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Originally Posted by lickemlolly

you will never see what others see because you are the one in love in this situation...of course she didnt care if he saw the two of you out together because that is what happens when you have an ex whom you are trying to let see that you have someone else..in a sense make them jealous...i know because i have done it before...i have liked for my ex to see me out with the new guy so that it will hurt him..so he will know that im not sitting around pining for him..do you think that couples dont do this all the time when they break up?? passion hasnt much to do with the fact that she is still with him...but from a psychological perspective as i have just fininshed a semester of psychology..relationships tend to start out with alot of passion and over time have a way of mellowing out to become a deep sense of love and connection...you arent going to get what you want to hear on this site...but ill say this much..she probably broke up with her ex...was hurting alot...got closer to you and because you were a distraction from him it worked for her..because thats what happens when you rebound but it doesnt change the fact that she still loves him and obviously wants to still be with him..why would you want to play second to any guy?

just another thought...say this to yourself over and over and perhaps it will become clear to you..she is still with him...they are still together..and where are you? thats right sitting on the sidelines....let it go...you are her thing on the side...you are her option...her OPTION not her priority...you are just getting sloppy seconds...not a great option at all man...

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I agree with u 90%. The bottom line is like what you said, she is with him, not me & it doesn't really matter what she says to me on the side. Her actions prove more. The issue is that I wrote this very fast leaving out some key details. Wrong as it was for us to be together, we lasted almost 2 years, now that doesn't sound like a rebound to me while he was constantly trying to get back with her. What I failed to mentioned is two key things: she invited me back to her country when she visited & I said NO (cause I was a scared idiot) & the other is that my ex & I got into a huge fight when "ss" returned, at the same moment her ex was extra aggressive about them getting back together. Either way she chose him but what you people don't understand is that I take full blame for what I did wrong. I understand this was a ****ed up situation. All I am asking is what to do from here? How can I fix this? Should I even bother? What explains how she doesn't even put pictures of them up at places he's taken her or they've been to together? Why does she contact me or answer my contact? This post was not about what I did in the past

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Originally Posted by lickemlolly

well...heres a little female perspective...you want to believe that she only went back to him because you didnt want to commit...however that is what you WANT to believe..she still wants to be with her ex...shes been on and off with him this whole time...im not doubting that she probably has some attraction to you but the fact remains is that she has history with this ex..there is something that is still keeping her there and i gotta agree with tali when he says that she is not confused one bit..she knows what she is doing...if she gets into a fight with her bf she still has you hanging around in the wing to make her feel better...and then she will continue to be with him..personally i wouldnt be suprised if shed been with him this whole time and seeing you...seems like you were just a rebound for her to try to get over her ex and when she decided she still wanted him she left you hanging out to dry

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I thought the same thing about the rebound thing. I believe we both rebounded somewhat into each other. But most relationships have an aspect of rebound unless the people involved waited long enough to get over their exs. Most people end up meeting someone worthy before they have a chance to. What I failed to mention are a few keys things: (1)we lasted almost two years together (in a dysfunctional situation but had some great times) which I feel is too long to just be a rebound, (2) she invited me to go with her back to her country when she visited & I refused, (3) her ex had been trying to get back with her the whole time but it was only until I got into a huge physical fight with my ex (she was crazy & slapped me multiple times when I told her I had feelings for my "ss") so my "ss" found that out & was pissed that I didn't press charges & didn't understand why we would fight over that if my ex & I weren't together, (4)that was at a time when her ex was being extra aggressive on them being back together & (5) she still contacts me, will answer my emails/txts/calls etc. So this post really isn't about what I've done wrong because I've learned the hard way how much I ****ed up but I want to know if there is a way to fix this & should I even bother? The bottom line is that she is with him & not me. But I don't get her mixed signals. Is it really cause I'm a backup plan or is it possible she still has feelings? Judging from my heart, her words & some of her actions, she doesn't want to lose this good guy she has even though she knows on paper she & I are a better match. I personally believe she has closed off the notion in efforts to save herself & feel secure. Like someone said before, most women want to end up with a house, family, etc. I didn't show any positive signs of that. I would just love to know why we last so long? Why she didn't get back with him & stay back with him? Why does she contact me? Why is she hiding pictures of him or avoid putting them up? Very strange behavior

I sense that you are beginning to unravel this mess a bit.

