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I find it insulting that you just said that about my sister and no she's not "playing games" with her boyfriend. She's 23 and a big girl and he's protecting me, my sister and my girlfriends. When I say she stays with her boyfriend do you realise that I mean next door?
NOT at the festival. At the festival, according to your posts, she is in a hotel room and YOU are in a tent. Are you now trying to change that arrangement or add another 'adult' to it?Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
No I said it would be easier if she went to a hotel as she doesn't like camping. But she's considering staying in a tent.
You are still using a kids argument on an adult subject. DO you REALLY believe all of that.. Females are statistically almost as likely to commit crimes these days as young males. And combine those two groups... a youung female is far more likely to be the victim of either group than a guy is.Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
DO you think there are more than a couple security guards for everyone there, and that they will be paying any attention to anything but keeping people from sneeking in without paying.
DO you know that I can be inside a tent in about 2 seconds, locked or not. DO you have any idea how quickly you can be gagged? About a second or two longer. How long would it take for you to wake up, recognise what was happening and think how to react from a sleep? A LOT longer than that I'll tell you.
The longer you try and argue this the worse your arguments are getting. They all highlight exactly how ill prepared you really are to attend an even't like this.
I'm sure your dad and your sister have all this figured out.
Can I ask, what's your mother take on this?
smoothy I suggest you stop talking to me about your disgusting theories and you emphasise the right bits.
redhed35; I don't live with my mother and haven't spoken to her for many years, her opinion is not valuable to me in any way what so ever.
I though you said your sister would be staying at a hotel, because she doesn't like camping. Does your dad know this? I don't think anyone on this site would insult you or your sister. We are trying to make a point.
We are trying to say if you are not chaperoned properly by an adult who is going to be there not next door, then you could get into all kinds of trouble. Maybe you don't recognize the dangers, but we do.
No one is trying to hurt your feelings, but you wanted our opinion and when we give them you have an argument against every one. We are trying to tell you how unsafe iti s for a child of fourteen to be in an atmosphere that is unsafe.
Rosanna,smoothy is right,horrible things happen at concerts,I'm only in ireland,I know there is security and everyone is searched,but even still I'm sure you have heard horror stories too.
I reread your original post,and for me,if I were in your shoes,I would gladly have my sister come with me and stay in the tent,if you want your dad to trust you AND kim to look out for you,you both need to follow his rules.
That's how you get him to trust you,that's how you get more freedom as you get older.
My sister was allowed to go to reading festival when she turned 15 and I think its only fair that I can go too?
Did she have a chaperone?Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
You may not think its fair,but your dad had made the decision,he's looking out for you,he loves you and is trying his best no doubt...Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
My advice,give him a break,do as he asks,there will be plenty more concerts,and plenty more times to come that will seem unfair.
Really... and nothing EVER happens like that? Seriously... You are sleeping in a flimsy tent. And a lock on a zipper is going to stop exactly whom?Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
There is a LOT worse things that can happen than I mentioned... did you even Google up Morgan Harrington?
She was in College... went to a concert with friends.. got separated... dissappeared... and they found her dead and not at the concert.
Seriously... if you were mature enough to attend a festival those are EXACTLY the sorts of things you should be thinking about. Because let me tell you... there are a lot of really sick individuals out there... and you may even know a few of them. You just don't know who they are yet.
Did her sister have a chaperone?Quote:
Originally Posted by redhed35
No, my sister went behind my dads back, she went with her girlfriends and she was perfectly fine and said it was one of the best and most fun experiences of her life.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
She got lucky,anything could have happened,she was not allowed go!
You are allowed go if she goes with you and stays with you,sounds like you got a good deal.
smoothy the only UK abduction of a minor was Madeline McCann, this wasn't even in the UK, I'm not saying it couldn't happen but the likelihood is exremely low and also since 1998 there have been no cases of abduction or rape at both reading and leeds festivals.
And there are also a lot of missing persons that did the same thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
They don't always find the bodies. Its doesn't always work out for the best...
A music festival isn't Disneyworld. Your dad knows this... you refuse to accept the reality of it. And you REALLY need to start thinking about what could happen... because until you acknowledge it and are ready for it... you will be at a higher risk of being a victim of it.
Of course he knows its not disneyland, I don't refuse to accept it, I've already accepted it and I'm finding a way around it - you're trying to frighten me in telling me the facts which is the worst way around it.
500 children a year abducted from UK | Society | The Guardian
Rosanna over 500 children were abducted last year in the uk,the danger is very real.
