Hi all,

One of my baseboard heater (240v)'s wire was broken can I replace it with a heavier gauge wire? Also can different gauge ground wires (copper wire) be connected with a wire-nut? IS THIS SAFE TO DO? OR Will this create a fire hazard?

You can replace with heavier gauge wire IF the insulation rating is the same or higher than the old. If you are working on heat, most likely the insulation will have to be rated for 105 degrees C.

As to using a wire nut on the ground, it should be fine as long as: 1) You are not extending with lighter gauge wire. 2) You are using the correct size wire nut that is rated for that combination of wires. 3) The wire nuts are in a junction box or the wiring compartment of the heater.

EPM

Slinke

1. Yes, you can use a larger size wire. As long as you do not downsize the breaker size. Wire can be bigger than the breaker but the breaker can't be smaller than the rated wire size.

2. Yes you can put a wirenut for connecting ground wires.

I hope this helps you out.

JP
Patco lamp

Pat,

Would you consider rewriting #1.

"Wire can be bigger than the breaker but the breaker can't be smaller than the rated wire size."

Obviously, you can put a lower amperage breaker on a higher rated conductor (30 amp breaker on a 40 amp conductor).

What you cannot do is place a higher rated breaker on a lower rated conductor ( a 20 amp breaker on a 15 amp conductor).

What we should be asking, I think is is the proper wire size being used in the first place?

You need to take the (total wattage)*1.25/240 to get the current and the wire has to be sized from there. The 1.25 is a derating factor that needs to be applied to space heating loads.

I agree with KISS on getting the current size of the conductor.

Please tell us what the wattage on the heater is. The information will be on the metal tag on the heater.

From that we will be able to determine the correct size the conductors should be.

Also, When you say. "use larger conductor" are you speaking about replacing the entire conductor run or just a small run of conductor near the break?

If you are only replacing the broken section then you may not be doing a wise thing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by donf

I agree with KISS on getting the current size of the conductor.

Please tell us what the wattage on the heater is. The information will be on the metal tag on the heater.

From that we will be able to determine the correct size the conductors should be.

Also, When you say. "use larger conductor" are you speaking about replacing the entire conductor run or just a small run of conductor near the break?

If you are only replacing the broken section then you may not be doing a wise thing.

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Thanks for all the info so far... This is a fantastic forum!

The Baseboard Heater Wattage is 1758

Volt 230V

Amp 7.6

I'm just trying to replace the broken/burned RED wire that was twisted together(in a wire-nut) with the BLACK wire and wire-nut the broken ground wire with a slightly larger one.

I've attached a picture of the baseboard.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by slinke

Thanks for all the info so far... This is a fantastic forum!

The Baseboard Heater Wattage is 1758

Volt 230V

Amp 7.6

I'm just trying to replace the broken/burned RED wire that was twisted together(in a wire-nut) with the BLACK wire and wire-nut the broken ground wire with a slightly larger one.

I've attached a picture of the baseboard.

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Sorry guys... the broken/burned RED wire was twisted together with the WHITE wire not the BLACK wire.

Okay,

I must be blind because I cannot find any red wire in your picture.

For baseboard heat, usually it is a straight 240 VAC. That means that you can actually use 14/2 (15amp).
You would install the white wire to one input terminal and then re-identify the wire with black or red tape. Or some other permanent coloring to signify that this wire is no longer a Neutral wire. It is a live wire carrying power.

Black would be connected to the other terminal of the heating element.

BTW - The term, "De rating" applies to the reducing of the electricity flow in the circuit. It does not apply to the increasing of the electrical flow.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by donf

Okay,

I must be blind because I cannot find any red wire in your picture.

For baseboard heat, usually it is a straight 240 VAC. That means that you can actually use 14/2 (15amp).
You would install the white wire to one input terminal and then re-identify the wire with black or red tape. Or some other permanent coloring to signify that this wire is no longer a Neutral wire. It is a live wire carrying power.

Black would be connected to the other terminal of the heating element.

BTW - The term, "De rating" applies to the reducing of the electricity flow in the circuit. It does not apply to the increasing of the electrical flow.

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Eh... the RED wire is the missing burned/broken one which I'm trying to replace with a AWG 10 / AWM 600 volts vw1/ ANCE 90"C/194 F wire.

Do you or anyone know if wires rated 194F is a safe replacement wire for baseboard heater?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by slinke

eh... the RED wire is the missing burned/broken one which I'm trying to replace with a AWG 10 / AWM 600 volts vw1/ ANCE 90"C/194 F wire.

Do you or anyone know if wires rated 194F is a safe replacement wire for baseboard heater?

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I think in this case you should get wire rated for at LEAST 105C (221F). 194F wire is 90C. Those heaters can get up around those temperatures. I know if it was mine I would use wire from the burners on an electric range. I don't know the exact temp rating, but you can't burn it with a torch. And if you are connecting it within a couple of inches of the heating element, use a ceramic wire nut.

EPM

My rule is I never mix different gauge wires because of the national electrical code. Now to your question.

Go to the breaker panel and carefully with one hand open the door and locate the breaker that serves this circuit. Please be careful because electricity is very dangerous.DO NOT REMOVE THE PANEL COVER. Just find the breaker that serves the circuit.

The amps on the breaker will determine the size gauge wire to use on this circuit.
If you can understand the nec and have one, the tables will show you the correct wire size according to the ampacity of the wire; otherwise, call an electrician. I do not write this to be unkind but only to be helpful. And if you should decide to work on this circuit, turn off the breaker and test the circuit.