If he wants you he will prove it. It'll be up to you to decide if you want him if and when the time comes. Don't worry about him anymore. Just think about yourself and enjoy your life. No matter what anyone says, no two people are made for each other. So sitting around worrying about him only causes you to lose time on some guy who can't even make up his mind about you. He's weighing his options. I suggest you do the same.

Oh, and you're welcome. That's what we are all here for anyway.

liz28 thank u, my ex was never begging for me 2 come back and I did not enjoy him chasing me- I dindnt expierience that! I have wrote a letter agreeing with the break up yes because that seemed to be the right thing to do 2 allow him 2 move on- I love him and want him to be happy- of course I want that to be with me but if its not then he shd stop playing these dangling games and tell me straight up, which he just has not done, he tells me he misses me, he tells me that he loves me, we have been dating again for 4 months since I left our house, but he's just not the same, I know he feels guily for what has happened to me and angry what happened to us both and our children, and he wanted to protect me and feels a failure, this is all so much to try and deal with- I feel so very messed up about thje whole situation I know that absence makes the heart grow fonder and sometimes people need to realise just what they have lost but hey this isn't right

Thank u,iTried
Sometimes its hard to listen to all that hurts us and all I feel at the moment is hurt, hurt about anything and everything,hurt hurt hurt, hurt for him, me and of course our children.
Hurt and robbed

Threads merged/edited

I know that as part of breaking up with someone you will have many hurtful questions to yourself and probably questions that you will never be able to ask the "other" but you will still try to make some sense of them, well that is where I am at the moment, I know it's a kind of torture and not on the positive side but there is a need to make sense of it, so if I can ask you what this means please.

If you take a maths exam without making any attempt to study for it with no knowledge whatsoever you will inevitably fail right?
You can guess maybe a few questions right, pure luck!

OK so now if I apply that to life and a relationship- if you have no experience of good relationships around you, and the people with influence in your life are not particularly good for you,including and especially your immediate family, you know they are not good for you and you pull yourself away from that.
You hide yourself in a protective bubble so not to get hurt because you have a hard time working out what is good for you because the people closest to you hurt you the worst,

But then you meet someone who has the same ideas as you , someone you have learned to trust , love and believe in, you share your life s emotions with them your pain and hurt,
And from out of no-where they then seem to use these experiences against you in some way.
By saying that your lack of knowledge for how things are really done makes you make decisions that are wrong,
Now I can see that this could somewhat be the case, but the fact that I had pulled away from all those bad things because I wanted to make different decisions decisions that felt right and fair and to give my children better lives than I once had, how can this be fair

I'm sure that we all do make wrong decisions in our lives but don't we make those decisions with the best intentions?


I read a saying again I don't know where it came from sorry,

"i myself am made entirely of flaws- but I'm stitched together with good intentions"

How can people use experiences that you have had as a child and growing up that you had no part in choosing for yourself against you if when you grow as an adult, you make choices that feel right for you don't you, but they are not always right for everyone are they, as long as your intentions were good.

I'm sorry if it doesn't make sense to you its very difficult when you can't explain what situations led to this question, but I guess what I'm asking is,
Will I always do what is wrong in a relationship because I don't have the knowledge to do what is right or is it that because of the things I have been through makes me easily manipulated by people?

Welcome to the real world, with real people, and as your finding out, be careful who you trust, and always trust yourself first. Unlike math, where the answers are set, and so is the procedure to get them, people are more complicated, and the procedure of how there mind works is varied.

Talaniman Rule#1- Love yourself so you wont fall for someone else's BS!!

That only requires you know yourself, and are good to yourself. Much simpler than math!!

I know that maths and people/relationships are very different it was just the first example I could think of, but when you say welcome to the real world with real people its somewhat confusing! My real world and real people as a child and growing up were not my choices, and as I grew into an adult I chose to stay away from those types of people- however it seemes that even when I've been in a happy place with myself alone and I then allow someone into my life believeing that they are in fact the "good type" it changes, wolf in sheeps clothing comes to mind.
It just seems to me that when people don't want to try anymore, and want to give up on a relationship they want to blame someone else because it makes them feel better. But when you care about how someone feels why would you add to their questioning by using all their bad and upsetting expieriences against them.
I can't change what has happened to me, and I can only move forwards in a different direction which is what I was doing and still am, but in my expierience people just arnt what they say they are at all.

