Here I am again with another question for you parents. Particularly ones who have kids that are about to enter college. What if the child does something wrong and you punish them and it teaches them nothing but to be more careful not to get caught? Ill give an example: My best friends sister is now 20 but when she was a 18 yr old senior graduating in a few weeks she wanted to attend a concert on a school night. Her dad said no because it was on a school night. Well she lied to him and told him she was going to a friends house but she was really attending the concert.

Well yadda yadda yadda she got caught and her dad grounded her for the rest of the summer.Well when he first caught her he called my best friend(she was senior I college at the time) and asked her what she and I thought. We both said the same thing that she has to learn to be responsible for herself because this time next yr shell be on her own in college and decide for her self is it is the best idea going out on a school night knowing you have to be up in the morning(of course if she was smart shed schedule her classes late so she won't have to get up so early lol).

He said he felt that the punishment was justified (why did he call us and ask our opinon then I wonderlol) and he wanted to teach her right from wrong. My best friend said he was asting his time because she won't learn anything except how not to get caught and it really won't matter because that nxt yr shell be on her own and he won't know what shell be doing.

Well since then my best friend and I have asked her about that concert and was it worth getting grounded for. She is now 20 and she still says yes and she thought her dad overreacted. She says the first day she got to college she skipped class and went to a concert and she still made all A's that semester.

I personally just would have let the natural consequences get her (you know having to wake up early the next morning).

My question is this : What if the punishment you lay out no matter how harsh teaches the child to just be sneakier about what they do ?(I know that's what some of my punishments taught me lol) What if the child doesn't learn the "great life lesson". What d you do then.

Now I'm not talking about serious stuff like drinking and driving or having sex too young I'm talking about little teenage things like : going out on a school night , Staying out all night , wearing too much makeup etc

Like I said I'm not a parent I don't know but just something I'm curious about.

By 17 or 18 kids are either going to do as told or they are not, and even the ones that sometimes don't, it is always their choice, By that age there is nothing that is going to do a lot to change their choices. At that age, letting them know how disapointed you are but of course you do need to have your punishments which is to show them that every action has a result.

What about in this case the natural consequence of having to get up at 8 am the next day? Wouldn't that be punishment enough

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Originally Posted by TwinkletOes26

a 18 yr old senior graduating in a few weeks she wanted to attend a concert on a school night.

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I believe she was old enough to realize the impact on her life if she went to the concert.

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Her dad said no because it was on a school night. Well she lied to him and told him she was going to a friends house but she was really attending the concert. Well yadda yadda yadda she got caught and her dad grounded her for the rest of the summer.

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His punishment was extreme to the max and totally inappropriate for the offense. No wonder she disobeyed him, if that's how he disciplines!

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I personally just would have let the natural consequences get her (you know having to wake up early the next morning).

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I agree.

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My question is this : What if the punishment you lay out no matter how harsh teaches the child to just be sneakier about what they do ?(I know that's what some of my punishments taught me lol) What if the child doesn't learn the "great life lesson". What d you do then.

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Then it's time the parent learns a lesson or two about how to discipline. Discipline is about teaching a child, not about punishing him. The parent, not the child, has missed the boat if the child hasn't learned anything from "discipline."

Yes punishment has to meet the event, I loved walking them up at 6 am and helping to drive fence posts. Esp if they were drinking the night before,

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Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck

Yes punishment has to meet the event, I loved walking them up at 6 am and helping to drive fence posts. Esp if they were drinking the night before,

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This is why I waited until I was in college to drink and do all the partying stuff... my mom knew and still knows nothing about it lol

I wouldn't have grounded her, I would've grounded me. I would've called "time" on giving her anything for several months... no rides, no advice, no jokes, no real "concern" at all about what she did or how. That would've worked for us because my daughters and I had a pretty fun relationship, so that would've hit home at the time.

You're right, punishment at 17, end of senior year, that's basically pointless.

But I don't think influencing is out of the realm of possibility, it's just supposed to be more conversational by the time they're that age. "Grounding" suggests a control and a long-term ability to try out the new lessons that don't usually exist with graduated teenagers.

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Originally Posted by JBeaucaire

I wouldn't have grounded her, I would've grounded me. I would've called "time" on giving her anything for several months... no rides, no advice, no jokes, no real "concern" at all about what she did or how. That would've worked for us because my daughters and I had a pretty fun relationship, so that would've hit home at the time.

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Wow now that's harsh as well... that sounds like "if you dont do what i want you too im taking my love away" wow... it was just a concert lol I could see if the kid was stalin or hitler lol in the words of my best friend "damn thats cold as ice"

Unfortunately that does happen all too often with teens. They just get sneakier.
My younger daughter was like that sneaking out to clubs at 1 am after she had gone to bed then sneaking back home from school at 9 am after I left for work.

I was watching one of the daytime TV talk shows a few years ago and they had a kid on that said he always snuck out and he didn't care how much his mother punished him because his time sneaking out was well worth a month of being grounded in his room with no TV or video games.
I think that is the attitude of a lot of kids any more.

Many kids seem to only learn the hard way.

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Originally Posted by TwinkletOes26

that sounds like "if you dont do what i want you too im taking my love away" wow ...it was just a concert lol i could see if the kid was stalin or hitler lol in the words of my best friend "damn thats cold as ice"

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Well, not really, but I see how you read it that way. My kids would NEVER read anything I do as withholding love. But "timeout" is timeout. It means something is on hold. For little kids, timeout means their freedom is restricted... for young teens perhaps some luxuries are restricted. In my example, the "extras" I give are restricted because at that age, it's the only thing that would have any effect on my grown children. And I doubt I could havr kept that up as long as I suggested, I was trying to stay with the OPs "summer" punishment.

