The Lamb. Mount Zion. 144,000. I am curious to know what this scripture means to other God fearing people. :)
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The Lamb. Mount Zion. 144,000. I am curious to know what this scripture means to other God fearing people. :)
What does it mean to someone who is not afraid of God?
14:1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moparbyfar
I personally think that these are the very few whom at the end are actual true followers of Christ. Not meaning that others are bad, I just think that these must be the ones who chose to not have another life OTHER than Christ. I am not an expert though, just my opinion.
Fear of God is a positive thing not negative - to have awe and reverence for the creator and a wholesome dread of displeasing Him. This does not mean we should be afraid of Him. Rather it brings us happiness. (Psa 112:1)Quote:
Originally Posted by simoneaugie
I thought the question was what does the scripture mean to other people? What does whether they fear God have to do with the scripture?Quote:
Originally Posted by simoneaugie
The context is self-explainatory. These are young men from Israel who are selected for a specific position, that of being the entourage of Jesus Christ.
How about the theory that 144,000.00 is a direct connection to a " holy" number of 12
12 apostles. 12tribes etc. I do not think it is meant to be taken literally but rather as a number of completeness. Just a thought.
Yes, in the bible there are number meanings, for completion, holy and others, just like in the area where we are to forgive 7 times 7, which means forever not 49 ( my math teacher wouldhave issues)
It has been considered the idea of perfection, or completion.
If the number is to be taken symbolically, what is the significance of Rev 7:9 which speaks of a crowd which no man was able to number right after John hears that the number is 144,000? Surely this must be two different groups. What do you think?
What a beautfiul passage. I just think it represents all of us who have the love for Our Heavenly Father in their hearts.
I don't fear God though. I do fear hurting him, I fear doing wrong by him, disappointing him and I fear that my sins keep me from him, put distance between He and I, but I don't fear him.
Does that make sense?
Yes as I said in an earlier post, fearing God is a POSITIVE thing. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Allheart
So which group do you think represents all of us? The 144,000 or the peoples from nations and tribes etc which no man was able to number? Surely they can't be one and the same.
144,000 they are Jewish
12,000 from the tribe of Judah,
12,000 from the tribe of Reuben,
12,000 from the tribe of Gad,
12,000 from the tribe of Asher,
12,000 from the tribe of Naphtali,
12,000 from the tribe of Manasseh,
12,000 from the tribe of Simeon,
12,000 from the tribe of Levi,
12,000 from the tribe of Issachar,
12,000 from the tribe of Zebulun,
12,000 from the tribe of Joseph,
12,000 from the tribe of Benjamin
Everybody else that 'fears God' the whosoevers that believe (or however you want to word it) are the peoples from nations and tribes etc which no man was able to number.
Daily Bible Study - The 144,000
No, but now I know why.Quote:
Originally Posted by Allheart
Psalms 110
10 The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. A good understanding to all that do it: his praise continueth for ever and ever.
Just kidding. ;)
Crykee, that's a good question mate!Quote:
Originally Posted by Moparbyfar
Apocalypse 14
1 And I beheld, and lo a lamb stood upon mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty-four thousand, having his name, and the name of his Father, written on their foreheads.
The Scriptures kind of tell us who the people are:
The Lamb is Jesus:
John 1
36 And beholding Jesus walking, he saith: Behold the Lamb of God.
The 144,000 are... :
... Men,
4 These are they who were not defiled with women:
... virgins
For they are virgins.
... Christians
These follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth.
If we move to chapter 7, we see that they are of Jewish stock:
4 And I heard the number of them that were signed, an hundred forty-four thousand were signed, of every tribe of the children of Israel.
Mount Zion, I believe, represents Jerusalem:
2 Kings 5
7 But David took the castle of Sion, the same is the city of David.
And therefore the land of Judah:
Isaias 26
1 In that day shall this canticle be sung the land of Juda. Sion the city of our strength a saviour, a wall and a bulwark shall be set therein.
And Israel:
Psalms 13
7 Who shall give out of Sion the salvation of Israel? When the Lord shall have turned away the captivity of his people, Jacob shall rejoice and Israel shall be glad.
So, this verse seems to signify what Jesus taught. That salvation comes from the Jews.
John 4
22 You adore that which you know not: we adore that which we know; for salvation is of the Jews.
Sincerely,
De Maria
As far as I can see from God's Word, He rejected the fleshly nation of Israel in favour of a new spiritual Israel.
Matt 21:43 "That is why I say to YOU, the kingdom of God will be taken from YOU and be given to a nation producing its fruits."
1 Pet 2:10 "For YOU were once not a people, but are now God's people, YOU were once not shown mercy, but are now shown mercy."
Heb 8:7-13 I can't be bothered typing out the full comment, but it basically shows that fleshly Israel would no longer exist "he has made the former one (covenant) obsolete."
This is why I strongly believe that this number is literal , and aren't there are well over 144,000 Jews on earth today?
I believe too that being "virgins" holds a symbolic meaning because Christians were never commanded to remain virgins but if they were to marry to have only one wife (1 Tim 3:2)
And that some would fall away from God and pay attention to misleading teachings, forbidding marriages etc (1 Tim 4:1,3). Rather they have not defiled themselves with false relgion or politics etc of the world but have proved themselves faithfuland clean to the Lamb.
The great crowd that John saw must be those who remain on the earth as Jesus and his associates (144,000) rule over them in heaven.
Prov 2:21,22 "For the upright are the ones that will reside in the earth, and the blameless are the ones that will be left over in it."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moparbyfar
The 144,000 are certain specific Jewish from the specific tribes. That does not mean other Jewish will not be in heaven.
Christians were never commanded to remain virgins but through the centuries many have.
Absolutely! Maybe I should have added emphasis to 1 Tim 3:2 where it said "IF they were to marry."Quote:
Originally Posted by N0help4u
The statement by John in Rev that they did not defile themselves with WOMEN also tells me it is a symbolic sense as many 'chosen' are in fact women. (Maybe other versions says different).
That is interesting considering bible does say " The fear of the Lord is the beginning of Wisdom". Interesting that you are scared of hurting himbut you do not fear him. What is the difference to you?
I am always afriad of hurting someone I love, but I do not fear them.Quote:
Originally Posted by razor96
I know the Father loves me, but I fear being without that love.
Does that make any sense?
144,OOO are from the tribes of Israel and the other God Fearing People is in Revelation 7:9 It Says "After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds and people, and tounges, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;"
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