I deserve to go the hell for suicides.

I remembered something that I must have blocked from my memory.

It shows the degree of my sickness I have never been more ashamed of anything in my life

I continued to take her for granted while she was the only light in my life.

When I was living with my mother and my ex and I were still communcating semi regularly, I was using craiglist to look for a car and a room to rent, and occasionally I would browse the personals, I'd also look at the erotic services section and look at ads for 'escorts'

At some point I told my ex that I was frustrated because of the essential issues like a job and car, and my inability to secure either quickly. And I also mentioned to her my attempts to meet women through Craiglslist as well, and in my insecurities I told her that I was ashamed and worried that I was considering seeing a prostitute. I don't know what came over me, or how I could tell her that, I don't have any doubts any longer that there is something seriously wrong with me, I know that I did not actually a physical thing that was wrong, but my thoughts and my selfishness disgust me, she was actually reaching out to me again, she was impressed with my final effort to become a man and instead of comforting her I took and took and took, I used her for my emotional support and I did nothing but disrespect her by making her feel like less than a woman, less than human, I showed her the most disgusting and weak part of my being my words told her that she was not enough for me and a wretch like me couldn't be satisfied with her and I deserve to suffer for that.

That is no excuse for her, she doesn't need an excuse. I hate myself, I wish that man was dead

I am still selfish, I won't kill myself and send me to the hell I deserve to be in.

I want to kill that part of myself with therapy, and I know that I don't deserve her, but I still believe that if I can be I should be responsible for her happiness, and while I doubt I can do a better job of that than anybody else in the entire world, I still want to try.

I'm sick to my stomach from what I did, and I hate myself for even trying to still get back to her because I am lower than dirt and she doesn't deserve to be around somebody that reminds her of the horrible way I was.

I am going to beat myself because my shame is not enough, I'll see a counselor this week and my therapy begins next Friday but until then I have to suffer at my own hands, and emotional recoarse is not enough, I need to redeem through pain I hurt her more than I even knew. And she gave me better than I desreved in return she was too kind to me

Quote:

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I'll see a counselor this week

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Now your talking sense!

I feel a bit more stable now. I didn't expect to find something so selfish in me and I hid it from myself very well until now.

I'm not afraid to talk to her anymore, I know that I deserve whatever happens when that time comes, but it's not time for me to talk to her yet. I'm going to start seeing the psychiatrist, and I'll continue talking to my college counselor, and maybe after I've been on medication for a while and I've proven to myself that I can stay in control and that I don't feel so overwhelmed by my addiction or just life in general, then I will know when it's time to talk to her. Until then it's my burden to carry. I won't use her to make my life or my choices easier any more, I need to let her live her life like I said I would. And when I feel ready I will try again, and let her decide if the new me is good enough, if not then I'll truly be free, and I will forgive myself for all the pain I put her through. Right now I don't deserve her forgiveness, but given enough time I have hope still that I can be what we both believed I could become.

Good. Glad to hear that.

You can do everything that you said you will do in that post.

I believe in you! :)

I wish I didn't have to wait so long to see a doctor or just to talk to somebody.

I have such violent mood swings, my last post was just a few hours ago, and now I'm terrified to call her but I want to talk to her more than anything.

Talking to a psychiatrist is important in the long run and I know that it's necessary for me to learn to cope with my problems but for the time being I'm just using counselors and head doctors and everybody else as a substitute for talking to her everyday. When I want to call her I should be drawing strength from myself and hanging tight, instead I panic and call somebody to keep me occupied until it's too late to call her.

I just don't have that strength yet, I can keep myself from calling, (I have no idea how) but I still sit around obsessing about whether I should call her. No matter what I do to keep busy that thought keeps distracting me. My subconscious comes up with fiendishly clever reasons to call her. Sometimes all I can tell myself is, 'Wait until you can ask somebody else if they think I should call.' or

'Whats the difference if you call her today or tomorrow?'

That one gets me because I feel like everyday counts and every hour that passes just separates us more and more.




Here's a new question; What have I got to lose from calling her? She already knows I'm weak, I don't think that three weeks of no contact has made her think twice about that, but once again there I go trying to second guess her. I got to stop that.

My father and my college counselor both suggested the possibility that I should call her, neither of them actually said that I should they just mentioned that it might not be a bad thing to do, mainly because I want to send the message that I still care about her, and so far no contact has not been doing me any good, I've mostly been doing it for the wrong reason. I started it and continue it to show her I can carry on without her, and I don't want to waste all that effort, but I don't know if that is what she thinks at all. I think it's more likely that she thinks I'm not calling her for exactly the reason I told her I wasn't; because it hurts me too much, which sounds a lot like, 'Because I'm selfish, and if I can't have you the way I want you I won't talk to you anymore.'

I'll never know what she thinks unless she tells me.

Mostly now I keep putting off calling her because I want to have a piece of concrete evidence that I am getting better. I don't want to just tell her that I'm trying to get better, I want to tell her something like "my doctor told me that he thinks I'm doing much better now." or "I had a really great time last weekend" and I want to mean it when I say it. I won't ever lie to her, I just want to have something to show that proves to me and to her that I am following through with all the promises I made.

Proving that she can love me again is the only thing that matters to me.

I'm starting from nothing, even worse than I thought I was before I met her, and I'm going to work until I am the man that she gave her heart to before.

I won't stop until she falls in love with me again, I'll be as strong as she thought I was, and I will protect her and love her and do everything I can to keep her happy, I'll do it better than anybody else can because it's my reason for living. If she won't love me anymore I'll spend my days waiting until the suffering is too much, then I'll find out if I have what it takes to live without her.

The future isn't written all I can do anything about is the present, I won't let my love die because of who I was in the past. She deserves to see what she waited so long for.

I'm sorry Homesick, but if I were your ex and I read all these posts, the only thing I would be thinking about is "Restraining Order" . Everyone here I think has been trying to help you and you still seem hellbent on your "plan" to get her back. I hope you have already made an appt to see someone, because you really need to talk to a live person who can see what's really going on.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tnt76

I'm sorry Homesick, but if I were your ex and I read all these posts, the only thing I would be thinking about is "Restraining Order"

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That's because you are not her.



I'm seeing two college counselors regularly and I start seeing a psychiatrist next Friday. And potentially another psychiatrist from the VA the following Friday. So, soon I'll have an entire team of people helping me sweep out the skeletons and cobwebs in my head.

