Ask Me Help Desk - Owen coming when called.

Hi all

As you most of you know, I have been working hard on teaching Owen proper manners, he has been working hard as well. We are doing well EXCEPT for him coming when called, all the time. He does it very well, most of the time but when we are at the dog park and he wants to stay and walk with another dog he will either not hear us or ignore us. I will have to walk back and get him. I don't mind him playing and actually encourage it. I am mainly talking about times that the dog is going in an opposite way to us.
How do I improve this and should I just keep calling him? What I have been doing is going and getting him and making him go the way we want. As I said he listens to us most of the time and this only happens when he is playing and running with other dogs.

Susan

He needs to learn to pay more attention to you. It's hard to blame him when there are other dogs to play with distracting him.

One approach is to work with him speaking progressively more softly until you can hardly hear yourself. He will focus his hearing on you more closely and this will eventually result in his listening more all the time. This is the most patience-trying method of training there is but it will work.

A quicker method is a buzzer collar with a remote control. The downside to that one is remotes have a limited range.

Field trainers that work with hunting dogs out of sight routinely use whistles.

Which do you think Owen would respond to best?

Quote:

Originally Posted by mogrann

Hi all

As you most of you know, I have been working hard on teaching Owen proper manners, he has been working hard as well. We are doing well EXCEPT for him coming when called, all the time. He does it very well, most of the time but when we are at the dog park and he wants to stay and walk with another dog he will either not hear us or ignore us. I will have to walk back and get him. I don't mind him playing and actually encourage it. I am mainly talking about times that the dog is going in an opposite way to us.
How do I improve this and should I just keep calling him? What I have been doing is going and getting him and making him go the way we want. As I said he listens to us most of the time and this only happens when he is playing and running with other dogs.

Susan

I suggest you learn to become your dog's pack leader. It is, in my opinion, the best thing one can do before training.

Training does not automatically teach some dogs that the human is their leader. Especially positive reinforcement training. Unless the dog already considers you the leader, that only reinforces the dog when he wants something.

However, once your dog understands that you are the leader, the positive reinforcement and all other training will be much more effective, because your dog will be listening to you.

I recommend you get yourself some Cesar Millan DVD's or books. He's the best I've seen at Dog Psychology. Although there are others out there.

Sincerely,

De Maria

I have been following Caesar and implementing the stuff I know I do wrong. The hard part we are having is understanding the correct way to walk. Owen does not pull on leash usually but he will always be in front. If I stop walking when he pulls he will back up until leash is loose and then sit down until I walk.
I have read lots on it but just can not get it in my head how to correct him.
Susan

Quote:

Originally Posted by mogrann

I have been following Caesar and implementing the stuff I know I do wrong. The hard part we are having is understanding the correct way to walk. Owen does not pull on leash usually but he will always be in front. If i stop walking when he pulls he will back up til leash is loose and then sit down til I walk.
I have read lots on it but just can not get it in my head how to correct him.
Susan

Make him play follow the leader. Go forward. When he gets ahead of you turn around and go the other way while telling him "let's go". He will figure out that being by your side or behind you makes it easier to know where you are going.

Also, make being by your side or close to it where he wants to be. Make it a positive place to be.

Excellent suggestion Cat... when training them to heel never walk in a straight line, always keep your pattern random so they have no choice but to follow you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mogrann

I have been following Caesar and implementing the stuff I know I do wrong. The hard part we are having is understanding the correct way to walk. Owen does not pull on leash usually but he will always be in front.

How far in front? Mine is by my side but his head is basically in front.

Basically, I don't keep a slack on the leash, he does. Does that make sense?

I have a three foot leash and I fold it into my right palm and I have maybe 6" of slack. I use a choke collar that has another 6" of slack. So he only has 1 foot of slack.

I put the choker high on his head the way that show dog people put it on theirs and basically that's how my dog looks when we are walking. I've noticed that when he lowers his head, he brings it back up himself when he feels it tighten.

When he was first learning, he might get distracted by trees and posts, but I would tug, release and keep going. It didn't take him long to realize he just had to keep moving with me.

Quote:

If I stop walking when he pulls he will back up until leash is loose and then sit down until I walk.

That sounds good.

Quote:

I have read lots on it but just can not get it in my head how to correct him.
Susan

Another thing we did was:

When my son was walking him. He was too small to get his attention with a tug on the leash. So, I gave him a stick that he would use to tap the dog on the rump and get his attention when he began to pull. That worked really well.

I don't know if you roller blade or ride a bicycle. But I don't remember having any problems with my dog pulling when I ride my bike. For some reason, I keep him on my right side when I walk. But on my left when I ride. I start by making a few sharp turns to my left to make sure he knows how to get out of my way and then we go.

I keep him running at a canter. And I think he enjoys that more than the walks.

Well since you're already doing the walks and I assume you are doing them regularly, then its time to begin the training.

Cont'd

Sincerely,

De Maria

Quote:

Originally Posted by mogrann

I have been following Caesar...

Susan

Hi again,

I didn't want to make the other message too long and confusing. Here are two more message explaining some ways that I've used to train my dogs to come when they are called.

Teaching to come on the walk

By the way, one of the things that many people don't understand about the walk is that when you walk your dog, you're really on mission. That's how the dog feels. You're going somewhere to do something. Its his job. If you take it seriously, he will love it.

