Ask Me Help Desk - Why does my wife submit to such a humiliating punishment?

Okay, here goes. Can anybody help me understand my wife's psychology here?
My wife has a submissive element to her personality and likes to be spanked. This isn't particularly remarkable, I know, but when she's really displeased me, I've taken to punishing her in a different way. I put her naked over my knee and, using my fingers, I empty her bottom of its contents. She lies there acquiescently while I manually remove her excrement and then wipe her bottom clean. To be honest, I've been more than a little shocked not only by my own decision to punish her in this way but also (and more so) by her reaction. There's no question that she's embarrassed by the act, yet nonetheless goes over my knee whenever I tell her to. I hasten to add that we have a loving relationship, and one which is not bizarre in any other obvious ways. Can anybody explain to me why a woman would allow herself to be 'humiliated' in this way, albeit by somebody who she knows loves her?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshua1532

Okay, here goes. Can anybody help me understand my wife's psychology here?
My wife has a submissive element to her personality and likes to be spanked. This isn't particularly remarkable, I know, but when she's really displeased me, I've taken to punishing her in a different way. I put her naked over my knee and, using my fingers, I empty her bottom of its contents. She lies there acquiescently while I manually remove her excrement and then wipe her bottom clean. To be honest, I've been more than a little shocked not only by my own decision to punish her in this way but also (and more so) by her reaction. There's no question that she's embarrassed by the act, yet nonetheless goes over my knee whenever I tell her to. I hasten to add that we have a loving relationship, and one which is not bizarre in any other obvious ways. Can anybody explain to me why a woman would allow herself to be 'humiliated' in this way, albeit by somebody who she knows loves her?

In the book "the brain that changes it'self" there is a chapter on Acquired tastes and love. I think it's number four, but it is relative to your question. When I have more time I'll add more to this. The basic idea is that she was humilliated at some point and in some way pleased too, whether by adrenalin rush, or the excitement and intoxication of being with a new love or what ever, she learned to be pleased with the humiliation. You both may want to talk to a counseler, because it may get much worse, as the book explains, you get bord after a time and need to do more extream things to get the same old "high" or excitement. It can get pretty dangerous too. I advise the counseler, sex theropist maybe, both of you would be best to see separet ones I think.

I'll look in my Understanding human sexuallity book as well, that may give some insight. Also, word of caution, she may have been sexually abused and thus her "pervertion" (I only use this as a term meaning out of the ordinary, and queer.).

Then there is the question, why do you feel the need/ desire, to participate in this activity? Be careful of yourself, and I strongly advise you read that book. I'll be back later to write what I can from it.

P.S. You seem distressed, or plain old stressed about this issue. It doesn't seem to be what you reason to be as "healthy". Am I wrong in this assumption? Please correct me if I am as I don't want to be assuming anything, I much prefer the truth. Thanks.

Peace and kindness.

First of all, humiliation is in the eye of the beholder. She may or may not feel humiliated.

Sounds like you have a lovely submissive, possible masochist, on your hands that you need to learn to communicate effectively with. This behavior is not uncommon at all and it and similar acts are shared by many folks that fit into the larger category of "BDSM." I suggest finding some good literature and check to see if there is local community so that both of you can possibly engage in some enriching, fulfilling, and interesting experiences.

If you want specific book titles, websites, etc, please contact me directly: **Email removed**

Okay I have to ask why do you choose to participate in this action. If I am reading your post correctly you said she likes to be spanked. And when she really displeases you this is what you do, not what she asked you to do. I am shocked that she lets you do such a thing just as you are. But I am just as unnerved that you would think of such a punishment. I agree counseling is in order in this situation.

I am concerned about your statement about "her reaction", as to be brutally honest, I would look into your own reasoning to come up with such a "punishment" in the first place.

She enjoys spanking, fair enough-pretty normal sexual response.

But I don't see why she needs to be subjected to what is technically known as Digital Rape. (If it is not wanted-that is). By you.

What is YOUR reaction to this, Are you aroused sexually when YOU do this? I think the term is Copraphilia. (Admiring excrement in a fetishistic way.)Coprophilia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'm only asking-because I am trying to gauge any further responses that I may provide you depending on your answers

Sexual Psychological Neurology
(as best I can describe it.)