My plan is not sick, I'm just scared. I'm scared that I won't be able to make up for my past with her.

She left the opportunity for me, she never told me to stop calling, she hasn't tried to get rid of my things, she is confused and I don't want to show her how I feel yet because I don't want to scare her away again, someday I'll be able to explain to her that I understand all the things I did wrong and how I took her for granted. When I'm healthy enough to be happy without her, I can show her that I am not just obsessed with her but I'm dedicated to her, and to making up for my failings in the past.

I am working to prove that I don't need her, that's why I am keeping myself distant now, because I do still need her, when I don't anymore then I can give it my best shot.

In the mean time I vent here because If I don't let all this stuff out of my head I just might break down and call her, and have to start all over again.

And the biggest reason of all that I'm afraid is because she is with another man. I believe that she still loves me, no matter what anybody thinks, it doesn't matter that she has somebody else now, she stopped loving who I was on the outside because of my addiction and my weakness, but she never stopped loving the man on the inside, she just stopped believing in him, once I prove that the old is gone and the new is here to stay I know that she will give me another chance. It's going to take time and patience and a lot of work, and someday it will all pay off. I'm afraid for myself but I know that I will be OK, and I don't know if I'm more afraid that she will never be repaid for waiting so long for me to heal myself. It wouldn't be fair if she didn't get to share that with me, and I'm upset that she doesn't want to share the journey with me, but I won't blame her for it because of the way I was, I wasn't worthy of her companionship.


I can see things clearly, I know that emotions can change and that if I wasn't depressed it would possible for me to be happy without her. I mean part of the reason she left me is because I was depressed, it was impossible for her to make me happy. She put up with it for a long time, but I never did anything about it. Who would argue with me when I say that she will almost definitely give me a another chance when I make myself well, since she stayed with me for so long when I was sick? She doesn't let go of people she needs something else to hold onto to ease the transission, I know in my heart that when I am happy with myself that I have a good chance of getting back together with her.

I was in a race yesterday, and I had a lot of fun. It was very tiring and a lot of alcoholic beverages were consumed. At the after race party I got to know some of the people I'd met recently a little better, and purely by chance a woman started talking with me, she seemed to like me a lot. There weren't fireworks or anything but she asked me if I had a girlfriend that would be mad at her for talking to me for so long.

An almost cynical smile sneaked across my lips and I had to think about it for just a moment, far too short a moment to be noticed.

I told her no.

I thought to myself; "I don't have a girlfriend, and even if my ex still was with me, she wouldn't be mad, she would be proud of me."
But that doesn't matter at all does it? Because she has left me behind, and she hasn't even contacted me about anything yet.


I didn't think about it much at the time. But after I got home and thought about all that had happened yesterday, I started feel some uncertainty. I haven't done anything wrong, I don't feel guilty, but I am still terrified of change. I've only had one conversation with this woman, it could amount to absolutely nothing, but my future is thrown into question because I met somebody. I wanted to. I didn't want it very much but I did. I didn't want much more than that when it comes to relationships right now. I don't need to prove to myself that I'm a good man, or that I'm attractive and fun to be with, but there is something frightening about somebody else realizing that while a woman that I love (or loved?) has forgotten it. There's really no doubt that I still love her, and I always will but maybe I'm a little less frightened that I may not always dream of getting back together with her. However the new issue is "What do I want now?" If events unfold a certain way it might be much more complicated than it was before.


I need to stop thinking so much about the future.

I will stand by my choices, I'm going to get certified to teach english and I'm going to stay in school (I don't think anything could change that) and I'm going to adapt to the ever changes world and circumstances of life, I'm going to get to know this new woman a little better a little bit at a time, and see what happens. And each day I will take account of what I feel and get to know myself better.

I'll stay the coarse and keep sight of my goals, and constantly ask myself what I want and why, and if it changes I'll adjust heading accordingly.

I don't feel right about dating anymore, it feels like I'm still playing games.

I don't want to date this girl just because I want to prove to myself that I can, it's not important to me. She may be nice but it's not time for me to start something. I haven't finished yet with my ex. I don't even want to call her my ex.

My brother also encouraged me to call my ex.
I don't want to put stress on her because apparently her new internship is pretty intense. That's an excuse though. I have lots of excuses.
The best one is this, I don't want to call her because I won't play games anymore, I will tell her the truth, and that means I have to tell her that I was spying on her, and I've been trying to figure out how to trick her into calling me.

NC so far has been a game, and I lost because I wasn't doing it for myself I was waiting for her to call.

How ironic that I have so many reasons not to call her now.

I still love her, and I don't want to trick her anymore, but I still don't know what to do.
I feel like I am choosing how the rest of my life is going to be, I love her but I don't know anymore if I love her enough, and I don't know the reasons that I do things anymore, I don't know what is for me and what is for her.

I know if I call her and she makes it clear that she won't give me another chance, I know that I'm not going to take it well. I don't think I will come up again for a long time. And now I am clinging to some strange girl I just met, and I don't know a single thing about and wondering if I'll regret not taking a chance with her. That's just ridiculous, I'm talking about not giving every single piece of my soul to get the love of my life back because of a twenty minute conversation that ended with exchanged phone numbers.

Of course I can think about this. If I wait until next week to call back my ex is it going to make any difference? Seriously, it might and it might not. How can I gamble with this?

OK, the answer to the next question I'm about to ask is "don't worry about it, worry about myself"

I can't stop thinking about all my stuff in Hungary, I have been trying to figure out how to tell her that I can't afford to send it all here (when I actually don't intend to, because I want to move back to Hungary) so I want her to pack it all up and store it at her parents.

Let's be honest, its pretty uncool that she told me she had another boyfriend and then a week later she sends me a message about her playing with my toys...

And she still has my books and things there, what the heck?

She should not be allowed to have this leverage, I don't want her to get comfort from my things and I don't want her to have the reasurance that she has something of mine, things that I will want someday. A veritable guarantee that I will contact her. I don't want her using my things to make herself feel better when I'm not around and I don't want her using my things to entertain her new boyfriend or just regular friends when she has removed me from her life, I want her to realize that there are consequences for leaving me. If she doesn't love me I'm not going to be her friend, therefore I won't 'lend' her my things.

