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Originally Posted by bummedout4

I know she won't think im a jerk for not sending flowers and i know she doesn't expect anything, i didnt do it b/c of that.

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I know she won't think you're a jerk for not sending her flowers. What I was doing was giving an example to express: DO NOT WORRY, because even if she thinks "what the? why isn't he even caring when I'm sick" that she will let you know and be curious why you haven't been calling.

I put that example because some of the things you have justified doing is, as you say, is you wanting to make her know that you care? So I'm saying, "well even if you don't contact her, do not fear her thinking you don't care because even if she calls you one day feeling hurt...etc..."

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Originally Posted by bummedout4

I just thought it was a nice thing to do, and make her feel better that someone cares about her that much.

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This is smothering her. She asked for space. All the attention you give a person who asks for space, is called smothering. This isn't you showing love.

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Originally Posted by bummedout4

Just to take her mind off feeling bad, i know her better than anyone, and i think she will like it. I am not saying it will make her change her mind or want me more, but maybe think about me and what she means to me. Well thats my opinion, i am no expert but sometimes you gotta follow your heart.

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You have to trust us. You're saying you know her better than anyone, but you didn't really know about this breakup. There were actually a bunch of things in your posts you had no idea about when it came to her, and you didn't know what was going on in her mind. So, trust that you don't know what flowers, texts to wish her goodluck, etc, will do to her: they will make her happy, but only in the sense that you will stay put as she moves on with her life. This is a great feeling for someone who did the breaking up! So if that is your goal (to help her more easily see that she isn't missing something by letting you go, due to you being there with texts, flowers, etc), then continue please.

You're just going through what everyone else has gone through in their breakup. I'm sorry, but I guess you will keep doing things like this for a while, until you see yourself that no contact is the best policy. My heart goes out to you because I have been where you are.

You say that you don't do this to change her mind, but that you do this so she'll think about you more and maybe she'll ponder on what she means to you.

She already knows you care about her. She knows she is the one doing the breakup and that you want otherwise. So anything else you give her or send her will be classified as smothering.

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Originally Posted by bummedout4

I don't think its a big deal either way, so i dont think it was out of line, just something nice. I dont understand why everyone thinks its a big deal and a big thing that i did this. I guess we will see what she thinks, if she doesn't like it for whatever reason i am willing to face that, but will feel better that i did it.

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You do sense that it could be a big deal because you came on here and posted about it.

Leave her alone. Trust that everyone here is talking in your best interest when they say, leave the ex alone, and give her a chance to decide for herself. You want to do this right don't you? Then work on yourself while she is asking for space (jogs, saving money, education, work, hobbies, friendships, etc). What do you have to lose in this process??

Well I came on here to see what others thought. I know I think its just a nice gesture, nothing too crazy or smothering. But I guess it remains to be seen. I respect everyone's opinion and advice, I really do, just sometimes I guess you have to learn for yourself. I know either way she will not base a decision on this alone. She needs to decide what she wants, I understand that, its just hard to be patient. Well thanks again , ill let you all know what happens.

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Originally Posted by bummedout4

Well i didn't know her wishes were for me to leave her alone. B/c she never said that to me. All she said is she wanted a break, to do her thing, and time to think. So we still talk and are really close b/c well after 4 yrs we know each other better than anyone. So knowing her, i thought she might like this. If she doesn't then i will deal with that. If she had told me to leave her alone, and not to call or anything along those lines, then yeah i would not be doing this. We all have different opinions and ways to think of things so i can only see what happens from here. I am not a relationship expert and don't claim to be, I am just in love with her and afraid of losing her. So i would rather do something and say i tried then to leave it be and let things play out for who knows how long. If she says you shouldnt have sent the flowers, dont call me anymore then i will respect her wishes.

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By asking for a break to do her thing is saying that exactly she wants space, space equals time without you in it... she was just trying not to be rude and abrupt.

Hey..

Listen I'm in the same boat, I'm just over three weeks since my boyf took off and asked for no contact for at least a few weeks... and guess what? I've not contacted him once! Not at all, no calls, texts emails, nothing.

