To me the pit bulls are pests.
I can't walk down an alley without worrying about getting bitten. When I see anything resembling a pit bull on a leash I am forced to take evasive action. In my opinion, they should be bred out of existence.

Why aren't they?

Their a very well known species of dogs They are fighter that why most people likes them To me ugly as a post but some don't see it that way I think we should get over it There here and to stay there is nothing you can do about it.

Unfortunately, you appear to be one of those people that if they don't like something, they want it exterminated. Are you German, by chance?

I know I'm wasting my time in trying to explain to you, but Pit Bulls are not the problem, it's their owners. I have owned a Pit Bull I rescued from a shelter. She had a very hard life and would have had every reason to be mean. But someone in her early development had raised her right and she didn't have a mean bone in her. Pit Bulls are popular dogs with gang bangers and they MAKE them mean. Pits are not born killers. I've seen very aggressive German Shepherds, Rotweillers and Dobermans. Should they be exterminated, too?

Pits have a bad reputation and sadly people like you promote it.

People have the right to walk any dog in a public place as long as they have it under control and do not let it attack or even threaten to attack other people innocently going about their business. If you are simply afraid of any dog, either live with it, or get over it. If the dogs are a real threat to people in general, the local authorities are not doing their job. Complain to them about the owners of the out of control dogs. If they don't listen, complain to your representatives and the news media.

Too often bureaucrats take the easy way out, banning this or that because of a handful of irresponsible users. They pass unenforceable laws the majority of people do not support. That erodes both our freedom and respect for the law.

Pit Bulls, unless trained to, are not aggressive toward people, but other dogs. Ban Pit Bulls, and those people wanting an aggressive dog will simply find another breed.

Hi We can debate about this subject for hours. We can blame the pit bull behavior on the owners all day long. But Pit Bull are often inbreed which makes them crazy. My cousin used to breed pit bulls and it in there nature too be mean. O'course u can train them to obey but there instincts make them unpredictable at times.

Hey I have a pit bull and she's the nicest dog ever but most of them are bad because their owners train them that way . It's not the dogs fault it's the trainers fault

Quote:

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Originally Posted by labman

People have the right to walk any dog in a public place as long as they have it under control and do not let it attack or even threaten to attack other people innocently going about their business.

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I agree with this completely. However, I would like to see a law which would promote killing a dog who bites/attacks someone without a reason, as well as giving quite a big penalty (fine, or however it's called in english) to their owners. It would also make those who do not know enough about dogs, but want an "aggressive" (or at least, a dog with "aggressive" appearance) dog just because it's "cool", think twice before deciding to keep such a dog.

A year and a half ago I went to adopt a cute fuzzy puppy. As I walked the alley way I came across a dog that had been moved from shelter to shelter. This dog was originally found wandering the streets of Newark New Jersey. She had been moved from Newark to Tinton Falls and then too Lacey Township at the Pop Corn Zoo. She was emaciated. She had an enlarged heart and a heart murmur. She also had a prolapsed uterus. Here ears where scared from biting flies when she arrived at the first shelter. She had been used for breeding and when her body gave out they threw her out on the street. She was only 3 years old. It is sad what people can do to an animal. Along with all of that she had been abused by a man and had severe trust problems with men. She had been in the shelter system for well over a year. We went many times to visit her; she had many issues that we worked out before I took her home. Working with many people our dog has learned too trust humans again. Miss Piggy is by best friend and my life. As she a bounces threw our home, play with her toys, hangs from her rope in the back yard and licks the cats to death. I can smile and say I saved one. It is not the breed that is bad it the people that teach the dog to be aggressive.

So we have to corral the stupid people away from society and let the pit bulls rip them apart

Look, I KNOW owners behavior can affect a dogs behavior...

On the other side my wife's best friends daughter (follow that) was mauled by a pit bull. I KNOW it can happen with other breeds, I know it can be the fault of the owner training...

But you better believe I would not let a pit bull around my two year old son.

