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Originally Posted by michealb

Actually when you have evidence for things they stop becoming beliefs and become facts. When you don't have evidence they are beliefs. You can believe something other than the facts but that doesn't make the facts beliefs.

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Yes, I am yet to see Cred prove that his belief that God is a myth, is an actual Fact. Until he proves it.. it remains another one of his many BELIEFS.

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Originally Posted by sassyT

Oh Okey, i see.. if you are talking about the kinds of studies that can be done as Michealb said above then these studdies have already been done.
Check these articles out.


Researchers Look at Prayer and Healing
HowStuffWorks "Can prayer heal people?"
Prayer and Faith Healing, Proof that prayer works
Scientific Evidence of Prayer, Miracles, God and Christianity

The bottom line is miracles happen everyday. Like i said i have witnessed my own brother healed from full blow AIDS by the power of God. Now my brother travels the world preaching the gospel sharing his testimony with the world. I dont need science to prove God does miracles, because i have seen them first hand in my own life.
If you choose to believe you can experience the same miracles yourself. Nothing is impossible to them that believe! :D

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Those links all confirm that there is scant scientific evidence for intercessory prayer providing any benefit.

It's quite easy to show that miracles happen everyday. If you define a miracle as an event that has a 1 in a million chance of happening, and assume that the average person witnesses one event every second, then the average person should expect a miracle once every 30 days. Miracles are normal without God. Statistical anomalies are to be expected - we live in a statistical world.

God is a negative. You can't disprove a god. Until he is proven he remains a negative and it is a fact that he doesn't exist. Just as I have no evidence that a teapot doesn't orbit between here and mars but it's still a fact that there is no teapot in orbit between here and mars. That is the way you have to address things in a logical world to do other wise is fantasy.

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Originally Posted by Capuchin

Those links all confirm that there is scant scientific evidence for intercessory prayer providing any benefit.

It's quite easy to show that miracles happen everyday. If you define a miracle as an event that has a 1 in a million chance of happening, and assume that the average person witnesses one event every second, then the average person should expect a miracle once every 30 days. Miracles are normal without God. Statistical anomalies are to be expected - we live in a statistical world.

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Like I said before, your believing or disbelieving in miracles has not material effect on the fact that God does miracles in my life and many other Christians everyday. I am not here to convince or convert you, so I am not going to argue with you. So if you believe miracles don't happen, good for you, that is just your opnion on the matter. So lets just leave it at that. ;)

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Originally Posted by sassyT

I am not here to convince or convert you

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So why did you start this thread?

Have you ever seen magma? No? But yet, you claim to KNOW it exists. Sure, you say, others have seen it and proved it. But not YOU. Others claim to have seen God and KNOW Him to be true. Why would it be true for one thing but not true for the other?

To say that it is fact that God doesn't exist because His existence hasn't been proven my our limited minds is just ignorant.

sassyT,
Science HAS investigates and confirmed MANY miracles. Most of them were healings.
Just like your father.
He had HIV killing him now he does not.
Science conformed that the healing to place.
Such healing have taken place in recent years in many places around the world.
And science confirmed that they did take place.
Those are fact of science.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

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Originally Posted by michealb

God is a negative. You can't disprove a god. Until he is proven he remains a negative and it is a fact that he doesn't exist. Just as I have no evidence that a teapot doesn't orbit between here and mars but it's still a fact that there is no teapot in orbit between here and mars. That is the way you have to address things in a logical world to do other wise is fantasy.

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God is a negative to you yes because you don't know Him. I know Him so he is not a negative to me.

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Originally Posted by DrJizzle

Have you ever seen magma? no? but yet, you claim to KNOW it exists. Sure, you say, others have seen it and proved it. But not YOU. Others claim to have seen God and KNOW Him to be true. Why would it be true for one thing but not true for the other?

To say that it is fact that God doesn't exist because His existence hasn't been proven my our limited minds is just ignorant.

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That true.. lol these athiests should speak for themselves. Just because they have not had the opportunity to encounter God, they think that means he does not exist. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by DrJizzle

Have you ever seen magma? no? but yet, you claim to KNOW it exists. Sure, you say, others have seen it and proved it. But not YOU. Others claim to have seen God and KNOW Him to be true. Why would it be true for one thing but not true for the other?

To say that it is fact that God doesn't exist because His existence hasn't been proven my our limited minds is just ignorant.

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Your mind might be limited. I however am one of the smartest beings in the solar system perhaps the universe. If I don't believe in magma and want proof I can go see magma. If I want to see god, I can't go see him. It's more like bigfoot people claim to see and know bigfoot and if you ask the general population they will tell you he is real but he really doesn't exist.

