Everywhere I've lived. Everywhere I've worked. When I'm single. Attached girls are very interested in me. They can be married, living with their SO and even have kids. I'm not some arrogant narcissist. I'm actually surprised every time. I don't read too deeply into innocent gestures either. I used to encourage their behavior for the sake of my own ego but a few years ago I realized how damaging that can be. Now, I try to subtly distance myself when I feel like we are approaching "that line". It's not every last woman. It's most.

I've seen spousal cheating (especially in CA), I've seen a girl drift away from her boyfriend looking to me as a potential life preserver. I've had girls flat out compare me to their SO (with him looking awful). My last exgf started doing the same damn thing to me. What gives man? I hang in pretty affluent circles. It's not just me. Some of my other single friends experience the same thing. How can I not be jaded about relationships. I've seen so much cheating and misleading. Women who emasculate their man to me (I defend him to her). Women who brag about their man then whisper something to me.

As I said. My last exgf did this to me in the end. I know this isn't about me. I'm not Brad Pitt. I'm just a guy like any other guy. I've been burned by the same BS behavior and it's humiliating. Is this just modern times? Do I actually attract cheaters? Is cheating really as prevalent as it appears to be? Come on folks, chime in.

I don't believe in cheating. There are no morals in today's society. People cheat everyday just like that... which is so pathetic. I want to find a girl that won't cheat on me no matter what and is true to only me, wouldn't you? Why waste time with cheaters? Just igore them and go on with your day.

Are you a known player?

I agree completely and totally with none. Sorry, had to spread the rep.

There are some things in life I may be lenient about but cheating is not one of them. I have less then no respect for cheaters and I certainly wouldn't waste any of my time on one. Every second is two seconds too many. ;)

In today's society relationships and even marriage seems to have little meaning anymore. People have forgotten what it means to be loyal or to work through problems.

Truth is it takes two to cheat and unless if one party is completely unknowing both are responsible. Both are cheaters. So if you knew the women were taken then that makes you a cheater as well. No if ands or buts about that.

If you do not want to draw cheaters then do not allow yourself to be one. You cannot control anyone else's morals but you certainly control your own. "Do not do unto others as you would not have them do unto you."

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Originally Posted by inertia

Is this just modern times?

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I've wondered this myself and like you I've seen loyal, honest, guys get used and cheated on. I think part of it the pussification of men in today's society. We are given all kinds of mixed signals and if you do anything masquline it comes under fire so men are almost afraid to be themselves. If you show affection you're a wuss, if you don't show any you're a jerk, if you buy her a gift your seen as weak if you don't your still a jerk. That's why you just have to be comfortable with yourself. When you come under attack from an emotional perspective from her you have to stand up for yourself and remain in control at all times. You can not let her attacks become your reality, you must define your own reality and not change it for her.

I've also given this issue a lot of thought. Seen girls/women hunt guys who are unavailable, seen unavailable people cheat on their SO. Even my own parents have cheated on each other. (lol, no wonder I'm dysfunctional when it comes to relationships and commitment scares me more then anything). It might be society... a lowered moral standard...

In my hometown the people who work for the county have a HUGE christams party every year, people just call it the; Merry F**k party because that's what people go there to do. How dysfunctional is that? Apparently, that's where most married people in my hometown cheat each year... who knows if its true... it still defeats the point of a party like that! (there are like 2000 people who attend each year, crazy stuff, people who don't even work for the county get tickets, either from relatives or friends who work for the county and go)

There is a wonderful saying which says that 'we attract to ourselves what we give out'.

Of course it's about you. You ask why you attract this sort of behavior, well it's because in some way you condone it.

I'm not saying this is conscious behavior, but at an unconscious level you like the attention and as someone has already suggested - you're a player.

Don't kid yourself that it's about something that's 'out there' in society. Yes, there are a lot more people prepared to 'play around', and certainly, there seems to be less preparedness to work through relationship problems when they arise.

But the answer is within you, not out there... you are already starting to understand this by questioning why this is happening to you.

I'd suggest that you explore your own sense of ethics and integrity. When these elements within you are strong you are less likely to attract the type of people and behavior that you describe.

Good on you for asking the question. I hope it leads to greater self understanding.

Wow!! Talk about misinterpretation. Half understood what I was asking. Half of you obviously missed the boat completely. To clarify, I do not participate, condone or enable cheating. I'm morally repulsed by it. I took a minute and reread my post to see if I alluded to myself being a cheater. I don't see it.

I mentioned that years ago I used to flirt with taken girls but in my late teens and early twenties I didn't take relationships all that seriously (and I only flirted). I don't allow things to go even that far now. I'm no player but if I were a more opportunistic snake in the grass I suppose I could be.