Call me an ignorant fool who wants to kill off a breed? Not really, but since we cannot stop stupid people from owning pit bulls then I'd just rather not have them around

:confused: I feel sorry for those of you who are so uneducated and narrow minded. I am a dog lover. I ahave 5 pet dogs and I am a breeder. I breed Australain Cattle Dogs. But my #1 breed is the pit bull. I don't breed them because of the cruel uneducated people of the world who would fight them or treat them like the enemy. I have a 5 yr old female red nose. She is the most loving, gentle dog I have ever owned or known. She is like a 2nd mother to my Cattle Dog litters. I have been looked down upon for having her in many ways. I have had to lie about her breed in order to rent a home. I have been turned away at groomers and I have people walk on the other side of the road when she passes by. It is all sad ignorance. I have a chiuauah who is meaner than she could ever think of being. A mean dog is created by cruelty and ignorance. They do not come into the world, a fresh, tiny puppy, with the urge to bite and mame. They are conditioned through long hours of tortureous training for long periods. Any dog can fight, certain people just think the pit bull looks better doing it. Perhaps someday, the ignorant of the world will focous their attention on another unfortunate breed and give the pit bull the chance they deserve to be the loving family companion they desire to be. I remember when it was the rottwieler who was the bad- killer on all of the ghetto shirts and posters. That in itself shows you what a fad it can be. Unfirtunatly, it is our loving pets who suffer. :(

** a pissed off chihuahua isn't going to rip out my throat! **


Friend's daughter was playing in HER FRONT YARD and did nothing to cause the attack.

Were the owners responsible. YES. They were found guilty and paid a lot of money. The girl has had operations and the scars are still there, but much less noticeable.

I'm not saying to eliminate the breed. But if I hurt your feelings because I cross the street... if you cannot get service at a business because of the breed... TOUGH. Suck it up. You chose the breed of a dog that is perceived as dangerous by many, including the scarred daughter of my friend.

** a pissed off chihuahua isn't going to rip out my throat! **

Though it is unfortunate that your young friend was attacked, it is the responsibility of the owner, not the dog. It was raised poorly. And as to my feeling of being turned away from establishments, it is their loss, not mine. They missed the opportunity to bathe a well behaved bath lovin' girl. And I feel sorry for their ignorance and small mindedness. My point was that due to the mentality of others, the breed suffers.

Ps. You should try to have the patience and temperament of the pit bull instead of yelling at people. You might be better heard. I am a pit bull owners educator at a local shelter. I educate people wishing to adopt on the true, loving nature of the animal. You catch more bees with honey. Have a nice day :D

You call me and others "Pitifully uneducated and narrow minded"... and then have the gall to tell me to be more even tempered? I've acknowledged that the owners are a big part of the problem.

My wife once told her friend " 'I'm sorry you're an ' is not an apology". The dog, not the owner, mauled my friend's daughter. The owner bears responsibility. The dog was still the source of the attack.

But don't think for one minute I'll be reserved where my child's safety is of concern. I'd rather err on the side of being narrow minded.

Almost laughable.

The american pit bull is not a recognized breed by the akc or ckc
So making statements that blame a non existent breed as being a pest is very short sighted.

Many dogs are aggressive and injure and kill people every year. The reasons are

1. bad socialization - puppys must experience strange people, kids and environments so they learn to look to their owners to respond aggressively or not. Many owners treat their dogs like their kids and believe that the dog will grow out of bad behaviour. The dog mimics its owner. Eachh state should mandate obedience licence for a state approved obedance school for all dog owners so the puppy to dog gets a good education on how to behave towards dogs, kids, animals and people. The dog should be apart of your life not you a part of his or hers!

2. bad choice of puppy - puppys have a social order they develop right after birth an alfa or dominate dog is normaly more aggressive and need more leadership from his or her owner to behave correctly. These dog are not suited for small children. Always consult with a registered breeder the needs of your family and your expectations for the dog.

3. breeding - buying a mixed breed can be very rewarding or not
Buying a purebred at least you can research your needs and pick a dog that's right for your family.

4. bad planing - any pet is a big resonciblity every family member must particpate in the puppys to adult dogs life. Many adults buy a dog as a means of trying to make theire kids take on responcibilites and fail to monitor and proved both kids and pet proper behavior.

5. feeding proper nutrition to you dog and teaching him or her that food is not to prevoke and aggression response - your kids should be able to reach into dogs mouth or around their dish and not get bit.

6. good dog behaviour - your dog lives with you and often has little contact with other dogs. They need to know how to act like a dog around other dogs in a non aggressive behavior.

7. your dog is not a babysitter - when buddy gets unhappy he can't talk about it he growls then bites. Young kids don't know when they go too far that's your job to supervise and make them take a timeout. Reinforce good behavior on your dog deal with bad behaviour swiftly . Always monitor your dog and your kids!!