I have no idea where to start, I don't want to be dull and/or missinformative...

Love yourself, this is very hard for most, on account that we all have such high expectations for ourselves and one another. This one is very touchy and hard to deal with since it's a very powerful emotion. We tend to try and tighten our grip on it, but no matter how tight to grip it, it just runs through our hands like sand. We become addicted to Love, and in the book "The brain that changes it'self" it is compared to the drug Cocaine. While we have our love, or in my best interpretation that which seems to invoke the feeling of "Love"/"Euphoria", we are "happy". Then we start to associate things with that "Love". Should we loose that "love", we become depressed and miss that “love” dearly.
This is the complex part, we feel euphoric because the pleasure centers in the Septal region of the Limbic system is turned on. This makes us associate what we experience, good or Bad, with the feeling of pleasure. When we are "in Love", on a "manic High" (term for people who have a mental illness called Mania, or bipolar.), or if we are under the influence of cocaine; the threshold at which our pleasure centers will fire is lowered, making it easier for them to turn on. "Neurons that fire together wire together." (this term implies that while the threshold of our pleasure centers is lowered, we associate what ever we do/see/think/feel/smell and generally experience with Pleasure.) Now, the pleasure center has another name, "the appetitive pleasure system" ("Appetitive: 1. An instinctive physical desire, especially one for food or drink. 2. A strong wish or urge: an appetite for learning." - Appetitive - definition of Appetitive by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.) The reason for the strong urge or instinctive physical desire is because the appetitive pleasure system is a dopamine-based system associated with the pleasure of anticipating something we desire.

So now, when we separate from our "love" for too long we suffer from with drawl and the things that we associated with our "love", rather than bringing us happy feelings, they taunt us and serve as a dark reminder of the love we lost. That can change over time, but when the separation is new, it's really hard to look past the pain, and illusions we create. Generally after losing a love, the pleasure center isn't functioning the same, so they crash and begin craving their "love", get anxious, doubt themselves, lose their energy, and feel rundown if not depressed. Like the junky getting a small fix, a letter, e-mail, text message, or telephone message from our "love" gives us that old shot of energy and joy.

Relationships that are regular and routine, well the dopamine in our systems likes novelty, so we have to keep things rather fresh and new, exciting or our brains get bored. They need stimulation, and I've come to wonder if people who have relationship troubles and drink or do drugs regularly, aren't linked to this idea of new and fresh. See, when we do drugs, drink alcohol, we kill brain cells and make it hard for the brain to learn new things. That is only in relative terms though, and a whole new story.

K, so what do I say now... Oh right, That is mostly form the Book "the brain that changes it's self" written by Norman Doidge M.D. I believe he is a Canadian Psychyatrist.

This whole thing with the "Perversions", it gets more complex, because we don't know where it originated, and we don't know what the circomstances were that brought her to behave such as she does. All I'll say is "neurons that fire together wire together."- N. Doidge M.D. As I said above, "she was humilliated at some point and in some way pleased too" But how, why... These things are important cards.

As for you, Why the curiosity about why your wife allows for this? I wonder if you aren't afraid you'll go too far with it, or she will? I'm not sure where to go from here, I need to know more about you, and your wife, and when your behaviours became such as they are, that conserns you. That is if I'm to give you more detailed explanation, but you don't have to tell me anything you're not comfortable with, further more I believe a Counseler, or sex theropist may be of benafit to you two.

Take care, I hope my information helps.

Thank you all for the information you've provided for me. I think the reason that I've asked for your help is because I don't feel comfortable asking my wife about the situation. Her combination of shame and acquiescence baffles me. I feel that the situation is fragile. On one hand, I feel that an act of such intimacy between two people, however bizarre, should be appreciated and respected, because it signifies the existence of a profound depth of trust. On the other hand, is her acquiescence a sign of a deep-rooted insecurity about our relationship? Is she thinking that if she doesn't acquiesce, she will be damaging what exists between us, whether that be our marriage or our dominant/submissive sexual relationship? I hasten to add at this point that our relationship is, and always has been, without any even remotely serious conflict.
A question that has arisen is why I choose to punish her in this way. An enormous and hugely prevalent element of our love-life is anal sex - far, far more so than vaginal sex. Because of this, I've 'grown familiar' with her excrement, so that it is no longer taboo. In preparation for anal sex, there have been times when I have removed excrement from her bottom without telling her, because I haven't wanted to humiliate or embarrass her. I guess the difference now is that she knows that I'm doing it, and actually has to assume a particular position for the specific purpose of allowing me to do it. So for me, given the long and frequent history of anal sex that I've just outlined, it's almost been a natural development to arrive at a place where I do this to her. My surprise, as I've said, has been that my wife has accepted it.

