Ask Me Help Desk - Changing beliefs

There are 2 definitions of the word cult.
#1 and the most popular usage: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult
#2 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult_%28religion%29

The RC church is NOT a cult in the first sense. Using the "cult" word usually implies the first meaning making the reader balk at the statement "Cults are ordinary religions such as the Roman Catholic Church". If Morganite knew full well he was using the second lesser known usage then he goading the readers into an unnecessary discussion. But we have all seen what happens when we attempt to disagree with Morganite.

NeedKarma, Thanks for the links! I was aware of the second, lesser-known usage of the word "cult"... but like you said, most people would be referring to the more common definition. I'm really not interested in arguing semantics with anyone, especially since I have a good friend who used to be in a cult of the first definition, and seen how much he and his family have suffered.

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Originally Posted by NeedKarma

There are 2 definitions of the word cult.
#1 and the most popular usage: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult
#2 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult_%28religion%29

The RC church is NOT a cult in the first sense. Using the "cult" word usually implies the first meaning making the reader balk at the statement "Cults are ordinary religions such as the Roman Catholic Church". If Morganite knew full well he was using the second lesser known usage then he goading the readers into an unnecessary discussion. But we have all seen what happens when we attempt to disagree with Morganite.

When someone uses words capable of several meanings, they ought to 'unpack' their terms. That would remove any possibility of misunderstanding.

The most popular usage of the word CULT is not the pejorative term, except among certain religious groups who use it to to this and speak ill of certain other religious groups with which they disagree. "CULT" is an ancient word to which the nasty sense is a very recent extension.

Words do change currency, but when serious academics, social scientists, and sociologists of religion use the word CULT, they do not use it in the cheap and tawdry way that the so-called anti-cult ministries use it.

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<I>But we have all seen what happens when we attempt to disagree with Morganite</I>

MORGANITE has not prevented anyone from disagreeing. But I will not be prevented from freely expressing my opinions. That is the purpose of this site. It is not your playground or your pulpit.

If it is your intention to stifle opposition to your own ideas, and to prevent freedom of speech, then perhaps it is not MORGANITE you ought to be concerned with.

I respect others' views when they are not my own, but your petty comment - "But we have all seen what happens when we attempt to disagree with Morganite" - signifies that you are intolerant of oppoition or contradiction.

What kind of debate is it if you are to insist that everyone agrees with NEEDKARMA or be denounced and in an insidious and thinly disguised way?

If you want to discuss matters, then discuss them, but for goodness sake stop acting like a spoiled brat whenever someone offers an opinion that you do not share.

MORGANITE

:eek:

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Originally Posted by NeedKarma

There are 2 definitions of the word cult.

Two definitions? I see now where your problem lies.

"A little Learning is a dang'rous Thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian Spring.
For sipping doth but fuddle up the brain,
But drinking deep doth clear it up again"

Definitions of cult:

* adherents of an exclusive system of religious beliefs and practices
* fad: an interest followed with exaggerated zeal;
* a system of religious beliefs and rituals; e.g. "the Roman Catholic cult of the Blessed Virgin Mary"
* In religion and sociology, a cult is a group of people (often a new religious movement) devoted to beliefs and goals which may be contradictory to those held by the majority of society. Its marginal status may come about either due to its novel belief system or due to idiosyncratic practices that cause the surrounding culture to regard it as far outside the mainstream.
* In traditional usage, the cult of a religion, quite apart from its sacred writings ("scriptures"), its theology or myths, or the personal faith of its believers, is the totality of external religious practice and observance, the neglect of which is the definition of impiety.
*Cult is literally the "care" owed to the god and the shrine, such as the Temple in Judaism.
* A religious group that follows a particular theological system.
* In the context of polemical Christianity, and in particular, CARM and other "anti-cult" ministries, such as Saints Alive in Jesus, Christian research Institute, Reachout Trust (ROT), Utah Lighthouse Ministries, and hundreds mnore like them who sell books and videotapes to Christians they have managed to frighten, it is a group that uses the Bible but distorts the doctrines that affect salvation sufficiently to cause salvation to be unattainable.

