To make a long and painful story somewhat shorter. Was dating my girlfriend for 5 years; I am now 33 and she is 27. About a year ago she moved in with me in an apartment I was renting. At that point things started to go somewhat down hill. She became very moody and we had our first arguments ever in 4 years over very stupid things (going to bars with friends, etc.). Despite the conflict, we always worked out our differences and said that in the end there was no one else in the world that we would spend the rest of our lives with. She wanted to be married so badly and gave me a deadline of her 27th birthday for me to propose to her. I needed to get a few things in my life together (finishing grad school, etc.) so I didn't meet the deadline, but I bought the ring and planned on doing it soon thereafter. I did, however, have some doubts if I was doing the right thing.

A month ago, two months after her 27th birthday, we got in a huge fight based on the fact that she wanted to be married and was tired of waiting and us disagreeing about things; she moved back to her mom's house. She said that the reason we weren't getting along since she moved in was that she wanted to be married so badly and was resentful of our current situation. The move devistated both of us but the next day we agreed that we couldn't live without each other. We agreed that we would make it work despite the new living situation and that we loved each other. This went on for over a month, us seeing each other and things were going OK. I believed we were making progress and that we were planning on working back to the point we needed to be to be together forever. We discussed moving in together again and starting our life.

Two weeks ago, she told me "I love you, there is no one I would rather be with. I want to marry you". Then two days later, out of the blue, she told me, "It's not that I don't want to be in a relationship with you anymore, but I need some time to live my life for myself because I was so dependent on you and I want us to be together but without any complications or fighting in our lives. I just want to go out with my friends and have a good time. I have no interest in dating other men though." The next day, she came over to spend the night, telling me "she loved me multiple times and asking me if I still loved her, but said she still needed to find herself on her own and we would see each other when we see each other and just enjoy life".

After reading info on this site, I got it in my head that she was breaking up with me in a nice way or trying to simply keep me on the back burner and decided that the only way I could win her back was to go NC to make her miss me and realize she needed me in her life and it was all or nothing. I stopped taking her calls for three days and throughout that time she sent me at least one or two emails/txts per day, asking how my day was or telling me to have a good day. Two days after this we were supposed to go to a wedding together. A day before the wedding she asked me if I still wanted to go with her and I replied that I would because I already RSVP'd with her. To which she responded, "Nevermind, I don't want to deal with the akwardness of us being together there... let's do something the day after the wedding instead". I responded that I couldn't meet her that day but that we would get together when we were both free next. She seemed upset and said "whenever you decide to make time for me then".

I again went NC for two days but broke down the day after and asked her to meet me for lunch. She responded, "So you want to see me now that you are free? When do you want to meet?" I told her that afternoon, to which she respoded, "Seeing you will only make things more difficult. I need some time. Maybe after we've had some time to work on ourselves we can get together.".

So, did the NC drive her from wanting to see me one day and then two days later not wanting to see me? How is this possible? Last week she loves me and wants to spend our life together and now she doesn't even want to see me?

What do I do now? I'm devistated - can't eat/sleep - it's all I can think about knowing that I will NEVER find someone in life as attractive and with so much in common (trust me I've dated many girls over the past 20 years and none has ever come even close - and my friends and family agree).

She's not the independent type; has always had a boyfriend. I am almost positive she hasn't moved on to someone else, but can't fight the suspicion... why would she not want to see me at all and why would this come on so suddenly unless there is someone else? I saw her sister randomally last night and she mentioned that she has drastically died her hair and is making appointments with plastic surgeons to get a nose job and breast implants - something which she was previously totally opposed to. What does that mean?

So, what's the right move? Total NC or has that already ruined things? Is there a chance or is it time to give up? I haven't contacted her, it's been the 3 worst days of my life, and she hasn't contacted me.

You didn't deliver what she was demanding,a proposal and her feelings have changed.

You weren't ready to commit to marriage,and I suspect there were underlying issues between you that were never discussed.

You stay with the no contact and get your life back on track.

Read the stickies at the top of the relationship page for more advice on how to handle a breakup.

First of all, thank you from the bottom of my heart for breaking your post into paragraphs and making your situation easy to read! Also, thank you for your clear writing.