Some days it would probably seem easier to build an engine from scratch, than face the confusion over relationships.

But, allowing yourself to understand yourself a little better, will make it easier for others to understand you; girlfriends, friends, co-workers, etc.

It has been said on here many times that any relationship that is worth an investment, is worth the work to build a strong foundation.

You can't start at the penthouse, you have to start at the bottom, and work your way up.

Knowing what you want in any relationship, begins with a friendship in my opinion. You can learn much about a person just by being with them, and not in a sexual way. Being realistic, and knowing that you aren't perfect, and a potential partner is not perfect either- expect conflict, anger, arguments, differences of opinion, etc. They are all healthy emotions that should be on the table, honestly. When you know you have something good, is when all of those are settled and compromises are reached.

When it is always a guessing game as to 'why' , and the differences, left unresolved, only add up to bigger unresolved issues, it should not be a surprise when it becomes insurmountable, and unworkable.

My best advice to you, is to allow yourself the luxury of time without commitment. Even a few weeks to think, without being influenced by email/chat/phone calls/texts, etc.

That could be the best investment you've ever made.

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Originally Posted by talaniman

You can spin this any way you want it, but the facts are what they are. You had your fun, but now its on the outside looking in. That you now choose to see everything about her as being about the two of you, is not fact, just your seeing what makes you feel good, and keeps you from understanding why she is not with you. Soul mate, or compatible souls, I don't know, but for whatever reason she has chosen the safe conventional route, for now, and no doubt she will do so again, to have the respectful life that everyone expects, at least family and friends.

Step sister or not, you are still doing what every other jilted, dumped lover, in the world has done, holding on to false hope of returning to what was, and NOT moving beyond it, and getting a life that you enjoy without her in it. Maybe she isn't into this guy as you say. Does that mean you wait for her to dump him, and come back to you? Of course not.

What you fail to take into account from her is that she is with him, for whatever reason, and will be with someone else later, just to have what all females want, after they have had their fun, a house and family. Imagine what your family, and hers, would say about anything to do with the two of you being a couple and you see why you are where you are, and she is where she is.

That stands out in your post, more than anything, that this affair was done without the knowledge of anyone but the two of you, and clearly she sees that. And just as clearly, she will keep it that way. That you ignore this very obvious fact is telling, as its the biggest fact you have. The rest are feelings, that may or may NOT last as long as you think.

For it to work the way you want, then you better have a plan that doesn't include family being a part of your life, which was the biggest obstacle you faced from the beginning. My advice is the same I give all after a failed relationship. Move on with your life and get your proper healing, and get a healthy, happy life without her. It was fun while it lasted, now its over. Stay out of her business, and stop looking for signs that the good old days will come back.

If you don't, you will be a secret lover forever. No way will she trade a life with you at the expense of family.

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Well said & although a lot of what you've said is very true, you don't realize key aspects because I left them out in a rush writing the original post. For example, I was the one who was hiding us, she had no problem with ANYONE including her family knowing about us. She also invited me to go back to her country with her to visit her family which I was not ready to do. It was very akward for me. She would tell me things like, "WHO CARES?" etc. Many things I left out here which is making everyone on here react very negative plus the step sister aspect (im sure) is not helping. Bottom line is that I ****ed up many times with her. She is with him now & not me. But she still contacts me, answers my means of contact, talks about us & our past when we do speak, doesn't ever bring him up, avoids putting any pictures of him on her profile, tells me that she has said many things in order to move on even if they weren't true, etc. my questions here are, after understanding more details, understanding that I know I made many mistakes & learned the hard way, where do I go from here? She & I lasted almost 2 years in the messy situation. He was always trying to get back with her but she never did. When she found out that my ex & I got into a huge fight, she was very upset & couldn't believe that allowed that to happen. She was also very mad that I refused to go to her country with her. With that said, its not about my past because I know where I went wrong. What can I do to fix this? Is it worth fixing? I miss her very much & I wish I had a second chance to cherish her the way she deserved