My $.02. If your wife is of a fertile age, anal sex may be more exciting because there is LESS fear pf pregnancy. So, based on your frequency it has been a natural progression.

She's one of these people that get a sexual charge for the Dom / Sub thing. Can't say I personally understand it but that's because its not my thing. If it works for both of you then enjoy it. As long as it remains a consensual thing.

Look at it this way... she enjoys having it done for about the same reasons you enjoy doing it. Just different sides of the same coin.

My question to you is why would you want to do that to your wife and why do you feel the need to "punish"her for displeasing you? Sounds kind of weird to me, not judging. If your uncomfortable with it and her reaction to it bothers you then stop doing it and just fight like evryone else!

You said you don't want to ask her about it but if you respect her you will!
There could be so many underlying issues here.
You need to ask her how she feels about it.
If she enjoys it then great, but make sure she answers honestly and truthfully and she is not just saying what she thinks you want to hear.

Poop has lots of dangerous and harmful bacterias. I hope your being clean.

Your wife might actually hate having you dig around in her rectum. Find out if she really likes this behavior, or if she's doing it to please you.

I may be repeating some stuff, sorry about that, but here is more to the psychological perspective on Neurological explanation of addiction/love. I'm having a hard time finding where to start for your Sexual behaviour, and how to use the porn addiction section in the book to explain it. I hope this helps.

"Ok, so we have a pleasure center located in the limbic system, a part of the brain heavily involved in processing emotion, and a Dr. Robert Heath did experiements on humans in this area. He took electrods, the brian doesn't have feeling, and put them into the septal region of the limbic system and turned it on, the patient would then expereince a powerful euphoria, so powerful that one patient pleaded with them not to stop. This same region fires up when plesent subjects were discussed and during orgasm. These pleasure centers were found to be part of the brain's reward system, the mesolimbic dopamine system.
When the pleasure center is turned on everything we experience gives us pleasure. Cocaine lowers the threshold at which our pleasure centers will fire, making it easier for them to turn on. The three reasons our pleasure center's thresholds are lowered are we do a drug like Cocaine, have a manic high (Manics, bipolar.), or we are in love.
If a person gets high on Cocaine, becomes manic, or falls in love, they enter an enthusiastic state and are optamistic about everything, because all three will lower the firing threshold for the appetitive pleasure system, the dopamine-based systemassociated with the pleasuree of aticipating something we desire. They are sensative to anything that may give them pleasure, and are filled with hopeful anticipation. Things like nature, flowers, grass, sunshine inspire them; small but thoughtful gestures alow them to delight in all man kind. Doidge, the writer of "the brain that changes it'self", calls this process "Globalization".
Globalization alows us to take more pleasure in the world, and inhibits pain, displeasure, or aversion. Things that normaly bother us, don't. We love being in love not only becuase it makes it easier for us to be happy but also because it makes it harder for us to be unhappy.
Globalization alows us to learn new things easier too; because when we are "in love" we are "happy, and it's harder to be unhappy, we like thigs we normally don't", and the dopamine helps the brain consolidate "Neuroplasticity". (plastic is the brians a bility to rearange it's neuro conections to accomidate, the addition of informaition, sub traction, brain damage, "Hemisphere-ectimy" (I'm not sure how to spell it, YouTube - Brain Plasticity), and various other brain related issues.)