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Originally Posted by DrJizzle

Have you ever seen magma? no? but yet, you claim to KNOW it exists. Sure, you say, others have seen it and proved it. But not YOU. Others claim to have seen God and KNOW Him to be true. Why would it be true for one thing but not true for the other?.

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Originally Posted by michealb

Your mind might be limited. I however am one of the smartest beings in the solar system perhaps the universe. If I don't believe in magma and want proof I can go see magma. If I want to see god, I can't go see him. It's more like bigfoot people claim to see and know bigfoot and if you ask the general population they will tell you he is real but he really doesn't exist.

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Well, 2nd smartest being at best ;)

And you are correct. If you want proof that magma exists, you can go see magma. But of course, you first must be open to the possibility that magma exists in the first place.

And if you want proof that God exists, you can go see God. Of course, you first must be open to the possibility that God exists in the first place.

And of course, you would need a clear definition of what both magma and God really are.

The general populations opinion does not concern more nor does it have an effect on what I know to be true.

[quote=NeedKarma]

Nice magma video dude! What did they use? CGI? Lol

Check it out! BigFoot!

YouTube - BigFoot sighting

It seems to me that with this thread religion starts now catching up with the possibility that God is no longer surely established after thousand of years ago because of science...

:D :D :D :D :D :D

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And if you want proof that God exists, you can go see God. Of course, you first must be open to the possibility that God exists in the first place.

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Where do you keep him? If you can prove god to everyone like you can magma why are there so many religions? Surely if god speaks to those that listen some one is being told wrong information. Which means either there are multiple gods telling different people different things or people think they are talking to god and really only talking to themselves. I know my answer.

Michaelb,
God does exist for billions of people. They know Him and pray to Him. He answers many of their prayers and yet today still performs miracles.
That is enough proof for me and many millions of others.
As far as I am concerned He save my life during the Korean War and has answered many of my prayers.
That and more has established my religious faith.
A religious faith is much more that JUST belief.
It is belief plus trust and a knowing.
I know that God exist and my savior lives.
I am very comfortable with that.
I just though that you might like to know.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

God does exist to billions of people
God also doesn't exist to billions of people
Also billions of people believe in a different god.
Who all feel that god is speaking to them but god says different things to different people.
So either there are multiple gods or someone is wrong. If someone is wrong that means everyone is likely to be wrong.

michealb,
I do not agree with your conclusion.
The God of all deals with His children His way not to our way of thinking.
Peace and kindness,
Fred.

So do you believe that all religions are equally true? Even the new ones and that they all are inspired by the same god he just tells them to do different things?

So even people that worship Zeus worship your god they just don't know it because your god told them something different?

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Originally Posted by michealb

Where do you keep him? If you can prove god to everyone like you can magma why are there so many religions? Surely if god speaks to those that listen some one is being told wrong information. Which means either there are multiple gods telling different people different things or people think they are talking to god and really only talking to themselves. I know my answer.

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I keep Him in my pocket. Luckily for me, He can shrink from infinite-size to pocket-size... for easy travel.

Maybe I should state that I am not exactly a Christian... and I would certainly not try to prove that God exists by referencing the Bible or reciting clichés.

And also, I didn't say that I can prove God to you or anyone other than myself. What I said was if YOU want to go see God, YOU can go see God... but first, you must be open to possibility that God exists... which it's clear, you're not.

Where were we going with this?

Oh yeah... that.

I'm pretty sure God is NOT the white-bearded dude sitting in a golden chair that floats on top of the clouds. I'm pretty sure that no one can quite fathom just what God is... but the simple fact, there is no better word to refer to God other than God... and at the same time, there is no worse word.

The problem is that man doesn't have the vocabulary to explain God... we don't even have the wisdom/knowledge to understand God.

We use words like "spoke into existence" because we had no other way to try and describe whatever it was that happened.

We ARE created in His image... but so is everything. It's like saying that atom created the molecule in Its image... well duh. God is me, God is you, God is ice cream, God is AIDS, God is Life and God is Death, God is Buddha, God is Christ, God is Allah, God is the Devil (I know some of you are just loving this right now)... simply put, God is.

But the last place you want to look for God is in Religion.

I understand that Science tries to rebuke God but really, the battle is between Science and Religion. God is not hard to prove, if you are willing. Religion, on the other hand, is impossible.

</ramblingsofamadman?>

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Originally Posted by arcura

The God of all deals with His children His way not to our way of thinking.

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Remember Pascal's Wager, Fred : if you believe in the wrong "God" you are damned...
But nobody can prove that he/she believes in the right "God".
And nobody can prove that there is a right "God/Gods".
So is/are there (a) right "God/Gods". Or is that BELIEF BASED ONLY??

On what OSE can Christians base their BELIEF that they have "right" "God"?

:rolleyes:

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