My observations don't affect my ego. I think these girls would flirt with any guy that is offering something they are currently missing out on in their relationship. In most cases, I'm fully aware that I could only offer half of what these girls truly need anyway, while their SO is probably pretty fulfilling in comparison.

Having said all of this though. I do sometimes feel as though it would be easier to maintain the illusion with relative strangers than to actually open myself up completely, especially considering every time I do let someone in, they stab me in the heart. To put it bluntly, being a player would be the easy road and it seems as though that's why most people I have observed appear to be morally bankrupt.

Chuff, I hate that you are probably right about not letting a female emotionally attack you. That really makes me resent women. I take it seriously when someone says I'm hurting them by my actions. Who knew that was a sign of weakness? I'm tempted to be a bit more of a sociopath in my next relationship.

I'd also like to add that the one thing that has always attracted girls to me is my lack of interest. Turn it inside and out all you want. The more disinterested I am, the more interested they get. It's your (female) screwed up psychology, not mine. I'm not running around flirting and smiling with girls. I'm actually somewhat brooding and unapproachable. Please tell me how that attracts what I'm giving out.

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Originally Posted by inertia

I'd also like to add that the one thing that has always attracted girls to me is my lack of interest. Turn it inside and out all you want. The more disinterested I am, the more interested they get. It's your (female) screwed up psychology, not mine. I'm not running around flirting and smiling with girls. I'm actually somewhat brooding and unapproachable. Please tell me how that attracts what I'm giving out.

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Look, I was not saying that you are consciously a player - I was suggesting that it's unconscious and that at some inner level you like and attract the attention.

I sincerely believe that the answer to these types of questions invariably lies within ourselves. To believe that how people behave towards us is unrelated to our own behavior is, I would suggest, somewhat naïve.

Brooding and unapproachable you may be, but I honestly don't think that girls flirt with 'anything'. Nor do I believe that woman in general are awful, morally bankrupt, or out to 'get' men or emotionally manipulate them.

If this is how you've come to see women, then perhaps this is why you attract them. Or, it may simply be a reflection, please don't take offence, of the social circles that you mix in.

Chuff is right in one respect, you must define your reality. Be clear about what you want in a woman and in a relationship. Believe that she will be good, trust that she will be great. You may find that those silly flirters fade away and you meet a very different type of person.

Oh Gemini... how wrong you are. I admit that my posts have a bitter taste, but that is more of an expression of frustration than a condemnation of all women.

By your logic, people attract their own misfortunes as well. I don't think it's necessary to list historic examples to prove you wrong here (unless you continue to argue this point :) )

I mentioned in my first post that I swim in affluent circles. I have actually had the pleasure of swimming in several different circles (which I won't list in order to avoid sounding arrogant). I have seen infidelity everywhere ranging from churches to work conferences. I don't know how isolated you are "down under" but I doubt cheating is a rare occurrence in Victoria.

I don't reward flirtatious behavior with my attention. I'm actually somewhat openly judgmental about scandalous behavior. My last SO seemed far too demure, cultured and intelligent to be a serial flirt. In fact, she didn't flirt with me before we dated. She appeared to have a great deal of self respect and class. It wasn't until about a year into the relationship that I started seeing her flirt with other men.

I readily admit that I'm a bit jaded, but I'm not trying to score points for my ego. If playing "impossible to get" makes me a player than I'm kind of screwed.

Hey Inertia. At least I don't think I misinterpreted what you originally said. Actually, I was thrown off by other responses and then saw your second post. I'm not sure why or where the misunderstanding comes into play but it could just be me. I think, not 100% sure, that what you might be saying is that seeing cheating and wandering eyes make you insecure somewhat. For example and for me personally, I've had married men & guys that had girlfriends hit on me. It didn't matter what was going on in their heads. A couple of them were actually willing to break up their relationships BEFORE I would even go out with them. This could be quite a lengthy post so I will keep it as brief as possible. Basically, I was never impressed or flattered. Not at all. If anything, it made me think, "Well this is what could have happened in one of my relationships without my knowing" or "It could very well happen behind my back in the future" It made me (more) insecure.
That is how I felt. Again, I think this is what you're saying and I'm only going into just a part of it.
I become more insecure when that happens. When I'm with someone, I should understand that a man is going to look but guess what? I don't understand it any longer and I know that I should. I thought I did but I just don't anymore. I believe that a guy would be with one of these women if for example a woman was attracted to him also or if he was given the chance. How's that for insecurity? There's so much more but I believe I already made this much too lengthy.
P.S. I am in no way, shape, or form perfect and never will be. BUT, I find it difficult to have feelings for someone else when I'm with someone or have feelings for the one I am with let alone CHEAT. I seriously am one of those people that just could not do it. If something was wrong in a relationship and I knew we tried and could not repair it or go on, I strongly believe I would have to end it first before being with someone else. It just doesn't make sense to me. Who knows? Maybe someday I'll feel different but I hope the heck not.

