Much we, as perceived "intelectuals", have assumed about our world and how it works. Maybe it's time to open our minds and see what things are for what they are. And what is that? Nothing more than a transferance of energy form one form to another. No? Maybe maybe not. Evidence from all around goes in many directions at once. How many relious views are there? Who knows, doe it matter, no not really.

So here is my question, if Science makes the holy book a lie, by stating that man evolved from monkeys, and not by what ever means we were supposed to be created, why then not give that to science, and inturn realise that humans make mistakes. This would be true for whom ever may have made the book, let alone translated it, or even for whom read it. Haha, funny, to think that there is all this nonsense because one man says "it's a snake!", and another, "it's a tree!", and yet another says" no, it's a bush!"

How about this, I heard a story from some indian(east I think) culture, about a man who takes three blind men to the elefant and gives one man the tail, the other man the trunck, (I'm almost sure I spelled that worng.) and the other the leg. SO, the one with the leg says, it's a tree, the one with the trunk, it's a snake, the one with the tail, it's a bush.

I"M out of time but try to remember, they all had the same thing, and holding only ones perception is to separate from the rest, thus loosing what insights they see/learn/ and offer. DOnt' be a fool, and ignore that the possibilities are endlass, no matter what you think they are, they are simply what they are and not you or any one can cahnge that. Though, you can influence a change? Very dangerous.

MInd you, "there is no good, there is no Bad, there is only possibility." --- ME Benjamin.

Tell me what you will, for I have much more to say, peace bewith you my brothers, and sisters.

Does this have anything to do with Christianity? If so, please make the connection.

Maybe this is for the Religious Discussion boards?

I agree with De Maria, why post this in a specific religious board when the question is so general.

Ok, no more riddles.
I have chosen to post this, yes so very general qestion here because this is the most heated place for religious talk. Christians are one of the most heated, and passionate people I've ever met. That is why I want to see if Christians can make the connection.

The part about "THE BOOK" is acctually about the bible, there are possibilities that are there, and yet we choose to ignore them. SO I wonder why not try to take the "good" ideas from the story and try to learn from them. Much the same as we do with any bit of writing. Do we have to believe the bible to believe in GOD? What if we think GOD is more than just a being, more than our creator?

So am I off the wall, is there no possible way that the good book was misstakenly assumed "the book" when really religion does not come form a book, nor a church, Priest, heaven, hell, but really it comes from with in us. It is apart of us as we are apart of it. So in thinking so, just as Jessus said, "this is my body, and the wine my blood." Do you not wonder if that maybe means that he recognised that he was a part of all things, and the people back then may have bin too simple minded to realise he was talking of all things? Truly interesting I dead I say, and yes it ties close to christianity because I know little about it, but more than any other religion.

TO BE CLEAR, I'm not saying GOD does not exsist, because that is one of many possibilities, but I believe GOD is One and all. God is the energy that gives life, that makes it flow, that binds the biggest person to the smallest cell.

So tell me what you think.

Yes!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nestorian

Ok, no more riddles.
I have choosen to post this, yes so very general qestion here because this is the most heated place for religous talk. Christians are one of the most heated, and passionate people ive ever met. That is why i want to see if Christians can make the connection.

The part about "THE BOOK" is acctually about the bible, there are possibilities that are there, and yet we choose to ignore them. SO i wonder why not try to take the "good" ideas from the story and try to learn from them. Much the same as we do with any bit of writing. Do we have to believe the bible to believe in GOD? What if we think GOD is more than just a being, more than our creator??

So am i off the wall, is there no possible way that the good book was misstakenly assumed "the book" when really religion does not come form a book, nor a church, Priest, heaven, hell, but really it comes from with in us. It is apart of us as we are apart of it. So in thinking so, just as Jessus said, "this is my body, and the wine my blood." Do you not wonder if that maybe means that he recognised that he was a part of all things, and the people back then may have bin too simple minded to realise he was talking of all things?? Truely interesting i dead i say, and yes it ties close to christianity because I know little about it, but more than any other religion.

TO BE CLEAR, i'm not saying GOD does not exsist, becuase that is one of many possibilities, but I believe GOD is One and all. God is the energy that gives life, that makes it flow, that binds the biggest person to the smallest cell.

So tell me what you think.

---

I'd say, "you're getting warm".

First problem that I see is that you don't trust the people who came before you:
the people back then may have bin too simple minded to realise he was talking of all things??

But we believe they were just as smart as we are.

Second problem is related to the first. You seem to believe that the "BOOK" was laying around for 2000 years and NO ONE understood it until you came around.

Third problem, you admit you know little about Christianity and that the little that you think you know truly represents that religion. But no, we don't believe that religion COMES FROM a book. The Bible is the record of what God revealed to His people.

Fourth problem, you said that it is possible that God does not exist. No, that is not possible.

But you're saying that:
but I believe GOD is One and all. God is the energy that gives life, that makes it flow, that binds the biggest person to the smallest cell.

Is very close to the truth. God revealed that He is Yahweh. Some people pronounce it, "Jehovah". But it means the same thing. I AM WHO AM. As we understand it. It means that God is all which exists.