But to be perfectly honest, I doubt I would ever have gotten into this situation at all. (I know, maybe I'm naive) When my kids were that age we ALWAYS started with a "yes" for pretty much anything they wanted to do and then tried to support the "yes". Too many parents start with "no" and the kids have to try and turn it into a "yes". At 13 that makes sense. At 17-18 graduating, independence/accountability is what we're trying emphasize, so we would've started with "yes" and then made sure we solved all the issues needed to keep it "yes".

Does that make sense?

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My younger daughter was like that sneaking out to clubs at 1 am after she had gone to bed then sneaking back home from school at 9 am after I left for work.

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How old was she when she was doing this? If she was underage what clubs did she go to most won't let you in unless you are at least 18? I find that the worst thing about the club is the guys that drool all over you lol you almost need to drink to get through the night of gross guys.

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I was watching one of the daytime TV talk shows a few years ago and they had a kid on that said he always snuck out and he didn't care how much his mother punished him because his time sneaking out was well worth a month of being grounded in his room with no TV or video games.
I think that is the attitude of a lot of kids any more.

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Most I know just keep thinking soon ill be 18 and can do what I want.

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But to be perfectly honest, I doubt I would ever have gotten into this situation at all. (I know, maybe I'm naive) When my kids were that age we ALWAYS started with a "yes" for pretty much anything they wanted to do and then tried to support the "yes". Too many parents start with "no" and the kids have to try and turn it into a "yes". At 13 that makes sense. At 17-18 graduating, independence/accountability is what we're trying emphasize, so we would've started with "yes" and then made sure we solved all the issues needed to keep it "yes".

Does that make sense?

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Yes... but in order for your punishement to work (no rides,no advice) you have to have a GREAT relationship with your kids (sounds like you do) for it to have any effect. I know if my mama stopped giving me advice (especially about "white people") that wouldn't have been a punishment it wuld have been a vacation :p

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Originally Posted by TwinkletOes26

how old was she when she was doing this? If she was underage what clubs did she go to most wont let you in unless you are at least 18? I find that the worst thing about the club is the guys that drool all over you lol you almost need to drink to get through the night of gross guys.

Most i know just keep thinking soon ill be 18 and can do what i want.

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She was 15 and was going mostly to teen age clubs. I think a couple times after she was 18 she had a fake ID


When I was a kid I had to keep telling myself I'll soon be 21 and can do what I want but my mom had a control over me until I was 24.

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When I was a kid I had to keep telling myself I'll soon be 21 and can do what I want but my mom had a control over me until I was 24.

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I'm 26 and my mama is STILL controlling me (if only I could find a job and an apt still looking) She that when I have a kid ill be the same way. I woould hope that when my kid is 26 ill be like "ok youre grown have at it" by then id be too tired of parenting to parent my 21 22 23 etc kid after that its pointless and just makes your children resentful and when they do finally get away they won't come visit you often.

Most of it is because especially for us girls we have to go to college to get good jobs and who foots the bill most likely your parents and because of this they just fell they need to treat you like you are still in hs... if I could have gotten a good job at 18 I would have moved out a LONG time ago.

Warning to parents when you act like a control freak when they do get away they are going to do the opposite of what you said not to do I know I did (all in one night I had sex with my ex fiancé,drank alcohol,tried pot,went to a party where I got the alcohol and pot,and wore a low cut top and heels). The trick is the more you harp on something telling your child you can't do that or its wrong the more they want to do it. Don't want your kids to drink a lot ? Then don't act like alcohol is THAT big of a deal.

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Originally Posted by TwinkletOes26

Here i am again with another question for you parents. Particularly ones who have kids that are about to enter college. What if the child does something wrong and you punish them and it teaches them nothing but to be more careful not to get caught? Ill give an example: My best friends sister is now 20 but when she was a 18 yr old senior graduating in a few weeks she wanted to attend a concert on a school night. Her dad said no bc it was on a school night. Well she lied to him and told him she was going to a friends house but she was really attending the concert.

Well yadda yadda yadda she got caught and her dad grounded her for the rest of the summer.Well when he first caught her he called my best friend(she was senior i college at the time) and asked her what she and I thought. We both said the same thing that she has to learn to be responsible for herself bc this time next yr shell be on her own in college and decide for her self is it is the best idea going out on a school night knowing you have to be up in the morning(of course if she was smart shed schedule her classes late so she wont have to get up so early lol).

He said he felt that the punishment was justified (why did he call us and ask our opinon then i wonderlol) and he wanted to teach her right from wrong. My best friend said he was asting his time bc she wont learn anything except how not to get caught and it really wont matter bc that nxt yr shell be on her own and he wont know what shell be doing.

Well since then my best friend and I have asked her about that concert and was it worth getting grounded for. She is now 20 and she still says yes and she thought her dad overreacted. she says the first day she got to college she skipped class and went to a concert and she still made all A's that semester.

I personally just would have let the natural consequences get her (you know having to wake up early the next morning).

My question is this : What if the punishment you lay out no matter how harsh teaches the child to just be sneakier about what they do ?(i know thats what some of my punishments taught me lol) What if the child doesnt learn the "great life lesson". What d you do then.

Now im not talking about serious stuff like drinkin and driving or having sex too young im talking about little teenage things like : going out on a school night , Staying out all night , wearing too much makeup ect

Like i said im not a parent i dont know but just something im curious about.

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Children that age need time to their own give then some time and let them do what they want , then when its been going on for too long tell them "you've had enough nights to do what you want , sit in with me and we'll watch a movie or something " and they might just thank you one day trust me it works with my 17-year-old daughter!