Hello Christians:

Let's get to it. Pretty soon, we'll be able to design our children. I know you Christians think we shouldn't do that. But we ARE going to do that, and I want to know how you're going to stop it.

excon

Just as a related note: I'm currently reading Michael Crichton's "Next" which is all about genetic modification. Good read.

I am not going to stop it - people want to play God, I am not stopping them. Since I am not as intelligent as God, I could only mess it up worse, not make it better. I think gene modification has been done in the past, is done in the present, and will continue.

But what gene modifiers are going to be looked at? Genes that identify Trisomy 21? ADHD? Fetal Alcohol Syndrome? Epilepsy? Homosexuality? Where will it stop? So build the Uber Race.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by shygrneyzs

Where will it stop?

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Hello again, shy:

Or will it stop at all? It could be the end of us. Actually, I think it WILL be the end of us. Trouble is, I don't know what's going to be starting.

excon

You got something there with that idea, excon - it may never stop and who is going to be in charge of all that? The New World Order? Which brings up a totally different kettle of fish.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by shygrneyzs

who is going to be in charge of all that?

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Hello again, shy:

Well, I hope it's me, because I know exactly how to design a perfect human. The problem is, we ALL think we know what a perfect human is.

How are we going to control who does that? How are we going to control it at all? Should it BE controlled? Cause once we create the perfect race, THEY'LL be the ones in control.

It's actually, kind of scary. I think I'll read what Crichton has to say.

excon

NK - Next is great loved that book! Some of the sidenotes like the GFP glowing bunny are real!

I always wonder if genetic modification 'designer babies' actually did become feasible would people eventually separate off into the modified and the non modified. Would non modified humans become a sub race along the lines of Huxley's Brave New world?

I am against the idea of changing people to be 'enhanced' but is there as much of a moral dilemma in preventing carriers of horrendous genetic diseases form passing them on? My bet is this will most probably be the first steps into this territory. Suppose you just 'fixed' a genetic coding error in an egg or sperm before implantation and prevented a lifetime of suffering for that child?

I know some religious scientists who argue that God has allowed us to discover these techniques in order to use them.

I don't know how religious people/ anyone opposed to these techniques can stop it. They can drive it underground into dodgy countries and institutions but they cannot prevent everyone from trying it. This already happens with some types of embryo and stem cell research.

Hi Excon,
Firstly, in most countries genetic modification of humans is still illegal.
Secondly, even if it weren't it wouldn't be something that would be used to make a super race, it would be used to remove certain mutations in DNA that cause lifelong afflictions.
Third, even IF it became possible to make designer babies, these would only be available to the extraordinarily rich, and couldn't feasibly become a mainstream practice.
Fourth, and here's the clincher... if you're against genetic modification and believe it to be immoral and a sin against God, don't have it done to your kid. As a Christian, you shouldn't be trying to prevent people from doing this. If you believe it's a sin, let God do the punishing. By removing people's choice, you're not going to make them all righteous and good, they will simply be being obedient... and not necessarily to God.
That being said, I'm not a huge fan of GM.

Hello Kal:

1) That never stopped anybody.

2) Ohhhh, yes it will.

3) That's a problem too.

4) I'm not against it for good. It's just that I don't know how to decide what's "good".

5) Christians are going to stand by while the rest of the world is making a superior race?? I don't think they will. You might, and good for you with your hands off policy. But, your church ain't going to stand for it. And, I don't know that your church would be wrong for trying to stop it, either.

excon

Hi excon,

1) If it being illegal isn't enough to stop people, I don't know how you possibly plan to prevent it in other ways
2) You need to have more faith in people. :P
3) Maybe still a problem, but it won't be quite like it is in Brave New World or Gattaca where the majority of humanity is flawless and the natural born children are regarded as an inferior species. Whatever modifications are made won't stop people from being people.
4) Nobody can really say what's "good". Do what you believe to be right and express your opinion to others if you wish, but other people will still make their own choices and have to live with the consequences.
5) I just don't see this as an immediate concern. Get back to me in 20 years if this fear becomes a reality, but personally I don't believe a superhuman race is about to be created.

Kal

Genetic modification, like pharmaceuticals is linked to power and money. When those who have the money start seriously getting involved in genetics, there will be more societal problems/complexities that the Christians will attempt to control, with money, and scare tactics. In other words the same old stuff will simply continue. If it is ever to get better, some of us will have to break away from old dogma and address the real issue. Human's repeatedly treat each other like God or like $hit based on power and money.

excon,
Are you sure the gene modification techniques are not creating more problems than solutions?

You have a very valid question, FB - personally I cannot see how gene modification would make the world a better place. Too many variables and who gets to decide what genes are going to be modified and how? In utero?

Exactly Shy,
What does an elimination of a certain gene in a human mean to the other existing genes,will it not confuse the whole system and maybe short circuit ?

My thoughts too, FB.

Hello again:

I'm not saying it's a good thing. I'm just saying we're going to do it. I'm also not saying it's a bad thing.

excon

Do you have a test group ready, excon? Or is this a volunteer project? Any money involved in this? A sign-up sheet? Lol

Hello again, shy:

Nahhh. They don't have a gene for what I got, and nobody wants the genes I have. I'm just asking to see if I can stir up some stuff.

excon

Since you are looking to stir stuff up Excon, I will oblige. Even though I am not a Christian we can still have a good verbal spat if you want, or just wreak havoc on this thread together.

I am eagerly looking forward to the day that gene modification is available to everyone (as templelane pointed out) as Aldous Huxley expected would happen in his Brave New World. That idea has stuck with me since I read that book as a teen.
I have always wanted me a baby I can design meeself. I would make it the ugliest thing known to the human race. Boy, I could make lotsa money off it without lifting a finger. Hollywood would be calling to cast it in movies. I can rent it out to circuses as a side show phenom. We will write a bestselling book about life as the ugliest human that ever existed. When the novelty finally wears off and no one is a callin' anymore, I will have a child that won't ever leave me because it would be too ugly for anyone to give a job to, therefore it would be destined to take care of me in my old age. Now, if I only had some viable eggs lying around, we'd be cookin' I tell you. Can I get in as a test subject now? My bio clock is a tickin' and the eggs are already close to be being not just hard boiled, but rubbery.

Oh Ruby - you are priceless! I want to sign up too as a test subject, but only for the money. As if any of my genes are viable. Lol.