Okay, you seem to realize she's a needy, dependent person. She needs to have a boyfriend in her life and, now that she doesn't have one, she needs to dye her hair and get cosmetic surgery done. This will accomplish what for her?

Even though you say she is the love of your life, do you really want to be on her emotional rollercoaster for the rest of your life? If not, then what? Can you accompany her if she is willing to take her rollercoaster back to the factory for rehab, or can you maintain total NC and find a safer rollercoaster?

Unfortunately, I can somewhat relate to this girl.

She wants to get married. She wants to start a life with you.. Its been 5 wonderful years.. why hasn't things moved forward?

I firmly believe that you get married out of love and compassion... Not because the situation is finally good enough to get married.

Her reasons are her own on why she wants to get cosmetic surgery. No one will really understand why except for her.

If you love her and can see yourself with her for the rest of your life.. then what's holding you back? She obviously wanted to be with you. You didn't budge. She saw herself in a dead end relationship that wasn't moving forward, so she decided to back off it seems. Could she be seeing someone else? Maybe. Its hard to say. She could be completely heart broken because the man of her dreams doesn't want to marry her. She might not know what to do with herself because her relationship seemingly fell apart on her just as much as it did on you.

I think both of you need to take a break from the intense relationship that you both had going. Maybe go back to the basics?

Good luck

Unfortunately, at this point she wants nothing to do with me? I think, otherwise she would contact me, as she was the one that said she wanted time? Unless, it was the NC that I was advised to use that pushed her past the brink of wanting to speak with me?

I told her on more than one occasion over the past month that I wanted to work things out between us despite everything that has happened so we could get back to where we were and, yes, eventually get engaged/married as we planned. I thought that is what we were doing. Then, only days after saying she loved me and wanted to spend the rest of her life with me, I got the line about she "needed time to enjoy herself" and "seeing me would only make things more difficult"?

I guess what I don't understand is the drastic and sudden flip-flop? After 5 years, how do you go from one day wanting (or at least saying you want) to spend the rest of your life with someone and the next not wanting to see them - when nothing happened in between? I guess the obvious answer is her feelings changed overnight, or she was lying about her intentions.

The drastic makeover and sudden need for cosmetic surgery, something she was previously adamentally opposed to, only says one thing to me - she wants attention from other men and wants to move on. Which hurts when she told me she had no interested in other men. Again, maybe not being honest?

Despite everything that has happened, I was/am willing to try and work things out. So what do you do when you believe you are letting the love of your life go but you really have no options? I'm not sure this whole NC thing was all that it is cracked up to be... maybe it's only value is saving face for yourself - rather than taking a chance on doing everything possible to win that person back?

You had your window and you missed it. Do I think it’s right for her give you a deadline? Not necessarily but 5 years is a long time and you, like myself blew it. Her feelings changed, and although likely not overnight, she left.

As far as NC ruining your chances, I doubt that. After my ex left, I begged and pleaded with here for a month (we were on a break but not broken up) I even told her I would marry her that day if she just came home. The point is it was too late and her feelings had changed, there is nothing you can do to bring her back. Do not contact her, if she wants you back she will let you know.

NC and try and move on and stay busy!

NC is for a person to heal after a breakup,its not a tool to get somebody back.

I don't think her feelings changed overnight,they probably changed over a period.

What's seems obvious to me is that she isn't willing to try to work things out.

So,your best option is to start moving on,and heal from the breakup.

So a quick update.

To provide some context, when the x and I moved in together, she wanted a dog. So we adopted one because she wanted one, not me, but I agreed. 6 months later she adopted another dog, so the first dog would have a friend. Again, not really what I wanted, but I again agreed. 6 months after that, she felt she needed to adopt a 3rd dog - which I vehemently opposed. She did it anyway. When we broke up -she took all 3 dogs with her to her sister's house.

So, after 4 days of NC, I get a txt last night from Lindsay, simply asking me if I would keep one of her/our former 3 dogs because she is moving out of her sister's house into a friend's condo that only allows 2 pets. If not she would have to find a stranger to keep one dog or ask her sister who is allergic and hates dogs to keep it. This infuriated me.