Inertia, I don't want to keep 'debating' the issue with you, because I don't believe that's the purpose of this forum - it's really to offer differing points of view from which you can do what you wish with.

And I promise you that I'm not trying to score points either. What I said was:

To believe that how people behave towards us is unrelated to our own behavior is, I would suggest, somewhat naive.

(I don't see how the correlation to this is that people make their own misfortune.)

Anyway, all I am saying is that you keep talking about this issue in relation to something that happens frequently to you - the potential cheaters and the flirts - I'm suggesting that the answer might be within yourself.

Don't be jaded. There are many many really good people out there - men and women.

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Originally Posted by inertia

I'd also like to add that the one thing that has always attracted girls to me is my lack of interest. Turn it inside and out all you want. The more disinterested I am, the more interested they get. It's your (female) screwed up psychology, not mine. I'm not running around flirting and smiling with girls. I'm actually somewhat brooding and unapproachable. Please tell me how that attracts what I'm giving out.

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You're the challenge. I know exactly what your talking about, the more you show your interest the less interested they are. The less you care the woman won't leave you allone. A woman, especially one that is highly sought after by many guys, will find the one that turns shuns her to be different and want the challenge that comes with either the chase of him or the challenge of keeping him. If a woman is with a guy that gives her everything she gets bored in the relationship and that is where you come it.

Gemini, I'm sorry but if your going to say I'm naïve and I disagree, I have a right to say something. Victims of crimes, bigotry and genocide cannot be blamed for how they are treated and it is flawed thinking to assume otherwise.

Chuff and Trmpl, you guys get it. Thank the lord. The funny thing is Chuff, when I fall "in love" I fall victim to their boredom too (regular girls, not other guy's girls I steal). I'm starting to think that if I fall for a girl, I'll just keep it to myself.

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Originally Posted by inertia

The funny thing is Chuff, when I fall "in love" I fall victim to their boredom too (regular girls, not other guy's girls i steal). I'm starting to think that if I fall for a girl, I'll just keep it to myself.

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I will tell you this is honestly why I have remained single for so long. At first when I'm not interested they won't leave me alone like you described. But the moment I either fall for them or let them know the entire relationship reverses itself, and I become the one trying to hold on to her and she doesn't care. I think it's also (personally speaking) why after I just call it quits and go away for awhile they usually come back. I never understood this when I was younger, but I think they never thought of me as strong enough to leave them and when I prove I will and can they suddenly want to be around me more. There is a psychology to all this as you mentioned. One of the things I heard a few years ago that is so true is you never give more the 50% to a woman, and ideally you want to give 40%. Once you start giving more then you get from her she's taken the power and control and it leads to what you are talking about. I bet if we talked to the husbands and boyfriends of the people you describe they would say they give everything to their SO other because they love them so much... and that's exactly why the woman gets so bored. They are not the challenge she seeks.

What a great debate. Love it. I answer many questions here from people who cannot understand, or deal with the feelings, and actions of others(Partners spouses, etc.) Why, because they are so wrapped up in them, they fail to see themselves.

It doesn't matter what others do at all. Whats important is how you adjust to it. Whatever feelings others bring out in you, its still up to you to deal with it, and the healthiest people are those who know themselves, and can handle themselves in all situation, no matter what it is.

A lot of times, we don't have the knowledge, nor the experience to deal with ourselves in a positive manner, or we are overwhelmed, or distracted by our own feelings.

Life is a risk, not just our relationships. That's why the bottom line is no matter the situation you find yourself in, you can only deal with yourself, and the way you feel about yourself. ( coping skills )

I have seen to many things to blame my own misfortunes, or bad decisions on society, because I had to learn the only thing I could control is ME, and how I handle the things life throws my way.

So the bottom line to your question is how well you know yourself, and how you deal with everything, not what they are doing, or their reasons.

Be real with yourself as you learn about you, and make the adjustments you need to. It is your reality, not theirs.