Freud once described the elated effects of cocaine to his fiancee, Martha, in letters. He says, he feels fearless, not fatigued, less shy, increased self esteem, no longer depressed, euphoric, enhances his energey, enthusiasm, and has an aphrodisiac effect. He was describing a state akin to "romantic intoxication". The book says in both cases, the Cocaine high, and "romantic Intoxication" may impare one's judgment. Recent fMRI (functional magnetic resonance imaging) scans of lovers looking at photos of their sweethearts show that a part of the brain with great concentrations of dopamine is activated; their brains looked like those of people on cocaine.

When separated for too long, lovers crash and experience withdrawal, crave their beloved, get anxious, doubt them selves, lose their energy, and feel run-down if not depressed. Like a little fix a letter, and e-mail, or a telephone message from the beloved provides and instant shot fo energy. Should they breake up, they get depressed- the opposite of the manic high...
After a time of being with some one, the brain doesn't produce that dopamine like before, if they adapt to well to each other. Dopamine likes novelty. (From NESTORAIN: Some people might say that thier spouse/partner is too dull, but really they are just addicted to the unpredictability, and excitment that comes with exploration of a new place. You can do what you'd like here, but it may be wise to try and spice it up a bit, be random some times, spontanious, and take time away from one another so you both don't get "tired" of one another.) Dr.Doidge believes that this means their "plastic" brains have so well adapted to each other that it's harder for them to get the same buzz they once got from each other.
Dr. Doidge also suggests if this happens to inject novelty into the relationship. Try new activities together, or wear new kinds of clothing, surprise one another. Pretty much keep the brain working, entertained, and learning fresh new things." _ The brain that changes it'self by Dr. Norman Doidge M.D.

I hope that helps, I didn't quite quote the book, but I did paraphrase, and used some lines right from it. Those were just pages 113-116. There is so much more to this chaper on love, mind you it does go into details on porn addiction, sexual pervertions and how they may work/happen. Very interesting, as it is the chaper on Acquiring tastes and loves. Very interesting stuff, but if you're not into that, I guess not eh!

Take care eh.

P.S. The understanding human sexuality book that I have, I've yet to look throug. Sorry, I'll let you know if I find anything.

Does she have a history of child abuse?

If she was sexually molested as a child many so called deviant behaviors can stem from that.

The act of humiliation is the initial response of the child and often coupled with that is the sexual stimulation that makes the child feel guilt.

On the one hand you have guilt and humiliation and on the other hand you have a natural physical stimulation that is pleasant.In a child's brain that creates a conflict.

Maybe she is subconsciously recreating an earlier and perhaps buried sexual molestation.

That you do this to your wife satisfies some need you have to humiliate another human being.

That she submits to it, is probably out of a need to fulfill your needs, or out of fear.

I think you should find ways to satisfy your needs without harming the 'one you love'.

It is just wrong, not normal, and the two of you could probably use some counselling.

Just my opinion, but I cannot think of one single reason to justify this behaviour.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jake2008

That you do this to your wife satisfies some need you have to humiliate another human being.

That she submits to it, is probably out of a need to fulfill your needs, or out of fear.

I think you should find ways to satisfy your needs without harming the 'one you love'.

It is just wrong, not normal, and the two of you could probably use some counselling.

Just my opinion, but I cannot think of one single reason to justify this behaviour.

Based on what I've read so far, you also left out That she submits to it because it fullfills a need she has as well, There is no indication she's being forced to do any of this against her will, And a Dom/ sub does tend to enjoy and get off on this just as others enjoy and get off on doing it to others.

Now I can't understand either sides perspective intimately as this is not my thing. But I've known people who were into this sort of thing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by smoothy

Based on what I've read so far, you also left out That she submits to it because it fullfills a need she has as well, There is no indication she's being forced to do any of this agains her will, And a Dom/ sub does tend to enjoy and get off on this just as others enjoy and get off on doing it to others.

Now I can't understand either sides perspective intimately as this is not my thing. But I've known people who were into this sort of thing.

Very true smoothy there are people who really enjoy BDSM but it concerns me that he hasn't asked his wife how she feels... he said he could tell she was embarrassed but how does it know if she enjoys this typre of embarrassment or not.

I hope Joshua1532 comes back as I am curious to know his answer :)

I still maintain that if you cannot TALK about a sexual act with each other, then you shouldn't PERFORM said sex act with each other.