My husband and I moved into this townhouse almost 4 years ago, we initially signed a one year lease, however, with several mishaps during our lease, we decided to not resign another years lease. Although our landlord asked us to, this was never done. Now that I have given her proper 30 days notice, ( which I thought was standard for any landlord to receive ).. she is now stating that we were not on a month to month lease, that I have to give her 60 days notice. I'm not sure how she can say we were not on a month to month lease when after the first year, we never signed another lease with her. We live in Orlando Florida, and is she correct? Is there such a law that states this?

FL law section 83.57 says that yearly leases require 60 days notice. Month to month require only 15.
Now even though she asked you to sign another lease, you have to go back and read your old lease, because it might have a roll over provision, self-renewing, if no rent increase or other changes are made. She seems to think you have a yearly lease, right? She might be right. If there were rent increases, there can be no automatic renewal.
Florida tenant law is complicated.

Also, if the original lease required a 60 notice for termination then that provision carries over even if you were month to month.

Did you read the original lease before deciding not to renew or to terminate?

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Originally Posted by joypulv

FL law section 83.57 says that yearly leases require 60 days notice. Month to month require only 15.
Now even though she asked you to sign another lease, you have to go back and read your old lease, because it might have a roll over provision, self-renewing, if no rent increase or other changes are made. She seems to think you have a yearly lease, right? She might be right. If there were rent increases, there can be no automatic renewal.
Florida tenant law is complicated.

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Thank you both so much for your input. There were no rental increases during our stay, however the rent was decreased during our stay two times. In other words, we started paying 850.00. After living here 7 months, we were robbed, she decreased the rent by 30.00 because of this, and to offset the additional cost we were going to have due to a security system that was now being put in. ( she paid for that) however, we had to pay to have a home phone now, which we didn't have before. The second time the rent was decreased was when my husband lost his job... she decreased it another 20.00.. to 800.00/mo. In no time was anything else signed... does this matter? Also, I have another dilema now, I was trying to do the right thing by giving her what I thought would be proper notice, of 30 days, and have now received something from her via the internet for a 3 day notice to quit? I have never been through anything like this before... can this been sent to me via the computer?? Also, my husband and I did not pay this months rent, figuring she could use our security deposit of 850.00 ( which is more than the rent we pay now ) towards this months rent... I'm so nervous now... I've never been through something like this.

Originally Posted by joypulv
FL law section 83.57 says that yearly leases require 60 days notice. Month to month require only 15.
Now even though she asked you to sign another lease, you have to go back and read your old lease, because it might have a roll over provision, self-renewing, if no rent increase or other changes are made. She seems to think you have a yearly lease, right? She might be right. If there were rent increases, there can be no automatic renewal.
Florida tenant law is complicated.
Thank you both so much for your input. There were no rental increases during our stay, however the rent was decreased during our stay two times. In other words, we started paying 850.00. After living here 7 months, we were robbed, she decreased the rent by 30.00 because of this, and to offset the additional cost we were going to have due to a security system that was now being put in. ( she paid for that) however, we had to pay to have a home phone now, which we didn't have before. The second time the rent was decreased was when my husband lost his job... she decreased it another 20.00.. to 800.00/mo. In no time was anything else signed... does this matter? Also, I have another dilema now, I was trying to do the right thing by giving her what I thought would be proper notice, of 30 days, and have now received something from her via the internet for a 3 day notice to quit? I have never been through anything like this before... can this been sent to me via the computer?? Also, my husband and I did not pay this months rent, figuring she could use our security deposit of 850.00 ( which is more than the rent we pay now ) towards this months rent... I'm so nervous now... I've never been through something like this.

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Originally Posted by jeni47

Also, my husband and I did not pay this months rent, figuring she could use our security deposit of 850.00 ( which is more than the rent we pay now ) towards this months rent...I'm so nervous now....I've never been through something like this.

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That's your problem and the source of the 3 day. You do not have the right to decide that she should use your security for the last month. So pay the May rent immediately to forestall the 3 day notice.