Lets begin. You'll need a six foot lead. A bag of treats.

Plan to include a 15 minute training period in your walk and follow the Caesar method.

Begin your walk and go to the place where you are going to train. Stop and say, Owen sit! And show him your fist. If he doesn't sit, push his rump down gently until he does. Wait a short while, count to ten if you want. Then step forward and say, "Owen stay" while showing him the palm of your hand. Take two or three deliberate steps releasing the lead as you go. Turn around and face him. Count to three. If he begins to come to you without being called, say, "stop!" roughly! Start your count over.

When you are ready, say Owen come! Tug gently on the lead and release until he is on your side then turn around, wave your hand in the direction of the walk, Say, "Owen heel!" and begin to walk again.

If he did everything to your satisfaction, slip him a treat. Keep going about a minute. Then repeat the procedure.

Give him a treat when he does it right. Never when he does it wrong.
But don't give him a treat every time he does it right. The more he does it right, the less treats you begin to give.

After you've done it for about 15 minutes, go home following Caesar's procedure. No more commands.

EXPLANATIONS

Why plan a 15 minute training period? I don't know. I was always told not to tire a dog out with training and 15 minutes was the time I was told to a lot. So, that's what I'm passing on.

Why a six foot lead? Its just a convenient and easy length to find. Some trainers use a 10 foot lead. Some 15. I guess so they can get progressively farther from the dog when they train the stay command.

Why a bag of treats? You could put them in your pockets I guess. But some treats could get pretty messy that way.

Why call his name before every command? Owen sit! Owen stay! Owen heel! Because you want him to identify himself with his name.

Why show a fist when commanding Owen sit? Because eventually you will have the option of using sign language to direct your dog. Sometimes they pick that up quicker.

Why wait a short while, count to ten if I want before I start the stay command? Just a good round number. Use any that you prefer.

Why count to three for the stay? You want to build success. You don't want to make it too long where he'll be likely to fail. You can even make a one count if necessary. But you will make it progressively longer on your next training sessions.

Why tug gently and release until he is on my side?

1. Because you want to give him a hint of what you want him to do.
2. Because you don't want him to stop halfway, you want him to come all the way to you.

Why then turn around, wave my hand in the direction of the walk, Say, "Owen heel!" and begin to walk again?

1. Because the heel command is really the finish of your come command. When you call him you begin to walk away and he will follow. He isn't done until he is walking by your side. That is why you will not give him a treat until he has done everything right.

Why walk about a minute between procedures? Just so you have time to evaluate how you did. You can make it any amount of time you want but don't make it where you get confused. Try for between 5 and 10 repetitions.

Why give him a treat when he does it right? Its called positive association.

Why not when he does it wrong? You don't want him to associate a bad behaviour with a treat. It will take that much longer to extinguish that behaviour.

Why not every time he does it right? You can, if you want. According to science however, if you give him a treat sporadically when he does the behaviour you want, it will be harder for him to lose or extinguish that behaviour.

I hope that helps.

Cont'd

Does Owen lie down and stay there on command? If he does, then he is accepting that you are the leader.

If it was me, I'd leave a long leash on him. Yes, at the leash-free park, something lightweight and at least 10' long is about right. Don't hold it, just keep an eye on where it is. Then, when you see a distracting situation approaching, place yourself near the end of the dragging leash. When he does not come when called, make him. Then tell him what a great dog he is when he is within petting range.

Once he accepts that he needs to listen to you voice or get pulled away from something fun, take the long leash away.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mogrann

Hi all....
Susan

Teaching to come at home

Since this is indoors, you don't need a leash or a lead.

This is a lot of fun. My kids and I do it a lot. My wife doesn't usually get into it, but he usually follows her into the kitchen, so she must be sneaking and giving him treats.

What to be careful about?

The dog can become demanding for his food. If your dog doesn't have manners with children, don't include them until you have taught them how to be the dog's pack leaders.

Remember rules, boundaries and limitations.

Use your judgement. I only let the kids do this for about 15 minutes at a time. Why? Because I want to make sure the dog isn't burned out by tireless kids. You want it to be fun and to end on a good note for everyone.

What you will need

Give each person some dog treats.

Rules

Instruct them to only use the dog's name. Not the command.

In other words, Do not say, "Owen, come!" Just say, "Owen!"

And instruct them to take turns. Do your best to make sure they don't all call him at the same time. And that they only give him a treat after he gets within arms reach. They don't have to give him a treat every time, but shoot for 90% of the time. But the dog must get to where they can touch him without stretching.

Reason for this game?

Its just positive association with his name. Where ever he is, you'll get his attention when he hears his name because he'll associate it with food.

Start with everyone in one room. Call Owen to yourself and give him a treat when he gets there. Then have someone else call.

Get progressively farther apart. Have them call from different rooms.

My kids got pretty imaginative with this game. Apparently they played this when I was away and they've taught the dog to hop on two legs for his treats.

My oldest taught him to hold the treat on his nose for a few seconds.

You can also associate other things with food, such as a whistle. Instead of his name, whistle.

So, use your imagination! Have fun!

I hope that helps!

Very late at night but wanted to chime in with a big ole THANK YOU ALL, I have lots to read and absorb. I do appreciate it and we will implement the suggestions.
I am so glad that my niece showed me this site as the dog owners on here have been so helpful and knowledgeable. Thank you all.

Owen and Susan