirl

Do you have any stats for us?

The view expressed by Classy are pretty common among the various Pentecostal groups.

Here are a few stats:(You can look up the various denominations yourself, if you wish.)

Assemblies of God worldwide: 50-60 million.(The largest Pentecostal group)
Then add the membership of the Church of God (Cleveland, Tenn), Pentecostal Holiness, Pentecostal Church of God, United Pentecostal, Church of God in Christ, Foursquare, and some others, including a lot of independent churches.

And I think the Baptists also hold this view. Baptists, feel free to either confirm or deny this so we will all know.

This is hardly a tiny minority of Christians.

Quote:

Originally Posted by galveston

This is hardly a tiny minority of Christians.

Who's left? How many millions?

Yes, while the number ( so many millions) may sound large it is as noted only a small percent of the entire Christian groups.

It does not even come close to the Catholic, the Orthodox, Lutheran, Anglican and more

Quote:

Originally Posted by excon

Hello Tess:

Wow. Sounds like Bush on steroids. I certainly wouldn't want to live there. But, I guess I don't have to worry about that, do I? Wheeew!

excon

Hey, you are still alive and kicken aren't you. You could come around... stranger things HAVE happened. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by galveston

The view expressed by Classy are pretty common among the various Pentecostal groups.

Here are a few stats:(You can look up the various denominations yourself, if you wish.)

Assemblies of God worldwide: 50-60 million.(The largest Pentecostal group)
Then add in the membership of the Church of God (Cleveland, Tenn), Pentecostal Holiness, Pentecostal Church of God, United Pentecostal, Church of God in Christ, Foursquare, and some others, including a lot of independent churches.

And I think the Baptists also hold this view. Baptists, feel free to either confirm or deny this so we will all know.

This is hardly a tiny minority of Christians.

Thanks Gal. :) I'm with you. I was raised in a place called Plymouth Brethern... very very conservative. I now go to a non denominational church and the Pastor use to preach at a Baptist church.. so SOME Baptist do agree with this view. I believe Charles Stanley does too ( I'm pretty sure he is Baptist)

Quote:

Originally Posted by classyT

Thanks Gal. :) I'm with ya. I was raised in a place called Plymouth Brethern....very very conservative. I now go to a non denominational church and the Pastor use to preach at a Baptist church..so SOME Baptist do agree with this view. I believe Charles Stanley does too ( i'm pretty sure he is Baptist)

So then we can probably add the Baptists to this column. How many millions more is that?
If it is still a minority, it is hardly tiny.

Besides, since when does mere numbers mean any group is right?

Quote:

Originally Posted by excon

Hello Christians:

The other day, Hannity said that he'd torture the Gitmo detainees himself, if he could, and he finished by saying, "and I'm a Christian". I guess he meant that torture isn't against anything Christianlike..

However, I started to think about how Jesus was crucified. Isn't crucifixion torture? I think it is. Wasn't Jesus tortured to death??? I think he was.

I don't understand, then, how a Christian can be OK with torture. Tell me where I'm wrong.

excon

Excon, regardless of what "Christians" have said here, be assured that torture is absolutely antithetical to Christianity - and, for that matter, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism, and, yes, even Islam.

These pages, for whatever reason, seem to attract the wackos of religion - the sad, marginalized people who populate the fringes of all faiths. Fundamentalists come in all shapes and sizes, and in all religions.

In the US, for the last 30 years or so, they have raised their political voice and go along with just about anything their favored politicians feed them. If they could read, and open a book, they would see how these very blind acceptances have lead to the horrors of the 20th century.

And, yes, Hannity is a wacko.