Hi. I am having my bathroom done as an open wetroom. I wanted to install a concealed shower onto the wall however my tiler/plumber is trying to convince me against this and go for an exposed one. He has advised me if there is a problem with the concealed shower I would have to remove the tiling. Im not sure if fitting a concealed shower is harder and that is why he's trying to convince me to re-think.

Also I have bought some sheets of mosaic to put around the area where the water will fall,he has advised me against this and said dur to the amount of water falling on that area it will very soon start to lift due to water going into the cracks, leaving me with an uneven floor. Is this true.

And lastly I have bought him bags of powder adhesive for the floor and walls, he will use the powder on the floor and wants ready mixed adhesive for the walls as he says this is better, I have been advised by the diy store powdered adhesive is better. Any help would be welcome

If I am paying a guy then he will do it as instructed, however it's possible you are stretching his ability or skill level. Few would ever admit to that, and cut out a paycheck, but that's only my opinion and hard to judge a job/worker on the little info you have provided.

For all I know, the guy is right and you are in left field. I have no idea if you have planned this project well or are just winging it. I would think the details and materials would already be a settled and agreed upon issue as well as who provides what before any work is started.

Be aware the DIY guy advising you is at a store and not on the jobsite, so it seems you two have a failure to communicate, and you have no real plan or anything for him to visualize, and work from, or show YOU what he intends to do.

In my mind you work out the details before you buy stuff, or even agree to a price, and sorry you don't seem to have your plan together or you have the wrong guy doing it. Why even hire a guy who cannot give you what YOU want?

Hes not refused to do the work. Its his advice to me. Now I wanted another opinion before deciding if his advice is the opinion of others too

What exactly is an open wetroom?
A concealed shower means exposed plumbing?
Both those terms are alien to me in the US.
I see no reason for open plumbing, but if you don't have access to concealed plumbing from the wall behind it, then I would consider it. Or if you are in a cold climate and it's on an exterior wall.

'I have bought some sheets of mosaic to put around the area where the water will fall,he has advised me against this and said dur to the amount of water falling on that area it will very soon start to lift due to water going into the cracks...' has me REALLY worried about this guy. That's absurd. Grout is what matters, and you need grout regardless, and small tiles have many advantages.

Ready mix is fine but so is powder. What matters is the type of substrate, how even it is, and how clean.

What did you get for references? What is the shower pan going to be, and the membrane under it, and down the wall, and what is the wall material UNDER the tile?
Countless 'made from scratch' showers are done wrong. Water can leak all around them and rot out everything in about 3 years.

I would go to YouTube and look at videos of all-tile showers.

Please, define "open wet room" for me

Milo

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Originally Posted by Mo_safeer

Hes not refused to do the work. Its his advice to me. Now I wanted another opinion before deciding if his advice is the opinion of others too

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You should get TWO additional opinions (We call them estimates in my country) of your project by local contractors of good repute of YOUR choice.

Google wet room. I don't know how to explain it to you

So a wet room is a term for unenclosed shower, basically. You membrane the entire floor, and have a special daisy flower drain, or a long thin 'grate' drain along the long edge. You slope mud down slightly to the middle for the middle drain, or to the edge for the grate drain, so that water doesn't spill out past the drain.

You ONLY hire someone experienced in this, for sure. I would want to talk to his last client.

I am not sure I would do this retrofit in an older house, nor above the first floor. BATHROOMS LEAK after some years, almost always.

Oh, OK, now I know. We have done several of those before as General Contractors and also as Plumbing Contractors. The term is what confused me... Here are my 2 cents:

Floor: As said above: water proof entire floor + 12" up the wall around the perimeter of your shower room and over and behind a curb, if any. You can use vinyl liner or asphalt "hot mop." Floor base should be at least 3" of concrete over wire mesh. This is especially important if your existing floor is plywood or some other kind of wood as wood w/o concrete will flex and eventually will develop cracks. Leaks will follow. If you have concrete slab then you can install liner directly on slab. If you want to proceed with hot mop than your hot mop contractor will use layers of asphalt paper over existing concrete which will create the water proofed pan. If liner, you have to create slope before liner is installed. If hot mop, your tile contractor will create slope himself over the hot mop and before he proceeds with tile installation. Slope should be 1/4" per foot. Note here that with slope over large area, you will end up with high end ( a step ) at the entrance to the wet room. Plan accordingly. You can put on the floor what ever you want, including mosaic tile. I think what is your contractor worrying about is that there will be too many grouted seems. But if you do all prep work properly, that should not be a problem. Install tile with Thins Set. Thin set is a very fine concrete-like dry mix. You add undiluted Acrylic Additive to mix it in proper ratio. Apply with a trowel with appropriate sized notched edge.

