Our son is unbelievably disrespectful to his father and myself. He says he confesses his cruelty and disrespect and is forgiven. I have heard many people say the same thing. Is it true to break 4th commandmant or any commandmant because you will be forgiven at confession?

It's not okay, but that's what the bible preaches. If you sin, which we all do, simply ask for forgiveness and you will be forgiven.

Is it better to try your best not to sin? Of course. But most of the Christians I know live their lives knowingly sinning, like your son, and thinking it's okay because they go to church on Sunday and ask for forgiveness.

A true Christian is supposed to do his/her best not to sin, and only ask for forgiveness when he/she makes a mistake. Sinning on purpose isn't being a true Christian.

How old is your son? Who taught him his beliefs?

You can be forgiven of any sin, the issue is in confession, you have to repent and be sorry for the sin.

So if he repents, he stops doing the sin, so if he comes home and acts respectful, he has repented and can find forgiveness.

If he comes home and keeps doing it, he is lying to you or does not understand confession.

Great question that a lot of people struggle with. Consider this scripture:
"In turn Samuel said: “Does Jehovah have as much delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices as in obeying the voice of Jehovah? Look! To obey is better than a sacrifice, to pay attention than the fat of rams; 23 for rebelliousness is the same as the sin of divination" (1 Samuel 15: 22, 23, NWT).

"To obey is better than a sacrifice", clearly god wants us to follow his commands rather then ask for forgiveness (the purpose of sacrifices in ancient Israel) when we fall short.

Jesus's sacrifice was made to cover over our sins for when we are repentant. It was not an invitation to sin at will and then ask for forgiveness. As noted by Fr Chuck, if we continue to do the same sin, we're not really repentant. If we're not really repentant, no forgiveness will be given.

Gracey,

I have never seen anywhere in my bible where a believer won't be forgiven. Because the believers sins have already been forgiven, past, present and future. Please provide me with a few scriptures from the apostle paul that says otherwise.

Since you like quoting the OT so much, I will quote one for you... Salvation is of the LORD. (Jonah 2:9) see, we don't save ourselves, we don't keep ourselves and we can't out sin ourselves unsaved. SALVATION is of the LORD.

Please provide any verses that says a person is saved and then no longer saved until he repents from his sins. I have found none.

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Originally Posted by classyT

Because the believers sins have already been forgiven, past, present and future.

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I'm with you there! Even the sins of the unrepentant have been forgiven. They have been forgiven even before we ask for forgiveness and were forgiven with Jesus' death on the cross.

classyT, I certainly do reference both the Hebrew & Greek scriptures. No doubt your aware that the Greek scriptures regularly quote the Hebrew scriptures so I'm not sure why this has been mentioned. Thank you for sharing the scripture from Jonah, I certainly agree that Jesus' sacrifice makes way for our forgiveness by god.

"What! Do ​YOU​ not know that unrighteous persons will not inherit God's kingdom? Do not be misled. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men kept for unnatural purposes, nor men who lie with men,10nor thieves, nor greedy persons, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit God's kingdom.11And yet that is what some of ​YOU​ were. But ​YOU​ have been washed clean, but ​YOU​ have been sanctified, but ​YOU​ have been declared righteous in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ and with the spirit of our God." (1 Corinthians 6:9-11, NIV)

I'm sure you'll agree, this scripture discusses leaving gross sin behind and being found righteous in gods eyes. However, it does qualify this when it says "And yet that is what some of ​YOU​ were.". If one returns to sin, then do you conclude that the aforementioned still applies? If the Apostle Paul went back to killing christians many years after he became a follower of Jesus, would he still have been found righteous in gods eyes?

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Originally Posted by graceyj20

If the Apostle Paul went back to killing christians many years after he became a follower of Jesus, would he still have been found righteous in gods eyes?

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God's forgiveness would still have been there for him, and would have welcomed him back no questions asked had he repented.

Gracey,
Yes Paul certainly says those things but what did he say about those believers that were still practicing sin. He said they WERE those things at one time... not any longer and he reminded them of WHO they were in Christ so they need not practice sin. He called them RIGHTEOUS. When we believe right, we act right. Therefore there is NOW no condmenation to those in Christ Jesus.

Christ either made us righteous or he didn't. You can't have it both ways. Under the law the Jews were made righteouss for 1 year after their sacrifice. We make the blood of Christ even less than the blood of bulls and goats when we claim we can lose our salvation. That is my take.

I re read my posts. I didn't mean to come off and grumpy. I just like discussing.

Gracey,

Paul wouldn't have returned to killing Christians. He KNEW who he was in Christ and he loved the body of Christ. He was called to be our Apostle. BUT lets say Paul had an issue of lusting. Yes, he would still be saved. God doesn't put sin on a scale. If it is wrong, it is wrong. Paul out of every Christian really got grace. And I believe he died daily. But he certainly battled sin because we see that in Romans 7. He just knew WHO the remedy was.