In the end a dog is 50% environment and 50% genetics. Learning proper dog behavior will reduce your risks to injury. Making dog owners and their dogs train at an approved training center will eliminate the problem. The dog owner is the boss the dog must look to the owner to know how to respond!

If more people were able to think before they speak, as you did, we may not have 1/2 the problems we do in society. My pit bull and I thank you on behalf of all dogs getting the short end of the stick. I am a breeder, though not of pit bulls (due to the grave mistreatment which can occour). I breed Australian cattle dogs. They have a very strong personality and so I pay very cole attention to their "place" in the litter and they are placed in homes accordingly. The dominant ones are placed in working, herding homes, the submissives in single family, etc. and my litters are socialized as soon as possible with other dogs, cats, children and car rides. On occasion, I have the opportunity to see a puppy from my litter when it is older and the owner and I are always pleased. The same routine for breeding holds true for any dog, in general. I do recognize that all breeds have their special needs. For ex. The cattle dog is high energy, so left un attended in the back yard causes boardom and even mental problems from lack of contact and stimulous. As long as potetial owners are educated to the breeds needs and hold up to those needs, you will get a great animal.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CroCivic91

I agree with this completely. However, I would like to see a law which would promote killing a dog who bites/attacks someone without a reason, as well as giving quite a big penalty (fine, or however it's called in english) to their owners. It would also make those who do not know enough about dogs, but want an "aggressive" (or at least, a dog with "aggressive" appearance) dog just because it's "cool", think twice before deciding to keep such a dog.

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Well said. I agree. It's not the dogs. If people treat and handle the dogs right, there would be less fear of them, pitbulls or others. :cool:

It's been said numerous times, but being the "pit bull" owner that I am, I feel the urge to reply. Like the EDUCATED people said, not all pit bulls are vicious, not all maul anything they see sight in. It's a learned behavior. A pit bull puppy is no different from a lab puppy or a golden. People are so obsessed with what the media feeds them. So quick to jump at their opinions and follow what they are told like drones. Statistics show that pit bulls account for fewer bites than any other breed, GSD's, Chows, Labs (amongst many others) account more for bites. It's only the pit bulls that are more known because of the severity of it all. To top it off most arnt pure bred pit bulls, the pit bull gene is dominant therefore a mutt being 10% pit bull would look like a pit bull more than anything. Also, no thanks to the news that always seems to have to make known the "bad" news, alikes to a shooting on such side of town etc. My dogs would never ever think of harming anything. Like one person listed all the factors of what the causes of a "vicious" pit bull are; it varies, but it would be no different than any other breed. To annihilate the breed would just be absurd, it would only cause more problems. Genocide is right? Is that really fair? There's murders, rapings, & robberies that occur every day by numerous races of people but we'd rather spend our time banning a breed of dog, I don't think we would ban any races right? Case, in point to all this jibberish, what makes a pit bull more worthy of being abolished than any other breed of dog that bites? Just makes me think, if you were to see a growling GSD would you go "aww" ? Stop and think WHY law enforcement actually uses these dogs.

Own a properly bred pit bull and you'll realize what your missing out on :)

PS - All registries register the American Pit Bull Terrier except for the AKC (which registers Amstaff's). Pit bull is not a breed in it self.

Ehh I guess I'm done...

May be its time to register the breed by akc and set a standert for comfomation, apearance, stamina and behaviour. Instead of banning all bull terrior

All this breed crap is a bunch of hooey. Last Saturday I was at a dog festival and took advantage of it to get my Aster's Canine Good Citizen certification. I was very happy to see the first 2 dogs were ''nasty, vicious'' Dobermans.

jennapbt-you are correct, the "pit bull" is not a registered dog. The term "pit bull" comes from the origin of the old "sport" of pit fighting. The actual breed names are american stafforshire terrier and stafforshire bull terrior. Both of which are recognized breeds. And as the owner and lover the bull terrior, I agree with you in that they are a wonderful breed that does not get the recognition it deserves. They are a precious and often misrepresented and mistreated animal. I remember about 10-15 years ago I believe it was, the rottwieler (SP? ) and the doberman were the "bad to the bone" gangsters dog of choice with its face on all the t-shirts and in all the rap videos. Its just the misfortune of the amstaff's to be the current symbol of violence in the ghetto. You don't see any family oriented upstanding people with "vicious" pit's, just in the ghetto. My dog has never worn a lockpad and chain or run the tread mill with a racoon at the end. She is a diva, she has a leopard collar and just likes to have her butt scratched. That's my two cents on the subject...