According to these groups, examples of cults are Mormonism, Jehovah's Witnesses, Christian Science, Christadelphians, Unity, Religious Science, The Way International, and the Moonies. In some Fundamental protestant movements, Roman catholics are also called 'cults,' and salvation is denied for them unless they become Protestants.

If you think they are wrong about the RCC, then they could be wrong about a lot more of those they condemn. Yes?

* (cult) (kult) a system of treating disease based on some special and unscientific theory of disease causation.
* Veneration ( or honoring ) of a saint expressed in public acts, local or universal, and formally approved by the Pope. More Roman Catholics in the 'cult' world that you say they do not inhabit! (The anti-Mormon outfit led by idiot ex-Momron Ed Decker - Saints Alive in Jesus - considers the RCC to be an occult demonic cult. Is Decker right or are you right?

* A religious group which denies the essential doctrines of Christianity. The term is usually reserved for groups founded after 1750.
* A following of people.
* (noun) often attributive [French & Latin; French culte, from Latin cultus care, adoration, from colere to cultivate -- more at WHEEL];

First appeared 1617

1 : formal religious veneration : WORSHIP Such as the RCC and Baptists, etc.

2 : a system of religious beliefs and ritual; also : its body of adherents Such as the RCC and the Lutherans

3 : a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious; also : its body of adherents Regarded by who as spurious? Who gets to decide?

4 : a system for the cure of disease based on dogma set forth by its promulgator <health ~s>

5 a : great devotion to a person, idea, object ... Such as Jesus Christ and his teachings?

Before you try to trounce someone with your superior knowledge -

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There are 2 definitions of the word cult.

- you ought at least do a little research to avoid looking foolish when you attack another person.

These subjects are sufficiently serious to deserve our best attention, wihthout letting niggles about the personalities of contributors become the engines that drive input.

MORGANITE

"Let there be light"

As you see many posters have an opinion and many points of view when it comes to their belief system or faith. We all reach our spiritual system in different ways, following many different paths.There is no right or wrong way to get to the God of your understanding only that you take the journey and find your own place that is comfortable to you.For many of us this is a lifetime journey that we learn as we go and grow.There is no need to be confused by definitions or declarations because you will encounter many different opinions of right and wrong.The beauty of it is you get to make up your own mind in chosing the path you take.I believe when you meet your maker you will be alone in his judgement and all the opinions of scholars and learned men will make no difference what so ever.You will be judged by Him and Him only for your own actions.Follow your own heart. :cool:

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Originally Posted by orange

NeedKarma, Thanks for the links! I was aware of the second, lesser-known usage of the word "cult"... but like you said, most people would be referring to the more common definition. I'm really not interested in arguing semantics with anyone, especially since I have a good friend who used to be in a cult of the first definition, and seen how much he and his family have suffered.

You're welcome. I hope that your friend is on the road to finding him/herself again. The word "cult" is seldom used in a favourable light and for good reason: its connotation over the years has changed to mean all the negative aspects detailed in that first link. To say that the RCC or any religion is a cult without specifying the usage of the term seems to be an attempt to inflame the readers for one reason or another - like you mentioned it's a catfight over semantics and who has time for that.

Cheers.

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Originally Posted by talaniman

As you see many posters have an opinion and many points of view when it comes to their belief system or faith. We all reach our spiritual system in different ways, following many different paths.There is no right or wrong way to get to the God of your understanding only that you take the journey and find your own place that is comfortable to you.For many of us this is a lifetime journey that we learn as we go and grow.There is no need to be confused by definitions or declarations because you will encounter many different opinions of right and wrong.The beauty of it is you get to make up your own mind in chosing the path you take.I believe when you meet your maker you will be alone in his judgement and all the opinions of scholars and learned men will make no difference what so ever.You will be judged by Him and Him only for your own actions.Follow your own heart. :cool:

How good it is to read your enlightened views on our separate spiritual paths.

MORGANITE

:)