An example of what I meant in my first question,
When I was young I had a very bad expierience and needed the help of an official agency, this was a very agonising expierience, but it led to my being let down and made to feel that I had done something wrong, it left me with no trust for this agency, I stated in an earlier question that I had a stalker for a long time, and initially I did not want to use this agency for help, in fear of being let down again,
So although the other person in my life could see why I was scared they just replyed with I was wrong! Now I know that I was wrong but surely there is a much better method for helping someone through their fears?
I would just like to say though, that even when I did use the help of this agency again it was all dealt with wrong- I was the one that was seen to be in the wrong, was I encouraging it? NO I was definitely not- why hadn't I reported it before? I was scared, every time I did report it things got worse.
OK so finally this stalker went to prison but not for what he had done to me, or my partner at the time.
Again I know that its probably not a good example but I have constantly listened to you never deal with things in the right way.
Don't we all do things wrong?
Isn't that where we support each other making decisions together and dealing with the consequenses together too

That's part of my point. It takes a long time to see how people really are, and sometimes our feelings get in the way of being able to see what is the truth about how someone really is, "love is blind"(?).

That takes a lot of time, and paying attention to the character, and actions of others, and how it affect them, and us. We often have our own problems, or experiences we have been through, that makes us who we are whether that's good, or bad.

Hard to explain the actions of others, or figure why they do, what they do, but no matter the actions they take, you have to love yourself enough to be able to deal with yourself, and another human, and the way you deal with each other, is what makes your relationships, and life successful, or lets you know its time to go, and be happy for yourself, and protect yourself.

It seldom works when we depend on someone else to be happy, and they fail us. That hurts like heck. Sometimes we put too much faith in others, and they just can't deliver for us. I think you have experienced that in your own life, and have dealt with having to help yourself.

Don't be alarmed, or surprised, when others do bad things to us, intentionally, or accidentally, its how you deal with it, that really counts.

Always love yourself, and treat yourself the best way possible, no matter what you have to go through, or what life throws at you.

I hear what you are saying, and yes this does make sense to a point, I do love myself and have always only been able to depend on myself, but when you think that you have spent enough time figuring out the character of a person and it all works very well, and they compliment your life the way that you need-and you return that same compliment, only for them to change, get angry and bitter where does that come from? Had they been acting like someone they wernt truly, for all those years, just playing a game, what is the reason that people change so quickly like that?
I know that in some cases there can be an outside influence from maybe someone they may be attracted to, however this is not the case, we are both choosing to be on our own.
I know that life can sometimes be cruel, and I do believe that what we go through in our lives makes us the people that we are, and I feel good about myself knowing and believeing that I am a good person and try to treat people with the same respect that I myself would wish for, but I have got to the point where I think what's the point in any if it, if everyone else just wants to get you to a secure place with them only to throw you from a great hight and watch you break

That's why its very important to be able to protect yourself, because people do change, or we get to know them better.

You may know what you have been through in the past, and are going through now, but you never know about what someone else is going through. Or how they will deal with it.

A risk we take whenever we let someone in our world, or step into theirs.

So its eaisier not to take the risk then.

This is where I don't understand because we all feel the need to share our lives with someone, a special someone, but if there's that chance that we/they can change our opinions of someone just like that what is the point of setting yourself up for heartache in the first place? It was my belief that you should share expieriences to help you grow together as a couple, but also apart as individuals as well, but coming together and sharing your views- its supposed to be OK to have different opinions and views and ways of dealing with things as long as the goals are the same at the end and you were walking the same path- how can you just change the path that you was once walking to believe something entirely different?

Quote:

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So its eaisier not to take the risk then.

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Yes, its easier, but not as much fun. And you can never grow from the experience, as must of us humans learn from experiences we go through.

Until you have gone through the experience of having your feelings change and deciding to change the path your on, its hard to explain how people change.

Right now your hurt from rejection, and that sucks, but let me tell you from experience, it also hurts to reject someone, especially if you really cared, and they really have done nothing wrong to you, its just YOUR feelings have changed. Hope that makes some sense.

Hmm some sense but I think that I'm just torturing myself really with all the confsion from the things that have been said and the things he was doing- I do need to try andmake some sense of it though or what will I have learnt? I'm not saying that I didn't do anything wrong during our relationship, I wish I was that perfect but I didn't cheat I didn't treat him bad etc etc yes we has arguments as do all couples at times, but I just didn't deal with things in the right way- he saw this as damaging I saw this as protecting- both of us!

A question that has been really bothering me that I can't shake from my mind- I didn't deal with things in the right way sometimes that he saw damaging, we would talk it over and then of course we would make up as couples do very intimately- these times became quiet aggressive and he would say that he wanted me to feel some pain as he had done when I had made the wrong decisions, now he never really hurt me and it wasn't an awful expierience, sometimes things being a little rough was ok- but why would he want to hurt me in this way- he wanted to punish me(his words) in the beginning we had such a fantastic sex life he was so gentle, what does this change towards me mean?
I know its one of those questions that is intimate, and probably very difficult to answer but is this common?