Sincerely,

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by De Maria

I'd say, "you're getting warm".

First problem that I see is that you don't trust the people who came before you:
the people back then may have bin too simple minded to realise he was talking of all things??

But we believe they were just as smart as we are.

Second problem is related to the first. You seem to believe that the "BOOK" was laying around for 2000 years and NO ONE understood it until you came around.

Third problem, you admit you know little about Christianity and that the little that you think you know truly represents that religion. But no, we don't believe that religion COMES FROM a book. The Bible is the record of what God revealed to His people.

Fourth problem, you said that it is possible that God does not exist. No, that is not possible.

But you're saying that:
but I believe GOD is One and all. God is the energy that gives life, that makes it flow, that binds the biggest person to the smallest cell.

Is very close to the truth. God revealed that He is Yahweh. Some people pronounce it, "Jehovah". But it means the same thing. I AM WHO AM. As we understand it. It means that God is all which exists.

Sincerely,

---

You sounded a bit like the Cappadocians there for a minute. High praise indeed!

Nestorian,
Hey, I'm a Christian who sees no problem with the scientific idea that Mankind evolved from monkeys.
SOME Christians do have a problem with that but well over one billion do not.
Evolution was and still is a part of God's design of the entire universe.
That was and is a brilliant plan that science is still studying and discovering.
I believe that full scientific understanding of it all is still a long way off into the future.
Peace and kindness,
Fred (arcura)

Fred, please tell me you are joking about the evolution stiff, right?
If you are to believe the Bible at all then you must believe that man was created by God in his own image. And not Darwin's wild theory about man coming from apes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 450donn

Fred, please tell me you are joking about the evolution stiff, right?
If you are to believe the Bible at all then you must believe that man was created by God in his own image. And not Darwin's wild theory about man coming from apes.

---

Fred is Catholic as am I. And the Catholic Church permits us to believe in:

1. Strict Creationism.
2. Intelligent design.
3. Deistic Evolution (Not Darwin's Godless evolution)

All three are interpretations of the Word of God.

Sincerely,

450donn,
De Maria has already answered that for me.
Yes GOD IS the creator of all that is seen and unseen.
How He did it and how long he took is the problem with many.
I believe that God's creation is STILL working is the universe.
He set creation on a path of creation.
Even the stars are being created yet today, so says scientists and I believe that.
Even man, created in the image of God, is creating things; It seems faster now than ever before.
God's creation begets creations.
Peace and kindness,
Fred.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by De Maria

Fred is Catholic as am I. And the Catholic Church permits us to believe in:

1. Strict Creationism.
2. Intelligent design.
3. Deistic Evolution (Not Darwin's Godless evolution)

All three are interpretations of the Word of God.

Sincerely,

---

Now, you start to speak with intent to tell people that the Catholic Church speeks for you, and I am guessing GOD? Any man/woman who claims to know the will of GOD is a dangerous man/woman indeed.

Interpretations of the word GOD, do you realise that others say the same about your beliefs? So who is right? Personally, I see us only as travelers on a path, and non of us knows what awaits us, only what we are here and now. Thus "The past is history, the future is a mystery, today is a gift. That is why it's called the Present." Got to love the wisdom in that one eh? Ok, I Love it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by De Maria

I'd say, "you're getting warm".

First problem that I see is that you don't trust the people who came before you:
the people back then may have bin too simple minded to realise he was talking of all things??

But we believe they were just as smart as we are.

Second problem is related to the first. You seem to believe that the "BOOK" was laying around for 2000 years and NO ONE understood it until you came around.

Third problem, you admit you know little about Christianity and that the little that you think you know truly represents that religion. But no, we don't believe that religion COMES FROM a book. The Bible is the record of what God revealed to His people.

Fourth problem, you said that it is possible that God does not exist. No, that is not possible.

But you're saying that:
but I believe GOD is One and all. God is the energy that gives life, that makes it flow, that binds the biggest person to the smallest cell.

Is very close to the truth. God revealed that He is Yahweh. Some people pronounce it, "Jehovah". But it means the same thing. I AM WHO AM. As we understand it. It means that God is all which exists.

Sincerely,

---

I did not say I didn't trust them, I just think people are subject to making mistakes. Weather those mistakes are because of misscomunication, assumptions, narrow mindedness, lack of awareness, intelegents, or other wise. I'm simply recognising that, and be mindful of such things. No foolishness in that eh? Considering we as "HUMANBEINGS" are always looking for ways to saticfiy our needs, problem is we never seem saticfied. So I don't view them as any different in the old days. That's all.

They are just as smart as we are, however, Knowledge travels faster these days. Thus we learn more, faster (perhaps not always a good thing.) but one thing is rather possible. We have a greater probability of seeing more of the picture due to our vast knowledge.

If I sound as though I assume that the "book" was lost and forgotten for 2000 years, I"m sorry. That is not what i ment. I ment was that what they had, they did not understand. And no i'm not mystical person who see's something everyone else missed. I'm just asking if it's a possibility that the words were not ment to be taken the way they are taken. I've seen too much hate and anger come from that. Especaily the greedy Gluttonous way we live today. Myself included, i've only began to see what is happening around me. I'm no saint, only a passer by who may give you something of value or not. Remember i believe you and I are one and the same. Same ideas, differnt expressions.

