You know, I am glad for this forum - and up until today my thread had few replies. I'd love to be able to chat more with you all who have helped me through this tough time.

As big as my company is everyone scatters at break time. I think I am probably one of the youngest working there as well - most others are much older then I, and we don't share much in common.

Hi Farfromnormal.

I've read both of your threads and I'm unsure which to reply on but as this gives the full story I guess ill reply here.

I see a confused man and someone not ready for the next step.

I went through something similar last year when my ex freaked out after he proposed.

Like your situation he changed from one week from wanting to marry me and be with me forever to 'i want to be alone, I'm not sure if I love you or you are my best friend'
Then he came back and told me he was not sure and he needed time to think and needed to be independent and that all would be fine that we would be together after.

It was a very confusing time , I gave him space and we would see each other every 2-3 weeks(his inititation)This went on for 5 months.One night we slept together and then he got distant again.
I found this website last year and I had a talk with him. He said he was confused for 5 months and that he wanted to be friends.
He jumped into a new relationship right after that.

Since then I've read an amazing book. 'hes scared, she's scared' and it explains this whole type of situation. I really thought I was reading about my relationship when I read that book.

Like the title of your post, these situations make no sense.

In your other post you said he now wants to work on the relationship? Is he going to get counselling? What age is he? How have his previous relationships been? Has he always ran ? Has he incorporated distance into your relationship on occasions?

Here's some insight into the situation - After a failed attempt to hang out last night I met with him personally to discuss some things and here is the outcome. I told him that our relationship is toxic and until our issues are resolved nothing is going to have a good outcome. I told him that he has personal issues that need to be dealt with and to do that he is going to have to talk to a professional about them (He has frustrations surrounding our relationship that he feels like he can't get past). So we are going NC again and I personally believe that this is the only way he can heal and I can move on.

I cannot say RIGHT NOW that if he were to come back in a month and say "Hey, I love you lets make this work" that I would not jump at the opportunity - I Love Him and I know he loves me, just right now his frustrations are masking any feeling he may have and to fully understand himself and what he wants he needs to seek help (which he admitted he needed to do during our conversation last night). But what I can say is that I am moving on, with or without him I need to live for me.

As for him wanting to work on the relationship - he did say this and he said it again last night, but he also did say that things cannot be worked out right now because what we are going through individually is toxic. He is going to get counseling (At least he told me he was) - he is 26. He has only had one other serious relationship and she left him because he gained a lot of weight, however; I feel that the root of his insecurities are due to a divorce and a berating father who beat him down verbally as a teenager and adult (This is when he was living with his father for the first time in 12 years, for college). He has always ran from problems - as for incorporating distance, no he has not - I was the one that needed time/space.

This sounds really positive, well done for being so brave about it.

Did he hint that he wanted to try again at some point then?

I really hope things work out for the best for both of you. :)

Good for you farfrmnormal..

You have been really really strong and done the best thing possible.

Right now you both need to work on your issues.

You seem very mature for your age.

Basically through our conversation last night he said he wanted nothing more then to fix our relationship - but that cannot be done until he figures out how to get past his frustrations surrounding the relationship - right now those frustrations are plaguing him and he is unable to become in touch with his true feelings.

I am 25 - have been through two serious relationships. One from the age of 18-21 - this one was toxic because he treated me like crap. The next 21-25 he treated me like a queen and I didn't know how to handle it - in fact I didn't respond at all sometimes. A lot of my issues stem from passed down traits and a divorce when I was young - but I know what my issues are and how I can fix them. I think NC was so hard for me the first time because I had so much left to say to him - so much to tell him about the changes I was making. This time, everything is out on the table - he knows how I feel and what I am doing about the problems. He may think the ball is in his court, but really, I am the one taking control of my life - because right now that's what's most important for me to heal and to be happy again. If I don't, and things don't work out for K and I, I will be plagued just like him.

Yeah abandoment from when we are young does cause a lot of damage in relationships... I lost a parent when I was young as well.

