But don't feed the haters with the middle name thing please.

The respect is mutual. :)

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Originally Posted by 450donn

Well, maybe not after forty years of a failed liberal education system.

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Hello donn:

Sooo, I gather you think we'd be MORE educated if we threw out the LIBERAL idea of teaching of evolution, and taught creationism instead. Then we'd REALLY be competitive with the rest of the world in science, huh?

Donn, if that's what you think, you should NEVER speak the Pledge Of Allegiance again, whether your hand is over your heart or NOT. Because that kind of thinking is a BOOST for our enemies. Maybe you should pledge your allegiance to THEM. It has NOTHING to do with making US better.

excon

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Originally Posted by NeedKarma

But don't feed the haters with the middle name thing please.

The respect is mutual. :)

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Sorry, just a cultural social thingy with me... :p

Lots of good discussion here, many good points.

All I can say is that IF Obama is able to do HALF of what he wants to, we will find out why gun stores are selling out nationwide.

The reason we have the right to bear arms, is because the founders of this great nation could foresee that as time passes, and the people become comfortable, and pay less attention to what is going on with our government, that there would exist the strong probability that at some point in time, we would once again, have to take America back from a government gone out of control.

Sit back and watch.

As our economy crumbles with our new presidents plans to socialize our nation and redistribute the wealth, as the market continues to crash, as more and more jobs are lost to the punishment of success, there WILL be another American Revolution.

Remember, 46% of the citizens that voted, did not want this country to go down the path Obama has planned for all of us.

The only chance we have is that there are enough GOOD advisers to convince him to change some of his socialistic plans before it's too late.

"Fear the government, that fears YOUR guns"

Prog,
It's kind of funny that you are saying the same thing that 50% of the people were saying during the Bush administration. I guess the USA will never be happy.

J-9 - I have seen the quotes that are attributed to the Book of Revelations without references to their chapter and verse. I was unable to find these quotes anywhere in my Bible. Can you please give me the quotes with their chapter and verse?

Perhaps you are talking about different quotes than the ones I have had sent to me through mass emails. But the ones sent to me were made up quotes. It so hard for me to fathom people stooping to the level of fabricating Biblical verses to promote fear and hate.

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Originally Posted by jjwoodhull

J-9 - I have seen the quotes that are attributed to the Book of Revelations without references to their chapter and verse. I was unable to find these quotes anywhere in my Bible. Can you please give me the quotes with their chapter and verse?

Perhaps you are talking about different quotes than the ones I have had sent to me through mass emails. But the ones sent to me were made up quotes. It so hard for me to fathom people stooping to the level of fabricating Biblical verses to promote fear and hate.

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I would love to after a little sleep. Been up since 2 yesterday and have to be back up at 2 today to work until 7 am tomorrow. But the second I get a breath I will find these chapters and verses for you.

I would appreciate that. Sleep tight.

I think we are forgetting the separation of CHURCH AND STATE. Stop trying to enforce Christian morality on everyone, because not everyone is a Christian.

Also, if you all want abortion banned so much, you'd better be willing to support safe haven drop offs at EVERY hospital in EVERY state, and be prepared to foot the bill for these children to go to orphanages until they are adopted, because if you force these mothers to have kids they don't want, it almost always leads to some sort of abuse. We don't need anymore thugs and human trash on the streets, and an abusive upbringing often leads to that.

I'd rather a few babies aborted, than worry about some thug bullying me or threatening my family on the street.

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Originally Posted by High Max

I'd rather a few babies aborted, than worry about some thug bullying me or threatening my family on the street.

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I personally believe no person should have to die to convenience another. But that's another debate.

If it were "a few babies" I might be able to swallow the unfairness of it and be OK, but in the US alone, it's a MILLION babies per year. I hope you stop and wrap your head around that. It's another holocaust, and it's killing our national spirit.

You're right, this is a morality issue. But I disagree it's a Christian, one. I don't always need a deity to point out to me when something is wrong. Abortion of a few a babies would be a tragedy, but the 1,000,000 in the US alone each year... that's the stuff of monster movies.

Abortion is fundamentally the ending of a human life without its permission. That's what IT IS. In every other instance in our country that's called murder... you can't even do that to evil murdering rapist pedophiles without decades of legal hoop-hopping.