Once again, people put thier faith in the words of the Bible. Then i ask you again, if those words were missinterpreted, or misstranslated then what?? There are hoow many religions claiming that thiers is the one true religion. The one true path to GOD, but who's right? Does it matter, to me no, not really. To me they are all just differnt words expressing the path to GOD. In the end, i believe that GOD being all knowing, all "LOVING" would know as I do that people are just living thier lives the best they can. In my eyes i see no good or bad people, though i still say some are and are not and i get angered. Still i know, that no man/women is what s/he seems. I love all people, though im terrified by them. To me, we are still just animals, trying to get by. Sure we are capable of intelegent things, but that doesn't mean we have the wisdom to use that knowlege.

And now we come to some very sensitive stuff. "Is it possible that GOD does not exist? " Oh, it is possible, though i'd give you the fact that it does seem very unprobable. But it is possible. I do realise it is also possible that i'm wrong, and quite possible a little crazy, but the same goes for you, and any one else. I don't just see what is efore us, but what is around us, with in us, and that which connects us. DO you see how that is possible??

So yes, though you are absolutely correct, you are also wrong, and yet niether. No, you dont' see that some will agree with you, some will disagree, and then some wont care. As for me, i'm not sure who would agree with me, and believe that you are all three at once. Very confusing stuff, but nontheless real.

"all are one and one is all." --- LED-ZEP, stiarway to heaven.

At any rate take care, keep your faith in GOD. Because your relationship with GOD is not that of mine with GOD. (not good not bad, but notheless true.) Feel free to teach me more my brothers and sisters. I'll be wiating ;)

Nestorian,
First of all I believe the Bible Is the word of God so therefore true.
There were some errors in early translations but they have been corrected by experts who studied the earliest manuscripts and related documents.
Plus the fact that there is much archeological evidence that back up much of what the bible records.
Yes, you CAN trust the bible.
BUT you will only IF you want to.
Or you can continue with your many doubts.
Peace and kindness,
Have a happy Prosperous New Year,
Fred

Our brains and minds are not created to understand everything that's around us. Simple why would the Creator make us as smart as he. We will never reach to a point were we undestand everything around us, are minds are limited only to know what the Creator wanted us to know.

You do think there's a Creator of course?

Because nothing comes on their own.

complicatedlife,
Yes, I think you are right about that.
Happy Prosperous New Year,
Fred

The possibilities are endlass

... But there is only one absolute truth and to call good evil and evil good the Bible does say we will do that in the last days...
We do that now. As for a lot of the rest of what you said it is called moral relativism which can be very deceptive. Why call a branch a leg or a snake an angel of God? As long as you buy into moral relativism you will never be truly set free in your spiritual perspective.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by arcura

Nestorian,
Hey, I'm a Christian who sees no problem with the scientific idea that Mankind evolved from monkeys.

Fred (arcura)

---

Sorry guys and gals that is not what the Bible teaches. Please tell me how the catholic or any church can say man came from monkeys when in Genesis 1:27 it clearly says GOD created man in His own image. If you believe that sort of garbage then you are telling me and the world that the catholic church believes that GOD is an ape!

I don't think there is enough evidence to say man came from apes, but I do think that there is a God, and no matter what you think He is, or isn't is a matter of opinion, or tradition, or whatever you have been taught, from whatever region, or culture your from.

The most important thing to me is your own personal relationship with what YOU understand your God to be, and put nothing between you.

That doesn't mean you can't celebrate tradition with others, as that's human, but whatever tradition you choose to embrace, it doesn't change the fact that all humans are made the same way, and that's not a coincidence.

It's that commonality that links us, and should be embraced, not fought over, no matter the culture, creed, or region we are from.

As usual though, man would rather fight over the mundane, trivial things, than embrace the fact he is an individual that is part of a whole.

We may have different brains that gives us different perspectives, and our free will to choose, but we all share human DNA, so we are all equal. Given a bit of thought, there is room for all our uniqueness, and commonality, if we as humans so choose.

Maybe one day we can all listen to each other, and hear the same thing, without the close minded filter of bias, or self interest.

450donn
Yes, God created man in His image.
The question is "How did He do it?"
I believe He did it through evolution.
It was God's planned design.
No God was never an ape or monkey.
The Creator God was/is a spirit whose word became flesh through the womb of a human woman named Mary.
I believe in God and the sciences which study His creations.
That's what I believe.
Of course you believe as you want to.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

Yet you stated that man evolved from monkeys?
There is no question how God created man. Again Genesis 1:26/27 says "Then God said, Let US make man in OUR image according to Our likeness and let them rule over the fish of the sea, the birds of the sky, and over the cattle and over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth. God created man in his own image in the image of GOD he created him;male and female HE created them.
If YOU were to believe the bible at all there is no way that you can sit here and claim that man evolved from apes without saying that God is an ape! Fred, you really need to rethink your whole evolution theory garbage, because there is no where in the Bible where it states that God created apes to rule the world.