<but I know what my issues are and how I can fix them.>

Fantastic..

Everything happens for a reason... keep that in mind... maybe this relationship was for that reason.

Keep us updated with your progress.

That is my belief whether things between us work out or not - what doesn't kill us makes us stronger right? If he's not the one, then there is someone better out there for me. I'll keep you all posted.

<what doesn't kill us makes us stronger right?>

Dead right.
I came to the same conclusion.

Does one know how someone might get over their frustrations? I know you are going to say time, but is there something they should be doing to let go?

Everyone does it in their own ways. I suppose it depends upon what the frustrations are. Sometimes time cannot even fix certain frustrations. The person also has to really want to be rid of those frustrations.

The reason I ask is because he says he wants to be rid of them but doesn't know how. I wasn't going to try and help him with that, I just thought I might better understand the process. Perhaps the counselor will be able to help him with that.

I would imagine that a therapist could help.

Some people are able to work out issues on their own but sometimes others do the need the help of a professional.

All you can do now is just be patient. I know its hard but I'm sure you know from your counseling experiences that everyone "breaks" at a different speed. I think what you need to decide is how long you are willing to wait for him to get over these frustrations.

My personal feeling is a month - when I took a "break" in our relationship in the past I took a month to figure my stuff out. If he contacts me before that, great - but I feel personally for myself that he will need to know after a month whether his frustrations can be dealt with or not. In the meantime, I am not "waiting" - I am moving forward and working on me. Right now I am just having major emotional ups and downs. He told me last night that when I have the impulse to do something I should sit back and ask myself "what would K want me to do?" - I have been doing that. Its just hard to move forward - maybe I am not ready to do that yet?

It's all in due time. When you are ready for something it will come a little easier. Its hard to work through a lot of our issues especially when they are things that are ingrained from our youth. Some people spends decades working out some problems.

I've seen people spend major time in therapy and get nowhere. I don't think you are that way - you seem to be extraordinarily receptive to change and to working things out. As for your boyfriend he may want to put something's are too painful sometimes to get rid of.

I read that book by Pease and a lot of the things they said about how women are in relationships didn't fit how I am - he was the affectionate loving one where as I was the opposite - this confuses me. I can completely understand why he would have the frustrations that he does - he says he wants to deal with them so I hope he does.

Do you think after a month I should contact him to see where he is at? Or should I just leave it and never contact him again?

Well you are not uncommon. There are women out there who do not act stereotypical. Maybe as you progress in your therapy and become more in touch with your feelings those things will change. Time will show you what you are capable of.

Is his frustrations with the fact that you are so logical and rational? (if you don't want to share you of course do not).

I don't see the harm in checking in with him after a month just to see where he is especially since that is you "waiting around timeframe"

My rational and logical approach to things is what got me in the position I am in. It was not until this breakup that I realized that I was not a balanced person, with respect to my rational and emotional mind. I made decisions based on my rational thoughts - so when I didn't want to do something, even though emotionally maybe I should have, I used my rational mind to make that decision. I am SOOO in touch with my emotions now I don't know how to shut them off when I need to - I make decisions based on how I am feeling, not on the rational and logical way. I have told him everything that I feel and even wrote a list of the things I want to change and am changing - this time I feel more comfortable with this time of NC, but I am still very emotional.

I am not "waiting" around - I just feel that it may take me a month or more to start to be able to move on.

I know you aren't waiting around - but it's the only way to state it. You've given it a month to see what happens so I was just referring to that was the "Waiting period".

That's great! You should feel good that you are now in touch with them. That's a hard thing to do. As you get more used to it you will learn to temper your logic with your emotion however its still hard because emotions are much stronger then that small little voice of reason in the background.

Like every time I read a post on here now - I break down in tears.

We'll just have to see how things play out.

Well its kind of like a whole new world for you isn't it? You've opened a fire hydrant and its hard to push that cap back on you know?

It definitely is - I am finding it hard to concentrate while at work. I am fine when I am home and have no problem occupying my time. But here, I just can't seem to keep myself busy enough. Today I feel like I am putting myself back into that "waiting" phase.

