I have a definitive answer: My water heater imploded. Thanks to all of you for help, it is much appreciated.
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I have a definitive answer: My water heater imploded. Thanks to all of you for help, it is much appreciated.
To say nothing of the accompanying floor show. In all my years I've never heard of a heater imploding. Must have been a hellish vacuum in the pipes.Quote:
Originally Posted by ipcfarm
I think it was ipcfarms patience that imploded.
It is commonly known that shutting the inlet off with cold water in the tank and leaving the gas on will at least activate the safety pressure relief valve if not worse unless you open a hot water tap. If you shut the inlet and gas off on a warm tank, The water is going to contract. Again, something is going to give. Somehow, the volume is going to be reduced. Guess the safest thing is an expansion tank and no valve between.
If you have a blocked vent, a new tank won't fix it. My neighbor once kicked a football down my chimney. Fortunately it found its way to a fireplace not in use at the time.
I have never heard of one imploding either. Apparently everyone else has, including the manufacturer, the city water department, and both plumbers who came out. The 1st plumber who came out said he had only seen 3 in over 40 years.
A water heater gas valve no mater what the age can malfunction and one of those malfunctions is the valve does not close completely and leaves a small flame burning down at the orifice of the burner therefore it does not collect any air with the gas and so it creates lots of soot and this soot will build up on the underside of the burner clogging the ports of the burner. When this happens and it is time for the heater to heat again the valve opens sending gas out of the orifice but it has nowhere to go. It hits the bottom of the burner and creates a wild fire down in the combustion area of the heater, after a few firings like this and you have incomplete combustion and therefore it will be causing carbon monoxide gas. Spend the $100, get it checked and possibly save a life.
I would have to agree this is a potentially dangerous situation, that should be tested properly. Combustion air, manifold pressure line pressure, exhaust. I don't think that unless you have the experience, and the equipment that you should be dealing with flame roll out etc. A thermocouple is one thing, this is another
It's called thermal expansion.
I hope I can find someone QUALIFIED to do the job.
http://www.hotwater.com/bulletin/bulletin45.pdf
http://www.hotwater.com/bulletin/bulletin41.pdf
http://www.bradfordwhite.com/service...liefvalves.asp
I have to apologize to you. I thought about warning you about the danger of closing the inlet valve, but didn't. Too bad those shrieking about CO didn't think to either. Some still seem to be beating a dead horse. Even if you called a professional, the thing may have still imploded before he got there.
Problems from expansion are more common, but as you found out, water contracts too. In the past, water could cycle in and out of a hot water tank with the temperature with no problem, going back the supply line either to the city main, or the pressure tank in a well system. There can be problems with water returning to public water systems. The back flow preventers fix that problem, but create a new one with the hot water heater. The best solution is an expansion tank just before the water heater. And as your reference points out, some other devices can cause the problem too. Shutting off the inlet adds the problem of contracting.
Too bad none of us thought to warn you. In the other thread, Northern Heat may have been on to something about the blocked inlet. Of course, the screened air intakes are screened just to prevent flames from coming out through them.
Replacing a water heater isn't much of a job. Even adding an expansion tank if you need one and putting it up on a stand if in a garage isn't that much more. If you have a flex gas line on it make sure it is the newer plastic coated ones, more reliable than the older ones.
And as I mentioned, if the problem was a blocked vent, it will need to be cleared before the new tank will work right.
People often wonder what causes a rumbling sound in their water heater. The two most likely scenarios are breakage of the dip tube and sediment leakage. In the first scenario, the dip tube in the cold water supply inlet is supposed to run to within three or four inches of the bottom of the water heater.
When you turn on the hot water, it forces cold water to the bottom of the heater, which drives hot water out of the heater. If that dip tube deteriorates or breaks off half way into the tank, the capacity of hot water is cut in half, and the cold water meets that hot water, thus causing the rumbling sound.
The second circumstance occurs when the water in the tank is not being heated, some water may leak down through the sediment at the bottom of the tank. This sediment is the result of cold water being heated combining with the various particles settling in the bottom of the tank. When the water is fired up, these drops of water become super heated, and under most circumstances will stay there until some water is used, decreasing the pressure in the tank. These super-heated droplets then exit the sediment entering the tank water as steam and then condense or implode, which cause the rumbling noise.
The drain valves near the bottom of the water heater are generally somewhat off the bottom of the tank, which makes it impossible to drain off sediment.
Repairing existing metallic water piping with plastic tubing can also create an electrical shock or fire hazard and possibly ruin the electrical appliances and electronic devices attached to the wiring because of the plastic piping, especially if the metal pipes were used for the grounding of electrical services.
The electrical service in a structure needs to be grounded in order to make all of the electrical appliances and electronic equipment in your house work properly as well as limit the chance of electrical shocks and fires. In older homes the main ground wire was not always run back to where the water service entered into the building as it is done today. It was merely attached to the nearest cold water pipe that was accessible to the electrician at the
Time. So if you are repairing or adding on to existing metallic water piping with plastic tubing you must consult a qualified electrician to make sure that you are not exposing yourselves to undue hazards.
Be safe - engage a qualified and certified professional. Gas lines and electrical connections are no place for amateurs.
M:)RGANITE
I don't mean to split hairs, but thermal expansion would create an explosion, not the implosion diagnosis you presented earlier.Quote:
Originally Posted by ipcfarm
I'm on Growlers side, "thermal expansion would create an explosion, not the implosion diagnosis you presented earlier."
I want someone to explain to me how a water heater under 45 pounds of pressure could "implode". Implosion implies a suction or external pressure so huge it causes the tank to blow inward. Where does this super amount of suction come from?
Ipcfarm sez,"I have never heard of one imploding either. Apparently everyone else has, including the manufacturer, the city water department, and both plumbers who came out. The 1st plumber who came out said he had only seen 3 in over 40 years"
I want to contact the city water department, the manufacture or the plumbers who say they have found a way to reverse the natural laws of physics" Signed, Puzzled in Sarasota.
Seal a container of water and cool it, you will get a vacuum. However, the 15 psi atmospheric is the most you can get, and that would be less the vapor pressure of water. I would expect a tank with a design of 150 psi would take less than 1/10 of that in vacuum. I am not sure what happened. Be nice to hear more from ipcfarm.
I remember as a kid, putting a little water in a square gallon can, putting it in a fire, and then pulling it out and tightening the lid. We then watched it implode.
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