Hi! I live in Tx my question is can a judge deny me a public definder?I went to court on July , 9 2008 and was told that if wanted a public definder I would have to show the court 4 years of my tax returns. Is this legal ? I am on walfare and can't afford a lawyer. All the lawyer I called wanted 1,000 to 3,000 to take the case. I was charge with crimmal mischif less than 500.00 dollars damage.

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Originally Posted by mauj

hi! i live in Tx my question is can a judge deny me a public definder?i went to court on july , 9 2008 and was told that if wanted a public definder i would have to show the court 4 years of my tax returns. is this legal ? iam on walfare and can"t afford a lawyer. all the lawyer i called wanted 1,000 to 3,000 to take the case. i was charge with crimmal mischif less than 500.00 dollars damage.

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Yes, it's legal. There are guidelines and rules.

Why don't you want to show your tax returns?

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Originally Posted by mauj

hi! i live in Tx my question is can a judge deny me a public definder?i went to court on july , 9 2008 and was told that if wanted a public definder i would have to show the court 4 years of my tax returns. is this legal ? iam on walfare and can"t afford a lawyer. all the lawyer i called wanted 1,000 to 3,000 to take the case. i was charge with crimmal mischif less than 500.00 dollars damage.

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Because I filed bankrupt 4years ago

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Originally Posted by mauj

because i filed bankrupt 4years ago

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I still don't see why you don't want to use this as proof you can't afford a private Attorney - if you can't afford a private Attorney, of course.

If you can afford to pay someone, then don't furnish your tax returns and retain an Attorney.

Hello m:

Public Defenders are for poor people. If you're poor, then show the judge your welfare papers, and tell him that you make so little, that you aren't required to file a tax return (assuming that it's true - and it probably is).

Don't DO anything. Wait till your next court appearance, and ask the judge AGAIN. If they TRY to DO something else at your next appearance, tell the judge that you CANNOT continue WITHOUT legal counsel. Do NOT let yourself get railroaded. STAND UP!

excon

What is wrong about you going bankrupt that does not mean you don't have tax records.
There are income guidelines and other rules, for example in GA if you have the money to make bail, normally you will not get a Public defender since if you have money for bail you have money for an attorney ( that is the thought)

So if you want a public defender supply them the tax records

Thank you excon and judy. As for why I can't show my tax returns is because I don't have 4 years of tax returns I only have that one and he won't accept it . I filled out the paper work to get a public defender and the judge denied it.

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Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck

what is wrong about you going bankrupt that does not mean you don't have tax records.
There are income guidelines and other rules, for example in GA if you have the money to make bail, normally you will not get a Public defender since if you have money for bail you have money for an attorney ( that is the thought)

So if you want a public defender supply them the tax records

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My friend is a bails bonds man and got me out without no moey I still owe him for getting me out.

You can easily get your other IRS tax returns from the IRS.

If you did not file, you will have to go back and refile for those years, and then supply the forms for them.

If you don't provide what they need, they will not provide the attorney

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Originally Posted by mauj

my friend is a bails bonds man and got me out without no moey i still owe him for getting me out.

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Hello again, m:

The above PROVES nothing. The judge wants you to PROVE you're poor. If you can't do it with tax returns, then take him EVERYTHING you've got. Show him your bankruptcy. Tell him the name of your welfare case worker. Better yet, get an affidavit from your case worker. Take the judge every single piece of paper that backs up your claim of poverty.

Then again, request that you be assigned counsel. Do NOTHING other than that. Do NOT let them proceed with your case. If you don't watch out, Texas WILL railroad you!!

excon

Thanks excon and all the other here for your insite on this matter. excon I will get all my paper work together tonight because I have court this Tuesday sept 9 2008 8:00 o clock once again thanks everyone. mauj

OK! excon will do. Sorry for the late reply

In addition to what has been said above, I as a court bailiff have seen many cases where a defendant delayed meeting the requirements for getting a public defender or otherwise seeking legal counsel and the judge ruled that they had, by their actions, waived their right to an attorney.

While I have also seen appeals based on this practice, it does happen and the judges don't like to mess around with someone who appears to not be doing everything they can to get an attorney as quickly as possible. There is, of course, a Constitutional mandate to ensure a speedy trial.

Do everything you can to get all the documentation requested as quickly as possible. The fact that you had a bankruptcy doesn't matter in this circumstance.

In my state the judge is not involved in determining eligibility for the public defender, it is all done in their office. They don't look at tax returms, but pay stubs and other documentaion of current, as opposed to past, income, or the lack thereof. If you qualify for welfare, as you said, you should also qualify for a public defender.

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Originally Posted by JimGunther

In addition to what has been said above, I as a court bailiff have seen many cases where a defendant delayed meeting the requirements for getting a public defender or otherwise seeking legal counsel and the judge ruled that they had, by their actions, waived their right to an attorney.

While I have also seen appeals based on this practice, it does happen and the judges don't like to mess around with someone who appears to not be doing everything they can to get an attorney as quickly as possible. There is, of course, a Constitutional mandate to ensure a speedy trial.

Do everything you can to get all the documentation requested as quickly as possible. The fact that you had a bankruptcy doesn't matter in this circumstance.

In my state the judge is not involved in determining eligibility for the public defender, it is all done in their office. They don't look at tax returms, but pay stubs and other documentaion of current, as opposed to past, income, or the lack thereof. If you qualify for welfare, as you said, you should also qualify for a public defender.