All the same she is not throwing them out into the street so maybe I owe her for that, and maybe I can say forget about it because she is doing me a favor.

WHAT? She's doing me a favor? She broke up with me and is holding my stuff hostage!

She should pay to send it to me, I don't have $5000 to throw away like that, if I did, I'd just buy new things, but that is not the point.

If she won't communicate with me what right does she have to use all my things as if I were still her boyfriend?

I CAN'T STAND THIS


OK I'm not going to think about it.

I'll get my stuff back when I get back to Hungary, and I have absolutely no chance of getting back together with her, and I have no dignity left, and I can't love anymore, and this is garbage.

Ok I'm late for my math test now.

Bye

OK I'm about 250% calmer now, I think I did really well on my math test which is a very big surprise.

And I talked to my friend about my dilemma, I may have the solution.

I think I'm going to write her an email. I'm going to try to be completely neutral and not confrontational. Here's a rough draft;

I appreciate you taking care of all my stuff since I left, I don't want it to be any trouble for you but I'd be grateful if you could begin gathering it all together somewhere that's out of your way and getting it ready for transport when you have time. You can take your time because it will be a while before I have the money to ship it. Until then you can keep using whatever you like.

Comments? Suggestions?

I want to keep it short and impersonal, but not cold. I think I managed that.

In case it's not clear what I'm doing here, I'm sending a subtle message, that I am not at her beck an call anymore, and that she does not have the luxury of time when it comes to deciding if it me or the other man she wants, I feel that by saying this I'm not putting pressure on her, and I am asserting my independence from her without any financial loss.

If I could say one more thing in it I'd rather say "until I figure out what I'm going to do with it all" because honestly I don't want any of my things sent here, it's better off in storage or with her parents there, but I don't have the money for storing it, so I'll let her have her comfort from my things but I won't let her think having them ensures that I'll be back anymore.

Do you have another friend in Hungary that would be willing to store your things until you have the money to get it? That could be a win-win.

Her saying that she and her new boyfriend were "playing with your toys" is a low blow. I'm sorry, homesick.

If it bothers you that they are using your things then you have to find a way to get them out of there... by getting another friend to store them or sadly, have her simply get rid of them. (I hate to say that because being a historian and a writer, throwing away books is a serious sacrilege! But, for your sanity... )

You told her that she can use everything - hon, you've got to let it go. If you can't let it go, then find someone else to take it.

How are you doing, other than the stuff in Hungary?

I haven't sent that message yet, I don't have any friends there, other than her family. The toy thing was not a direct quote, she wrote me a message because she 'thought I called her' a couple days after she told me about 'him', she said she found out who really called her after she wrote the message from my original post about guitar hero.

Other than the stuff in hungary, I don't know how I am, I don't care about the stuff, its just another excuse to communicate with her, but that issue does need to be resolved. I want to be honest with her, I want to tell her that I'm going to come back and that everything will be all right. But it's not going to be all right, I don't know if I can look at her the same anymore, and to me it looks like she has treated me like all her other ex boyfriends, with mild affection and pity.

I love her but I hate what she's done. And I keep telling myself to move on. I can't wait to start therapy, I just don't want to be miserable anymore, I also keep telling myself that I'm better now, and if I just had her back, my life would be complete again, I don't need her but even though I made my life so much better I am still missing her.

What am I going to do tomorrow, I think I'll manage not to think about her while I am with my date. But what about afterwards. I know I'll still love her no matter what happens. This affects only me, not her.

You said before about my love being some kind of super love, but it seems like it's wasted on my ex. She saw the edge of it and she was scared because she had lost faith in me, she might have thought I was obsessed and that I was setting myself up for disappointment or failure. I'm disappointed, and I failed her, but I still love her, and I know her well enough to really believe that her love for me is still in her somewhere and when I finally get back there it will grow for me again.

If I believe that so much why am I so impatient, why am I so afraid of living my life until I know whether she will come back to me.

I want her to see that I'm strong but I really want her to see that my love is stronger than my ability to attract other women...


Maybe I don't give myself enough credit, but it seems to me that love is where all my strength comes from, love is the reason I kept doing all these things, I tried to tell myself and everybody else that I was doing them for myself, but I think that was a lie, I'm still breathing for her, even when it seems so hopeless and that there is no chance that we will ever be together again, I keep going on. I've been doing it for a while now, how can I find a better reason to go on than another person to replace her with, that seems to be what several people have suggested to me, but I don't want to be like my father, he was married 5 times, and now he is old and alone. I want to find out how to be happy without falling in love with somebody else. My god, that's what she's done too. Are all people like this? I can never teach her that she took away our future because of her fear of being alone, I don't want to be alone but I don't want to live for somebody else forever..

What a paradox, I want to learn to love myself so I can get her back. But honestly I love myself, and I am happy with my progress, but I won't stop working on myself. Still no matter how much better I feel about myself, I want to share all that come from it with her, she earned it, she deserves it, and she is so special to me that I want to share all that we can be together.

Sorry now I'm just rambling

Yes, I did say that yours was a super love. Super in the sense of "leaping tall buildings, jumping all obstacles, super power" love. But darlin, that powerful, amazing, Shakespearean love is being tragically wasted. You know it. We all know it.

You're caught up on this hamster wheel - you're running as fast as you can, bettering yourself, rising to the occasion of taking control of your life, and yet, you're still not going anywhere because you haven't gotten off, had enough, and moved on.

You can have that super-love, but if you don't realize that you have that love to give to someone then what good is it? By "give to someone" I mean "give to someone who possesses an equal amount of super love." The Elasti-Girl to your Mr. Incredible. The yin to your yang. The Gate Keeper to your Key Master.

You're asking the right questions and taking the right steps... but darlin, your first step is going to have to be to get off the hamster wheel.

You may be wasting your time looking for something you may not get. YOUR CLOSURE. Or you have it, but refuse to accept it. Either way is unhealthy, as you sacrifice getting healthy, holding on to what may not be realistic. Use your time wiser, would be my advice. Be healthy to deal with whatever the future holds.

It's being wasted now.

I'm thinking about the future. That is not always a good thing.
But take Talaniman's quote there

"Obstacles are what you see when your not looking at the goal."

It's cliché time.

I guess I need to stop and smell the roses.

Jealousy is driving me crazy, I'm driving myself insane.

I hope that therapy helps, I wish I started sooner.