I said in an earlier post that yes, I had wanted to do so but each time I've managed to get out of that way of thinking. Yes, its hard but I look at it like this: If he is thinking about me its because he's missing me or is thinking things over. I don't want him to be thinking of me because I'm in his face.

You say you are following your heart and want to try everything you can because you don't want to turn around a few months down the line and think if only I'd tried this or that... To be honest, what you don't want to do a month or so down the line is to suddently think "If only i'd given her the space she asked for"... trust me, if she decides she doesn't want to be with you, you WILL always wish you'd done what she asked.

It's a hard time, I know this more than anyone, but you have to give her what she needs.

Well what's done is done, I will have to live with whatever comes as a result of this. I hope its nothing bad , and ginger, she didn't ask for no contact , just to let you know.

I know she didn't but that's not what I'm talking abou, I was just trying to give you an idea that you aren't alone in such a situation. I'm just saying give her some space... and using my own experience as a guide for you.

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Originally Posted by bummedout4

to add to above, I really want to do something special for her that will really make her understand how much I want this to work and that i'm sorry for whatever i have done to lead to this. Is this a good idea? How long should i wait before even attempting this? i know that i should probably wait until she feels comfortable to see me but after that how long? I feel like i have to fight for her, b/c if i don't we may grow farther and farther apart? i know this is probably not recommended but i can't sit by for weeks and weeks doing nothing. any opinions? these things are going through my head and seem like a good idea, what do you all think?

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You know who needs flowers? You! Maybe not flowes, but a guy's night out, a good dinner, work-out, etc.

You need to be more selfish, but you need to know what to be selfish about. That is, you have to be selfish with what you NEED (time with friends, a break, etc), and stop being selfish with what you WANT (her).

I also understand what you're going thorugh in wondering if you two will grow apart. I feared this and still have a bit of this fear when it comes to my ex.

You probably will grow apart, but just as you two can grow apart, what makes you think you can't one day grow back together? So, trust in nature and don't only look at the situation with a negative eye.

Be positive, but also be realistic. Instead of thinking you've lost the love of your life, like I said before, think that you have lost her "for now". And like I mentioned in another post for you, what are you going to do in this mean time? That is, what you are going to do while there is this space between you? Exciting things I hope.

If you two come back one day, what do you think would be the best case:
(1) you say all you did was go to work and then come home and think about her.
OR
(2) you tell her about that mountain you climbed, you show her the new house you bought, you show her how good you look, you bring out your trophy for that time you won that, you talk about this amazing book you read, you show her pictures of the time you... etc... etc... etc..

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Originally Posted by Gingerkid52

i know she didnt but thats not what i'm talking abou, i was just trying to give you an idea that you aren't alone in such a situation. I'm just saying give her some space.... and using my own experience as a guide for you.

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Thanks for your advice, I am trying my best but it seems whatever I do never seems or turns out right. I hope I can get through this w/out any more damage being done.

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Originally Posted by Sad Soul

You know who needs flowers? You! Maybe not flowes, but a guy's night out, a good dinner, work-out, etc.

You need to be more selfish, but you need to know what to be selfish about.

I also understand what you're going thorugh in wondering if you two will grow apart. I feared this and still have a bit of this fear when it comes to my ex.

You probably will grow apart, but just as you two grow apart, what makes you think you can't one day grow back together? So, trust in nature and don't only look at the situation with a negative eye.

Be positive, but also be realistic. Instead of thinking you've lost the love of your life, like I said before, think that you have lost her "for now". And like I mentioned in another post for you, what are you going to do in this mean time? That is, what you are going to do while there is this space between you? Exciting things I hope.