If you try to apply the abuse / trash argument to a person who's standing in the room, it doesn't fly.

"Your honor, I can't keep from abusing my infant kids, I think it best if we just end their lives."
"He's a criminal, we can just kill him."
"They're orphans, let's euthanize them to save money."

None of that is acceptable, right?

Women's rights... check.
Black rights... check.
Children's rights... nah... only if it's convenient.

We can't even get half our country to acknowledge how conveniently they change their value system on this one issue in ways they won't do in others. They won't even admit it.

So I say again, this issue is killing our national spirit, our "moral" center is eroded to the point of irrelevancy. If it doesn't change, we won't have to wait forever, the universe won't tolerate it. Every major culture that fell from within started with moral degradation. We got that in spades, so the handwriting is on the wall if we don't wake up.

The value of any society can be measured SOLELY on how they treat the most defenseless of their people. An unborn child is the most defenseless of all. Judge that.

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Originally Posted by JBeaucaire

Women's rights....check.
Black rights......check.
Children's rights......nah....only if it's convenient.

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There are children's rights indeed, my wife works in that legal realm occasionally. But a blastula is obviously not a child and that's what you are referring to. That's a whole other debate.

Words are funny things aren't they? We can coin them anytime and give them any meaning we want.

A child isn't a man. Or is it?
An infant isn't a man. Or is it?
A fetus isn't a man. Or is it?

I know, as thinking creatures we have no choice but to make decisions and draw lines in the sand. It's part of our responsibility.

But 1,000,000... per YEAR. Something's wrong here.

Like I said, ban abortion. But repubs can foot the bill for safe haven drop offs for all parents who didn't want the child.

JBeaucaire I have to totally agree with you on this if the government lined up 1 million of our citizens and murdered them a year people would be outraged. Wait didn't that happen starting in 1939 in Germany! As for the bill for those children HighMax? How about instead of giving more welfare to lazy people we give the money to educate them and teach them how to work instead of spitting out more welfare babies. The failed bailout package could have more than paid for those children. One last thought, How many babies have been murdered since Rowe V Wade? If RVW had not happened how many more working citizens would we have to support the baby boomers that are retiring now? Think we would have a financial crisis on our hands with 5 million more working people in this country?

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Originally Posted by JBeaucaire

I personally believe no person should have to die to convenience another. But that's another debate.

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What happened to that thought?

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Originally Posted by asking

What happened to that thought?

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I know... I'm sorry. Hijack over. Sorry. ((*ashamed*))

Start a new thread, This one is old and boring now LOL

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Originally Posted by 450donn

JBeaucaire I have to totally agree with you on this if the government lined up 1 million of our citizens and murdered them a year people would be outraged. Wait didn't that happen starting in 1939 in Germany! As for the bill for those children HighMax? How about instead of giving more welfare to lazy people we give the money to educate them and teach them how to work instead of spitting out more welfare babies. The failed bailout package could have more than paid for those children. One last thought, How many babies have been murdered since Rowe V Wade? If RVW had not happened how many more working citizens would we have to support the baby boomers that are retiring now? Think we would have a financial crisis on our hands with 5 million more working people in this country?

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You are right on target, only the figure would be far more than 5 million. Probably at least 25 million if you concede that some of the 40 million plus would not yet be of working age.

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Originally Posted by 450donn

So sad that a man that the people have elected as president of the United States, refuses to say the pledge of Allegence. Has associated himself with known terrorists, has refused to release any personal information, went to church under a pastor that preached hatred and bigotry, has as his platform socialism through and through, will increase welfare payments to millions of people who do not pay taxes, will spend this country into a depression that we will unlikely get out of for many many years, will run from our enemies at the drop of a hat, has NO experience in either foreign or domestic policy. I could go on and on, but choose instead to finish with this. Look at the stock market. Down 355 points so far. America will under Obama become the next third world country in the very near future.
The most capable candidate of them all was Palin. She has managed government, she has been commander in chief of the Alaska National Guard which is the first line of missle defense from the North. She has managed and made good decisions for the people of her state. Cannot say the same for Biden/obama or McCain.

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My "agree" should have been a "disagree." (Obviously I don't give many disagrees.) You are so very wrong on everything you mention.

I honestly hope that he does an amazing job in his term, just to smear it in the right's face until the day I die. Their unbridled arrogance is really irritating.