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Originally Posted by EASTcoaster

i agree with u 90%. the bottom line is like what u said, she is with him, not me & it doesn't really matter what she says to me on the side. her actions prove more. The issue is that i wrote this very fast leaving out some key details. Wrong as it was for us to be together, we lasted almost 2 years, now that doesnt sound like a rebound to me while he was constantly trying to get back with her. What I failed to mentioned is two key things: she invited me back to her country when she visited & i said NO (cause i was a scared idiot) & the other is that my ex & i got into a huge fight when "ss" returned, at the same moment her ex was extra aggressive about them getting back together. Either way she chose him but what you people don't understand is that i take full blame for what i did wrong. i understand this was a ****ed up situation. all i am asking is what to do from here? how can i fix this? should i even bother? what explains how she doesn't even put pictures of them up at places hes taken her or theyve been to together? why does she contact me or answer my contact? this post was not about what i did in the past

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I get how you feel.. believe me I do... im not saying that she doesn't care for you or that she didn't care for you... what I'm trying to get you to realize is that she loves him more... her heart is with him... and what you fail to realize is that may have NOTHING to do with you messing up... you could have had a perfect relationship but if the power her ex has over her is stronger then what you hold then you are ALWAYS going to lose... ALWAYS... you are better off going your own separate way with this.. even if for some chance she did take you back... whats to say she won't leave you again.. sneak behind your back and be with him... it doesn't matter how bad this guy is for her... she will not walk away until her heart has had enough.. and obviously she's still willing to make it work... its hard for you to conceive that I know because you want this to happen so bad now that she is gone... you will always be planning runner up to him... he has her heart and that's something you will never be able to change no matter how hard you try

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its not about my past because I know where I went wrong. What can I do to fix this? Is it worth fixing? I miss her very much & I wish I had a second chance to cherish her the way she deserved

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Leave her alone. The added details do absolutely nothing to change the fact that you are not together. Nothing, so there is nothing to fix. Not with her any way. Its with you that the truth lies, and you will never see it unless you remove yourself from the emotions, and deal with the facts. She has already made her choices, so her words are not relevant, just her actions.

The important thing to know is that after all the emotional dust has settled completely, you will no doubt see things with a different perspective. Right now all you see is YOUR blame for all that's happened, and even though your actions played a big part in everything that has happened, was it as wrong as you think? No, and it seldom is. Her actions had as much to do with the way things worked out, as yours did. So really there is no blame, just the situation is what it is.

That's why you back up, and cope with your own feelings better, get beyond them, and deal with reality with a clear head, and conscious, so you will understand better exactly what has happened. Right now your feelings are in the way, and you see excuses, and reasons, and your own justification of her actions, and a whole lot of regret. Your reaching for straws that go no where.

Give yourself the chance, to fix yourself, and the solution to your situation will be a lot easier to deal with, after YOU have dealt with your own feelings in a positive way. Your course of action is simple, but difficult but it's the best way. That is allow yourself to heal from your past experience, and see it for what it is, a conflict, and remove yourself from it completely, to gain clarity of thought, to see the facts, and evaluate them correctly. Then you can make a better decision for yourself, based on facts, and not just feelings.

It starts with leaving her alone, and staying away from her influence (better known as No Contact)!! Only then will you see with your head and not just your emotions. There was a reason you didn't run around half the world to have her, there was a reason you hesitated, and not to forget while you forgot your ex, she didn't forget hers. There is a big reason it happened that way. You just can't see it yet but if you listen, and take a few suggestions, I guarantee that you will.

That's how you end confusion, misery and pain, and keep your dignity, and self respect, and not be the slave to a very young female with her own agenda.