Just because it does not make the news,does not mean its not happening.
smoothy is making very real points,it wise to know so you can be aware.
Your going to the concert,your sister is going too,you can still enjoy the time and be cautious and safe.
That's what your dad is getting at.
Your safety.
I feel that I can't still enjoy myself with my sister, she takes control over everything I do - I'm sick of being dictated and I want freedom, I'm 15 and I'm going to reading festival.. I don't think anyone on this shouldve told me unless theyd actually been to reading/leeds or any other uk festival..
From what you've been posting you have been refusing to acknowledge those facts... pretending they don't exist isn't the best way around it.Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
Sorry, but the innocence of youth is no protection from the lowlifes of the world. And with the passage to maturity... you have to deal with them as part of everyday life. We all do when you walk down the street, where you chose to live... IF you even decide to pass through certain neighborhoods. I'm 48... I've been around Biker Gangs... I grew up with people that are doing life in prison for murder... I've had friends that were killed various ways over the years. I've been to far more funerals than I care to remember of people I cared a lot about.
Sorry, but I've seen too much reality to pretend otherwise.
And spending three days at a music festival ISN'T like going to the market shopping. Not in any way. And even if nothing happens to you and you get your pockets picked on the first day... how do you eat. You have the Travelers (Gypsies) in the UK that like to be at these events... many have no legitimate work... and survive by theft.
An adult looks at these things... and prepares for them... they don't just assume it won't happen to them.
A common misconception is that gypsies steal, they don't. My aunt and her family are romany gypsies, it's the pikeys (irish travellers) that steal. And I most deffinately don't think that a gypsie can pay £170 to get into an event, they won't even get in through sneaking in. if anyone's stupid enough to keep your money in your pockets whilst around a lot of people is just asking to get their pockets picked. Yeah and I know that people are messed up, that's the reason I'm not my mother and she is who she is, she hangs around with these people and lost everything from it which is why I chose to stay away from it. Being at a music festival is for the enjoyment of the music - that's the whole point of it.
Nobody is trying to frighten you , we are telling you there is a world out there with cruel, sick, perverted people. This isn't what you want to hear.Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
You are wanting one of us to say; okay, hey great idea! A fourteen year
Old girl at a festival where God knows what could happen.
You are very relentless when you argue about something you want. Do you argue with your dad like the this? Life sometimes isn't fair and that is the truth.You should be grateful people who you don't even know are trying help you.
No, I don't argue with my dad like this - we discuss it because he respects what I have to say and doesn't attack me and tries to take my ideas and his and put them together. Also I'm 15, not 14, yes the world is full of sick and peverted people - it can happen to anyone, its no more likely to happen at a festival then it is on the street or waiting for a bus.
Really... Gypsies don't steal... Exactly where did you gather that tidbit of information from.Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
I've seen and been around the Romany Gypsies on continental europe for over 25 years... and they do nothing but steal... they don't stay in one place long... nobody will hire them so exactly where does this money come from? Its like the Mafia... the low people on the ladder that do all the theft pay upwards to their elders who avoid the direct crimes... but stolen property is still stolen property no matter how many hands it passes through.
Gypsies were caught breaking into my Condo in Europe... Gypsies stole a friends car... (IT was found in their camp)... when the police go through the camps they arrest a LOT of people for possession of stolen property.
Fact is they teach their kids to do most of the theft... and pickpocketing due to the very lax laws about juveniles who commit crime. Until the influx of Albanians and Romainians into Europe.. the Romany were the perpetrators of a disporportionaly large amount of crime.
Yes... I know a lot of Police in Continental Europe... personally. I know what the Roma do there all too well (In a general sense). I don't see why the UK should be unique.
The Travelers aren't really any different... except for ethnicity. We have them too, thieves and shysters. They are just a bit less visible.
You said you would be 15 when the summer comes. Look I've given you my thoughts and you still want to try and convince yourself and your dad it's okay. Hope you and your dad can get it settled.Good Luck
The romany gypsies here don't steal, it's the irish tinkers that typically do.
Yeah asin because ill be 15 when it comes around meaning I don't have a birthday or anything coming up. I am going to convince him its okay, because it is - don't knock it till you try it.
Can you provide statistics that can back that claim up... you seem alone in believing that.Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
No I can't provide statistics, can you?
It can happen anywhere.
The Irish Tinkerers aren't the ones roaming in bands in Europe I was referring to... though they probibly are there as well... those are Romany Gypsies I speak of... and they would never pass as Irish to anyone, anywhere. You can't miss them.Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
Pick a country anywhere in Europe... Paris... Rome for example.. you will see Rmany Gypsies there... on the streets robbing people... usually the kids doing it since they won't be locked up for long as an adult would. I've seen it personally.