It is totally normal that happens all the time. I had always had the opposite problem. I would get CRAZY at work. I would invent things to do so I could guarantee 8 hours of not thinking about "it". Then at home I would try to do anything to stop from thinking but it never helped.

Any goofy things you need to do at work that will take up some time? Re-organize files? Any chance of making up a project?

Its stupid monotonous work right now that I get bored doing. Then my mind races with things I should have told him and want to tell him...
I hate this.

Oh geez that really sucks. I'm sorry you are having to go through with this. There is nothing worse then trying to deal with relationship stuff while you are at work. Its impossible to shut off sometimes.

Maybe try and write everything out just to get it out of your head.

I am doing that as well - here is what I struggle with - how can I move on, tell myself its over if he has not told me its over?

Anyone?

I don't know. That's the hardest part trying to reconcile it on your own. Its hard enough most times to accept that its really over even when the person tells you.

I could accept it if it were over - I would know then that I wouldn't have to try anymore and I would know I have done all I can. Right now, I know I have done all I can - but I'm still just... there.

Yeah "there" can be a pretty junky place to be. Its limbo. Its terrible. Its so hard to attempt to wait things out patience always seems to be in short supply when breaks happen. I wish I had something really perfect to say that would help you here but I'm at a loss. I always would hate it when someone would just reassure me in times like this. My best friend loves to spit out "everything is going to be fine" and it would just make me feel worse because I would say but is it really? Ultimately yes everything works out as it should and with distance and time that's easy to say but in the moment you just want to know what the heck is going on.

I sit here and I think about everything - I am giving myself a month to accept things and to "wait" things out. Work on myself, physically and continue my sessions with the therapist. Does it make sense that I can see myself at the end of the month perhaps being ready to tell him its over - if in fact he does not contact me before then?

Personally, I feel like a month of NC with an Ex is LOADS of time to connect with yourself and get to the bottom of your issues - IF that is what you want. Is it wrong to assume that?

I think you are absolutely correct. A month used wisely can allow someone to have wonderful break throughs. If someone wants to change badly enough a month is plenty of time to initiate that change and really see some results.

It may even be that you see that you are progressing in your life and hitting your therapy goals and trying to get yourself on the right path in your life and if your boyfriend doesn't start doing the same it may feel as if he is trailing behind you. I hope I'm explaining this so it doesn't sound stupid. But you know if you start to feel that you are maturing faster then someone - mentally, emotionally - whatever - it doesn't feel like the relationship is satisfying anymore. I had this experience with high school friends after I went to college. Some people had changed too much, gotten too mature too fast and our friendship just wasn't what either of us needed anymore. On the other hand were people who didn't change at all while I had and it just seemed impossible to maintain the friendship.

Does this make sense? I feel like a rambling idiot :)

No I get what you are talking about - its all about the direction you choose and I am choosing to better myself with these sessions. Whether he and I work out or not I know they are helping me become a better person.

I think he was always afraid of change and this is why he is having so much trouble with this - he has never accepted that HE had to change as well, until the other night. I do feel he has some growing up to do and maybe this is his chance (Although his growing up made him, him. I love him for that - and the things that were issues for me weren't serious enough for me to end things)

I have very few friends now because I feel like I don't connect with my old friends and the individuals I do run into who on the surface come across as being a good match for me (friends wise) turn out to be stuck in high school and can't carry on a conversation.

I'm glad I made sense.

Some people don't want to have to be self reflective. They don't want to stop and wonder could my actions be causing problems here as well? Its quite easy to toss blame upon another person and say you have issues while ignoring your own. Not necessarily saying that he did that but I've dealt with boyfriends like that myself. Where change is too much for them and it becomes so overwhelming.

You have the right attitude about the whole situation and you've set your boundaries.

I have the same problem when it comes to making new friends. Most people pull too much junior high stuff - I won't even give them high school level of drama. Its very frustrating. I know how you feel.