Then, if she does not return the security deposit or use it improperly you can go to court to recover it.

Yes, the terms of the old lease are still your month to month rental agreement, and are binding, except you can move with notice ( 60 days) and they can change the rent ( with notice) normally up but in your case down.

Since you did not pay, they have now called to evict you, since no, you can not just have them use the deposit, the deposit is to pay for damages and then any amount left is refunded it is not a last month rent.

You you will owe them the rent for the full 60 days.

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Originally Posted by jeni47

Originally Posted by joypulv
FL law section 83.57 says that yearly leases require 60 days notice. Month to month require only 15. ...

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"83.57 Termination of tenancy without specific term.—A tenancy without a specific duration, as defined in s. 83.46(2) or (3), may be terminated by either party giving written notice in the manner provided in s. 83.56(4), as follows:
(1) When the tenancy is from year to year, by giving not less than 60 days’ notice prior to the end of any annual period;

(2) When the tenancy is from quarter to quarter, by giving not less than 30 days’ notice prior to the end of any quarterly period;

(3) When the tenancy is from month to month, by giving not less than 15 days’ notice prior to the end of any monthly period; and

(4) When the tenancy is from week to week, by giving not less than 7 days’ notice prior to the end of any weekly period."

"83.56 
...
(4) The delivery of the written notices required by subsections (1), (2), and (3) shall be by mailing or delivery of a true copy thereof or, if the tenant is absent from the premises, by leaving a copy thereof at the residence."

There is no definition of "mailing", so I guess you could arge that it means old-fashioned, U.S. "snail-mail", and that if those folks in Tallahassee had meant to include that new-fangled e-mail thingie, they would have said so.

First, I merged your threads, please don't start multiple threads over the same issue.

Second, laws about e-mail legal notices are still evolving. So its hard to say whether a court will accept it. However, since you have acknowledged receipt, I think they will.

But the real problem is that you had no right to withhold the May rent. So, she has the right to file for a pay or quit. Whether you owe 1 months' rent or two will be a matter for a court to decide.

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Originally Posted by ScottGem

First, I merged your threads, please don't start multiple threads over the same issue.

Second, laws about e-mail legal notices are still evolving. So its hard to say whether a court will accept it. However, since you have acknowledged receipt, I think they will.

But the real problem is that you had no right to withhold the May rent. So, she has the right to file for a pay or quit. Whether you owe 1 months' rent or two will be a matter for a court to decide.

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I never acknowledged receipt of the 3 day notice to quit... she sent me a link to download, which my computer would not do... so.. I was unable to open it or acknowledge it. Also, sorry for starting multiple threads over the same issue... I am new at this. Thanks for your help on the situation.

A rent increase would have required a whole fresh new lease. I have no idea how the court would rule when there's two decreases. You could argue a presumption of month to month based simply on the changes regardless of going down, PLUS she asked you to sign a new lease and you refused.
I think you have a right to 15 day notice.
You don't have a right to use a deposit as last month's rent.
You are in enough of a quagmire now that a sit down with the landlord is in order.

Thank you so much. I understand that we have no right to tell her how to use the security deposit... I take responsibility for that entirely. I just don't understand how after I sent her a written notice that we would be vacating on 6/2/12, that 5 days later she would send me a download for a 3 day notice to quit. From everything I have read, I have read she would have to have it served to us by a prosessor, send it certified letter, or have it placed on our door, then send a copy in the mail. My computer could not download her notice. I would also be interested in knowing, once it is served upon us, how long does it take to evict from that process. Again, our notice to her was that we were vacating on 6/2/12. Thanks so much for your advice and knowledge.

You gave her notice prior to 5/1 correct? Your rent was due 5/1 and you didn't pay it. So she sent a pay or quit. Why is that so surprising? Any good landlord would send a pay or quit when their tenant is late.

Yes, she should have served it differently. Again, laws on service are evolving and its hard to pin it down. Obviously you are aware that she is giving you a pay or quit. If you don't pay, then she goes to court for an eviction order. Depending on how crowded the courts are, she gets a hearing. At the hearing, the judge may or may not issue an eviction order given your pending move.

