My daughter is 12 and I share joint custody of her with my ex husband. I have physical custody of her and we have a parenting plan/custody agreement that we came up with through mediation 5 years ago. Now that she's older she has decided that she wants to change some of the visitation/access arrangements. She has told me exactly what she wants and I know that her father will completely flip when he finds out (she's scared to talk with him and anytime she's voiced what she wants he gets angry if it's not in his favour). I need to know how I go about getting this changed. I'm pretty sure that at 12 years old she can decide what she wants but I just don't know how to go about it. Basically all she wants is to change her christmas/new years and halloween arrangements to be with me and only see him every other weekend and 2 wednesdays a month. The original agreement says 3 weekends a month and 1 weekday every week. What should I do?

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Originally Posted by frostybabygurl

I need to know how I go about getting this changed.What should I do?

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Firstly-you may tell your ex that your daughter does not want to spend Christmas,New Year and Halloween with him.If he agrees with the change there will have no problems.

Secondly-you may petition for change of the custody agreement in Court.There you must convince the judge that this change will be in your daughter's interest and it will not disturb her relationship with the father.

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Originally Posted by frostybabygurl

She has told me exactly what she wants I'm pretty sure that at 12 years old she can decide what she wants

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Actually it is a weak-kneed argument.

[QUOTE=frostybabygurl;2511522]I'm pretty sure that at 12 years old she can decide what she wants [/QUOTE

This is not true. In all the US, a child cannot make this decision at all. Only a court can change court ordered visitation. Some areas do allow more weight to the child's preference as they get older. ANY question of law needs to include your general locale as laws vary by area. At 12 though, its unlikely her preference will get much weight.

As GV70 says, if her father agrees to the modifications, then the court will approve it. If not, you have to petition the court for a modification of the parenting plan.

One last note. You are required to make her available for his scheduled visitation. You are required to explain to her that the visitation is his right. But you do not have to physically force her to go.

We live in Ontario Canada, I've had a few people tell me that as a child gets older the Parenting Plan will need to change in order to meet their needs and that the legal age to decide is 12. That's why I'm trying to find out everything I can. There have been some things that have happened in the last little while in regards to her father having poor judgement which makes me want to go for sole custody, however I don't know if the courts would feel that the situations I'm referring to would be enough to make a change. Don't misunderstand me, I encourage her to have a relationship with him, this has been an uphill battle and she has been hurt so many times that I'm just at the end of my rope. She has stated on more than one occasion that she hates going to her dads because he never spends time with her (she feels that his girlfriend and her children mean more to him), it's been years since she's had any 1 on 1 with him. She dislikes the disruption to her schedule, she's always complaining that she never gets enough time with me, she's even stated that to him. I work full time days, so does her dad. I work the saturdays that she's with him, My whole likfe revolves around my children and work, when I'm not at work, I'm at home with them. I just don't know what I'm supposed to do, I was going to go to the family law office on Tuesday after work and see what I can do. I don't know how to petition the court, do I need a lawyer? How should I approach this with her father, clearly I would rather we agree and not have to fight it out, hence why we went the mediation route the 1st time around.

You've been told wrong.

From Child's Age and Child Custody : Canadian Divorce Laws

The theoretical answer is children never choose. The court decides what is in the childrens best interests. What the children want is just one of several considerations the court takes into account.

It is, however, true that once a child enters their teen age years, more weight is placed on their preference and Canadian courts are reluctant to go against such preferences.

I would agree that any parenting plan has to be fluid. As a child gets older, spending time with friends becomes more important then spending time with parental units. So BOTH parents need to take this into account.

Again, I would do some research on this (start with the site I linked to) and present to the father what the legal facts are. Explain to him, it would be better for his relationship with his daughter if he was to go along rather than fight.

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Originally Posted by ScottGem

You've been told wrong.


The theoretical answer is children never choose. The court decides what is in the childrens best interests. What the children want is just one of several considerations the court takes into account.[/I].

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AGREE!

In Ontario, Canada, the court will look at a number of factors in determining the child's best interests, including:

* each parent's ability to provide for the child's needs,
* the relationship each parent has with the child,
* your child's wishes, if he or she is old enough,
* if you have more than one child, the court normally prefers to keep them together,
* the court will try to minimize the disruption of the child's life (the status quo), and
* who the primary caregiver of the child was during the marriage
* time available to spend with the children (working hours, out of town trips)
* one parent's interference with the other parent's relationship with the children
* any special needs of the child.

Yes, and in fact if you are helping "push" and not supporting your ex's rights to see the child. He can even site that as your interference with his rights.

Depending on the distance between, he can even go for joint physcial custody if he can show the courts that the lack of contact is hurting his role as father.

The wishes of a child, while she can testify, unless there are reasons for her needs, will not carry much weight.