I'm sad because there was a time when I made her happier than anybody else in the world. I was nothing then compared to what I am now.

She is cheating herself, and living in ignorant bliss (possibly). It's not a selfish wish I make to be with her again, it's for her.

Don't tell me that she knows better what makes her happy, let me have my sick fantasy that I know better. My therapist will help me sort it out.

I'm going to call her in a minute, I don't have a any idea what I'm going to say.

I'm going to apologize to her for the way I treated her, but I'll do my best not to get emotional, I'll try to see what she is feeling and I'm going to bring up my things if it's the worst.

Somebody please tell me if I'm making a huge mistake, tell me that if I wait another month she'll call me and tell me she broke up with the new guy and she'll want me to take her back. Tell me anything. I have some pretty unreal expectations.




Last night I got stood up by the other new girl. My only regret was that I didn't call my ex earlier that day just to talk.

I need to stop fooling around and apologize that's the last thing I need to do. I pray that it will make a difference, but I have a feeling it will only make a difference to me.

Clicking that dial button is really hard.

And I really feel like a fool when the response is the message telling me that the number can't be reached at the moment.

Life is really funny some times.

I guess I'll try again later.

I got her on the phone, and it was a stupid meaningless conversation.

She managed to make me feel guilty because she was standing out in the cold.


She said she was happy that I called, but asked me not to read too much into that, I said I wished she wouldn't say it at all. Really if she thinks I might misinterpret something why does she even say it?
I kept myself in check, and she revealed nothing to me, except she has no boyfriend I didn't ask, she thought I said something about a boyfriend when I mentioned her ex's. I revealed that I want to return, and that I'm seeing a therapist. I didn't lie, I'm doing well I told her, that I'm doing OK and I'm not at the same time. She said she thinks about me a lot. She said she was happy that I called, and she said she would call me back after some days or weeks had passed, I told her not to promise me that, I told her to call me when she wanted to call me.

She said she's not going to get on a plane and come see me and get back together right now. I told her I don't want that.

I said I wanted her to be in therapy like me, and she said she would like that too, but apparently she doesn't have time.

She said she likes her new job, lovely...

I said she was being unrealistic when she asked if we could visit in japan on spring break, she said she knew that already, and it was no big surprise that I knew it too.

She knows I'm different now, but it's just like her aunt told me, she knows I'm different but she isn't certain about anything, especially the way she feels about me. I think she doesn't want to waste years holding out for me.

She says she doesn't have a boyfriend. I believe her, I think I believe her.

She also said that she doesn't think we should talk anymore, but she got so much more upset than I did. She said I couldn't upset her anymore, and that it was only the wind and cold making her shout at me, but I could hear her voice shake, I didn't want to make her upset and I told her that, we both know each other too well to lie, but maybe she can lie to me, she lies to herself enough. I'm going to try to wait until march for her to call, that's when she mentioned might be a good time because her schedule will change. She says I'm silly, when I say dumb things like, 'pretend I never called, don't call me again'
But she says sillier things that really hurt deep.

She says she wants me to let her go, that's ridiculous, I told her it's possible but I don't see why I have to. I am making progress right now, even with all this extra hurt, and I can make it back to Hungary this year or next, I can make it, I told her that.

She is just floating along, while I am fighting the current. She said I knew that she stopped loving me a long time ago, and it was silly of me to think about all the things I wanted to apologize for. She still talks about three or four years down the road, and says she's not going anywhere, but she's foolish if she believes that, I know that is a dumb way to think about it, she says 'don't think about the future, think about now." I want to think about both, she doesn't want to think about the future.

I can't tell her what I really want, because I don't know what I want her to do. I have wishes that are unrealistic, but I don't know what is practical for her to do. I still don't have closure, and I don't want it, I told her I won't be her friend. I showed her I can get angry at her but she knows that I think all the things I'm angry about don't mean a thing. She even said so, and she's right. She doesn't think she is 100% innocent in our relationship bu we both know that I am mainly responsible for it not working.

She says she thinks I am a special person and it makes her happy that I called, and it makes her smile when she looks at my things. I don't know how to tell her that I want her now, but it can change. She knows it and she wants it to happen. I don't know why because I think that she know she still wants me back. I think she might know that I need to seem unobtainable before her instincts make her desire me again. She's too damn smart for her own good. And so am I.

So I don't know if calling was a mistake, I probably should have written, but I would have written the wrong thing, and I would be just as confused with nothing to go on from her.

She seems to think that passing her medical exams was harder than my finding a job, car and home at the same time. I didn't know what to say, I couldn't say that the exams were easier, and I didn't know how to explain to her that the fact that there were consequences for me failing and none for her. She comprehends but I still think she doesn't fully understand. I only brought it up because I could tell she didn't want to talk anymore and I was grasping at straws. So I guess she continues to string me along, so I'm going to keep trying to have a social life that I'm not particularly interested in and not worry about her, after all she's not going anywhere.
I told her she underestimates me, I also told her she underestimated my sickness. Mostly she underestimates my ability to survive her emotionally. The conversation went bad I guess because I didn't get anything I wanted, I didn't get closure, She just got upset and I got nervous, I'm maintained cool for it though, I didn't cry, I'm just frustrated, and I think she realizes that, but somehow she just thinks that I'm not different enough, or that we can't have a relationship now, because she's too busy, I don't know what the hell she thinks. But she says a lot of stupid things, She says it was hard for her to not call me she said it wasn't as hard for her as it was for me. She said she wanted to a lot. I told her she can now, but I told her not to call unless she really wants to talk.

Therapy yesterday was a waste of time, I got a lot more out of talking to my college counselor later on.

Quote:

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I didn't get closure,

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That's your fault not hers. You could well take this conversation as closure, but your false hope won't let you.

How can I take it as closure when she says she wants to talk again, and she doesn't want to do anything with my stuff. She says she doesn't think of me like her other ex boyfriends. I could have taken it as closure when she started to say she thought we shouldn't talk anymore, but you're right I won't let that happen, she can call me in march and I'll see what happens.

She keeps saying she is going to make my life miserable, but I know she can't do a better job of that than I have already done to myself.