THe adults usually beg on the sidewalks... the kids do pickpocketing and purse snatching until they become adults... usually.
No, I'll agree, the Irish tinkerers are no different and no better than the Romany Gypsies, just a different group ethnically. But maybe more dangerous because they blend in better ethnically.
And again you are totally ignoring everyone... you alone know more than anyone does... all of us.. you rfather.. because heaven knows... at 15 you already know everything there is to possibly know about life and its all downhill from there.
Sorry... but that's the attitude that's coming through the words you are typing. Whatever anyone says you are arguing they are wrong and you are right basically.
ANd the last thing any of us wants to see on the news is a story about a 15 year old that was brutally raped and murdered at a UK music event. No a picked pocket won't make it beyond local news.
And think you are unique... most child prostitutes are runaways that thought at whatever their age was that they alone knew more than their parents and insisted on doing what they want, when they want to. And Hollywood for example is full of them... same with NYC, LA, NYC. Andy major city you can name... and NONE of them are in control of their lives either.
One of the signs of maturity... is being able to see and admit when you are wrong about something.
Would it be possible that both of you,stop talking about enthics groups.
Happily
Its not going to make me like that group any better... restitution was never made for my losses. Even though they were caught.
Incidentally... your father seems to care more about your well being than you do. Its time to trust your father because he has your best interests at heart... you however have only your selfish self interests about what you want right here and now at any cost at heart. And no.. as the adult he isn't required to go ad-nausium into great detail why he said no. It's a family... not a democracy. They will make choices you don't always like... thats life. If they wanted you to die... they would have had an abortion 15 years ago. Widom comes with age and experience... judgement comes with wisdom... at 15 you have neither. And neither does anyone else your age.
When you are self supporting and have your own place. (there will always bwe another festival to attend).. THEN you can do what you want. You may not care about what happens to you... but spare the man the pain and guilt of responsibility if he let you go and something happened because you were too young and naïve to do it safely. Trust me... some day you WILL know what I'm talking about.
Lets assume you had an 11 year old sister that wanted to go alone with her friends... would you tell her go and have fun... or would you say she's not quite old enough yet... and if so... what makes 15 that critical age but not 11? Give that some thought.
Yes, I'm selfish and have selfish interests.. that's what "kids" do best!
That's been clear since post #1. At least now you admit it... rather than expecting everyone to agree with you.Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
NOW will you try and look at this from an adults perspective? Rather than dismiss all the advice we've given... and the explainations behind it.
There isn't a person here that wants to see something bad happen... or we would just say do it. Reality of today's life is far different than it was even 30 years ago. As in its far more dangerous today.
Its not I don't accept what you're saying its just so boring and repeated 24/7, just doesn't get through because its not being put into my head the right way!
First night in Reading, coolQuote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
Second night in a cargo container, not cool
Third night in Albania, bad
The rest of your too short, too trusting life in Istanbul.
Happens every single day.
Well see, that's your problem to assimilate... we are putting the facts out to you in as simple and clear a manner as we can... to avoid the possibility of misconception.Quote:
Originally Posted by rosanna-hope
If we get creative or clever there really is no way we can be sure you understood them as intended. That's one of the limitations of a forum. Face to face body language says a lot,. but absent that we have to be more direct.
And we really are trying to make you understand it from your fathers perspective.
I've hung out with some real scarey types growing up... but some of the things I presented is what goes through my mind if it was me going... or even a daughter. Even at my age. When you get older you see and think about what MIGHT happen.
Nobody grows old by taking uneccessary risks. Or being blissfull ignorant of what might happen.
I'll be the first to tell you... "Ignorance is bliss"... and wish I could explain that better... but I can't. There are events and knowledge you will come across as you grow up and older. Some of them change your life forever. Most of them you should be in no rush to experience. You just have to take someone's word for some things.
I've seen a man get shot in the chest point blank from 20 feet way (about 7 meters)... I've seen bodies burned alive until they were human shaped chunks of carbon. Not photos or video of it. There is plenty of time to do some things... but not to take chances with your well being.
I don't know your fathers story, but I'm sure he has his he could tell. And he does want you to make it to adulthood without any trauma.
I have been reading your arguments and I think you need a wake-up call. That non-existent crime at the Reading Festival:
Reading Festival rape victim not willing to prosecute - News - getreading - Reading Post
Please read the article and keep in mind that not everyone makes police reports especially those of a sexual nature.
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