Its more than common, and over time would have escalated. One thing you should know is he was pretty selfish and controlling, as he wanted things his way. Trust me, it would have gotten worse.

Now relax, and let yourself heal from this, and clear your mind of thoughts of this guy and then your answers to your questions will be clear to you as the emotional dust hasn't settled enough to allow you to see everything as it really was. That takes time so be patient.

THANK YOU TALANIMAN, how did you become so wise?

Kissing a lot of frogs, and busting my head against a lot of brick walls.

Got tired of the chapped lips, and the headaches.

It ain't wisdom, its being tired of the pain.

But I've been tired of the pain like forever now! They say that god doesn't pt you through anything that you can't handle but I really can't handle anymore, I don't just mean the relationships thing, I mean all of it, my children are hurting his children are hurting, my daughter ran away from home to his after we split she's 11, he wouldn't even see her, I can't seem to pick her up again. His daughter has left his home cause it isn't the same now that I'm not there, she's 16, so she's legally old enough to leave, but she and I had such a good relationship, now she's throwing her education away, she's so troubled- she told me how much of a difference I made to her life, she feels that her dad and her brothers all pick on her and put her down and if I'm honest they do! I know that you are right about the controlling issues because I've seen the boys follow their dads traits, by me being there she wasn't the only other female and she felt that someone was looking out for her a little.
We had 8 children between us, he was married for 20 years previous to our 4 1/2 years together and I was married for 10.
My ex husband repeatedly cheated and I left him once I was strong enough, it did hurt but not the way that this has torn me apart.
I have spoken to my ex's ex-wife of 20 years, I don't want to be rude about her in any way at all cause I don't really know her, but she is a bit loopy now, one day she just up and left 5 kids and that's got to be hard, for her and the children, but there must have been a reason! She did come back for them but then he took her to court for them, and he won custody. They are of course used to it now- it has been a long time, 9 years in fact, she did say some things to me about her, and now my ex- about the way he was, and the way things were between them, but it was all covered very well by the fact that she was "crazy" according to everyone around them. Even their children. They do see her and quiet a lot now that they are older, but in my opinion they use her for the material things that their dad couldn't provide.
I feel like I know a little of what she may have gone through, but I've listened to it being down to me for so long- me always being wrong and doing the wrong things according to him, and he even said that I was just like his ex wife, which was hard to listen too because he told me how much he hated her, the first time I saw her I was shocked because I look just like her- I mean ten years younger but I could seriously be her twin. How do I help my children to recover from this when they miss him so much but he won't see them. How do I help his daughter when I'm not allowed to see her.
The house that we shared together was a rented property that we agreed upon and when it came to sign for this he signed all the documents, so when it was time for us to part it was me and the children that had to move out, I had put all my savings into this new house and bought all new furniture to fit this house- I gave to friends things that we had 2 of, because we didn't need 2 washing machines and 2 fridges and two ovens etc etc etc, I know these things are only material things but when you have used all of you savings on a house you don't now live in and you don't have the means to buy anymore, well I'm sure you know what I mean, when I asked him for some help because all the furniture was being left he just said that id made the decision to buy it and he didn't have the money. He got to stay in the house cause he signed and he got to keep everything and my children are the ones that have been paying the price, I feel like I'm letting them down so badly I have let them down, I'm so tired of the pain now

Too much pain now.
There is that old saying about putting a child in a cage with a dog and eventually the child will bark- this has been proven hasn't it?
Can you go through a relationship that ends up making you feel confused about who you are because of the things that have been constantly said to you?
Can you be put down to a point where you start believing that you are nothing and no-one.
I wake up in the mornings with good intentions and that's about as far as it gets, I don't feel I know what's real and what's not anymore

I know full well about the rebuilding, healing process, and how long it takes, and the hard work it involves. There is nothing harder in life, I don't think.

I also know, its time to be very selfish, and think of yourself, or you do no one any good, not even yourself.

All you say is true, and I know the pain, but there are no magic pills, quick fixes, or good advice, to replace the work that's in front of you. You just have to have faith in yourself, and get busy in your own behalf.

Just because your down, doesn't mean you stay down. I think your stronger than that, and will get up again.

The best I can do at this point, is give you a big cyber hug, so you will know someone cares, and wishes you well.

Thank you for the cyber hug, 1 FOR YOU TOO

Is there a time when you have been down for too long? I'm starting to worry that it has been too long and I'm not starting to feel better, I know that it must be different for everyone but even so I reall feel like I don't want to go on, I know that I have to, and I have to for my children more than anything, I love them with all my heart, and I am all they have, they are all I have.
I've never felt as low as I do, I feel like the control has all been taken from me, even my children have noticed that things have got worse for me, I know that there is not much that you can't hide from children but...
I really feel so alone in the world