Hello,

This may come across as somewhat complicated.

A month and a half ago (Oct. 1), I came home to discover that my now ex roommate moved all of her things out. No notice was given to me by her at all. She paid the October rent, however she considered her November rent should come out of her half of the security deposit. She told me I had all of October and November to figure out what to do. Not true.

My landlady informed me that in fact, she only paid the October rent- the security deposit was not hers to have (still kind of vague on that, though). We both moved into the place in June, 2006. It was the top floor of a brownstone in Brooklyn, and the landlady and her family occupied the bottom two floors. We signed a one-year lease in 2006 and 2007, but not for 2008. My landlady was supposed to leave it on the stairway for us to sign but never did. Because my ex roommate moved out so suddenly and we are no longer on speaking terms, I have no idea if she signed anything this year. If she did, it had to be in late September, right before she moved out. Whether she did or not, the fact remains that I did not sign anything this year.

It was brought up to my landlady that we were considering moving out by the end of the year but had not been definative about it, so it was my understanding that the terms became month-to-month. I informed the landlady that I would try and find a place as soon as I could. I wanted to shoot for December 1 but upped my search because she preferred to have someone new move in before the middle of winter, which she termed November. I found a place on October 14 and moved out on the 31st.

In terms of the security deposit, she mentioned the possibility that it might not get returned to me if she couldn't find a tenant. As far as I know, she still had people looking at my former apartment the day after I moved. I have not heard a word back from my landlady. In addition, my ex roommate left a hole in the wall after she tore her corkboard out. I dutifully patched it up and sanded it down as best I could but it obviously needs repainting. There might also be some very slight scratches in the floor from when the movers were over, but no other damages. And rent was always paid on time.

As for our landlady, the condition of our place when we left was similar to when we moved in, i.e. "under construction"... the walls of the stairwell had marks and were never repainted; our doors were falling off the hinges (one time it almost got me when it fell over suddenly), and even though we were told we would, we never received a mailbox. Our mail would be left on the steps by the landlady. If she was not home, sometimes we wouldn't get things for days. Though livable, the place always seemed in a constant state of repair. She also asked us if we had a copy of the lease in 2007 because she couldn't find hers.

My questions are:

1) Is this situation considered an "illegal" apartment rental? If so, do I have the same rights as legal renters do in NY State?

2) Is my landlady entitled to hold onto my security deposit, even though I never actually signed a lease for this year (I'm not even sure what the terms were)?

3) Am I to be held liable for damages caused by my ex roommate (the hole), even though I repaired it and, again, I didn't sign any agreement this year?

4) More specifically, what makes an agreement of this type legally binding? Does it have to be in writing or could it have been made verbally? As I have stated before, I didn't discuss these new "month-to-month" terms with my landlady; my ex-roommate did. Therefore, I never actually heard my landlady inform me about anything.

Thank you very much for reading my long and frustrating story. I appreciate any advice you can offer.


JS

1) Whether it's a legal apt or not is not of concern to you. You have the same rights and obligations regardless

2) When the lease expired without either of you terminating it, it became a month to month tenancy. The prior lease remained in force except for term and rental.Security deposits are unaffected.

3) Again, forget that you signed nothing. That just means the prior lease remains in effect. Since you both were signed on the lease, you are equally responsible for damages.

4) Same story, prior lease terms continue to apply

Bottomline here, either of you can terminate the lease with notice equal to one rental period. Your roommate gave notice on Oct 1 and paid through the end of October. So she actually did things pretty much correctly. She did not owe for November. But she had no right to deisgnate how the security deposit would be used. Since you moved out by 11/1 at the request of the landlord, then you would not be responsble for November either.

The landlord is required to return the deposit or an accounting of how it was used, with a specified time after you vacate. You can check NY statutes to see what that time frame is. That time probably has not expired yet.

Sorry, I failed to add that she upped our rent by $50 per month since June.