There is no way I am going to take one dog, simply because she now wants to live somewhere where she can only have two pets. Her argument will be, well it is your responsibility because we adopted them together.

So, what do I do? Maintain NC and not reply at all. Which will make me look weak and not address the situation?

Or, reply, like I want to - and tell her there is no chance I am going to take one dog now just because she wants to move into a condo with her friend? Or, will this just spark a response and start the whole NC process over again? Personally, I would like to reply and tell her there's no chance I am taking one dog and never to contact me again because I'm over her. I would like to throw in the words "selfish" and "immature". Or is that just immature on my part?

Thoughts?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BillRoland

So, what do I do? Maintain NC and not reply at all. Which will make me look weak and not address the situation?

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I feel bad for the dog.

Maintain NC, and we will hope she is a nice enough person she will find a good home for the dog. If you respond to her, she will think you are weak (and she retains the power in the relationship).

Wouldn't NOT responding show weakness? Not "man" enough to address it? I don't think she is writing in an attempt to assert power/re-establish anything - I really think she is so selfish that she now doesn't want to have any responsibility for a 3rd animal, cares more about where she wants to live, and wants someone to bail her out.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BillRoland

Wouldn't NOT responding show weakness? Not "man" enough to adress it? I don't think she is writing in an attempt to assert power/re-establish anything - I really think she is so selfish that she now doesn't want to have any responsiblity for a 3rd animal, cares more about where she wants to live, and wants someone to bail her out.

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So you will be the one to give your power to her and deal with her dog? You said you don't want it. Why would you respond? And once you respond, with even a "no," you've given her the satisfaction that she can get you to answer when she asks a question. (Goodbye, Power.) Wonder what her next question, her next ploy, will be?

OK I'm seeing this from a totally different perspective.
amicon said "NC is for a person to heal after a breakup,its not a tool to get somebody back." (have to spread some rep, but I agree)

That was your first mistake. You did NC because you wanted to get back at her. She was honest enough to tell you how she felt but you were not. You were mad and you started to pout, (I'm not going to speak to you, so there).
You gave her no reason for your not returning her calls or text so I would imagine she said OK.

I don't think your doing nc with her means anything to her at this point. If you don't want to keep the dog, tell her so. No need to play anymore games. I think whatever you two had may be gone. She had been with you since her early twenties, 5 years is a long time for adults to date. She may now be ready to just move on. You should accept it and move on yourself.

Dear billboland,
Do you really love her?
Do you want to be with her for the rest of life?
Before talk about anything further, answer these 2 questions.
These are yes or no question.

Do I love her, yes. Do I want to be with her for the rest of my life? I don't know, now. I did. I would right now, but maybe because I just miss her so much. But, there were/are things I also hated about her. I think that's life though, there will always be things you don't like about someone. My biggest problem is that in 20+ years of dating a lot of women, I have never met anyone that I loved as much as her. And, I don't think I will ever find anyone as beautiful and a match for me. If the next 20 years, is anything like the previous, I imagine having to settle or ending up spending the rest of my life alone.

So, I'm confused? NC or respond?

Billroland, the big mistake you did was to initiate No Contact hoping she would miss you and come running back to your arms. That's what I thought, but I realized initiating No Contact is for your own healing progress, Not trying to get her back in your life, but to accept the fact that your relationship is at the end of the road. 2 of you grew in age but didn't grow together in love. 5 yrs is a very long time to be with one person. And you still don't want to marry.

Quote:

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I needed to get a few things in my life together (finishing grad school, etc.) so I didn't meet the deadline, but I bought the ring and planned on doing it soon thereafter. I did, however, have some doubts if I was doing the right thing.

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at that moment when you 2 were together, even you giving the ring you had doubts in your mind and heart. How could that be? Ask yourself that, why aren't you so sure that you wanted to marry her?
Myagony1234 ask you if you want to spend the rest of your life with her? This is your answer to the question.

Quote:

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Do I want to be with her for the rest of my life? I don't know, now. I did. I would right now, but maybe because I just miss her so much.