If you two come back one day, what do you think would be the best case:
(1) you say all you did was go to work and then come home and think about her.
OR
(2) you tell her about that mountain you climbed, you show her the new house you bought, you show her how good you look, you bring out your trophy for that time you won that, you talk about this amazing book you read, you show her pictures of the time you...etc...etc...etc

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Thanks sad, I know you are right, just getting there is tougher than I ever thought. I was doing fine last week and then starting yesterday I just started feeling lost again. I know I just need to be positive but its just so hard sometimes. Well after today and whatever happens, I will continue on my track to become a better person. Its hard to be selfish because I really do just want to be the best for her, be there for her and love her with everything I have. I guess I have to just see what happens and not push it any further.

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Originally Posted by bummedout4

well whats done is done, i will have to live with whatever comes as a result of this. I hope its nothing bad , and ginger, she didn't ask for no contact , just to let you know.

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She did ask for space... as I stated, space = Time apart. That means she doesn't want to see you, she doesn't want to talk to you. She doesn't have to draft a legal document detailing what she doesn't want.

She wanted space, and she was trying to be nice about it. For the vast majority of us that means don't call, don't knock on the door, don't send endless texts, emails or send gifts.

A woman saying she wants space means she doesn't want to see you or hear from you for a while if not forever. Getting in her face will not cast you in a favorable light. What she sees is a guy that won't listen and respect her request.

If you think otherwise you are only fooling yourself. She doesn't see it that way. What she sees is a guy that won't take no for an answer. And quite honestly having known enough women who I was close friends with, not intimate with I know that guys that won't take no for an answer scare them. Sorry to be that blunt but guys that won't leave them alone scare the hell out of them. They are afraid to come right out and be more direct because they feel if you can't take a hint then what would you do if they were rude and nasty about it. And that prospect scares them even worse.

And as I had stated before. A woman that's scared WILL get a restraining order and will be prone to overreact. And that's someplace you don't want to be.

Just listen to what people are telling you here, if only for one week. We aren't just making up things here, telling you to do random things. We have ALL (probably) been where you are and done what you are doing and have seen the results. The people may be different but the situations are almost the same.

Like some others are stating above, she isn't going to be insulted if you actually live your life and have fun without her. It might just intrigue her. What they are all saying is correct, every time you phone, send texts, or flowers, you are proving to her that you are still hanging on, and she can take her time and do what she wants.

If you leave her alone, maybe SHE will start thinking about you just as much as you are thinking about her. Wouldn't that be nice?

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Originally Posted by smoothy

She did ask for space...as I stated, space = Time apart. That means she doesn't want to see you, she doesn't want to talk to you. She doesn't have to draft a legal document detailing what she doesn't want.

She wanted space, and she was trying to be nice about it. For the vast majority of us that means don't call, don't knock on the door, don't send endless texts, emails or send gifts.

A woman saying she wants space means she doesn't want to see you or hear from you for a while if not forever. Getting in her face will not cast you in a favorable light. What she sees is a guy that won't listen and respect her request.

If you think otherwise you are only fooling yourself. She doesn't see it that way. What she sees is a guy that won't take no for an answer. And quite honestly having known enough women who I was close friends with, not intimate with I know that guys that won't take no for an answer scare them. Sorry to be that blunt but guys that won't leave them alone scare the hell out of them. They are afraid to come right out and be more direct because they feel if you can't take a hint then what would you do if they were rude and nasty about it. And that prospect scares them even worse.

And as I had stated before. A woman thats scared WILL get a restraining order and will be prone to overreact. And thats someplace you don't want to be.

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I get what your saying but I think you are taking it a little to far. We have talked and I know her and they type of person she is, and she is stressed, confused and scared about everything going on in her life. She told me herself, she knows I care and I know her better than anyone. I also know she cares because she told me and we have talked about this. So she knows I am not a stalker guy who won't take no for an answer. I have been her best friend and boyfriend for 4 years and she knows my intentions. I can guarantee you she is not scared of me or what I will do or anything crazy like that. If she didn't want to talk to me, or for me to call her she would have said so, because I asked her straight up. So yes, she wants some space, OK but she doesn't want me out of her life, and I don't either. So I will leave it at that, I know everyone's situation is different and all these advices and opinons don't apply to anyone. I will be first to admit if I am wrong and someone is right. I will just have to see what happens from here on out.