Doesn't it mean the slightest damn thing that she is still happy when I call her now, or that she wants to keep my things around. I don't think she deserves that, but I won't be the bad guy that tries to take them away, especially now.
I'm letting her walk all over me, but I don't want to play the jealousy game, and there is no logical solution to the problem with my things. But she let me walk all over her when we were together, she bent over backwards to try to fit into my twisted life. So I'm going to wait just like she did. And I'll try to fulfill her crazy requests and meet other women and try figure out more reasons she just isn't the girl for me.
I don't like the waiting game either. But what else have I got, she has a hostage, I don't know what I have, other than a big heart and a lot of patience.

It seems that she told me that she was with the new guy back in January because she wanted to scare me off. Well I don't care either way. She doesn't think I'm creepy, and she doesn't hate me, and she says she'll never hate me.

She has a f#@$ed up attitude about personal growth in long distance relationships, and I think she wants me to hate her, or at least to stop loving her, but I just don't get it. She doesn't like herself I guess. She said she hates Valentine's day, but a few minutes later when I asked her if she remembered the last time she was happy she mentioned yesterday, but not what made her happy maybe she meant Friday, and her brother's birthday. I digress.
I asked her about being happy because I don't remember the last time I was happy for an extended period, or maybe just a day that I woke up happy. She said she was happy that I'm in therapy and thinks everybody should do it, but she got angry when I brought up the possibility of medication.

She says she want me to be over her, and I ask why. She doesn't have an answer. She thinks it's not going to work when were far apart or something. Every time we talk I can't get to the bottom of anything she thinks or feels, I bare myself completely and she just runs in circles.

My counselor says that love is like a log in a fireplace and when it's lit it burns brightly, but once that log is burned through nothing can bring that flame back. I didn't get to ask him what happens when you throw another log in there.
That's what I want to do, I want to keep that old log burning until she sees that I'm bringing a new one. It doesn't matter if it's already gone out, I'm still bringing that new log damn it.

She's is still playing a game and I'll play along because if the last month proved anything it's that I can hang in there no matter how bad it hurts, and I can keep waiting. Maybe she can wait longer, but what does it matter, I opened the door now, so I know if she doesn't call it's not because of anything I said.

I'm taking the long road again, because she keeps choosing to make me wait. She wants me to decide all of a sudden that I don't love her just because she doesn't know what she wants. Well sorry but maybe I need a rebound relationship too, before I realize that you're a witch. But it just won't happen. She won't get jealous, I won't confess, I probably won't even go there because I am too focused on school and work and counseling now, to have any kind of romantic relationship now. That's just the damn thing, she confessed when she told me about the other guy, she felt guilty as hell about him, she just won't admit it to herself. It's so sad that she won't see anything but what's right in front of her. If we get back together I might get tired of dangling a carrot in front of her all the time and basically having to keep an eye on her, but why bother thinking about either of those things, like she said, don't worry about the future.

I'm a libra, that is against my nature, I need to have everything accounted for.

So it's only two weeks until march, I'll wait until spring break, and maybe that oxford seminar will put things in perspective.

I'm going to use my Financial aid money from college to pay for it. Maybe I'll take out a student loan interest free from the VA, in any case, she is not influencing my decisions.

I've been too hard on myself, even she said that. Desperation won't get me anywhere, perseverance and patience are what are going to pay off now, and I'm investing them in myself a lot more than I have been in the past few months. I guess it's probably a good thing that I'm a bit annoyed by her indecision and unwillingness to communicate her feelings. Maybe I'm beginning to understand what 'high maintenance' is all about.

homesick: "How can I take it as closure when she says she wants to talk again, and she doesn't want to do anything with my stuff." I think this girl is unusually cruel and heartless; just my opinion. Where does she see the relationship going? Twenty words or less, please.

I have no idea where she wants the relationship to go. And I don't think she does either.

She is selfish, I'm selfish, people are selfish, what are you going to do?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by homesick

She is selfish, I'm selfish, people are selfish, what are you gonna do?

---

Quit whining and get a life. DuuuuuuH! A month and a half of non-stop crap, should be enough for any one. You seem to smart to chase your own tail that long and still have no clue whatsoever? You have vented soooooooooo much, there can be nothing left, but to live your own life.

My mind has started going to work on this, I'm going down fast again.

I sent her a text a few hours after I called,

"Are you curious about what else I've been doing?"

that was stupid, even more stupid than calling, I stink of desperation. I want to call and scream at her to that I'm not all these things I appear to be, but I am these things. I'm lonely I'm desperate and I still depend on her approval. I'm angry because she plays on her terms, and she doesn't give answers, she just keeps me waiting.

"Go live your life, I'll tell you how I feel in a few weeks if I feel like calling..."

I should pretend I don't care until I don't care anymore, I want to call her back right now and have a shouting match with her. Better to do it now then to wait another month of convulsions and sobbing and hating every minute of everyday without her, waiting, hoping, crying, and screaming.

Why does she need more time? I told her I don't want to be her friend. She is not going to feel different in a month, she 'loves' her new job, why can't we stop being so selfish. I want answers now, she wants to keep waiting for who knows what. What can we do now, nothing, we can talk but she doesn't want to do that anymore.


It's over but she won't say it unless I twist her arm?

What is wrong with me? Why can't I let go, because I don't have anything else to hold onto. I know that there is a whole life out there ahead of me but I care too much about this old life to just leave it dead in the street, I want to run back and check to see if it's still alive every minute.

I don't know if she knows how bad it hurts me to wait and wait and wait. It's been hard for me and she says she misses me and it's been hard for her but how hard could it be when she wants to wait another 'X weeks' before talking again.

Is her life that hectic, she doesn't have time to think about me, maybe it's true but so the f what. She hasn't even answered the text, maybe her phone is dead again, maybe she's on a date maybe maybe maybe, I won't let myself stop thinking about it. Somebody slap me upside the head for real please.

I haven't left the house for anything but school and work and counseling for a while, I got some new glasses but I still don't have a life, the race was fun but what the hell am I doing with my life, I got stood up again, and what is my backup plan? I don't have one, this used to be easy, now I don't know how to enjoy life, I'm slipping back into my addiction like a perfect fitting glove. And I want to choke myself for being so weak and pathetic. I don't have money for going out, and I'm too messed up to let myself concentrate on other hobbies, and I should be doing my homework right now but I got myself all worked up again from calling her, therapy will take weeks to help me figure out how to cope with my stupid issues, and I'm rotting from the inside out all the while.