I think certain breeds have a more aggressive streak than others but doesn't mean that they are bad dogs. And you can't generalize a breed because their owners foolishly trianed some of them to be that way. I use to be very scared by pit bulls because my brother was attacked by one when he was ten years old. My grandmothers neighbor's pitbull wasn't on a leash and it escaped from the neighbors house and ran into the yard and bit my brother in his leg. The neighbor had to pry the dog off him. Now what caused the dog to come into my grandmas'yard and bite my brother was unknown but we found out later that the neighbor admitted to training it as an attack dog. Well instead of training it to attack intruders on their property, it tried to attack almost anything, becaue a week after this happened to my brother, a woman was walking by with a baby stroller and the dog burst though a screened door and attacked the woman, thankfully the baby was okay, but the dog ended up having to be put down. Its very unfortunate because I have actually beeen around a few pitbulls that are actually very very sweet. But I also know the people who own them and they didn't train them to attack any one. You can't generalize a breed, are there breeds more dispositoned to be more aggressive? I think so but that doesn't just include pit bulls, German shepards, Rotties, and Dobermans also can be aggressive. If you can't take the responsibility to train a dog properly than you shouldn't own one. Unfortunately many think they can and end up with a dog that is a danger to humans and other dogs. Shame on the owner not shame on the dog or its breed, a dog learns behavior what its taught.

I agree that now days specific breeds can be frightening; however, I strongly feel that is the owners of these dogs and not the animals themselves that need to be punished. Different breeds have different temperaments, and pit bulls have a long history of being bred for dogfights. This means they are naturally more aggressive toward other dogs, but not to humans. Temperaments are also inherited, but can be changed in the proper environment... say to make pit bulls less aggressive toward another household pet. Hundreds of families have properly trained pit bulls, Dobermans, German Shepards, and Rottweilers that are friendly household pets. My point: breeds may be more aggressive by nature, but it is the owner's responsibility to care for and train their dogs.

I am responding to the quote of pit bulls are pests and should be banned. I have never owned a pit bull till my boyfriend brought one home by surprise, a 5 week old black and white girl and to be honest I didn't want anything to do with this dog and not for the fact it was a pit bull but for the fact it was a dog, I never owned a dog prior and now that I do, I love her to death, I have never seen a dog with more intelligence and personality and compassion for its owner, she has been in 2 training courses and picked up on the training extremely well. I am a strong believer that a dog will do what its trained to do and if a person is abusive to an animal then of course if you were the animal being beaten would you take it, that's is the questionto ask yourself, people believe these dogs have no feelings and to treat them like a tool and so don't blame the dog, blame its master cause if you give your dog the attention and love and correct discipline he or she needs, your dog will not be aggressive and this comes from personal experience, my dog has no aggressive bone in her body and people who didn't like pit bulls met her and they love her. She is very social with other dogs and all people and not saying that all of them are that way but then again that comes with any breed of dog, not all are social type. People are to blame for cruelty to these prro animals. Would you ban a tiger or a cougar from existence, well then why would you a pit bull, its is not a humans right to ban a dog, they have as much right as you and I to walk the earth god has given us. We have already destroyed enough, lets not add more to it.

Marauding pit bulls attack six
Boy, 10, in critical condition

Sunday, November 6, 2005; Posted: 9:30 p.m. EST (02:30 GMT)

CARY, Illinois (AP) -- A 10-year-old boy was in critical condition Sunday after three pit bulls escaped from a home and went on a rampage, attacking six people before police shot and killed dogs, authorities said.

No charges had been filed Sunday, but McHenry County Sheriff Keith Nygren said it was being investigated as a crime scene.

Neighbors said the attacks started late Saturday afternoon when children going door-to-door for a fund-raiser arrived at the home of Scott Sword, 41, who owned the dogs.

"We had music playing, and I heard this bizarre sound," said Debby Rivera, who lives three houses away. "I looked out the window, and I saw a young boy. The dogs were just jumping on him."

"The screams were horrible," she said. The dogs were "relentless, like they were possessed."

The pit bulls attacked the two children, and when the dogs' owner tried to stop them, the dogs turned on him and bit off his thumb, Nygren said. The boy's father also tried to protect his son and was attacked. The dogs went after another neighbor as well.