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your right, go with your first gut feeling, you don't know, right now every thought you have is through emotions, so your not thinking clearly and there is no logic to your thoughts at this moment cause you are badly hurt and in pain. But what happens when you do get back to her, what now? Do you still want to spend the rest of your life with her. Remember when she comes back she will be the same person as you dated 5 yrs ago. Nothing is going to change. If you can live with that and force yourself to marry cause you miss her, then go for it, but if you cant, do NC and work with yourself.

Sorry guy, but not only do you not respond to her ever again, but disappear from her life. If 5 years of dating have not shown you that she will never work with you, then the living together should have been the final straw.

For whatever reason you have for not running for the hills, it does not matter, as she is on a course that will challenge not only you, but her family also.

Trust me, if you keep NC, and heal properly, you will see many options better than her for a happy life.

I think that's what you really want, but are afraid to keep looking.

Whatever it is, disappear from this fruit loops life, and get a solid female who actually appreciates you.

Listen to what you said:

"she wanted to be married so badly and was resentful of our current situation."

"I want to marry you". Then two days later, out of the blue, she told me, It's that I don't want to be in a relationship with you anymore"

"she has drastically died her hair and is making appointments with plastic surgeons to get a nose job and breast implants"

"she responded, "Nevermind, I don't want to deal with the akwardness of us being together there"Nevermind, I don't want to deal with the akwardness of us being together there"decided that the only way I could win her back was to go NC"

Just go NC, screw winning her back. Look at this & her. Ewwww...

She hasn't found it yet. Nor, you.

I'm 10 years your junior, but I think the whole "growing in age not love" totally applies. The girl who just left me wanted to get married, have kids, up until a week before she left. I opposed marriage because we were so young, an neither of us was established education or career wise. I said no, she left. The way I try to look at it is if it was meant to be, ad they wanted it badly enough, they would stick around. I mean it's not like we Didn't want to marry them, the time just wasn't right. These people on this board know their stuff backwards and forwards though. I have read tons of old posts/threads from this site and NC is the only way to go. Every time you break it, you feel worse and reset the situation back to square one. Ilet this girl do her thing and u stay no contact. Trust these guys, they know their stuff

Ignore her. She lost your respect when she left.

She took the dogs. Now they are her responsibility.

Do NOT contact her EVER! Move on and enjoy a great life with someone else that is willing to "grow in love" with YOU.

So, an update. I talked to one of my friends, who works with this guy, John, who is social friends with the x and has always wanted to date her. While we were dating John and Lindsay (the x) would sometimes hang out in the same group of friends at bars and leave Facebook posts for each other. I called her on it a couple times when I got jealous, but she swore she was not interested in him at all, and I believed her. Apparently, minutes after leaving my condo in the morning from spending the night that one day last week, when she told me "she loved me" and we were intimate (for context: this however was after she told me she needed time on her own), she texting John, saying "I miss hanging out with you" and making plans to do something with him/his friends in the next couple days. This says to me, she had already called it quits at that point. Maybe not? But why then was that the first thing she did when she left was to text John? What infuriates me, is if she knew she wanted to hang out with other guys, etc. at that point, then why even bother to come over and tell me "she loves me"?

A further update, so, this morning, after her text two days ago asking me to take one of the dogs so she could move into her new condo and me not responding; she calls me. I didn't answer. She didn't leave a message. A few minutes later, she texts me saying "You can't even respond? You are so immature". I have a feeling she was just calling because she wants to selfishly guilt me into taking one of the dogs.

You are correct about the guilt trip to take the dogs, and with your update, its apparent she had other plans to pursue elsewhere. That my friend makes her a liar, and a cheat, and the only response to her is " keep your freakin' dogs, and leave me alone".
She has been playing your emotions to get what she wants, long enough, and even though for a while you will only see the good things you shared, eventually you will heal, and see the selfish lying, cheating, manipulator that she is.

She only cares when she get what she wants. That's truly sad, to have feelings for a person of that character, but at least now you know who you gave your heart to, and must take it back. Tell her to go to hell, and disappear from her life. You have enough facts for that decision, but you must convince your own heart, it's the right thing to do. That may take time, but its well worth it to be able to put this behind you, and deny her any further BS, into your own happiness.

