I have two questions. First, I have a Trane HP that's about 12 years old and is leaking freon. The service guy said I could replace the coil on the outside for about $1,200.

Second option is to replace the unit entirely with a new 3 ton Bryant Evolution 16 seer split unit, installed for $6,300 (price reflects $1,000 rebate from Bryant). I live in Florida. My air handler is pretty old and rusty and the outside unit is about at its max life from what I have read so I am inclined to replace but the price seems high and I don't know much about Bryant. I could get the 18 seer model for about $700 more.

Thoughts? Should I replace the coil and or cut my losses and go with Bryant or a more well known brand like Trane?

Thanks in advance!

Get the new unit and new inside air handler. While Florida uses a lot of cooling I would be inclined to just go with a 13 SEER system. Now much of this depends upon price. Get a price on a 13 SEER and post back.

The reason I say this is if the price differential is high you may never recover your extra cost for a 16 SEER unit.

A Bryant unit is a very good unit, it is made by Carrier and is in a class with the Trane unit.
When you start talking about the S.E.E.R differences of units you need to go shopping and look at some of the condensing units that are out of the box. Look down into the unit and see what you can see in the 18 S.E.E.R unit that is different than the 16 S.E.E.R unit or as far as that goes a 13 S.E.E.R unit. You will not see anything that is worth $700.00. So I am a little doubtful about some of these fuel cost saving the people tell you about.

You have to figure a pay-back on the units, if you are saving 20% of your cooling bill and your cooling bill is $60 for the three hot months of summer and $30 for two months that are not so hot with a saving of 20%, the total saving on cooling will be only be $48 for the year.

I say buy the 13 S.E.E.R put the rest of the money in the bank and have enough saved up to pay for the next unit you will buy in 12 to 15 years, if is is needed.

Thanks for your answers, hvac 1000 and letmetellu.

The 18 SEER Bryant Evolutions unit is now at $6,300 after discussing with the contractor today. Supposedly the unit has won awards as a best buy in Consumer's Digest. He can go to $6,000 on the 16.2 SEER unit. He recommends, that actually... it's me who is thinking I should go with the 18 SEER for just a few hundred more dollars.

I should have mentioned that my house is 3,250 sq. ft. and the 3 ton replacement unit would cool/heat a little more than 1/2 of my house - the side we are in during the day. The other half is heated and cooled by a 2004 Payne unit (yes, I know, not the best, but free from a warranty company). The Payne unit is 13 SEER I believe and has the original A/H unit (from 1992). The contractor recommended replacing the A/H on that side of the house for $1,400.

Is the Bryant Evolutions unit really as good as say the Trane 19i? Thanks!

Working on getting a price for the 13 SEER and 14.5 SEER Bryant units by the way... Thanks

The higher you go with SEER the more it costs. Here
Is a secret. No matter what SEER you buy it will not perform as advertised
Yep that is correct. I am retired but teach augratis (for free at a local university) We were paid by a few large HVAC companies to test there stuff and
Cherry pick defects. What we found was that if lets say a 16 SEER unit is over or undercharged by as little as 1/2 ounce of refrigerant the SEER drops like a rock.

Most HVAC comanys do not have the proper tools to do a critical charge like what is required for a 16 SEER. Actually most companies can hardly do a 13 correctly. With this being said I recommend the 13 SEER. No reason to pay big bucks for a 16 when you will not be getting the 16 performance.

Always remember the energy efficiency ratio is listed by the factory and done under ideal conditions. That is not the case when installing it into your home. They love to sell the higher efficiency stuff because they make more money.

One final note. The more expensive equiptment will not last any longer that the cheaper stuff. The more expensive equiptment will also cost more to repair after the warranty.

For over 30 years I had a 37 man HVAC operation so I have been around the block more that a few times. I am retired now and devote my time to the university to train some of the younger people in this trade. My wife made me do it because for years I was never home and then when I sold the business I was home all the time. She told me to find something to do before I drove her crazy. LOL

I only know two other systems that can hang with the Carrier/Bryant Evolution and that is Trane and Water Furnace. And yes the higher SEER will pay off. The difference when you look down inside a 13 SEER or higher is not what you looking at but knowing what your looking at. (Coil surface,two speed scroll compressor, temp switch to control the fan motor for ambient temps.) Carrier/Bryant makes their dealer and techs be NATE certified. Plus as a bonus-check the quote you should have a ten years parts and labor.

A higher SEER will only pay off after years of usage. Do the math then speak.
What are you looking at?
Two speed compressor? Who cares. A correct size unit will not need a slower or higher speed to get the job done to start with, Lets not talk about moisture removal because the blower motor running at a slower speed will strip the water out faster that a 2 speed compressor system can. Fan switch for ambient temps? I do not think the normal person will be running there A/C when it is 55 or 60 outside because that is the only time you need ambient control. NATE is good. We offer our university as a testing facility and I am the moderator. But there is a problem with NATE. It is answering book questions on HVAC knowledge. It really makes no difference how much of the book you know. It is how you apply your knowledge in the field that counts. In other words can you see the forest with all the trees in the way. Many people cannot and they should not be service people to start with.
Warranty. Just about every manufacturer has a good general warranty. Heck even Goodman has 10 years on some of the units they make. Extended factory warranty is also available. The problem with extended warrants is that who is going to fix it when the dealer you bought it from goes out of business because that is a ongoing problem. No one wants to adopt a sick unit when the original dealer is no longer around and why should they. The dealer that gets stuck fixing it only gets a very small allowance for the repair and no money mark up on the parts. This is a problem for people who 7 years from now will find out about and NO the manufacturer is not going to send someone 500 miles to fix your unit. Actually most of the local reps for the manufactures no little or nothing about how these units work because they are salesman.