Doesn't matter. You are still on a month to month basis since no new lease was signed. The terms of the previous signed lease, except for rental and term remain in effect.

Okay. But my landlady was insisting that she might withhold some or all of the security deposit in case she didn't find a tenant by Nov.1. She didn't find one when I moved out, she was still showing.

So the main issue, considering what you said about either of us not breaking our month to month, is whether my former landlady is entitled to hold onto the security deposit for something other than damages to the premises. A finder's fee if you will..

She insists we (meaning she and I) "broke the lease".

Well, as for any "verbal" agreement, legally it is about as worthless as your ex-roommate, for both parties involved.
As far as the expired lease is concerned, it doesn't really matter what was "verbally" agreed upon. As long as both landlord and tenants were were in agreement of continuing the rental of the apartment, then by law the expired lease automatically continues on an extended month to month basis, with all rental terms remaining the same(!) until a new lease agreement is signed or until either party gives notice to vacate, and if the landlord initiated your moving out, legally she must give you at least 30 days notice, and in some states it may be even longer. Typically a tenant is not usually bound to give a minimum notice of 30 days or more to vacate when renting month to month, since you fulfilled the terms of the original lease when it ended. Although if you chose to vacate, it's usually in your best interest to try to give as much notice as possible, it will get you a much better references when a future landlord calls.
Now as far as your deposit goes, it all depends on the terms in your original lease. As long as it was stated to be a "security deposit" it is illegal for the landlord to hold it for any purpose other than to cover any damages that you incurred while living there, and any expenses incurred if a tenant breaks their lease, which you have already fulfilled when it expired. If it was listed as a "cleaning deposit" you might have a problem, even though it's not usually legal to call it that. And trust me, many things landlords try to write into a lease aren't legal, even if you have already signed it.
For future reference, always do a through inspection when moving into a new place, with a checklist of anything and everything that is not perfect, and make sure it is checked and signed by the both of you. You will be so glad you did, landlords are notorious for finding ways to get out of returning deposit funds that they were supposed to keep in an escrow account but probably spent before you even finished moving in!
Now comes the good part! Because so many landlords for years have screwed renters out of their "good faith" security deposit so often in the past, there are strict state laws that were passed to help protect renters. If the landlord can show no legal reason for keeping your deposit, such as receipts showing it was spent for the repair of excessive damage, (and this does not include normal wear and tear), or that it was forfeited by the tenant moving out before the end of the lease agreement. (which is not applicable after the lease was fulfilled and you continued month to month) they must return it to you within 30 days in the majority of states, or face penalties that could be as high as having to pay double the original amount! That is the law here in ga. unfortunately, most people don't know about it.
And most importantly, make sure you give your ex-landlord your forwarding address, if you don't, then quite often that gives them a "loophole" to get out of returning it!
Remember, most all of the laws concerning landlords/tenants are to protect the tenants!
There is a publication out there that every state has available, called "questions concerning landlords and tenants" that every renter should have a copy of to protect their rights. Years ago I obtained mine by calling the state housing authority, now you can most likely download the current edition for your state online. I had mine with me for years, and thought of it as the renters bible... It saved me from being majorly screwed by many landlords and even more roommates from hell!
Good luck, aaron

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by periwinkle27

She insists we (meaning she and I) "broke the lease".

---

She can insist anything she wants but it won't hold up in court. The fact is you gave her 30 days notice as required by law and (probably) the lease. She asked you to vacate earlier and you complied. Your roommate also effectively gave 30 days notice by paying for all of October. So you can consider the lease terminated as of 11/1. That's how a court will look at it. Since you both paid up to 11/1 you owe nothing for rent.

Ok, I found my Renter's Bible, and the actual name of the publication is "Questions Frequently Asked by Landlords And Tenants", just in case you Google it.

Thank you everyone for your help. Will let you know how it goes after I give said landlady a piece of my mind... and the NYS Landlord-Tenant Law.