"The scene sprawled over a couple blocks; it was a very chaotic scene," said Lt. Michael Douglas of the Cary Fire Protection District.

Residents threw rocks at the dogs and honked car horns to try to distract them from attacking before police arrived and shot the animals.

Jim Malone said he and a neighbor tried to beat the dogs back with baseball bats. "He'd hit them, they'd run, and they'd come back," Malone said. "This went on for 15 minutes."

The boy who was attacked, Nick Foley, was hospitalized in critical condition Sunday. His friend Jordan Lamarre, also 10, was in serious condition. Nick's father was listed in good condition. Sword and two others were treated for injuries and released.

Last week, another 10-year-old boy in Colorado was mauled by a pack of pit bulls that attacked him in his own back yard. The boy was in critical condition after the attack, and the hospital said Sunday his family had requested no further information about his condition be released.

The attack in the Denver suburb of Aurora came two days after the City Council banned pit bulls and other "fighting dogs." Owners who already had the dogs could keep them if they paid a $200 annual license fee.

Again... I recognize that a stupid owner can make a loving dog a hateful beast.

I get it.

But I still don't care if an owner is offended if I cross to the other side of the street with my 2 year old.

And I still know the young woman whose face was ripped into by the pit bull when she did nothing to provoke the animal.

I'm not calling for them to be wiped off the face of the earth... but I surely don't want one next door to me when my son is outside.

Is this what you do all day, looking for anti-pit bull media? Relax, smoke a joint, or will that make you go crazy and kill someone too?

When an animal gets abused and mistreated that is what they have grown to understand and so its all they know how to do and I do understand that a person will be afraid to walk down the street if they notice a running free pit bull but you have to remember like my booboo said this yr it is fixated on pit bulls, next yr who knows what it will be, if you are concerned for a loose pit bull on the streets you should watch for any other dog loose on the streets too cause even though a dog may be small and look like it can do no damage to an adult, a child could just as easily have its face ripped off by a little dog and the throat has one major artery that with one bite by any dog one tooth is all it takes to puncture to the point and the person is helpless. I have never been chased by a big dog but I have been by small dogs and I have scars on my arm and scars on my chin from being bit by a mutt dog but I can't live my life being afraid to walk the streets. A parent should automatically fear a child on the streets in towns and not mostly for dogs, I would for people cause people are the most unpredictable animal of all. A dog big or small can do damage, its all depended on how they were brought up. Its sad though what people have done to these dogs or any other dogs who deserve a chance at a happy life.

A dog running the street is a dog the owner doesn't care much about. Best thing is to call animal control for your area. Even if it is a usually well cared for dog that managed to get loose, the sooner it is picked up and taken to a safe place, the more likely the owner is to get it back safely.

A few people still live where they can let their dog run free, but in most places it is irresponsible and illegal. Even if they don't attack people or other pets, loose dogs spread disease, scatter garbage, foul yards, harm lawns and gardens, and contribute to the slaughter of unwanted pets.

> LoveMyBooBooGirl

> got hobbies?

> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

> is this what you do all day, looking for anti-pit bull media? Relax,
> smoke a joint, or will that make you go crazy and kill someone too?

Um... the article I copied was front page Yahoo news... not a lot of looking needed there.

As for smoking the joint, sorry, have a 2 year old I'm responsible for... that would be stupid, but then you know about that apparently?

... and as for killing someone, you've got to be kidding me. Almost funny how passionate the lovers of the breed can defend it to no end, but when someone is uncomfortable with the breed (again, I've NEVER said to kill 'em off), well... I'm just a raving homocidal lunatic in need of a joint and a hobby.

Wow. Almost funny.

Can't wait to send this to sarah. My friend who was mauled.

y'all watch out for them roaming packs of angry weiner dogs.