I agree with you in essence Talinman. We are only responsible for our own actions and emotional reactions. I wouldn't blame society for poor job performance. I would blame a serial killer for murdering someone I love. I don't think judgment is a black and white issue most of the time though. Relating to my question, I don't approve of lying or cheating, I condemn it. I am confused that the majority of people I have witnessed don't. Considering the fact that cheaters are deceptive and prevalent, I'm somewhat insecure in relationships because you never really know if you will be betrayed.

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I'm somewhat insecure in relationships because you never really know if you will be betrayed.

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That's understandable, especially if it has happened a few times. But the best thing about experience is it's a heck of a teacher, and you learn much for the future. Again, examine YOUR actions, and give them much thought, as its hard when you make decisions, based on feelings instead of seeing the facts.

Example- Giving your heart to a stranger of 2 weeks, because she is hot, and your feelings are intense, and you have never felt this way before, even though you have had many girl friends.

Example- Your so in love you, are so busy giving her all you have, and get nothing back.

Example- Your so in love, you only see the good and ignore the bad.

These threads are full of examples. The bottom line is know yourself and love yourself, so you don't fall for the BS that sexy stranger is talking about.

Take a risk, but protect yourself, until the facts say this is for real, and worth it. Time will let you know.

People attract people that have common interest and similarities. Are you a player or a cheater? If so, maybe that could be the reason.

I think It goes deeper than that. I think you may be one of those guys who falls hard, to fast. Before you know more about them.

Talaniman, I see why you have status of "expert". Thank you for all of your input. Sincerely.
Inertia, keep this thread going if you will because it is very very interesting. I agree with you also. I am also learning some new things for myself. Thanks and you hang in there. I think maybe you're stronger and wiser than you believe. If I am wrong, my apologies.

Actually I didn't fall for my last exgf until after a year of dating, but I did fall hard when I did. I'm not speaking from a painful place. I'm speaking from an observational place. I see this behavior everywhere. I'm no player none. I have actually spent most of my days alone on this planet (by choice). I have a lot of integrity in relationships. I know "some" people are good. I just feel as though "most" aren't. I'm naturally pretty protective of myself, but even when you think you know someone... you can be surprised.

I think many who are looking for something, tend to focus those desires on the one that is there. That's why, dating more than one at a time, keeps you from becoming so attached, that its hard to see reality sometimes, and when we do, its hard to switch directions.

That's why I have a rule for you,

Talaniman Rule #62- Date them all, and give your gut enough info, to make a good choice, where you would like to focus your attentions

I think exclusively dating one person after just meeting them, is a disaster waiting to happen, and distracts you needlessly from all the options, and opportunities, life presents you.

A few dates is not a commitment, nor should it be.

I'm a very deliberate thinker (should be obvious by my posts). I test the waters before I jump in. I'm smart enough to know that past behavior of an individual usually repeats itself. I wouldn't date someone who just got out of a relationship. I definitely wouldn't date someone who is in a relationship. I never thought the last ex would pull the stunts she pulled. When she did, I walked away going NC immediately. Haven't looked back except to ask myself what indications of her behavior I missed. I'm still pretty sure I was truly blindsided. I continue to see this behavior in so many people. I'm losing faith in humanity. "Do what makes you happy no matter the consequences" seems to be the modern mantra. I was raised a bit differently I guess.

I totally agree Talaniman. Until the relationship is physically consecrated, you should play the field. Once you become intimate, it's time to make a choice though. Either end the recently christened relationship or end the stragglers.

I maybe guilty of placing pressure on those I date though. If I'm not the obvious first choice, I don't waste my time. This mentality tends to put girls in a position to either drop the others or drop me. My odds have been pretty good, thus making this a pretty effective way of having girls commit to me. Maybe that's my problem.

"Do what makes you happy no matter the consequences"

Be happy, no matter what life throws at you.

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I'm a very deliberate thinker

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So am I but will take calculated risks, and have a very fun loving attitude.

My single days where about friends, and good times, whether there was a chance for romance or not.

Rejection, failure, and disappointments are just parts of life, but no reason not to pursue your own happiness, within your own boundaries of course.

Females that are fresh from a relationship, are good dinner partners too. Some can even bowl. You just have to know yourself enough to know what your own limits are, and what you expect, as opposed to what is.

If you have read any of my other many posts, you will find its seldom about the actions of others, but your own that matter.

I have never spent as much time studying relationships and love as I have over the past 8 months or so. Having a love interest has never been a priority in my life. Despite having GF's along the way, I never put that much into them (and I never sought them out). I guess now, I'm trying to understand their nature a bit more (including my own nature). Talaniman, I have lost a lot of my lightheartedness over the past few years. I need to get that back (and I'm working on it). I do appreciate your advice. You make an excellent mentor and I always enjoy reading your pithy posts.