The issue is not her anymore, it's me and I'm so sick of being sick. Why doesn't talking to anybody help me, it just makes me rethink my problems and I don't change anything inside no matter how much I want to. I keep back stepping with her and with my illness, and my addiction, and my thoughts.

Only I can change it, but I don't seem to be doing a very good job, am I going to be able to keep my resolve to change long enough to see a mental health professional for the next 2 or 3 months with agonizingly long weeks in between each session?

Suicide sounds better and better all the time, if it is eternal suffering at least it is without the additional torture of hope.

Seriously I won't kill myself, I'm far to afraid of the possibility that it has consequences worse than a life of self abuse. But that doesn't stop me from wishing for death.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by homesick

She is selfish, I'm selfish, people are selfish, what are you gonna do?

---

Thank goodness, I thought I may have introduced the word, "selfish"; but I looked back and didn't see it. Selfish is what you need to be, homesick; that is what NC is all about, looking out for you and your best interests. You can't do that and invest so much of your time and soul into this situation. Let me give you a "for instance", which isn't fair or fun, but it could happen, that is to say, it is within the realm of possiblility: what if she were to just disappear today, what would you do? What should you do? What do any of us do when we lose something precious and dear? I think you are obsessive about this girl and I don't think it is healthy. You don't feel really good, and she probably doesn't want any part of that when she is considering her need for romance and love in her life. Just my free opinion, OK? Not trying to be an a$$.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by George_1950

what if she were to just disappear today, what would you do? What should you do? What do any of us do when we lose something precious and dear?

---

I would act the part of the insane obsessed boy and sacrifice all to go looking for her, I am obsessed and stubborn and quite foolish sometimes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by George_1950

You don't feel really good, .

---

I really don't feel good, I am full of very ugly sadness inside and I don't know how to get rid of it. I am good at faking it sometimes, like when I have to pretend that I'm having a good time at parties, I might even actually have a good time, but I feel guilty afterwards. It's pretty sad.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by George_1950

I think you are obsessive about this girl and I don't think it is healthy.

---

I am repeating myself but yes I am obsessed I am aware of that, and I have an addictive personality, I'm going back to my old addiction, to cope with this attempt to stop being hooked on her. And I really really don't want to do that.

Help can't come fast enough for me to stop myself from being a monster, not a terrible monster just a pathetic lonely cave dwelling monster that hates itself. Some people love this monster but they can't get him out of the f-ing cave.

You seem to love sitting on that pity pot, in your cave of your own making. Any excuse not to be happy. Sad you're to lazy and selfish to make yourself happy, by following a few simple instructions. Oh well!! It's your life to waste.

Darling, homesick,

"Be great in act as you have been in thought" (Shakespeare)

You have wrapped your mind around what you know you must do to move on.... now is the time to do it.

Its done. You're done. Start writing a new chapter. "What's past is only prolouge."

I'm talking to her on skype right now, and against all odds we're are having fun.

:P

Nothing is in stone, but I have my foot in the door again.

I didn't mean to be rude with my last post, I'm just excited. It's not exactly like it was when we we're just getting started, but it's like a new beginning. I can feel physically when her heart is opening to me again, and I know that while she is still afraid that I will hurt her again, bit by bit I am earning her trust back.

I did it a hard way, and I know this must not work for everyone, it might not even work for me, but she still loves me, and I still love her, it won't be long before she isn't afraid to say it anymore. I just need to keep doing what I'm doing.

Heal.

No more spying, no more games, no more self pity, no more dwelling.

She even said to me the moment she decided she wouldn't turn down other guys anymore. I was right about it. It was the call I told her I was thinking about prostitutes again. Well I'm long past that hurdle, and I will keep fighting and working to make sure I never feel that much doubt about myself again. And I will make sure she knows that I know I am better than that.

When she calls me back I will have something good to talk to her about.

I held out, I took a chance, and I believe that it's going to work. The hard part is not over, but I believe in myself, and I believe in our future.

I've been thinking a lot about the way I have acted, and I'm pretty ashamed.

If I ever want her to trust me again I have to be 100% honest, I've known that from the very beginning.

I'm going to tell her that when I stopped using pornography I started looking in her email box, and that I have stopped since we talked on Saturday and I won't do it again. I don't think I should wait for her to call me again before telling her, but I need to decide if I should write a letter or call her to tell her this.

I've just begun to earn her trust back and I don't want to build it up too high before I tell her about this. It wouldn't be fair. And I need to confess everything to start over.

I'm going to tell her that I am making a conscious effort to stop doing things like this that hurt me and break the trust that other people put in me.

I'm going to have to leave it up to her when we talk again after this.

I am absolutely terrified that she won't want to speak to me anymore when I tell her. She might not be nearly as upset about it as I imagine she could be, some things like this she doesn't take very seriously. But I'm going to tell her no matter what, and I'm going to tell her because it is my intention to tell her everything and that I am doing everything I can to be a better man, I don't want to hide the truth from her to gain her trust back.


I'm tempted to tell her that it only caused me an incredible amount of pain, and that every time I read something private I hated myself more and more because I was doing something so wrong, but I couldn't stop reading her letters even though I wanted to die every I read something she wrote to him. I couldn't stop because it was a substitute for my addiction, but I'm getting help for my addiction now, and I am doing everything I can to keep myself from starting any of these things again, I won't use porn and I won't spy on her anymore. I hope that makes a difference, I hope it isn't too late.



I'm so scared that I'm doubting myself. I have arguments against telling her now; I didn't use any of this information to influence her, I looked up information about the other man from his address and learned about him, because I was jealous, but I didn't manipulate or hide anything from her, except for one letter I sent to her, which I deleted before she read it, and I called her and told her everything that it said anyway.
I got some addresses of her family and friends and that is how I got in touch with them, but I haven't asked any of them to do anything for me I only asked them for advice and support. I don't ever want her to know that I did an of these things because I'm afraid it will hurt her and she will never trust me again, because if I hurt her again now it will only make it harder to prove to her that I am changing and I am taking all the right steps to keep myself from doing things like this anymore.

And one step is telling her the truth and letting her decide if she can trust me again after this...

I hate knowing all the answers.

The reason she doesn't want to get back together with me is she is afraid I'm going to hurt her again, and now here I am about to tell her something that will hurt her, and wanting to convince her that I won't do it again.

Well it turns out I do know her as well as I thought. She wasn't mad at all.