First off, "pit bull" is a slang term originated from the criminals that have marred their once honored reputation.
The correct term for this breed of dog would be Staffordshire Terrier or American Pit Bull Terrier. Calling them anything else just perpetuates the myth and stimga that uneducated people motivated by fear call them.
The Staffordshire/American Pit Bull Terrier was bred into exsistance in the 19th century for the cruel sport of Bull Baiting. In Bull Baiting, a dog would attempt to grab onto a bull's nose in a ring before the slaughter and hold onto it until the bull collapsed. Any other bites the bull incurred were considered beneficial to the meat of bull, tenderizing it, as this happened right before the bull was taken to slaughter.
The characteristics that the Staffordshire/American Pit Bull Terrier was bred for was the ability to never quit. They had to go into the bull pen and achieve their mission or die in the attempt. They were not bred for dog fighting, they were not bred for human-aggresive behavior. The desired characteristic was the overwhelming desire to please humans and NEVER QUIT. Human-aggressive behavior was immediately culled. It was not desired or tolerated. The dog handlers had to be able to control and trust the dog, in a pen with a 2,000 lbs beast with horns.
All of the recent media sensationalized press about the Staffordshire/American Pit Bull Terrier is just a mirror of a fight I had to fight hard in the past, when everyone was anti-rottweiler. I have owned rotts all my life, in fact there is one sleeping at my feet right now, and would never stand for Breed Specific Legistation that Staffordshire/American Pit Bull Terrier owners must now live with.
It is unfair, just irresponsible parents leaving their children alone with strange dogs and then being surprised that a child could provoke a dog, as most odg attacks involve unsupervised children. It has happened in my past, with a wonderful chow I had growing up, a man came over with his four year old son to talk to my dad, we told him not to mess with our dogs food bowl, the child did and almost had his nose torn off. The parent did not surpervise the child, allowed him to be harmed and the ****ing dog gets the blame.
This whole argument is just same **** different day, people no longer want to be accountable for their actions, and it is easier to blame something that cannot speak for itself, a dog. If this Breed Specific Legislation continues, it will just be a new outlawed breed of dog every so often, until even Americans cannot pretend to enjoy the freedom of having a wondeful family pet. It is a crying shame that people choose to remain uninformed and irresponsible, and continue to allow the mutation and manipulation of such a treasured breed.

Majm - Well said *claps*

Thank you jennapbt, for your support.
This was my surprise, I recently had to do an arguementative paper for my english class and I, of course, chose the BSL as my topic.
I could not find a website that was an anti-apbt/amstaffy organization. I found opinion columns from newspapers, opinion articles, and misinformed bloggers but as hard as I looked for an organization that could be behind this movement, I could not find it.
When you look up "anti pit bull" on Google, pro apbt/amstaffy websites come up resoundingly pounding the opposition into defeat. The only places I have found "anti pit bull people" are on message boards/blogs. I try to comment as often as I can to try and make them see the ripple effect that they will have if they let misinformation and fear make their decisions for them(ie - loss of all rights).
I even tried "I hate pit bulls" on Google, and found nothing, no organization, no mad mothers against the vicious pit bull, NOTHING. More pro apbt/amstaffy websites but nothing anti besides the same blogs/message boards.
I sit and wonder about HOW IN THE WORLD the powers that be managed to pass such silly legislation if it is so obvious that the people are not behind it. I mean, I simply cannot understand it. All I see out here on the World Wide Web is love for these recently tainted creatures. I see no hate for them, only a peppering of closemindedness.
http://sf.metblogs.com/archives/2005...ls_are_b.phtml A misinformed SF blogger I tried to set straight with a three coment diatribe, the last three comments made by Kayla, in case you are interested in seeing my other points in this argument or helping me out with these people, they are scared and fear the unknown. It should pass with help from the pro apbt/amstaffy community. Flood them into believing!

I want to thank you for your well thought out post. I have tried to make the same point (remembering the anti-rott era myself). But those who don't want to hear logic won't hear of it. I have stopped posting on this entire forum for the most part due to the menality of a good majority of the members. I do pop in from time to time when I get an e-mail "posting alert". I wiswh there were more people like you.

Thank you LoveMyBooBooGirl for your support.
What weighs on me most is how these people form their opinions from news stories, the very news stories that are slanted to get that fear and prejudice reaction. I cannot understand how people do not realize that the media is toying with them. The graphic photographs and gory details are used to stir up closemindedness and fear.
Think about Iraq/Afghanistan, 2,000+ soldiers have died in the attempt to bring them freedom. We have seen oh, about 5 casket photographs. The powers that be have made it illegal to show photographs of the fallen soldiers. While I understand the family not wanting that pictured, I know that the media is complying with this illegal decree on purpose. If not, if we had seen 2,000+ casket photos, we would all be in Washington D.C. ripping Dubya from his royal throne.
Press on the American Pit Bull Terrier/Staffordshire Terrier is abused in the opposite way, graphic gory overload. Disfigured children, crying parents, etc. This is used to specifically garner a fear response from the general public, who trusts Tom Brokaw and won't question what Brian Williams is presenting. They will see, absorb, meet at the watercooler and give all American Pit Bull Terrier/Staffordshire Terrier owners bad looks and snide remarks. They will go to town meetings and push silly legislation on the sly of dog owners and rip rights away from everyone.
No one does any research anymore. There are no beloved muckrakers. There is no responsibility in the media. We are losing a fight for a damned good breed of dog, and I only fear my rotty is next.

