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Originally Posted by Wondergirl

I went back over a number of Christianity threads and fail to see where anyone is being coerced to become a Christian. Or is that happening via PMs? Or are you talking about real life?

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You are relatively "new" her on "Religious discussions" but it is going on in almost all posts.
And not only experienced by myself.
I respect everyone religious belief, but I am NOT interested in Christianity, nor in Christian "salvation".

;) (happy now without blinking ?)

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Originally Posted by Credendovidis

You are relatively "new" her on "Religious discussions" but it is going on in almost all posts.
And not only experienced by myself.
I respect everyone religious belief, but I am NOT interested in Christianity, nor in Christian "salvation".

;) (happy now without blinking ?)

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I'm not new here; I rarely post on Christianity because doing so is so unsatisfying most of the time.

I didn't notice where you or anyone else was being coerced. Yes, there were strong and vehement arguments in favor of Christianity, but no one was being threatened with hellfire (except in the case of a few moral enemies that have done so on other sites -- I get around, John.) I'll have to check back re Alty's experience.

(By stopping eye-rolling, you've just saved me a long-distance call to my mom. Thanks.)

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Originally Posted by Wondergirl

I'm not new here; I rarely post on Christianity because doing so is so unsatisfying most of the time.

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That is why I stated "relatively"...

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Credendovidis

That is why I stated "relatively" ....

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We might be related, you say?

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Originally Posted by Wondergirl

We might be related, you say?

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I'm just a simple European male who speaks his English (as his third language) a lot better than most of you gringo's do. But yes : I make sometimes spelling mistakes. Don't you?

:D

PS : I'm going now in horizontal mode for some hours to reload the batteries...

:D

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Originally Posted by Credendovidis

I'm just a simple European male who speaks his English (as his third language) a lot better than most of you gringo's do. But yes : I make sometimes spelling mistakes. Don't you?

:D

PS : I'm going now in horizontal mode for some hours to reload the batteries ....

:D

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Sleep well.

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Originally Posted by Credendovidis

Unfortunately the cult of Catholicism is commonly confused with Christianity.
Catholicism a cult? It all depends on your parameters !
If parameters are properly "adapted", even Christianity becomes a cult !

anything that involves legalism and departs from the teaching of the bible in my opinion would be a cult. Note I said my opinion, so yes it must depend on my parameters.

Its not a matter of "recruiting". It's a matter of do you believe christ died on the cross for your sins. Christians are typically only concerned for salvation (true salvation).
Altenweg is NOT a Christian but a DEIST !!! "Salvation" is not her concern nor her goal.

You see my friend, when someone answers a question you need to stop taking it personal. When Alt posted her comments it was then open for someone to post a "Conversational Response". Of coarse if I post something, it will be from my christian point of view. You continue to post that you are superior in intellect but seem to lack the ability to differentiate conversation from coercion

Most of your post imply that an opinion is more valid if they do not include a christian point of view.

Typically Christians "true Christians" are very adamant when it comes the means of salvation.
That may be so, but once someone has clearly and beyond any doubt stated not to be interested in "Christian salvation", the constant pushing for conversion should stop.

When you hear the mere mention of Christianity it drives you crazy doesn't it? Why do they always talk about Christ and salvation? OMG they are trying to make me a Christian!! Why does someone who knows a lot about a topic always direct a conversation towards that topic. Christians can relate to other Christians from all walks of life on this common ground. We can also weed out the Non-Christians the same way. Ultimately I want to surround myself with like minded people. It's a double edged sword.

Secondly as Christians we are called to spread the gospel. Spread, not convert..I can't convert you only God can. Only if you (not "you" anyone) are called. Not everyone is called. Actually very few are, even the ones who "think" they are not always saved.

Get over the self centered feeling that its all about you...

You do not see Altenweg pushing anyone for conversion to Deism.
You do not see any Secular Humanist here pushing anyone for conversion to Secular Humanism.
really? I have seen ton's of secular humanism agendas in past post..so..hmm

Just some thoughts too !

:rolleyes:

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I would roll my eyes, but I am not as trite..

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Secondly as Christians we are called to spread the gospel. Spread, not convert..

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And you do so even when someone says they don't want to hear it. That's the problem I have.

