It's ownership by your own decision.. You decided what you do.. You decided what you believe..

ARE WE? The word ignorant is found 17 times in the Word of God. Are we foolish and ignorant as beast before Our Lord? What are the patterns of our thoughts each day? Where do those thoughts take us? How does the Word of God fit into that pattern of thoughts each day? Do we remain foolish and ignorant?

Psalms 73:22 So foolish was I, and ignorant: I was as a beast before thee.
Psalms 73: 26-28 My flesh and my heart faileth: [but] God [is] the strength of my heart, and my portion for ever. For, lo, they that are far from thee shall perish: thou hast destroyed all them that go a whoring from thee.But [it is] good for me to draw near to God: I have put my trust in the Lord GOD, that I may declare all thy works.

Romans 10:3-4 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.For Christ [is] the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Romans 11:25-27 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this [is] my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

1 Corinthians 10:1-11 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ. But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted. Neither be ye idolaters, as [were] some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play. Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand.Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents. Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer. Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

1 Corinthians 14:38 But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.

One of the things that we gained when we received new life in Jesus Christ is an awakened spiritual nature. We came to know what God considers sin and what is righteous behavior. We are still learning this more and more as we walk with Him.

But until we leave this world our flesh still clings to us. We have a spiritual nature from God and a fleshly nature as an effect of the rebellion of Adam and Eve against God. That means that we have a "battle" going on in our minds between these two.

Rom 7:14-25

14 We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. 15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do — this I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.

21 So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22 For in my inner being I delight in God's law; 23 but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. 24 What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? 25 Thanks be to God — through Jesus Christ our Lord!
NIV

In these few lines, Paul explains why some of David's Psalms(and other parts of Scripture) confess failure to be perfectly following God's will while others speak about us being the very "righteousness of God".

Our failure is all in the realm of Sanctification(our growth in holiness in this life) and not in the realm of Justification(our having been saved by the blood of Christ).
God has declared us righteous/justified but is still working on our new life with conviction by His Spirit. The Spirit teaches us daily things we haven't learned. Thus God uses the word "ignorant" - we still don't know it all. We are "disciples". We are learning.

And as we study His Word and aim at righteous living, we grow. That we make mistakes in our lives or even backslide into former sins we see that we still need to learn how to use the spiritual weapons which God has given to us to fight the good fight of faith.

In summary: We now have two natures. With our renewed spirit we serve God... with our clinging flesh we show our ignorance of how to follow the new life in Christ completely.

Job 12:13
“But true wisdom and power are found in God;counsel and understanding are his.

Proverbs 2:2
Tune your ears to wisdom,and concentrate on understanding.

Proverbs 3:13
Joyful is the person who finds wisdom,the one who gains understanding.

Proverbs 14:6
A mocker seeks wisdom and never finds it,but knowledge comes easily to those with understanding.

Proverbs 14:33
Wisdom is enshrined in an understanding heart;wisdom is not found among fools.

Proverbs 19:8
To acquire wisdom is to love oneself;people who cherish understanding will prosper.

Proverbs 21:30
No human wisdom or understanding or plan can stand against the Lord.

It is the attitude of our hearts with which we seek wisdom and understanding that will determine if we remain ignorant or become wise.

Psalm 19:7
The instructions of the Lord are perfect,reviving the soul.The decrees of the Lord are trustworthy,making wise the simple.

Psalm 107:43
Those who are wise will take all this to heart;they will see in our history the faithful love of the Lord.

Proverbs 9:8
So don't bother correcting mockers; they will only hate you. But correct the wise, and they will love you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by revdrgade

One of the things that we gained when we received new life in Jesus Christ is an awakened spiritual nature. We came to know what God considers sin and what is righteous behavior. We are still learning this more and more as we walk with Him.

But until we leave this world our flesh still clings to us. We have a spiritual nature from God and a fleshly nature as an effect of the rebellion of Adam and Eve against God. That means that we have a "battle" going on in our minds between these two.


In summary: We now have two natures. With our renewed spirit we serve God....with our clinging flesh we show our ignorance of how to follow the new life in Christ completely.

---

I agree with you and the scripture you refer does definitely add an explanation for our daily paths and pattern of life which we take. And indeed Adam and Eve actions did set the path for man.

Genesis 3:17-19 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed [is] the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat [of] it all the days of thy life; Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou [art], and unto dust shalt thou return.