I'm not defending her, because right now all I feel is hate for her actions, but technically she did not lie and/or cheat - despite her telling me "she loved me", she did say that "she wanted time to herself to figure things out and didn't want to be in a serious relationship" and as far as I know -she was txting John to hang out after she made such statement but was not with him while we were together. As much as it hurts that she did it first thing right after leaving my house, being with me and telling me she loved me. I guess she thought I would never find out and will probably never know that I know. I know SHE would feel justified in doing it because of her statement about "needing time".

Considering everything though, you are right - she is a selfish, immature and manipulative person. Why do some women think that just because they are very attractive and tons of men want to be with them (she's a part time bikini model) they can get away with being the biggest B*t*h in the world? How I didn't see that in the first 4 years and 11 months - I don't know? I knew she had some flaws, like everyone does, but I seriously thought this was the person I was going to marry. I mean I am/was no saint either, but when it came down to it, I was the one willing to put everything behind us and move on together. It sucks, but I can only hope that she ends up with someone else that makes her as miserable as she made me and realizes what she lost.

I think this is your anger speaking.
You were with this woman for five years. If things were that bad you could have left her.
All of the things you are saying she did, or c how ontrolling she was, you allowed it, you put up with it. Don't make her a pariah when you let her be.
She was honest in that she told you she wanted out and now you're mad and hurt.
Maybe you stayed with her because you thought she was "so attractive" (that is a bit shallow too)
It's time to stop dwelling on her, stop dogging her and just move on.

Sorry you're in this situation man.

You've said in one of your posts that she was very attractive and you don't think you'll be able to find another one like that again. Well not with that attitude you won't!

Ive met some very attractive girls who get a tonne of guys chasing them who are very down to earth and aren't es at all. Then of course there are the girls who are very attractive and are complete es, those are the ones you avoid.

PS, just because somebody is extremely attractive in looks doesn't mean they're a great person to date. Once you get tired of their looks, their bulls*** starts catching up with you and then maybe you'll realise they're not as attractive as you once thought.

Take care

She knows how to twist the knife - I just got another txt this time saying, "I took care of the dog, so don't bother to reply. You're an a**hole deadbeat. Good thing they weren't kids". Did I do the right thing by not replying? It doesn't feel like it - at least I should have stood up for myself and said, NO!

Well, that says it all, huh? She's lame.

Stand up for yourself by staying NC, and ignoring her.

Don't care what she says or does from now on.

You stand up for yourself by not dignifying her stupid,abusive insults by a reply.

Never accept offensive behaviour,and don't by into an infantile manipulator's attempts at trying to control you.

As you said, she is only trying to twist the knife, but she is really mad because YOU DID stand up for yourself by not replying to her stupidity. She will be mad for a long time behind that because your actions were more effective than any words, and she got the message loud, and clear, screw her BS, and its not worth arguing about, and you don't have to defend yourself to her any longer. A very powerful message I would say.

I would not reply to that insult, however I think you would have proven yourself a man by standing up to her and saying you would not take the dog instead of hiding behind nc. That is what got you in this mess to begin with. Not saying what you really think put using passive aggression. I think that is what ticked her off.
But leave it alone now.

Homegirl50 - I think I agree with you. Instead of following the NC advice, I likely should have replied that I was not going to take a dog. At least it would have shown that I had some cojones.

While I consented to adopt the first dog with her, I was opposed to the second and definitely the third. The fact remains that the ONLY reason she now wants me to take care of the dog is because she wants to move in somewhere where she can only have 2 dogs and wants to pass off the responsibility for the 3rd to someone else. Am I completely without fault for agreeing to let her adopt the dogs? No. I think I even signed the paperwork for one. But what was the right move in this situation? Take the dog and give in? Say no? Or implied say no, by maintaining NC?

Regardless of if I responded or not, I know her and know that the situation would have turned out exactly like it did anyway. Me telling her no, would have resulted in the same calling me an "a**hole" and "deadbeat" because she is not getting what she wanted. So I guess it doesn't matter.

I would like to think that this is over and I will never hear from her again. Which now there is a very good chance because of how stubborn she is. But I have a feeling there is more to come.

That's in the past now.
She's shown her true colors for whatever reason.

There may be more to come. But not from you.