In every thread about religion there are Christians telling you to "read the bible", "go to church", believe, believe, believe. When I tell them that I do believe, they question my beliefs. Why, because I'm not a Christian, therefore, in there eyes, I don't believe, or not enough for them anyway.

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Of coarse if I post something, it will be from my christian point of view.

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And when I post something it's from my Deist point of view. When Cred posts something it's from a Secular Humanist's point of view. Are we not allowed to state our point of view as well?

Do you see the double standard? I do.

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

And when I post something it's from my Deist point of view. When Cred posts something it's from a Secular Humanist's point of view. Are we not allowed to state our point of view as well?

Do you see the double standard? I do.

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Double standard? I welcome your point of view, and will counter with my point of view. It is called a conversation. We do not have to agree on a topic to have a conversation. Or is that what you are saying? It's a double standard unless I share your point of view?

You can't support your point of view without give some substance to back it up. I am sorry you think that when I support my information with my opinion and beliefs, those words are "bible beating" you into submission. That concept from educated people is almost comical to hear as an argument.

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

And you do so even when someone says they don't want to hear it. That's the problem I have.

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So, when a christian comes up to you on the streets preaching the gospel and you tell them you are not interested they stand there and don't let you walk away?

When you come to a religion topical conversation on the internet and a christian gives you their beliefs again you can not just take it or leave it?

I must be confused because it sounds like you are saying again that if someone says something that you don't share the same view on, they shouldn't be allowed to say it?

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

Why, because I'm not a Christian, therefore, in there eyes, I don't believe, or not enough for them anyway.

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Why are you concerned what any christian believes you believe if you are satisfied and happy in your beliefs?

You welcome my point of view? Really?

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Ultimately I want to surround myself with like minded people.

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I am not like minded, so why are you bothering to try and converse with me?

Also, a conversation is usually pleasant, one side speaks, the other side listens and then states their side in a nice, polite way. Even if we disagree, we can still be polite.

You posts are filled with anger and aggression, that's not the way I like to converse.

If you really want a conversation, I'm all for it. What I'm against is another argument, and I will not be brought in to one by you or anyone else, not anymore.

I've said what I wanted to say, if you can actually have a rational discussion about our differences, than let me know, I'm more than willing to discuss this with you, but not if every one of my posts is picked apart by you.

Good luck.

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

I am not like minded, so why are you bothering to try and converse with me?

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With the anonymity of a Q&A board we are not actually surrounding ourselves so that question really has no merit.

This is an interesting conversation that I would like to understand more about why you have such disdain for Christians. You have posted your thoughts and I have posted mine. Not totally sure where you get the anger. On the contrary, I am not even slightly angered.

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

Also, a conversation is usually pleasant, one side speaks, the other side listens and then states their side in a nice, polite way. Even if we disagree, we can still be polite.

You posts are filled with anger and aggression, that's not the way I like to converse.

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Hmm, so posing question, valid and concise is now anger and aggression?

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

If you really want a conversation, I'm all for it. What I'm against is another argument, and I will not be brought in to one by you or anyone else, not anymore.

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Again how quickly a conversation goes from a conversation to an argument when the two sides don't agree. Interesting.

My last question stands.. If you are satisfied in your beliefs, then why would anything a christian say bother you in any way?

When I answer a valid question and pose one of my own you are upset?

Your whole tone is confrontational, if you can't see that then I'm sorry.

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My last question stands.. If you are satisfied in your beliefs, then why would anything a christian say bother you in any way?

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I am satisfied in my beliefs, and I am curious of others beliefs. That curiosity doesn't mean I'm searching for something different. I would like to know why people believe the things they do.

Now, why are you so eager to have a conversation with a Deist? What do you hope to gain from this conversation? Are you really interested in my beliefs, or just hoping to be able to interject yours into the conversation? Are you really listening to what I say, or are you just waiting for the opportunity to pick apart my words to use to your benefit?

As for your other question, no I'm not upset. I just won't allow myself to become involved in another religious fight. Like I said before, if you want to converse then lets be civil. If you refuse to be civil, then I will not be a part of this "conversation".

I do believe that people with different views can have rational discussion, but it's takes two people, just like it takes two to fight.

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

Your whole tone is confrontational, if you can't see that then I'm sorry.

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Alt, taking a tone from something written is self imposed. I apologize if you perceive my tone to be anything but inquisitive. Truly, that isn't the "tone" I am trying to impart.