But I still go back to scripture in 1 Corinthians colored in teal below.The scripture tells us pretty much the same which you refer: But it also tells us as an example of what not to do, because God was displeased with them. And note did all drink of the same spiritual drink; for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them.

1 Corinthians 10:1-11 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ. But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted. Neither be ye idolaters, as [were] some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play. Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand.Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents. Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer. Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

All said and done we should see the light, and understand better today because of the examples that are in scripture for us to be advised and encouraged as it is written.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sndbay

ARE WE? The word ignorant is found 17 times in the Word of God. Are we foolish and ignorant as beast before Our Lord? What are the patterns of our thoughts each day? Where do those thoughts take us? How does the Word of God fit into that pattern of thoughts each day? Do we remain foolish and ignorant?

---

In a way, I'd have to say "yes":

As a result of original sin, human nature is weakened in its powers, subject to ignorance, suffering and the domination of death, and inclined to sin (this inclination is called "concupiscence").
CCC #418

... but we believe the victory that Christ won over sin has given us greater blessings than those which sin had taken from us: "where sin increased, grace abounded all the more" (Rom 5:20).

Peace be with you.

All said and done we should see the light, and understand better today because of the examples that are in scripture for us to be advised and encouraged as it is written.[/QUOTE]


Yes, we "should". But we sometimes have a difficulty in "seeing the light" with any real clarity. Or maybe I should say that we don't know how to take the examples of the past and put them into advantages practice of walking with God.

Our problem is an ignorance because of our still being imperfect. As even Paul said:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by revdrgade

Our problem is an ignorance because of our still being imperfect.

---

Why would anyone want to become perfect? And why would being imperfect be a problem?

:rolleyes:

·

1 Corinthians 10:1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by revdrgade

Yes, we "should". But we sometimes have a difficulty in "seeing the light" with any real clarity. Or maybe I should say that we don't know how to take the examples of the past and put them into advantages practice of walking with God. .

---

Proverbs 6:23 For the commandment [is] a lamp; and the law [is] light; and reproofs of instruction [are] the way of life:

God said: Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant. So with all the promises and love God gives us. And He gave us light because light is the law. The way in life.. If we don't see the light, that path became filled with excuse or allowance, which becomes the ownship of choice. Yet still an excuse.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by revdrgade

Our problem is an ignorance because of our still being imperfect. As even Paul said: .

---

No I don't think for a moment we can be perfect. And I don't believe God ever expects us to be perfect. So where should we go in our pattern of life? But to seek the Lord, and to thus to the light, and testimony.

Isaiah8:19-29 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? For the living to the dead? To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, [it is] because [there is] no light in them.

I would hope choice was each day is with the Lord. Otherwise the result is as Isaiah 8:19-20 speaks of being no light in them

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ScottRC

In a way, I'd have to say "yes":

As a result of original sin, human nature is weakened in its powers, subject to ignorance, suffering and the domination of death, and inclined to sin (this inclination is called "concupiscence").
CCC #418

...but we believe the victory that Christ won over sin has given us greater blessings than those which sin had taken from us: "where sin increased, grace abounded all the more" (Rom 5:20).

Peace be with you.

---

Thus once again an excuse or allowance given to a path taken. And in this excuse, are you thinking Christ will allow the same. For that is not so.

Lev 20:6 And the soul that turneth after such as have familiar spirits, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his people.

But rather God tells us be holy.

Lev 20:7 Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I [am] the LORD your God.

I agree that Christ won over in victory this is your scripture refer: Romans 5:20 Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound: Romans 2:21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

Yet again look at the verse just before Romans 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Then you can see it is still the path they have elected to take. They remain ignorant to Truth, and thus to the knowledge of the Word of God.

Psalms 73:22 So foolish was I, and ignorant: I was as a beast before thee.

Romans 10:3-4 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. For Christ [is] the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

This is not for us to worry about, because God will draw near to those that draw near to Him.
Hebrews 10:22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.


We need not judge the hearts of others. Christ is on the right hand of God.

Luke 14:27 And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple.
Matthew 10:38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by savedsinner7

It is the attitude of our hearts with which we seek wisdom and understanding that will determine if we remain ignorant or become wise.

---

Yes... And all the scriptures you offered shows this wisdom... A gift of wisdom and love.