Important: Use proper Shower Drain. Proper shower drain is a shell-like drain and should have Weeping Holes. Weeping holes are there to drain condensation that forms between waterproofing and concrete base when Hot water hits Cold concrete floor. Without proper drain, you will be re-doing it year later.

Walls: Depends what you have on the wall. If you have water-proofed drywall then premixed Tile Adhesive is the way to go. Tile Adhesive has a consistency of tooth paste and is very sticky. It comes in large buckets. If you have floated walls ( interior stucco ), backing board or Wonder Board - then use Thin Set again (same as you used for floor tile installation ). If you use backing board or Wonder Board than tape seems with mesh tape before this set is spread. Mesh tape prevents cracks in tile grout. Thin Set is not recommended for installation over drywall.

Once tile installed, let it dry for 3 days. After that, all seems in the bathroom - floor and walls - with Grout Sealer. Sealers come in several grades. From my experience, the most expensive is usually the best. You may need a gallon of Sealer for large room.

Fitting shower ( a small shower stall ) is probably better for installation purposes. Also, it will be less expensive. Wet room shower will be more difficult to do and will require an experienced contractor to build. As far as design goes, wet room is definitely a very modern way to go.

Please, do not take advice from Home Improvement store employees. Ask professionals. Call other contractors and ask for their advice and opinion. We all like to help. The more information you get, the better decision you will be able to make.

Hope that helps

Milo

Well none of you have really read my wuestions before replying

Well you have done a lousy job explaining, and you clearly have no clue about the importance of what your house construction is and what substrates are planned or even feasible. Milo really is a good and experienced contractor, and you just insulted him. Good luck with your disaster.

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Milo really is a good and experienced contractor, and you just insulted him.

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I agree. I think Milo gave you a pretty good synopsis and pointed out critical aspects of the process. The most important is "contact other professionals."

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Well none of you have really read my wuestions before replying

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Seems that you don't read and comprehend the responses you get.

What is your beef? The advice you receive here is free. If you don't like the advice you get here, there is always Yahoo

I asked a really simple questions. And to put it even more simply for you. Is an exposed shower head and thermostat better than an enclosed one

Neither is better than the other (Though one is more expensive), and it depends on what you rather have since you are the one who is paying for it, and has to live with it. That simple. Beware a contractor who tries to talk you out of what YOU want.

If this guy cannot deliver, find one who can!! That's why I advised 3 separate independent estimates! Then you will know the COSTS of what YOU want.

Now what's so hard about that?

Talaniman. Perfect. Appreciate it mate. Im aware of the costs and the fitting isn't an issue with him either. However out of my three estimates he is the only one that mentioned of I fit an enclosed shower/thermostat in the event of any fault with the unit I would have to take down the tiles

Naw guy, a small access door to the controller/thermostat takes care of that, as well as any valves, or maintenance shut offs.

A nice acces door enhances while it hides the jewels safely. Any design that doesn't allow for easy maintenance/repairs/emergencies is useless anyway right?

Ok, let me give this a shot...

In the USA, we don't have exposed or external shower systems... all of ours are installed behind the wall and usually last anywhere from 20-30 years before ever needing to be replaced, so I would suggest installing the shower valve you want and don't worry about replacement for a long time (access panels on rear walls can be an option if there is a rear wall). If repairs are needed, like a drip developing, repairs are easily made by removing the trim plate, so that should also not be a concern.

Next, if you want mosaic tiles and your tile guy preps. the floor and installs the tile as recommended by the tile manufacturer and installs the correct grout then there should NOT be any concerns about tile lifting or coming loose... just doesn't make sense here.

Finally, powdered adhesives are usually best, for sure, but many tile guys like the ease of use of mastic adhesive out of a barrel/can and the stuff is usually just fine as long as allowed the required time to dry... if dry time is inappropriate then that can actually lead to non-cured adhesive and that can create problems over time. I like OMNI-GRIP for walls... ready mixed in a bucket, spreads easily and has great grip (Google this).

That's my two cents...

Mark

Appreciate that mark. Looks like u read what I wrote. Thanks

Good luck with the project!

Mo_safeer, definitely there was a confusion in terminology.

My apology if I misread your question. However, I am sure you I have offered plenty of information in my response to do your bathroom remodel correctly.

Good luck with your project !

Milo