I can not believe this post is still going and there are so many angry people, the pit bull is a vicious breed only if the human makes it that way. Any breed of dog can be made to be mean. This is only my opinion but if we took the individuals that are doing this and put them away for a very, very long time. Confiscated the belongings of such and individual and fined them more money then they would ever make, maybe this cruelty would stop. In most instances this crime is plea bargained down to a lesser offence and they get off with a small fine and they are back doing it in a few days. The laws need to be changed so this no longer happens, the dogs would be safer and no one would ever be bitten by a dog that was trained to fight.

M'kay. Help me make this thread end on something other than each side calling each other blind and ignorant... maybe we can find a middle??

This thread has made me understand that it is unfair to judge any dog, American Pit Bull Terrier or otherwise, by its "breed" alone.

I have a friend with a dalmatian, a vet no less, that is a bit testy. And I will never allow my 2 year old near my wife's grandmother's beloved chow... as it is old and set in its ways and doesn't tolerate a noisy, unpredictable child. It doesn't like children, but it "rescued" the grandmother when she broke her arm and fell down some stairs. It also nips at my son when he comes near. We keep the two apart.

My intention was mostly to say I don't feel comfortable with my naughty boy, who is still learning right from wrong, around an animal that has had less than great press. The 76 year old Texas woman who was just mauled and killed by a pack of roaming pit bulls is another example... front page news Yahoo.

Clearly this was, in major part, an owner issue. Any moron who lets any pack of dogs roam the streets, regardless of breed, is just asking for trouble. I would, however, like to feel safe mowing my lawn, as she was, when this attack occurred, if there were dogs of this breed or other labeled "aggressive" breeds in the neighborhood. Saying the owner is to blame isn't going to ease the devastation the family will feel with the loss of a mother and grandmother. Fining a bad owner will never compensate for the loss of a life. Banning a dog because of "breed," however, doesn't seem fair.

The fact that there seems to be an "owner issue" is in itself the issue.

So help me be comfortable with this. If the primary issue with the Staffordshire Terrier or Pit Bull Terrier is the owner, then how can I be comfortable when a new owner and dog moves in to my neighborhood? I don't know them. I don't know their animals. I know my son is loud and noisy sometimes, even when supervised.

If I cannot judge an owner an a moron or as a responsible owner on sight, then how can I be more comfortable with the animal? Again... this is in the context of having a 2 year old boy running around... always supervised, but still a bit unpredictable. Obviously if the owner lets the dogs run loose, he's an idiot that should be severely fined.

But the article I posted last month, again front page sensational Yahoo news, was about dogs that escaped from a house when a visiter came to the door for a fundraiser. These were not dogs running the alleys in packs.

So... what is the happy medium?

Let's ALL AGREE that it is unfair to call the "breed" dangerous outright and always. I'll give you that. Absolutely.

Everyone see that? The ignorant homicidal moron in need of a smoke (see previous comments) concedes that many of you owners and your beloved pets get a bad, bad rap.

And I'll concede that the title of this thread, which I didn't start, is therefore unfair.

I imagine more children die in backyard swimming pool accidents and driveway accidents each year than dog attacks.

But I'm getting mixed messages about how to handle my son around the dogs. If I'm showing ignorance by crossing the street when walking with my son when an unfamiliar owner approaches... AND I'm ignorant for letting my son approach a new dog... where's my happy middle?

The answer is to find a way to label stupid owners. Unfortunattely, I cannot tell one from another when walking my son on the bike trail.

I guess my last comment, and I'm sure we all hope this will be the last one, will be a request to not get angry with a parent who keeps his child away from your dog if I do not know you, by moving across the street or out of the way.

You might be a great owner and your dog might be the best animal that ever loved a human. I don't have the skills to know you from the Illinois dogs owner or the Texas dogs owner (that attacked this last month) when we meet on the trail. I cannot tell who is a terrible owner when I bring my son around for Halloween trick-or-treating to houses I'm less familiar with. I don't know on sight which dogs were bred well, fed well, cared for, etc...