What sin will take us out of the family. At what point does the Holy spirit leave us. And where does it say the Holy spirit WILL leave us. According the ephesians we are SEALED. And in order to become
"unsaved" he most certainly would have to depart.

WG,

What if they didn't repent? What if a natural disaster struck and there wasn't time. What then?

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Originally Posted by classyT

WG,

what if they didn't repent? What if a natural disaster struck and there wasn't time. What then?

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So you are saying once we have been "sealed" (your term), we can do whatever Satan or the world or or own flesh tells us to do, and God has us covered. It's okay.

(I know how you so love to discuss!)

WG

Well, Paul put it best... where sin abounds grace super abounds. Grace is far above our sin. Yes, that is what I am saying.. you can't ever ever become lost if you are really saved.

BUT... when someone is really saved the Holy Spirit comes in and sanctifies them. But it IS a process. I don't believe people who really understand grace and put their trust in the Lord want to stay in sin. It is a miserable existence just look at Paul in romans 7. And certainly I have been there. I have done what I knew to be wrong over and over hating it but feeling I had no power over it.

In 1 Corinthians 5 there is a man in the church in Cornith living in sin with his step-mother. Paul calls the guy a brother. He was not only living in sin but it was incest to boot. Paul never said to remove the "sinner", he said to remove the "brother".

I really believe if our churches preched GRACE the way Paul did without telling people "be sure your sin will find you out" we would have a different church today. Knowing and REALLY believing we are completely and totally righteous before a Holy God doesn't produce more sin. Just the opposite. Paul wasn't afraid to preach grace. If you want to stop sin, throw grace on it. Where sin abounds grace much more abounds. I didn't say it... Paul did.

You didn't answer the question on the table. You had asked, "what if they didn't repent? What if a natural disaster struck and there wasn't time. What then?"

You believe "once saved, always saved," so you would have said they would have been saved, even after committing a heinous sin and then they died before repenting and seeking forgiveness. Right?

classyT, interesting thoughts. When Jesus hand picked Judas to be one of his closest disciples, would you considered him saved at that point? If so, after his betrayal of Jesus do you still consider him saved?

Gracey,

No. He had NO faith and besides none were actually saved until after his death and resserrection. Judas was along for the ride. He didn't actual believe Jesus to be who he said he was. He saw the miracles, he saw his power, he liked it. Our church pews are full of people like Judas. The bible actually says somewhere that he went to his own place after he died. That can't be good. I feel certain he was lost for all eternity. Sorry though he was, he had NO faith. Instead of crying out to the Lord to forgive him, he took his own life. He repented though, repented just means to change your mind. He just didn't come the Lord to do it because he didn't believe he was the Lord.

Peter denied Jesus three times. He was as bad as Judas except he had faith. He believed who Jesus was, he just had too much trust in his flesh. Which is a really big problem. We are all capable at anytime to fall into sin. I know who my redeemer is and he isn't a guy that buys me back just to let me go if I stray too far. No way, no how.

WG,

To answer your question, yes they would be saved. Absolutely. I can find no verse that says if a person doesn't repent of his sins after he is already saved, he will end up in hell. If the blood of bulls and goats covered a person for one year how much MORE does Jesus blood cover?

Hebrews 10:38, "Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him."

classyT, the Israelites had a covenant with God. In this covenant, they agreed to abide by Gods' commands. Aside from some faithful followers and some Godly times, they generally and repeatedly disrespected and his commands. Ultimately, God found them in such violation that he dissolved the covenant. The Israelites, by merit of their actions, lost their standing with God.

If one dedicates their life to God today, it is essentially forming a personal covenant with God to follow his commandments and act in his interests. If one acts in violation of it, repeatedly showing a disregard for this covenant, would not God would consider ones personal covenant with him dissolved just like he did with the Israelites?

WG_

Who is Hebrews written to? Jews. Big difference. Jews that were going back to the law and sacrificing animals.

Gracey,

Nope. The only way any of the OT saints were "saved" was by faith. They followed the laws given to them by God, sacrificed animals for their sins. The only reason God gave them the law was to show them they couldn't keep it. That's it.

Jesus didn't die to make bad people good. Jesus died because no matter how hard people tried they couldn't be good enough. He died to make us completely righteous before God. Just as he became sin for me, I took on his righeousness. A divine transfer took place. I can't out sin grace. And I don't want to. Seriously once someone really understands what grace does, who grace IS, they don't want to go out a delibrately live in sin. They don't and if they do, I believe they weill be miserable but saved.

WG

You know I'm a big rightly dividing the word of truth girl. Hebrews isn't wirtten to the gentile church but the Jews. And it does make a difference! That is what Paul meant by rightly dividing the bible. What is meant for who.