And never take full blame, over something you didn't have FULL control over. That makes no sense and its your heart talking, not your head. Tell the heart to shut up, and listen.

Regardless, you should not keep your relationship with your S-sister. You both won't have normal relationship in a long run, she understood and moved-away.

Its time for you to move away from her as far as you can. Be with another gal and get married and have healthy relationship.

Hey Eastcoaster,

I apologize for my harshness. You were completely justified in saying so.

Didn't mean to impose my values in that way. For that I am sorry.

The advice so far has been right on. Especially by Tal & Jake. Take heed in what they say.

Sometimes emotions get the best of us.

I agree with leaving her alone. Using this as a lesson to not jump before we are ready. Healing from ex's, not rushing.

To know ourselves before we bring others in. To use our gut, our detectors, if you will.

Someone told one time that our mistakes define our successes.

That's something that holds true forever. That's growing.

Like Tal said:
"Tell the heart to shut up, and listen."

Maybe try being single for a while. People don't define us. But our relationships do.

Ive had good ones & bad. Still learning.

My best of luck to you using this lesson to better yourself.

Cheers,
van.

Ok long story short: I met this girl, we hit it off but she had a boyfriend & I had a girlfriend. We broke up with our partners for each other & began to date. We probably rushed into our relationship too quick but we really liked each other too much to care. For a year & a half we had some really great times but little by little I felt it fading away because I had trouble completely committing. (I had some valid reasons & with a few "not so valid" reasons but its too much to write at the moment.) I also noticed her falling for me faster than I was for her. Eventually, she went back to her ex who was a really nice guy, willing to commit & I had realized the hard way what I had lost. (Since their first break up she never completely cut off contact with her ex nor did I with my ex.) While they got back together she sent me many mixed signals. One day, "she & i weren't meant to be" then the next day, she would call or text me. When we did talk, she would never mention his name & we would usually end up talking about ourselves & our relationship. I stayed in contact with her because I felt deep down something was off with them & of course, I loved & missed her very much. We started talking A LOT over the phone & I expressed to her how I really felt & why I didn't commit. I also admitted to all the mistakes I had made. She slowly began to open up on how she really felt about me but she was still with him. Soon after, we hung out twice but with no physical contact. We had a really good time though. She admitted that she was very confused. Again, one moment we weren't meant to be then I reacted poorly, then the next day she claims she didn't really mean that. About a month later, I found out they broke up again & she & her ex had a long talk & she claims she told him she couldn't be with him due to their personal problems (and how she felt about me but she did not admit that part to him). A few days later, we met up & went out for drinks & she kissed me at the club. It was actually really nice. Soon after, we were very "lovey dovey" through out the night. I took her home & I haven't seen her since (its been a few days). Since then she's been a bit colder than I would expect. I mean, we still contact each other a lot via text & email but I feel that something is off. I assumed after the kiss that she was very into us getting back together & giving me a second chance because I had done a lot to prove it. (too much details to explain here). I asked her if we can talk about us & since the night we kissed, she's been avoiding it. She originally told me she needs time & I need to be more patient. But then why did she kiss me? Part of me knows she is probably very afraid to jump right back into something with me because I hurt her in the past (never cheated though) but I allowed MY ex to interfere with our relationship. Moving on, I am nervous that I might get my heart deep back into this only for her to leave me. She is not a spiteful person but I know human nature, which can never cease to surprise. So part of me wonders what is the psychology behind her behavior. I mean, she got back with her ex AGAIN, they seemed happy but then broke up again, month later, she & I kiss. Is she rebounding with me because she's hurting over him or is it just obvious that she is slowly learning to love me again? Is she missing him because I know she still has feelings for her ex but at the same time, most people still have some feelings for their ex. Do I leave her be? Am I just a second option or was he? Do I pressure the subject more? Do I pull away? Do I give her some sort of ultimatum? Its very hard for me to pull away from her because I'd like to end up with her & I'm afraid she might not think I care enough & run back to her ex again. But at the same time, I want her to know that I'm not just some second option. I'm a good enough guy to eventually find happiness elsewhere. I don't want to "scare" her but I don't want to be in limbo for too long. If she call or texts, I jump to that phone like a frog to a lily pad (which shows her I'm still right there.) Im trying to develop a plan on how to continue here because I know that I can be very impatient so if I devise a plan for myself & my future, I can work around that helping me to be patient. I know that if you pressure someone too much, it will backfire. But her kissing me & us being so "lovey dovey" definitely confused me. Any advice or suggestions are appreciated. Thank you everyone!