Matthew 16:24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any [man] will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

Mark 8:34-35 And when he had called the people [unto him] with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. 35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.

Luke 9:23-24 And he said to [them] all, If any [man] will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: but whosoever will lose his life for my sake, the same shall save it.


Come after Me, deny yourself, take up the cross, follow... The ignorant will do as they please with excuse.

And I rejoice in that claim of Truth.. and tell you, he that is not of God heareth not .

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Revelation 19:13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

Deu 32:4 He is the Rock, his work [is] perfect: for all his ways [are] judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right [is] he.

Psalms 25:5 Lead me in thy truth, and teach me: for thou [art] the God of my salvation; on thee do I wait all the day.

1 John 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

1 John 5:6 This is he that came by water and blood, [even] Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sndbay

And I rejoice in that claim of Truth .. and tell you, he that is not of God heareth not .

---

And from me you may BELIEVE that !

:D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Credendovidis

And from me you may BELIEVE that !

:D

---

Don't be ignornant to the Truth, for God is a consuming fire.

There are 3 verses in scripture that speak of God as the consuming fire. Each time refer. God's anger being pushed by the ignorance of man.

The first Deu 9:3 is the tribe of Anakins which were known as the tribe of "Giants" those born of woman by the falling angels = sons of god.
Genesis 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare [children] to them, the same [became] mighty men which [were] of old, men of renown.

God was brought to show His anger upon them, and did away with those Anakins that were with the children of Israel.

Deu 9:3 Understand therefore this day, that the LORD thy God [is] he which goeth over before thee; [as] a consuming fire he shall destroy them, and he shall bring them down before thy face: so shalt thou drive them out, and destroy them quickly, as the LORD hath said unto thee.
Jos 11:22 There was none of the Anakims left in the land of the children of Israel: only in Gaza, in Gath, and in Ashdod, there remained.

2. The second time again God finds evil being done, and He again is refer as the consuming fire in Due 4:24

Deu 4:24 For the LORD thy God is a consuming fire, even a jealous God.
Deu 4:25 When thou shalt beget children, and children's children, and ye shall have remained long in the land, and shall corrupt [yourselves], and make a graven image, [or] the likeness of any [thing], and shall do evil in the sight of the LORD thy God, to provoke him to anger:

3. The third time is a warning us not to anger God, but to serve Him with love, as He love us.

Hebrews 12:28 Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:
Hebrews 12:29 For our God is a consuming fire.

So heed the warning, God is a consuming fire, to Him give all glory and honor.

Revelation 14:7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.


Christ is our Saviour

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sndbay

Don't be ignornant to the Truth, for God is a consuming fire.

---

You BELIEVE that !

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sndbay

Christ is our Saviour

---

You BELIEVE that !

:rolleyes:

·

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Credendovidis

You BELIEVE that !


You BELIEVE that !

:rolleyes:

·

---

Let the heavens be glad, and let the earth rejoice: and let men say among the nations, The LORD reigneth.


O give thanks unto the LORD; for he is good; for his mercy endureth for ever.

YES I BELIEVE!!!

Let me explain this clearly with example.. What I pointed out was the description of what shoes could be put on. One will give you blisters, and one will give you comfort..

It is you who puts your own shoes on...

Have a good walk today.

Post #13 Points to the shoes a person puts on for his or her walk in life

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sndbay

Then you can see it is still the path they have elected to take. They remain ignorant to Truth, and thus to the knowledge of the Word of God.

Psalms 73:22 So foolish was I, and ignorant: I was as a beast before thee.

Romans 10:3-4 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. For Christ [is] the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

This is not for us to worry about, because God will draw near to those that draw near to Him.

Hebrews 10:22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.


We need not judge the hearts of others. Christ is on the right hand of God.

Luke 14:27 And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple.
Matthew 10:38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.

---

Post #11 Wisdom is found in these scriptures

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sndbay

Thus once again an excuse or allowance given to a path taken. And in this excuse, are you thinking Christ will allow the same. For that is not so.

Lev 20:6 And the soul that turneth after such as have familiar spirits, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his people.

But rather God tells us be holy.

Lev 20:7 Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I [am] the LORD your God.

I agree that Christ won over in victory this is your scripture refer: Romans 5:20 Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound: Romans 2:21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

Yet again look at the verse just before Romans 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

---

Wisdom in understanding the guidance God's Word does offer His children.

Err yes indeed we ALL are.