I have been around the block to many times and heard all the horror stories. Salesmen worry about there commission and the more they charge the more they make. There are some good and very honest people in the HVAC trade. I always suggest to check references on the companys you get bids from and the Better Business Bureau.

One last tip. Make sure you get an Thermostatic Expansion attached to you coil instead of a flow rater or piston system. Also make sure the unit has hard start components (relay and Capacitor) to go along with the expansion valve. The hard start items will make your compressor last much longer because most of the wear on the compressor comes at start up time. The Expansion Valve will make sure you indoor coil is fed the proper amount of refrigerant under all temperature conditions.
Good luck hunting for the best system for your house.

Are yoi interested in saving money or energy?

If the answer is money buy the 13 S.E.E.R.
If the answer is energy buy the 18 S.E.E.R.

Bryant/Carrier are the same, very well known established brand, just like Trane and Rheem. With that said, Im know of many issues with the infinity series of equipment. Even Regal Beloit (manufacturer of the GE ECM motors) have stated problems with their communication system. The SEER will pay off in time, but the repair bills after 5 years on many of these new super high efficiencies will cost you all that you have saved. Set up is crucial on these models and Water furnace too. I know a couple of the water furnace engineers, they have made great improvements in their furnace, but they will tell you 90% of the warranty calls was due to improper set up. I agree with everything HVAC100 said, but to the best of my knowledge all 13 seer (the minimum you can buy today) have TXV's in them.

You can buy a 13 seer condenser and by simply putting in an air handler with an ECM motor will increase the seer to nearly 14.5 seer. But be warned ECM motors only are cheap to operate if the static pressure of the ductwork is low, non restrictive. Since it is a constant airflow motor even a dirty filter will ramp up the motor and it will cost much more to operate.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hvac1000

A higher SEER will only pay off after years of usage. Do the math then speak.
What are you looking at?
Two speed compressor? Who cares. A correct size unit will not need a slower or higher speed to get the job done to start with, Lets not talk about moisture removal because the blower motor running at a slower speed will strip the water out faster that a 2 speed compressor system can. Fan switch for ambient temps? I do not think the normal person will be running there A/C when it is 55 or 60 outside because that is the only time you need ambient control. NATE is good. We offer our university as a testing facility and I am the moderator. But there is a problem with NATE. It is answering book questions on HVAC knowledge. It really makes no difference how much of the book you know. It is how you apply your knowledge in the field that counts. In other words can you see the forest with all the trees in the way. many people cannot and they should not be service people to start with.
Warranty. Just about every manufacturer has a good general warranty. Heck even Goodman has 10 years on some of the units they make. Extended factory warranty is also available. The problem with extended warrants is that who is going to fix it when the dealer you bought it from goes out of business because that is a ongoing problem. No one wants to adopt a sick unit when the original dealer is no longer around and why should they. The dealer that gets stuck fixing it only gets a very small allowance for the repair and no money mark up on the parts. This is a problem for people who 7 years from now will find out about and NO the manufacturer is not going to send someone 500 miles to fix your unit. Actually most of the local reps for the manufactures no little or nothing about how these units work because they are salesman.

I have been around the block to many times and heard all the horror stories. Salesmen worry about there commission and the more they charge the more they make. There are some good and very honest people in the HVAC trade. I always suggest to check refrences on the companys you get bids from and the Better Business Bureau.

One last tip. Make sure you get an Thermostatic Expansion attached to you coil instead of a flow rater or piston system. Also make sure the unit has hard start components (relay and Capacitor) to go along with the expansion valve. The hard start items will make your compressor last much longer because most of the wear on the compressor comes at start up time. The Expansion Valve will make sure you indoor coil is fed the proper amount of refrigerant under all temperature conditions.
Good luck hunting for the best system for your house.

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You are so right about the warranty work on units that no longer have a dealer or a distributor in the area.

One other thing I would recommend people look for when they buy a unit is if you are in a storm prone area make sure you get a good hail guard.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jaxdawg

I have two questions. First, I have a Trane HP that's about 12 years old and is leaking freon. The service guy said I could replace the coil on the outside for about $1,200.

Second option is to replace the unit entirely with a new 3 ton Bryant Evolution 16 seer split unit, installed for $6,300 (price reflects $1,000 rebate from Bryant). I live in Florida. My air handler is pretty old and rusty and the outside unit is about at its max life from what I have read so I am inclined to replace but the price seems high and I don't know much about Bryant. I could get the 18 seer model for about $700 more.

Thoughts? Should I replace the coil and or cut my losses and go with Bryant or a more well known brand like Trane?

Thanks in advance!

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No HVAC expertise here... just an impoverished consumer.

A key factor when addressing your question is the warranty. Until recently a new compressor usually came with a one-year warranty while a new system carried five years. With the transition to 13 SEER, systems now carry ten year warranties... and compressors are still one year.

BOYS... please talk in ladies language... here is my situation. I have a heater.. and fan.. inside my mobile home, however, I need a a/c unit.. now, what do I buy... the mobile home is 1800sq in sc myrtle beach area, so what do I need to buy?

Great info. I was wondering if there is a big difference between Ruud, coleman and bryant? Or if I should just with the cheaper... thanks jon