Are you sure you are not confused and it is her who is confused? Please read your own post again.

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Originally Posted by lifeistough75

Are you sure you are not confused and it is her who is confused? please read your own post again.

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Are you trying to help or hurt? Obviously I am confused but now how I feel about her. I was confused in the past (months & months ago) but not anymore. What I am confused about is what actions to take. I guess I just want to know if this is real or not as quickly as possible but I understand if there is no way around waiting it out. I was hoping for some substantial advice on here but I also understand that outside advice is hard to give if you are not in the situation yourself. Trust me, I would not be on here if I didn't care. I was very hesitant about going online for advice.

I am not trying to hurt you, nor I can help you. I am completely confused about what you are looking for, what questions you really have. Again, please read your own post, and see if you can make sense of it.

To answer both of your threads.

Don't wait for her. Leave this in the past. Chalk it up to memories, not obsession.

Lots of drama like you originally said.

Who wants that?

You may be looking for a certain answer here & not always like what you hear, but that's what's great about AMHD. Lots of free (well, except for time, hehehe) advice to listen to & let soak in.

Thousands of dedicated people.

She isn't. Too young.

However "unique" you feel your situation is, the advice has been solid. Posting another thread isn't going to change things.

Same people here.

Maybe a few paid sessions with a therapist could help reveal what you are seeking. Tell them the same thing, see what they say.

Give life guy a break EC, in case you hadn't noticed your threads were merged for the whole story, and we realize when you don't get the advice you want that you like many others repost to get different answers and leave or add details out.

Doesn't matter as you should be leaving this female alone and doing your own thing regardless of what she says or does. You are acting and reacting to the hope that this whatever it is works and you get the girl, but you cannot see she is capable of keeping you around until she is ready to be caught. I know it's a hard thing to accept the girl you want and love has that kind of power over you, and knows how to use it.

Actually she doesn't. But that's what you allow her to do so, it fits with her own plans, and does what she has to to keep you around, because she knows you want to be around. It was no mistake it didn't work as secret lovers, and its no coincidence that the other guy is in the picture still. That says a lot, that she doesn't really want either of you at this time but juggles you both to keep you both chasing.

Sorry guy, it's a blow to the ego, but you seem to powerless to do a darn thing about it and even still think she is afraid of getting hurt by you. Yeah right. Wake up and add the fact without the ego and you see two fools who take whatever crumbs she throws at you and stand at attention when she is around, hoping to get petted by the lady who has your heart. SIMPLY PATHETIC.

Neither of you has the dignity, and self respect of a common flea, and will forever be at her mercy until she gets a new dog that can do better tricks. Don't believe me? Stop chasing, and letting her have her way with you, and see what happens. Let me know, and I promise to not say I told you so, because that's exactly what I am telling you now in advance.

Tal, you nailed it hard. Amazing.

Eastcoaster wants this girl no matter what. Bruised ego totally. Power. But who's in control? Or out of control for that matter?

Selfish pride. But the ironic thing is that pride already has been lost, right from the get go. By selfishness & need.

Still is.

Maybe she is waiting for you to really show you want to be with her and that your committed

EASTcoaster: Love wasn't meant to be that hard or painful.

Im sorry but your only going to keep getting hurt if you keep playing the game she's playing.

I would back off and leave her to it.

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Originally Posted by vanheart

To answer both of your threads.

Dont wait for her. Leave this in the past. Chalk it up to memories, not obsession.