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

I am satisfied in my beliefs, and I am curious of others beliefs. That curiosity doesn't mean I'm searching for something different. I would like to know why people believe the things they do.

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With complete respect to that statement, earlier in the thread I posted a brief description of why the "christian" believes and does what they do. I also am always curious as to what people believe and why.

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

Now, why are you so eager to have a conversation with a Deist? What do you hope to gain from this conversation? Are you really interested in my beliefs, or just hoping to be able to interject yours into the conversation? Are you really listening to what I say, or are you just waiting for the opportunity to pick apart my words to use to your benefit?

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You seem like a smart and passionate person who can have a challenging conversation. Gain? Nothing but insight.

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

As for your other question, no I'm not upset. I just won't allow myself to become involved in another religious fight. Like I said before, if you want to converse then lets be civil. If you refuse to be civil, then I will not be a part of this "conversation".

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Pro's and con's of a discussion board. One can perceive something completely opposite of the intended meaning. I believe a lot of that is predisposed in ones personality. That is my opinion of coarse so please don't consider that some veiled attack. Just thinking out loud.

This is a stimulating conversation in which uncharacteristically of myself I am not keeping silent. My normal MO is to make a point and bow out gracefully, but I have been stirred to continue. I see a lot of "Christian Hating" on this board which is very sad. Sadly a lot of that is due to "so called Christians" misrepresenting the faith.

Your faith, while not the one I share, is valid for you. My point, long in the making, is that if you are satisfied by your faith then you should be able to dismiss those you think are "judging" you. Anyone's opinion on your beliefs should never have any weight. Stay solid in your faith if you believe that is the road to your salvation.

Now, this is where I would share (not even so much to your benefit but someone who might read this) what I think would be the (in my belief system) true road to salvation. But, again I have already done that, and that isn't the point of this particular post.

God bless you alt :D

I'm sorry if it sounds like I hate Christians, because I really don't. If that's how my posts come across then I truly apologize.

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Sadly a lot of that is due to "so called Christians" misrepresenting the faith.

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Christians aren't the only ones. In every religion there are good an bad, people who follow the true nature of their belief, and those that take that belief and twist it to do harm.

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Pro's and con's of a discussion board. One can perceive something completely opposite of the intended meaning.

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Very true. Unfortunately we cannot talk to each other face to face, and a lot of things are misconstrued in the written word that wouldn't be if we could hear the persons voice.

God bless you too Smoked. :)

Altenweg and Smoked,
It is my opinion derived from being on this board for quite awhile that there is a higher percentage of Christians here who are tolerant, respectful and loving than I have seen on other boards.
Yes we do have a few who are more than assertive, even aggressive, but on other boards it appears to me to be a greater percentage than here.
In my case I am here to two reasons.
1. To see and try to understand other's point of view and opinions whether Chrsitian or not.
2. To express my opinions and see how others respond to them.
I have learned a lot from the several similar boards I have been on over the years.
I try to be respectful all the time, but I admit that I have failed from time to time.
I think that MOST people here can truthfully say the same or words to that effect.
I continue to hope for and wish all to have much peace and kindness, give and take,
Fred (arcura)

Fred,

This is the only board I've ever been a member of, so I can't speak for other boards.

From what I've seen I'd say you are correct, most of the Christians here are tolerant and respectful, there are only a few that aren't. Sadly, the bad always sticks out more than the good.

I too try to be respectful, and I too fail, more often then I care to. I'm a thick headed, stubborn German woman, I can't help myself. ;)

Peace and kindness to you as well. God Bless. :)

Alty

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

I'm a thick headed, stubborn German woman

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No, no, no. You are a pragmatic, strong-minded German freulein who gets things done. (I know. My ancestors are from Hannover.)

Altenweg,
I respect your choice of belief as I do of others.
We all have beliefs. Even the atheists have beliefs or various sorts.
In many counties it is OK, even encouraged, to have and be able to express one's beliefs.
I'm all for that.
I'm also of German extraction as well as from other counties.
I guess I'm a mongrel with blood from about 5 counties.
It's no wonder then (If ethnic blood tells what we are like) that I can be a different person at different times.
LOL
Peace and kindness,
Fred (arcura)

Wondergirl,
I think you got that right about Alenweg.
Peace and kindness,
Fred