So I'll not label your dog outright as dangerous... if you'll not call me an idiot (or "pitifully uneducated", "short sighted", "narrow minded", "hot headed" as I've already been called these) for keeping my son away from your dog by moving clearly out of your way until I know you and your dog better. Do you know my son well enough to trust him around your animal?

God, I hope this is middle ground.

I could not help but empathize with your dilema. I know where you are coming from as I have a one year old son. But I also own a Pit Bull... and a Beagle and a Treeing Walker Coonhound. I too do not let my son approach just any dog but as an animal behavorist, conduct around dogs is like second nature. So, here are some tips and pointers on what you should teach your son, how you can feel more comfortable and why.

The reason most children are hurt by dogs ( I do not use the word "attacked" because that is not what a dog is doing) is #1 they do not know how to behave around dogs. Most children pick at and pester and being that dogs do not speak english they can only communicate by first growling, then snarling and last resort, biting. If you have ever seen puppies play fight with each other they will bite at each others muzzles and pin one another. That is their way of establishing who is the boss. Now, children do not have muzzles so when a child is doing something to a dog that the dog does not approve of and wants that child to leave him/her alone or repremand the child the dog will go for the face. And a child's response is to fight back which in turn will usually trigger the "leader of the pack" response to pin the child. This is how these so called "attacks" happen. All in all, it is miscommunication between dog and human gone very bad.

So how can you keep your son safe? Well, if you are on the trail or out for a walk an overzealous (jackass) dog owner will usually have their dog off the leash letting them run amock. A responsible dog owner will have their dog on the leash and the dog should be walking right beside them. Here is where the leader of the pack also comes into play. Who is always out front? The "leader of the pack". I can almost guarantee you when the dog is out front taking the owner for a walk, they are not in complete control of their dog. Now, regardless of what breed the dog is, how big it is you should always ask to pet the dog first. Show the dog the back of your hand, allow him to sniff until the tail starts wagging and you are OK with him/her. And as far as being "attacked" in your front yard, highly unlikely, but if a dog were to ever come running at you do not run, do not fight, do not raise your arms and hands kicking and screaming. Ignore them, do not look them directly in the eye, turn away and stand straight. By doing this you are not challenging the dog but you are being passive aggressive, standing your ground but not putting up a fight.

In response to your Yahoo stats, I actually live outside of Denver, Colorado and the ten year old boy that was attacked, only one of the dogs belonged to the household and the others were wayward rescues from the genicide that was taking place. And no where in the article in the Denver paper did it mention the parents who should have been supervising their son that was in the yard with two unknown dogs.

The best thing anyone can do is educate themselves. Not everyone is going to agree that American Pitt Bull Terriers, American Staffordshire Terriers and Staffordshire Terriers are great dogs but ignorance is no better than fear.

Hey Kp2171


Last year my wife was robbed and beaten by two african american males at the local grocery market... yet to this day she has not said one bad thing about african american men. She even continues to shop at the same grocery market with african americans. She holds no grudges nor blames the assailants nor their parents. You may find this odd but she even walks on the same side of the street with them children in tow. I honestly find that amazing. Its unfortunate how you stereo type specific dogs for what they have done or how they were "used". And to post a "mauling" article on pitbulls was below low. Please name a dog or bird for that mater and I will list a medly of maulings for that specific breed.

If you stereo type dogs I could only imagine what other "justified" stereo types you hold. Please tell me - is ignorance bliss?

How sick can a person be, comparing an 'animal" to a race of people, this is the most racist comparison I have heard on this site.

While you said , she stills shows there and even plays with 'them. It is obvoius that a standing of racism is in your committ.

Dogs are anminals without the God given ability to be rational. They respond from breeding, they are breed to be aggressive animals.

Our city has outlawed them and I call on more people to petition their council people to do the same. In our city if you have one, it has to be licenced, and always chained with heavy chain ( leash) it can not merely be on a chain in a yard but a real pen and/or cage which has to be inspected and oked for use. Failure to do this will result in heavy fines.

As for African American people, there are good and bad, just like good and bad whites and indian and mexicans and so on.

The biggest crooks are not normally black but the white collar criminals.

Your comparison just make me... time for confession before I say something wrong

Just give it up already people. If you don't like a breed don't own one. Simple enough. No need to bash on something you don't understand.:)