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Thanks,jimgunther I guess you're right about the judge because he would not let me submit my walfare papers in court today. He the(judge) stated that I already had enough time to comply with the courts order to hire a lawyer but as I stated I have no money to afford a lawyer and that's why I needed a public definder. I ask the judge if I could submit the papers that I had from the walfare office to show the courts I have very little income but he the (judge) said no that if I was'nt ready oct 14 2008 he's going on to proceed with the trial weather I had a lawyer or not or that I would have to repersent myself. After all that put down by the judge here's comes the d.a's asking me would I take 2 years defereded judacataion probation I said no.so the judge set trial 10-14-08 and this is were I stand now!

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Originally Posted by mauj

thanks,jimgunther i guess you"re right about the judge because he would not let me submit my walfare papers in court today. he the(judge) stated that i already had enough time to comply with the courts order to hire a lawyer but as i stated i have no money to afford a lawyer and thats why i needed a public definder. i ask the judge if i could submit the papers that i had from the walfare office to show the courts i have very little income but he the (judge) said no that if i was'nt ready oct 14 2008 he's going on to proceed with the trial weather i had a lawyer or not or that i would have to repersent myself. after all that put down by the judge here's comes the d.a's asking me would i take 2 years defereded judacataion probation i said no.so the the judge set trial 10-14-08 and this is were i stand now!

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And so what are you doing to resolve the situation?

Hello again, m:

Texas is going to railroad you, EXACTLY LIKE I SAID THEY WOULD. Texas railroads EVERYBODY. Isn't the dufus in chief from Texas?? Texas should be blown off the map.

excon

PS> (edited) Private Message received earlier today:

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Originally Posted by excon

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Originally Posted by mauj

hi! excon this is mauj; you answered one of my ouestion the other day( about can a judge deny me a public definder).well let me start off by thanking you for your post back second this is what happend today! i tryed to submit my paper work from the walfare office to the courts today and the judge would not let me he stated that i was given enough time to hire a lawyer and that it was to late to ask for a public definder and that my papers were not acceptable. the d.a. came and offered me a plea of 2 years audj. probation after i finished talking to the judge. i told him no because i didn't do it. thats when the d.a. told me my d.l. had been suspended 3 times. the problem with this is after the first time i never paid to reinstate them. So how can they suspend them 3 times? Then he was saying that if i take the probation that when i got through with it, it wont go on my record. I know thats a lie from my last experience. (But i'm stupid). Now the judge is saying that when i come back in there this time they're going to proceed with the case, and i'm going to have to represent myself. Do you have any suggestions? thanks again mauj

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Hello again, M:

I TOLD you they were going to railroad you. If you want to lay down, then take the plea.

If it were me, I would tell them that you can't continue WITHOUT legal representation.

I know the judge doesn't care. But, by saying that, you reserve your rights to appeal.

I HATE Texas.

excon

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Mauj, I hope you undertand what deferred adjudication is, in my state its called probation before judgement and is a great way to go if you want to prevent a conviction from appearing on your record. If you are able to get a public defender or other attorney to represent you by the court date, I am sure he will explain it to you.

Basically, it means that you plead guilty, but instead of a finding of guilt being entered, a period of probation is imposed, and if the person completes the probation satisfactorily, no finding of guilt is entered. In other words, you are not convicted of the crime.

In your case this might be a problem because if the offense involved damaging property of some kind, you can pretty much be assured that one of the conditions of probation will be restitution for the damage, which you probably can't pay in your current situation.

Try to get the PD as hard as you can and let us know...

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Originally Posted by excon

Hello again, m:

Texas is going to railroad you, EXACTLY LIKE I SAID THEY WOULD. Texas railroads EVERYBODY. Isn't the dufus in chief from Texas??? Texas should be blown off the map.

excon

PS> (edited) Private Message received earlier today:

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hee hee I agree but wait until I get my family out. Hee hee

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Originally Posted by JimGunther

Mauj, I hope you undertand what deferred adjudication is, in my state its called probation before judgement and is a great way to go if you want to prevent a conviction from appearing on your record. If you are able to get a public defender or other attorney to represent you by the court date, I am sure he will explain it to you.

Basically, it means that you plead guilty, but instead of a finding of guilt being entered, a period of probation is imposed, and if the person completes the probation satisfactorily, no finding of guilt is entered. In other words, you are not convicted of the crime.

In your case this might be a problem because if the offense involved damaging property of some kind, you can pretty much be assured that one of the conditions of probation will be restitution for the damage, which you probably can't pay in your current situation.

Try to get the PD as hard as you can and let us know.....

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hello... jimgunther yes I understand what deffered judication is and that's why I told the d.a. that I wouldn't accept deffered judication. I'm not admitting guilt for something I didn't do. Now on the other hand if I had committed this crime I would be more than happy to accept the 2 yrs. Probation.

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Originally Posted by JimGunther

In addition to what has been said above, I as a court bailiff have seen many cases where a defendant delayed meeting the requirements for getting a public defender or otherwise seeking legal counsel and the judge ruled that they had, by their actions, waived their right to an attorney.

While I have also seen appeals based on this practice, it does happen and the judges don't like to mess around with someone who appears to not be doing everything they can to get an attorney as quickly as possible. There is, of course, a Constitutional mandate to ensure a speedy trial.

Do everything you can to get all the documentation requested as quickly as possible. The fact that you had a bankruptcy doesn't matter in this circumstance.

In my state the judge is not involved in determining eligibility for the public defender, it is all done in their office. They don't look at tax returms, but pay stubs and other documentaion of current, as opposed to past, income, or the lack thereof. If you qualify for welfare, as you said, you should also qualify for a public defender.

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hey! Jim I agree with you 100 percent. Its just these little towns think they can do anything they won't to people and they do. This what's makes the world we live in so bad you got rotten judges;lawyer; d.a's; and the rest of the crap in the system. Seems that your guilty until proven innocent instead of the other way round innocent until proven guilty.