I'm not understanding why anyone would think that I might be helping push her in the wrong direction. I support whatever she wants. I have fought with her father time and time again, to spend time with her and to have a GOOD relationship with her, there have been no changes to that effect. He only site's our agreement when it goes against what he wants. He never follows the rest of it. I almost feel like I'm on trial for sticking up for her and what her needs are. I pulled out my agreement and looked it over last night, I'll be going to the Family law office after work tomorrow and seeing what steps I should take next. I definitely don't wish to fight this out, and I'm certain he wouldn't want to either, however I also don't want him to make her feel bad because she has wants and needs and chooses to voice her opinion. I'm the parent who wanted to try joint birthdays and christmases wo she wouldn't feel torn. I'm the one who encourages her to continue going to her fathers and to keep asking for time with him. I feel like I set her up to be dissapointed every time she comes home and tells me that he ignored her all weekend, or he's too busy to do stuff with her. She doesn't understand how he can live with his girlfriend and her kids everyday and still not find an hour or two for just father/daughter time. Up until a year and a half ago, he had zero interest in seeing her during the week. He never calls to see how she is, he show's no interest in her life, I feel so bad for her. I can't begin to explain how hurt she is and how much she struggles with trying to voice her oppinions without upsetting him. I keep telling her that he will love her no matter what, but her biggest fear is that he will have nothing to do with her if she tells him what she wants. She has openly told him time and time again that she is not comfortable talking to him. As far as I can tell, mind you I can only by what she says and what I see, he's really not doing anything to fix that or to nurture the relationship that they have. She has even gone so far as to say that she wishes that my fiancé was her father because at least he shows he cares. I'm sorry, but I just find this very frustrating. He lives maybe a 20 minute drive from me, he never goes anywhere without his new family, I remember her telling me that when he would come and take her to the park, that his girlfriend would be sitting in the car and watching them the whole time, like seriously? Is that nessasary? I just feel like I'm stuck no matter what I do.

Maybe it would help to explain that I'm the parent who pushes the homework, studying, curfew, bedtime, I'm the one who doles out the punishments and takes things away. I'm the harda** and he's the laid back who gives a crap parent. Yet she would still rather be here. I think that says a lot. I can't tell you how many times she's come back from his place since I had her brother 15 months ago, and told me that he asked her to move in yet again, he promised to buy her stuff and move to a great house etc... I live in an apartment, I can't afford much, she doesn't have her own PC like she does at his house, she gets to stay up late at his place, she doesn't have chores and responsibilities there, she doesn't get an allowance, yet she always chooses here. Despite what some tweens/teenagers might choose (usually the lenient fun parent) she still chooses here. She states all the time how important rules and consistency are for her. Oh and let's not forget that every time I send her there with homework it never gets done because either he refused to help her or he forgot all about it. I think that those are huge things. I'm not trying to take her away from him, I wouldn't dream of doing that. I'm only trying to show why and where I'm coming from. My children are MY #1 PRIORITY, they always have been and always will be!

First, it is very common in a split for one parent to try and push the children to not adhere to visitation. I don't think anyone said you were, only that IF you were.

Second, you are providing more info about their relationship then you originally did. And that does make a difference. If he follows the parenting plan only when its convenient for him, then his ability to force enforcement of it changes.

However, I must comment on this part of your postings.

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Originally Posted by frostybabygurl

He lives maybe a 20 minute drive from me, he never goes anywhere without his new family, I remember her telling me that when he would come and take her to the park, that his girlfriend would be sitting in the car and watching them the whole time, like seriously? Is that nessasary? I just feel like I'm stuck no matter what I do.

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I don't see a problem with him including his new family or his girlfriend watching them.

Like, seriously - I don't see the problem here with the girlfriend watching the children.

I never said there was a problem with including the girlfriend and her kids, or the girlfriend watching her. What I was referring to is that sometimes she needs just 1 on 1 time with him, and I don't understand why the girlfriend has to tag along to watch them have time alone. That's all I was saying.
In any event... I spoke with the family law office and they suggested talking about making new arrangements and that if we can't come to an agreement, to go back into mediation.
So when he drops her off tonight, I'm going to let him know that we should sit down and review the agreement and maybe change some things around so that everyone is happy. And I guess we'll see how that goes.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Thanks, I spoke with her dad tonight and told him what she wanted to change, he just stared at me and said that he wanted to sit and talk with her and find out her reasoning behind the changes and then he said that we would sit down the 3 of us and reach an agreement. I advised him that as far as the Christmas holidays are concerned I would be more than willing to compromise and have her christmas eve/day with me and new years eve/day with him and split the remainder, or if she was absolutely deadset about having both with me, then I would only take 6 of her 16 christmas vacation days, giving him the extra 2 days. So, I guess that's good, I mean neither of us wants to fight and we've both agreed that mediation would be best if we couldn't reach an agreement. Thanks to everyone for all their help and support =)

You would need to file a motion with the courts in the city you currently reside in. You don't need a lawyer, but you might need some help with the paperwork if you don't know what you're doing (i.e. with a motion to change you'll need a motion form, affadavit, affadavit of service served upon his representation, confirmation form, previous court order, etc). The court house should be able to provide you with everything you need. You can also request for the Office of the Children's Lawyer to become involved and evaluate everything and talk to your child. That would be your child's voice in the situation and would solve the problem of having to tell her father that she doesn't want to visit as much anymore.

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Originally Posted by jessie777

You would need to file a motion with the courts in the city you currently reside in. You don't need a lawyer, but you might need some help with the paperwork if you don't know what you're doing (i.e. with a motion to change you'll need a motion form, affadavit, affadavit of service served upon his representation, confirmation form, previous court order, etc). The court house should be able to provide you with everything you need. You can also request for the Office of the Children's Lawyer to become involved and evaluate everything and talk to your child. That would be your child's voice in the situation and would solve the problem of having to tell her father that she doesn't want to visit as much anymore.

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Did you read that it's pretty much been resolved?