Ignore her now.

I think you should have stood up to her and said "no I do not want the dog. You may have gotten the same results had you told her no, but you would have at least stood up and said no.
You could have said no to her when you didn't want the dogs from the beginning but you didn't. She did what she wanted to do because you did not speak up and because you didn't speak up then, she probably saw no reason to think you would not take one of the dogs. But again, you backed down and didn't say anything.
Be that as it may, there is no need for you to deal with her again.

Move on, but take it as a lesson learned. Say what you think. Passive aggression is weak.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BillRoland

Do I love her, yes. Do I want to be with her for the rest of my life? I don't know, now. I did. I would right now, but maybe because I just miss her so much. But, there were/are things I also hated about her. I think that's life though, there will always be things you don't like about someone. My biggest problem is that in 20+ years of dating a lot of women, I have never met anyone that I loved as much as her. And, I don't think I will ever find anyone as beautiful and a match for me. If the next 20 years, is anything like the previous, I imagine having to settle or ending up spending the rest of my life alone.

So, I'm confused? NC or respond?

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Thanks for answering.
You answer clearly shows that you do not love her enough to marry even after 5 years of relationship. That was your problem.

Either sticking with NC or not is not that significant compare to your mind setup. You already made up your mind after 5 years, and you chose not to marry her, and initiated NC to push her away.

One thing I know is You should me madly in love with someone if you want to be with THE ONE only for the rest of your life with FULL commitment.

You followed your gut feeling, and she is gone. You just did not expect this much pain when you made your decision. Breaking up is really painful especially for the years long relationship. Your pain is normal. I suggest you just focus on yourself now, not to impulsively flip your decision to create more confusion between you and your ex. Spend some time alone, figure out what you REALLY want. That is the best advice I can give you for now. I hope it helps.

So, one day after the text calling me a "deadbeat" and "a**hole", she sends me an email this morning, it said "I miss you this morning and I wish things would have not turned out this way."

6 days into NC and struggling to fight the urge to write back, "me too".

Just a ploy to toy with my emotions because she's hurting from NC or after 6 days she really realizes she's made a mistake? I don't want to read into it anymore than I should.

Whatever her reasons are,stick with NC.

You're doing NC for you,remember?

No, it is what she says. She wishes things would not have turned out this way.

You are still in the mind set of NC to get back at her, not to get over her.

To be honest, I'm in the mind set of NC for both. She decided she wanted to end things - not me. So, despite any feelings I may have to say, "I miss you too", I'm not going to respond out of spite for what she's putting me through AND based on the fact that I KNOW even if I were to run back to her and try and work things out - SHE was still the one that left/didn't want only me - and that likely hasn't changed. So I'm doing it to protect myself from getting hurt again and in attempt to slowly move on with my life.

Quite frankly, I'm surprised that she would even email me that after the prior day's contact. But, I guess I need to accept it for what it is: her saying "she misses me and wishes that things wouldn't have ended on such a bad note" (as she is likely feeling guilty now and sadness from the break up), BUT NOT, that she wants me back.

Good thinking!
Just continue NC and get yourself together

May be true, but don't fall for it.
You've moved on.

Relationships and breaking up are both rollercoaster rides. One day you can't stand the person, then something reminds you of them and you miss them. It works for both parties of the relationship.

After reading the entire thread though, she sounds immature, and manipulative. If she really was worried about the dog, she should have called left a message asking you politely if you knew anyone who could take care of it. Instead she insulted you when you didn't respond. I think you were justified in not responding - it sets you back, and she would have made you feel bad either way.

There will always be days when she randomly misses you and thinks she made the wrong move, and there will be days when you feel that way as well. You need to decide for yourself if it is woth the hassle of trying to make it work. If you tried, would it just break apart later in the future? Your best bet is to just continue no contact, but don't do it to get her back, do it because your life is yours, and you want to heal and move on. NC isn't about who is weaker or stronger, its just about you and feeling better.

Doesn't sound like its going to work out with her, so in my opinion keep doing what your doing. I know it seems weird that it took 5 years for you to figure this out, but sometimes when we think we love someone we put their negative traits in the background, and then down the road we realize how irritating this person really is.