I have read a lot of posts on here and most cannot recognize that the relationship the way it is, is toxic. K and I on the other hand realize this and right now I think his actions are the ONLY way he knows how to handle things. At least we have accepted the problem, and are working on the issue - yes, we may be apart but I do believe he is doing what he can to sort his situation out. Most just walk away, turn their feelings off and expect everything to be all right (I did this with my last relationship - jumped into my most recent) - It catches up with you. If I had taken the time to reflect before I got into this one we may not be where we are today - But, I can't speculate nor can I change the past.

I talk the talk right now, just finding it hard to walk the walk.

Its easy to be blind in your relationship. Just looking at the posts on here and its amazing that someone can even write a full paragraph and still not be able to see the problem. Most of the time they answer their own questions in their question.

What its going to come down with between you and him is how much he actually works on changing. Anyone can say I'll change and I'll do x, y and z. But you have to see them actually making the strides or else its useless. Talk is easy its taking action that's hard.

Ultimately its going to work out how its supposed to. I truly believe that everything happens for a reason so maybe this break will be his catalyst for change.

I hope it is - He is still stuck on the fact that it took him coming to me and telling me that he wasn't happy for me to realize that things needed to change.

I keep trying to re-itterate - Its like a heart attack patient, they may have been told for years to change their lifestyle or you will die - and when do they actually make that change? AFTER the heart attack. Hind sight is 20/20 and if going back in time existed I am sure I would take advantage of it here - but it doesn't so I am left with sticking to my goals.

I suppose this month (unless he calls first) is for me to see if he actually wants to change things as well - I should look at things that way as well. Considering I am willing to bend over backwards to fix my issues, he should be willing to do the same if he truly wants us to be together.

Yes I agree completely. There is no equality in a relationship if both parties can't see their fault and if both parties cannot agree to mend their issues.

You are right. Most people won't address a problem until its brought to their attention or it becomes so painfully obvious that whatever you are doing is just not working. I wish more people would be open to recognizing the issues that they have and want to resolve them. Its hard when you want it more then other people do. I have a close female friend who is such a great person but she has absolute crummy self esteem and because of that she jumps into bed with everyone on a first date then laments that she is never in a relationship. I point out to her all the time that men don't start relationships with women who move that fast especially not guys in their late20's early 30's. Her comeback is always that it worked when she was 19 and was in a 5 year relationship. Which just goes to show you that this behavior hasn't worked for her in years but she's holding onto it because it worked once. Some people get programmed by the dumbest things.

Guys who are 19 are different then guys who are late 20's early 30's. Most men and I say men, want someone who is comfortable with who they are and what they want in life - K, knew that with me - I knew what I wanted and often was pig headed enough to not consider his feelings towards things. But there comes a time when people need to pull back and take a look at the bigger picture - I have to work with him, not against him. When you come off as being promiscuous to an adult male, its not attractive and not a quality most men look for - simply being a women who hops around must have some self esteem issues and is looking for something/someone to help her.

This wasn't the case with K and I. I was too set in my ways at the time.

You know, I look at some of the things that I used to do when we were together and they don't appeal to me anymore (They were toxic to the relationship). Not to say that I have not taken up new habits, but... I used to obsess over this car forum which I was the admin for - now I have no desire to visit the site. I used to sit in front of my computer from the time I got home until the time I went to bed, often on Facebook, since the break up my computer has not been turned on. All these things that kept me in my "rut" are gone, and not even an interest. The internet is my savior at work, simply because I can vent all of my frustrations and talk about how I am feeling at that point in time - but only when am I am at work am I on the internet.

It sounds as if your focus has changed for the better. When we see that the things we are doing are bad or are toxic to those around us they began to become unappealing. You should feel good that you have been able to recognize those things. Its often very hard to do.

I'm glad you've found your way out of your rut. That can be pretty difficult for some people. It sounds as if you have taken up more healthy things and I'm sure things will be even better once your season starts. More to put your mind on instead of all of this.