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Originally Posted by madaman

Just listen to what people are telling you here, if only for one week. We arent just making up things here, telling you to do random things. We have ALL (probably) been where you are and done what you are doing and have seen the results. The people may be different but the situations are almost the same.

Like some others are stating above, she isnt going to be insulted if you actually live your life and have fun without her. It might just intrigue her. What they are all saying is correct, every time you phone, send txts, or flowers, you are proving to her that you are still hanging on, and she can take her time and do what she wants.

If you leave her alone, maybe SHE will start thinking about you just as much as you are thinking about her. Wouldnt that be nice?

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What you say makes a lot of sense, I know today I may have made a judgment call that may not help me but it was a mistake I made, if it turns out to be a mistake. Yeah I know about living my life w/out her and she knows I am, she knows I have been going out, just as she has. I just thought the flowers would be a good gesture and a nice thing to do. I do hope she thinks of me, I guess I just need to wait it out some more to see what happens. Thanks for putting it clearly in a way that makes sense to me.

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Originally Posted by bummedout4

I get what your saying but i think you are taking it a little to far. We have talked and I know her and they type of person she is, and she is stressed, confused and scared about everything going on in her life. She told me herself, she knows I care and i know her better than anyone. I also know she cares b/c she told me and we have talked about this. So she knows i am not a stalker guy who won't take no for an answer. I have been her best friend and boyfriend for 4 years and she knows my intentions. I can guarantee you she is not scared of me or what i will do or anything crazy like that. If she didn't want to talk to me, or for me to call her she would have said so, b/c i asked her straight up. So yes, she wants some space, ok but she doesn't want me out of her life, and i don't either. So i will leave it at that, i know everyones situation is different and all these advices and opinons dont apply to anyone. i will be first to admit if i am wrong and someone is right. I will just have to see what happens from here on out.

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You have a fixation on her, your judgment is therefor impaired on what she wants and doesn't want.

You are hearing what you want to hear, and twisting everything to suit what you want it to be to justify being in her face.

4 years means nothing at all, people get tired of being with each other even after 40 years together, Is she calling you everyday, is she making the attempts to contact you or is it always YOU initiating each contact? Think about it. Your answer is right there.

She's not scared? Come on... I know women that have been in exactly this situation, they want the guy to leave and he just can't take no for an answer... yeah they are scared... are they going to tell you they are? No they aren't they are afraid of what you will do if they are more direct or what they think you would see as rude.

I'm not kidding here. That's very serious. Women get raped or worse everyday from guys in exactly this same situation and they know it. Some of these women I know had been raped by guys just like that.

You can't see this because you are convinced you are the only one that's right and that if you just keep it up she will change her mind, see the error of her ways and see things your way. Fact is in reality you are doing the opposite.

If you stop there is a remote chance she might come back around, if you keep it up I can guarantee you its going to get ugly. And by that I mean you won't be happy with what happens.

This thread has grown to 44 pages of you repeating the same things over and over again, with everyone telling you to stop.

Make today Oct 8th 2007 the day you changed. You have done the same thing for how many days now, and it should be painfully obvious it isn't working. Make a change, and make it now. The path you are heading down there really is only one outcome and that is you being extremely hurt. Take the other path, the one where you leave her completely alone and live your own life. In the end there are two results: Her coming back to you, or you being happy without her (and finding someone else way better).

You keep saying that she 'wants' you to contact her and keep in touch. That is nice that you are concerned about what she wants. You want her to be in love with you and come back to you. She's not concerned about your 'wants' why are you concerned about hers? Why are you giving so much when she wouldn't do the same for you? How does that actually make you feel? Personally I don't do things for people who wouldn't do things for me.

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Originally Posted by madaman

This thread has grown to 44 pages of you repeating the same things over and over again, with everyone telling you to stop.