She was a tiny bit sad that I was stupid enough to put myself through so much pain for nothing.

I really put myself through a whole lot of suffering the last few hours just because I was afraid. And as it turns out it really hardly made any difference at all to her. She says she is still going to call me, and I don't really think that telling her that made any difference. But it made a world of difference for me. I don't have a guilty conscience any more, and I will continue to fight my impulses.

My heart is still beating very quickly, I'm relieved that she was not angry and she wasn't the least bit upset, she said she even had an errant thought a few days ago about the possibility that I was reading her emails because she knows I know the password.

She speaks to me as a mother does to a child. I hope that once some time has passed she will begin to see me as a man. She is already coaching me, with her tiny voice, telling me not to be sad, and to get some sunshine, not to take things so seriously. She calls me baby in her own way, that she doesn't say to anybody, she never liked that nickname but we called each other that so much, and it just seems so familiar. I still say 'I love you' and feel a pain when there is none in response. But I'm not surprised, and I'll try to refrain from saying it until I feel there is a chance of an echo someday.

Now I need to start where I thought I was on Saturday, start being strong, start being independent, start with a clean slate.

Now I'm free to be the man I want to be, I better start on my home work...

So I went to the VA clinic yesterday, before my appointment I watched a movie and had one of my intense crying and shouting fits. A few minutes after I'd stopped crying I heard my roommate coughing in the next room and suddenly remembered he'd been told by his boss to stay home yesterday to recover from a chest infection. He pretended he hadn't heard, but I told him not to to be embarrassed and I apologized, and told him I was going get some medication that day.

Once I got to my appointment at 1:00pm, I found out that there was a mistake and that I hadn't been scheduled to see a psychiatrist, but only a primary care physician, I wasn't terribly upset because I was planning to get checked out soon anyway, and afterward he told me I could just go to mental health as a walk-in. I spoke to the doctor there and he said I could be medicated but it would take a couple of weeks for the medication to arrive at that clinic, but if I drove to the city and saw a doctor there I could get some that day. I was hesitant because I didn't want to drive far and the weather was bad, but he convinced me it would only take half an hour.
So I was on my way.

It took me an hour and a half in heavy traffic and rain to get there, and when I arrived I didn't know where to go.

I found the department I was supposed to go to but they hadn't put me in the computer and it was extremely busy. They told me that I most likely would not be able to see a doctor that day, then the nurse there told me to just go to the emergency room. I waited for two hours and got more upset each minute, I saw the triage nurse and was told it would be a few more hours before a doctor would see me. I had dinner from some vending machines. When I finally saw the ER doctor she could not prescribe me antidepressants and that I couldn't see a psychiatrist until Monday...

But if I stayed the night in the Psych ward I could see a psychiatrist the following morning. Because it was so late and I had wasted so much time already I decided to spend the night there and save myself another long drive, I also was determined to get started with medication and treatment as soon as possible. I don't want to wait X more weeks to see if medication helps I want to start now.

So I checked into the Psych ward and spent half the night in processing, and speaking with a nurse and the admitting doctor. By this time it was about 9:00pm and I was ready to crash. Then a nurse mentioned to me that I might not be able to leave until Monday because a doctor would have to approve my discharge and it's not normally done on the weekend, I explained to them that I have a job and that I didn't want to lose it just because I came there to get some medication, and also about how much time I'd wasted that day and that I had been up since 2:00am.

I didn't sleep much last night, I was too worried about being stuck there and losing my job. I saw a doctor the following morning and to my great relief he understood the situation and signed my discharge papers once he verified that I was not a danger to myself or others.

Then after some more bureaucratic hassles of waiting for them to get my valuables out of the safe in the basement and some other mix ups with paperwork they sent me on my way and told me to pick up my meds from the pharmacy downstairs.

The pharmacy is closed on Saturdays.

I asked around and got angry and was told to come back and that it was unfortunate about all the misinformation I had been given and all the hassle I'd gone through to get one tiny prescription filled, all to be told to come back again which is the last thing I want to do.

I asked a nurse by chance and explained my situation and she told me to go back up to the psych ward and ask, so I did and they had my prescription there, I'm still breathing relief quite deeply.

In two weeks I'll return to do a follow up and hopefully after that I won't need to return to that clinic again and I can continue therapy at the closer clinic.

All that for just two weeks of anti depressant/anxiety medication. It doesn't seem worth it. But I am still committed to improving myself and continuing on my quest for personal and professional growth.

What in god's name am I supposed to do with this!?

[3/5/2008 12:18:06 PM] I said: Hi
[3/5/2008 12:19:04 PM] she says: hello sweetoman
[3/5/2008 12:19:46 PM] I said: do you know what that makes me feel like?
[3/5/2008 12:20:00 PM] she says: waito
[3/5/2008 12:22:00 PM] she says: what does it make u feel like?
[3/5/2008 12:22:25 PM] she says: i was looking foru earlier thisweekbut u werent on
[3/5/2008 12:22:26 PM] I said: it can't be put in words. I don't think you understand what you can do to me.
[3/5/2008 12:22:41 PM] she says: am i hurting u?
[3/5/2008 12:22:47 PM] I said: i don't know yet
[3/5/2008 12:23:09 PM] she says: im sorry im real irresponsible now
[3/5/2008 12:23:58 PM] she says: today was my second double twelvew hour shift and im happy noones life is in my hands.. im really sorry i ll be gentle with u
[3/5/2008 12:24:19 PM] she says: im realy really dead
[3/5/2008 12:24:54 PM] she says: work sihard and tuff as can be for me..
[3/5/2008 12:25:06 PM] she says: whats up over there
[3/5/2008 12:25:21 PM] I said: I've been very busy
[3/5/2008 12:25:38 PM] I said: I don't have happy stories to tell
[3/5/2008 12:26:03 PM] she says: school?
[3/5/2008 12:26:13 PM] I said: I have a math test today
[3/5/2008 12:26:40 PM] I said: I started the English Teaching Seminar last Weekend
[3/5/2008 12:26:58 PM] she says: űwiewww
[3/5/2008 12:27:06 PM] she says: is it cool?
[3/5/2008 12:27:28 PM] I said: the teacher is cool, she is married to a turkish man.
[3/5/2008 12:27:45 PM] she says: okey..
[3/5/2008 12:28:56 PM] she says: whats the bad stuff?
[3/5/2008 12:29:20 PM] I said: there is no bad stuff
[3/5/2008 12:29:28 PM] she says: thats good
[3/5/2008 12:29:31 PM] I said: only a piece of me that is missing
[3/5/2008 12:29:51 PM] she says: glue glue glue!!!!
[3/5/2008 12:29:54 PM] I said: i shouldn't do this
[3/5/2008 12:30:22 PM] she says: talk to mee not?
[3/5/2008 12:30:39 PM] I said: what do you want to talk to me about?
[3/5/2008 12:31:43 PM] she says: tonite i dont have brains for anything i can hardly keep sending signals for breathing.. chat would be nice tomorrow sometimes maybe..
[3/5/2008 12:31:58 PM] she says: nothing in particular though
[3/5/2008 12:32:08 PM] I said: I should have waited,
[3/5/2008 12:32:36 PM] I said: when you want to talk to me I will be waiting,
[3/5/2008 12:33:27 PM] she says: i ll look for utomorrow okie?
[3/5/2008 12:33:44 PM] I said: I'm telling you.
[3/5/2008 12:34:02 PM] she says: oh i remember now i wanted to see a pic with u and ure new glasses!
[3/5/2008 12:34:41 PM] I said: When you want to call me, call me. If I am here I will answer. If you send me a text I will tell you when I can talk.
[3/5/2008 12:34:45 PM] I said: ok
[3/5/2008 12:35:05 PM] I sent file "New me.jpg" to members of this chat