Lots of drama like you originally said.

Who wants that?

You may be looking for a certain answer here & not always like what you hear, but thats whats great about AMHD. Lots of free (well, except for time, hehehe) advice to listen to & let soak in.

Thousands of dedicated people.

She isnt. Too young.

However "unique" you feel your situation is, the advice has been solid. Posting another thread isnt gonna change things.

Same people here.

Maybe a few paid sessions with a therapist could help reveal what you are seeking. Tell them the same thing, see what they say.

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Thanks but I didn't post a second thread to "change things," it was actually the update to my situation. Since my first thread, she broke up with her man & we got close recently for the first time in a longgg time. We spoke on the phone the other day since that night & she claims that she wants us to start our relationship again but SLOWLY. That it was too intense before & when we kissed the other night that it was very intense. She claims she doesn't want to be with him anymore & that she would like to have something with me. In a sense, our last conversation (which was after my most recent thread) was her giving me some clear cut answers I wanted to hear but I "feel" something is off. She said all the right things & I see that they are no longer myspace friends (not that that means much) but it shows some progress. I agree that this is filled with drama but its so much easier said than done to pull out. Especially when she waited for me to commit for so long back then when I never did. I will give her some time (no more than a few weeks) & if I feel weird still or it seems shady, I PROMISE (to myself) I will stop all contact with her. Thank you everyone

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Originally Posted by talaniman

Give life guy a break EC, in case you hadn't noticed your threads were merged for the whole story, and we realize when you don't get the advice you want that you like many others repost to get different answers and leave or add details out.

Doesn't matter as you should be leaving this female alone and doing your own thing regardless of what she says or does. You are acting and reacting to the hope that this whatever it is works and you get the girl, but you cannot see she is capable of keeping you around until she is ready to be caught. I know its a hard thing to accept the girl you want and love has that kind of power over you, and knows how to use it.

Actually she doesn't. But thats what you allow her to do so, it fits with her own plans, and does what she has to to keep you around, because she knows you want to be around. It was no mistake it didn't work as secret lovers, and its no coincidence that the other guy is in the picture still. That says a lot, that she doesn't really want either of you at this time but juggles you both to keep you both chasing.

Sorry guy, its a blow to the ego, but you seem to powerless to do a darn thing about it and even still think she is afraid of getting hurt by you. Yeah right. Wake up and add the fact without the ego and you see two fools who take whatever crumbs she throws at you and stand at attention when she is around, hoping to get petted by the lady who has your heart. SIMPLY PATHETIC.

Neither of you has the dignity, and self respect of a common flea, and will forever be at her mercy until she gets a new dog that can do better tricks. Don't believe me?? Stop chasing, and letting her have her way with you, and see what happens. Let me know, and I promise to not say I told you so, because thats exactly what I am telling you now in advance.

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I agree with you very much. But one thing I think you misunderstood is that if you read my 2nd post, its actually an update to the events that happened since my first. Since my 1st post, she broke up with him, we hung out again but this time kissed & got VERY close. Since my 2nd post (after the kiss) she & I had a long conversation & she told me she does not want to be with him, that she wants to be with me but take it VERY SLOW because its too intense for her to handle etc. Even the kiss we recently had was very close to turning into sex but we both stayed strong. In our phone conversation, she said all the right things like "i want to be with you, i dont want him," etc. its hard to pull out since I'm so deep in but I will consider all that's been said on here but give her a few weeks or so & if I feel something is up, you can rest assure that I WILL stop all contact with her. Thank you!

I hate to say what I have to say, but you'll be back in a few weeks time asking why did she do it again and how to deal with being heartbroken all over again.

This girl jumps from one relationship to another - VERY bad sign. The second the going with you will get tough, she'd run back to her ex. AGAIN. And us, AMHD smartasses, will be waiting right here with our "told ya so".

Seriously, leave her alone to sort her life out. With you in a picture, she'll never know for sure who she wants. And even then you'll never feel safe. You can't win this game, so stop playing.