Make today Oct 8th 2007 the day you changed. You have done the same thing for how many days now, and it should be painfully obvious it isnt working. Make a change, and make it now. The path you are heading down there really is only one outcome and that is you being extremely hurt. Take the other path, the one where you leave her completely alone and live your own life. In the end there are two results: Her coming back to you, or you being happy without her (and finding someone else way better).

You keep saying that she 'wants' you to contact her and keep in touch. That is nice that you are concerned about what she wants. You want her to be in love with you and come back to you. Shes not concerned about your 'wants' why are you concerned about hers? Why are you giving so much when she wouldnt do the same for you? How does that actually make you feel? Personally I dont do things for people who wouldnt do things for me.

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Well, him doing the same thing and to keep wanting to hold on is rather normal, despite it being what will bring him more heartache. For his length of a relationship, I would imagine he would be like this for a good year.

This is just something he has to go through and despite our efforts, he will probably still be in a desperate and depressed state (which is what most of us went through for a long time, including myself). But I've noticed some rare posts where people follow the advice of NO CONTACT, and they seem far better off.

I guess our job is to keep helping push him in the other direction. I know on my personal posts that helped a lot.

And what you wrote there, about him saying he keeps in touch because that's what she wants, etc, yet she doesn't seem to care about what he wants: WOW! BANG ON! You are very right!

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Originally Posted by Sad Soul

Well, him doing the same thing and to keep wanting to hold on is rather normal, despite it being what will bring him more heartache. For his length of a relationship, I would imagine he would be like this for a good year.

This is just something he has to go through and despite our efforts, he will probably still be in a desperate and depressed state (which is what most of us went through for a long time, including myself). But I've noticed some rare posts where people follow the advice of NO CONTACT, and they seem far better off.

I guess our job is to keep helping push him in the other direction. I know on my personal posts that helped a lot.

And what you wrote there, about him saying he keeps in touch because that's what she wants, etc, yet she doesn't seem to care about what he wants: WOW! BANG ON! You are very right!

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Notice... HE is the one always calling her, never her calling him. Like she is incapable of picking up the phone if it was truly her wanting to talk to him. That speaks volumes on his self delusion there, its really all about him not about her or it would be her initiating the contacts all the time, if she wanted to hear from him incessantly she wouldn't have asked for a break, and therefore space. Lets hope he takes our advice before she feels hounded enough to contact the authorities.

Hey I feel for the guy, I've been there before... but you have to know when to let go. This is an obsession, not love.

Oh I know, it took me a year of extreme pain to get over my 'first' and that was a 3.5 year relationship. But I didn't have anyone to help me or guide me. I did everything that he's done and probably more. I really wish I hadn't. This time around I'm 2 months in and already seeing some other girls. Im still in pain sometimes, but I can already visualize myself happy without 'my' girl. Its because I took the NC route as soon as I could, threw out everything of hers etc and made a strong effort to fix myself. I just hate seeing him go through this, because I know exactly what its like.

False hope is the ultimate killer when trying to heal.

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Originally Posted by smoothy

Notice...HE is the one always calling her, never her calling him. Like she is incapable of picking up the phone if it was truly her wanting to talk to him. That speaks volumes on his self delusion there. Lets hope he takes our advice before she feels hounded enough to contact the authorities.

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Lol. I think I showed I noticed when what you quoted me saying says (at the bottom) "wow! bang on!" etc in regards to her not really caring what he wants.

Smoothy, I hope he does take the advice of no contact! And, yeah, I agree with you that the person who was dumped usually has a lot of delusions. I think NO CONTACT helps dispel some of these.

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Originally Posted by Sad Soul

Lol. I think I showed I noticed when what you quoted me saying says (at the bottom) "wow! bang on!" etc in regards to her not really caring what he wants.

Smoothy, I hope he does take the advice of no contact! And, yeah, I agree with you that the person who was dumped usually has a lot of delusions. I think NO CONTACT helps dispell some of these.

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I agree, he needs to get his head clear and that's what its going to take, NO CONTACT WITH HER. I suspect its this obsessive behavior that lead her to ask for a break in the first place.