[3/5/2008 12:35:22 PM] I said: it's not very good I
[3/5/2008 12:36:14 PM] she says: heee intellectual..
[3/5/2008 12:36:37 PM] she says: u look prettypleased
[3/5/2008 12:36:52 PM] she says: like somewhat happy
[3/5/2008 12:37:02 PM] I said: I was talking to you brother when I took the photo
[3/5/2008 12:37:18 PM] she says: really u guys talk again?
[3/5/2008 12:37:22 PM] she says: cool
[3/5/2008 12:37:45 PM] I said: we have talked a lot. I like to know how his work is going.
[3/5/2008 12:38:00 PM] she says: my legs are really hurting ive gotta go now
[3/5/2008 12:38:20 PM] I said: goodnight.
[3/5/2008 12:38:25 PM] she says: u are a nice bro!
[3/5/2008 12:38:48 PM] she says: have a nice day!!! kissos
[3/5/2008 12:39:01 PM] I said: please think about what you say to me before we speak again.
[3/5/2008 12:39:18 PM] she says: right
[3/5/2008 12:39:22 PM] she says: i ll try
[3/5/2008 12:39:51 PM] I said: I understand that your tired and not entirely yourself right now, it's ok, I'll be here when you want to talk.
[3/5/2008 12:40:24 PM] I said: goodnight.
[3/5/2008 12:40:30 PM] she says: good night!
[3/5/2008 12:41:02 PM] she says: thanks!



Today; 03/06/2008:
[9:55:20 AM] I said: are you well rested?
[9:56:22 AM] she says: hey! i thought about it.. I dont think we should talk yet..
[9:56:44 AM] I said: are you serious?
[9:56:59 AM] she says: i can't tell what i should say..
[9:57:16 AM] she says: i dont want to cause harm
[9:57:44 AM] she says: utold me to try to be sure of stuff i say
[9:57:52 AM] she says: well im not sure of anything
[10:00:20 AM] she says: i can't figure what is ok to talk about
[10:01:19 AM] I said: forget what I said do you want to talk to me or not?
[10:02:01 AM] she says: hate myebut i wont!
[10:02:13 AM] I said: ok
[10:02:21 AM] she says: im sorry
[10:02:29 AM] I said: goodbye
[10:02:31 AM] she says: take care


She doesn't want to hurt me but waiting for her to talk to me has been tearing me apart for the last 3 months. I've been so patient with her, I've tried so hard not to push her, but obviously I can't stop myself from trying to let her know that she is hurting me. I can't just play it cool when she talks to me in such a casual way. I'm so frustrated, I keep waiting and working and staying silent, I want to scream at her sometimes. I want to show her everything I've done since she left me. But I just can't get an opportunity, because she won't listen on my terms, I have to play on her terms.
She doesn't say 'I'll call you' she say; 'I'll look for you on skype.' What does that mean? Does it mean 'I'll call you', or does it mean 'I'm waiting for you to call me and make an of yourself again'


I'm going out on a date tomorrow, and she has no idea about it.


I don't know if I'm running out of patience with her, I just don't want to suffer for her anymore, I don't have guarantee's and I'm angry that she treats me so poorly and I continue to reassure her. I apologized for all the things I did in the past and I was sincere, I've forgiven myself as well, she needs to stop playing games with my heart and talk to me. I'm not just going to wait around for her to mess with my head again.

While she is trying to figure out what to say because she is confused I am trying to plan my life, I have big decisions riding on the way she feels, for example, do I want to buy a house this year or sell all my things and move to Europe right away. I have very good plans for doing both and a lot of reasons to do either one. Bah, I'm going to buy a house and move to Europe when I have a regular income from renters. I won't mess my life up anymore for her, if she wants me back she's going to have to wait, I'm sick of dancing for her.

Oh homesick, darlin... Don't do this to yourself. If you want to talk to her, TALK. On the phone. Don't message each other, don't text, don't email, TALK.

If you're not ready to talk to her on the phone, then don't talk to her.

You don't need this. You don't need a girl that plays with your heart. She still owns it because you haven't taken it back from her... don't let her control it, too. Don't let her keep doing this to you. She is dropping "sweetie", "kisses" and "you look good"s... don't let her do that.

Conversing with her over the internet, or whenever you cannot actually hear her voice - the inflection and tones - will only hurt you. If you feel that you desperately need to talk to her, then call her on the phone. But I agree with you. Know what you want to say before you say it... and expect the same from her.

Darlin, HEAL thyself. (My own take on Shakespeare!) Heal your heart. Don't allow her to do this to you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by homesick

I won't mess my life up anymore for her, if she wants me back she's gonna have to wait, I'm sick of dancing for her.

---

Dance for yourself, dear homesick, don't dance for her anymore.

"When you do dance
I wish you a wave o' the sea
that you might ever do
Nothing but that."

A Winter's Tale - Shakespeare