Quote:

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Originally Posted by arcura

Cred,
That about American id just plain fooy.
Fred

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There is an "edit" facility here, Fred. "fooy"??

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I stated to Galveston :

"As you are a US American (at least I think you are) :

Your extremely capitalistic system "lives" at the expense of the most weak, the most needed in the world. Locally and worldwide.
Your system is at the basis of a lot of profound misery for billions of human beings worldwide.
Jesus tought socialism (note : not communism).

I see only very few real socialists in the US ....."

Dear Fred : the economic crisis in the US and the ripples that cause in the US and worldwide just underlines that what I stated is true. That crisis was caused by capitalistic greed and nothing else. And who - in the end - will pay the bill for that ? The common Mr and Mrs. Jones. The poor, the needed, and the "common man". No golden handshakes for them.
And you see now two main US political parties who - while Rome burns - do not really do their best to sort the problem out, but who in reality are continuing their election race, and misuse this crisis to blame the other party.

Therefore I state once more , as the consequences of these actions are economically worldwide :

Your US extremely capitalistic system "lives" at the expense of the most weak, the most needed in the world. Locally and worldwide.
Your system is at the basis of a lot of profound misery for billions of human beings worldwide.
Jesus tought socialism (note : not communism).

But with so many US Christians I see only very few of these real "Jesus" socialists in the US ...

Draw your own conclusions, Fred!!

:rolleyes:

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Cred,
Thanks for once again expressing your hate of the USA.
Fred

Yes we're horrible, which is why we have to have immigration laws and quotas to keep people from flooding into this horrible country and sneaking in anyway and fighting extradition or deportation

Now Cred's post is really interesting. He has told us repeatedly that he doesn't believe the Bible. Now he is telling us that Jesus taught socialism. Where did he get that idea? Is he now going to appeal to the Bible as PROOF that Jesus taught socialism?

Please don't encourage him. He IS full of helpful ideas at times and has no reservations about sharing them with us though

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wildandblue and Galveston1

Yes we're horrible, which is why we have to have immigration laws and quotas to keep people from flooding into this horrible country and sneaking in anyway and fighting extradition or deportation

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I will not go into the political and social causes of that, as that goes further away from the topic.
Just one point : do you really think you can HONESTLY say that the US and all it's citizens have the interest of all of humanity in their mind - just as Jesus taught - instead of the basically "me, myself, and I" approach?

I do not hate US americans, as Fred suggested. I only wonder why (and actually regret that) the USA and it's approx. 300 million people which I admire for it's beauty and qualities - like purposeful and efficient working - could stray away so far from basic social underlining of society in general. You people have perfected a way of living that is in some way related to vultures who feed on the carcasses of their own, as long as they can fill their bellies, and who do so without any second thoughts.
Here in W. Europe we also have a capitalistic system, but one co-based on social responsibility - a system not as effective as the US system, but with a lot higher content of fairness towards the interests of all others involved.

Returning to Luke 4 - 18/19 : instead of preaching the gospel to the poor, you may show more interest on why they are poor, and help them to improve themselves, even if that goes for part at your own interest and expense. In my views that social aspect is more important than preaching something you - seen from your own actions - clearly do not believe or adhere to yourself...

:rolleyes:

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Cred,
Preaching to the poor at heart; those who are spiritually bankrupt are who Jesus was talking about.
Be prepared to get some preaching to you about that; particularly from folks like Tj3.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

Quote:

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Originally Posted by arcura

Cred,
Preaching to the poor at heart; those who are spiritually bankrupt are who Jesus was talking about.
Be prepared to get some preaching to you about that; particularly from folks like Tj3.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

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Dear Fred, Jesus may have been talking about that kind of poor, the real world is full of people who are financially so poor, that they do not know in the morning if there will be food for an evening meal.
I KNOW (not believe) that , because I lived between them for years during my Africa experience, and I shared my food with them.

(Spiritual) thinking is also important , but on an empty belly thinking is considerably less effective (and that is a fact !).

Thanks for the warning, but I do not have much problems with those who try to preach to me. Specially if that is done by haughty hypocrites with a personal agenda ! I am sure you know what I mean!!

Have a nice day, my friend !

:)

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If I was starving and someone tried to talk to me about how much God loved me. I would wonder why God would starve me. But even Jesus fed his followers when they were hungry-the fish and the loaves? He took all of he had and shared it. You know I've always though of Jesus as the original hippie. I think the US should consider some forms of socialism. Like healthcare. The Ownership system of the current party has proved ineffective so far.
Ps. This is not an attack! This is only my opinion

spyderglass,
They way I read scripture on that is that it is we who are to share, not the government forcing us to share via taxing, raking off some, and then spreading it about as the government sees fit.
We now see who they favor (not the people) and the do nothing congress has just do nothing again.
So much for the Christian attitude in the USA government.
Jesus intentions according to that passage were good, what He was sent to do.
Congress is not doing what it was sent to do.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

Christianity: I have three coats and my neighbor has none. I give him one of my coats.

Socialism: I have three coats and my neighbor has none. The government takes 2 of my coats away, gives one to my neighbor and keeps the other one.

Communism: The government has all the coats, winter is coming and neither me or my neighbor has a coat. We work for the government so we will have a coat. Next July, we each get a coat, maybe.

Galveston1
That seem to be the way things are and work.
Fred

Quote:

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Originally Posted by spyderglass

If I was starving and someone tried to talk to me about how much God loved me. I would wonder why God would starve me. But even Jesus fed his followers when they were hungry-the fish and the loaves? He took all of he had and shared it. You know I've always though of Jesus as the original hippie. I think the US should consider some forms of socialism. Like healthcare. The Ownership system of the current party has proved ineffective so far.
ps. this is not an attack! this is only my opinion

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Spyderglass : from the Bible it is easy to see that Jesus had strong social(istic) tendencies.
Surely not capitalistic ideas.
And yes : I agree with you with your views on changes to the US system.

But as the political clique can not even agree on saving their own economy, I strongly doubt that such changes will ever be implemented...

:)

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Galveston1

.... "I have three coats" ...

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And if you have an American capitalistic coat, the banks offers you forward options and credit for that coat, the bank managers end up with golden handshakes, and you end up with no coat at all while the politicians are arguing on the way they want to save the economy so that you can buy another coat with your credit card...


:D :rolleyes: :p :) ;) :D

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Cred,
LOL...
That could be.
Fred

If I have an agenda it's news to me
I heard something just like this coat business only it involved cows.
A lot of our current crisis is due to bad mortgage loans. A lot of the homes or at least the loans are actually owned by by overseas banks or buyers. So why should the American taxpayer bail them out? We are just enslaving ourselves to foreign governments on top of all the cash leaving to pay our thirst for oil like that Texas oil guy on TV says. Tell them if they want their money, come and get it. (Or pry it out of our cold dead hands.)
Apologies to our new member byiki we all should not be hijacking his post an ignoring his question.

wildandblue
Please back to the subject.
But a lot more of the people will be much hurt IF the do nothing congress still does nothing.
At least Jesus did what He was supposed to do according to that passage.
Peace and kindness,
Fred (arcura)