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Originally Posted by ScottGem

You gave her notice prior to 5/1 correct? Your rent was due 5/1 and you didn't pay it. So she sent a pay or quit. Why is that so surprising? Any good landlord would send a pay or quit when their tenant is late.

Yes, she should have served it differently. Again, laws on service are evolving and its hard to pin it down. Obviously you are aware that she is giving you a pay or quit. If you don't pay, then she goes to court for an eviction order. Depending on how crowded the courts are, she gets a hearing. at the hearing, the judge may or may not issue an eviction order given your pending move.

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It is so surprising ScottGem because I would think a good landlord would get in touch with you once the rent isn't received by the 3rd, which is when she has ALWAYS received her rent for the last 4 years without fail. Even though the lease stated that our rent is due on the 5th... not the 1st. So yes, she did receive notice from me prior to our rent being due. She received notice from me on the 2nd of May, again our rent is not due per our lease until the 5th. My understanding is that they have to show proof that you received a 3 day notice, and emailing a document for me to download, does not show that I necessarily received it. It shows she sent it, not that I received it. That then becomes a " he said" "she said" issue. But thanks for your information .

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Originally Posted by jeni47

It is so surprising ScottGem because I would think a good landlord would get in touch with you once the rent isn't received by the 3rd,

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A NICE landlord would do that. A GOOD (from a business standpoint) landlord would not waste any time and just5 give you a pay or quit. If you pay, the notice becomes moot.

As for the validity of the service FL is pretty landlord friendly. So the likely scenario might work like this:

You: Your honor, this hearing is invalid because I never received a legal pay or quit notice.
Judge: But you knew that the landlord had had sent it via e-mail, Yes?
You: Yes
Judge: And you were served a summons for this hearing which explained what the hearing was for?
You: Yes
Judge: Do you have the rent you owe, plus late fees to pay right now?
You: No
Judge, Eviction order granted!

The judge is really not going to care that much about proper notice. If you don't pay before the hearing, he's likely to issue an eviction order. If you pay, as you should, then service becomes moot. I really don't understand why you are harping on this service issue. You owe the May rent so pay it.

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Originally Posted by ScottGem

A NICE landlord would do that. a GOOD (from a business standpoint) landlord would not waste any time and just5 give you a pay or quit. If you pay, the notice becomes moot.

As for the validity of the service FL is pretty landlord friendly. So the likely scenario might work like this:

You: Your honor, this hearing is invalid because I never received a legal pay or quit notice.
Judge: But you knew that the landlord had had sent it via e-mail, Yes?
You: Yes
Judge: And you were served a summons for this hearing whihc explained what the hearing was for?
You: Yes
Judge: Do you have the rent you owe, plus late fees to pay right now?
You: No
Judge, Eviction order granted!

The judge is really not going to care that much about proper notice. If you don't pay before the hearing, he's likely to issue an eviction order. If you pay, as you should, then service becomes moot. I really don't understand why you are harping on this service issue. You owe the May rent so pay it.

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You are correct, and unfortunitly we don't have the money to pay this rent... after putting down the money for the other place. Lesson learned. Guess it will be nice to move into a place with a working a/c unit.. since ours isn't working now, and I have been told that since we haven't paid May's rent, that she is not obligated to fix it until we leave.

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Originally Posted by jeni47

you are correct, and unfortunitly we don't have the money to pay this rent...after putting down the money for the other place. Lesson learned. Guess it will be nice to move into a place with a working a/c unit..since ours isn't working now, and I have been told that since we haven't paid May's rent, that she is not obligated to fix it until we leave.

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Yep, sorry to say that you are caught between a rock and a hard place. You have a few choices that I see.

a) Take your chances that she can't get a court hearing quick enough or
b) Take your chances in court that a judge will say that since you are moving so soon, he will let you stay until then, or
c) borrow the rent and pay it

In either case, you will be required to pay what you owe and the judge may lean towards the 60 day required notice because of your actions.