Ask Me Help Desk - Debate on Porn

Just like any potentially addictive substance or act, it needs to be used, or viewed in moderation.

I truly feel that GOD's greatest creation was woman. From head to toe.

Ever since I found my Daddy's old Playboys in the attic, I have been a big fan of the female form. But now, at this stage of my life, I only have eyes for one, the mother of my children. And before the boys were born, she would renew my subscription to Playboy. Tasteful pornography is not a problem for us.

However, here is a quote to ponder:

". . . I've met a lot of men who were motivated to commit violence just like me. And without exception, every one of them was deeply involved in pornography . . . "

Ted Bundy in an interview with Dr. James Dobson shortly before his execution.

One problem with modern Playboy centerfolds is that they are now skinny and unnatural looking. Look at old copies from the 50s to the 70s and the women looked very beautiful and natural, but by the late 90s, they looked like barbie dolls, only with more plastic, fake tan, tattoos, etc. I can see why hardly anyone reads it anymore. The articles have also gone downhill. (Yes people did read the articles believe it or not!)

Quote:

Originally Posted by earl237

One problem with modern Playboy centerfolds is that they are now skinny and unnatural looking. Look at old copies from the 50s to the 70s and the women looked very beautiful and natural, but by the late 90s, they looked like barbie dolls, only with more plastic, fake tan, tattoos, etc. I can see why hardly anyone reads it anymore. The articles have also gone downhill. (Yes people did read the articles believe it or not!)

Haha they old "I only buy it for the articles" excuse ;)

Nah, my partner buys them on occasion, we have fun going through and picking the fake boobs out and picking our 'favourite' girl on each page...
The articles used to be good but as you said, even they aren't worth the read anymore, I don't think we have actually bought one for about 6 months, he used to get the old ones for free because he worked next to a newsagency.

But presumably Playboy is giving its readers what they want. So I think you have to ask why other men want that?

I just read the Linda Lovelace entry at Wikipedia. What an awful life she had. I see lots of efforts to discredit her, and I think anyone subjected to so much brutality and pain (psychic and physical) is bound to be an imperfect person given to deviousness and occasional lies (a survival skill), but I think the overall picture of total humiliation, degradation, and abuse by her pornographer husband is inescapable.

I believe that most successful pornography fosters the idea that men are entitled to have women and to take women with some degree of force if they are not willing and that women enjoy degradation, so it's "okay."

I have always been puzzled by the whole concept of the rape fantasy. I have the feeling that (some) men fantasize about raping women a lot more than women fantasize about being raped and that when women do have such fantasies, they are pretty tame compared to what men have in mind. I have never had any desire to be raped. And the times men have attempted it or coerced me in some fashion, I felt awful, just awful. I felt betrayed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shazamataz

The articles used to be good but as you said, even they aren't worth the read anymore,..

I am guessing this is a market problem. They may have lost circulation due to pornography on the internet, which means less ad revenue, which means less ability to hire good writers. I'm just surmising, but I know a little about the magazine business.

I read somewhere that 80% of the pornography industry is owned by organized crime. Is that true?

Hmm, this is interesting.. organised crime linked to porn :rolleyes:

I don't know, but I have read an article about employee misconduct in a tax thingy, and they were accessing porn from their governmental computers. According to that article (Washington times), one senior executive spent at least 331 days looking at porn and chatting online with nude or partially clad women without being detected.

I got that from a post of speechless, http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...-agency/print/

The rape fantasy is a common one among both men and women. I've never had that fantasy, probably because I lived the reality.

Porn is so easily accessible now, it wasn't back in the 50's, 60's, 70's, even the 80's and part of the 90's. Now you just have to type in a few words on Google and the sky's the limit. I would imagine that this would have a big impact on magazine and movie sales. It only makes sense, why pay if you can get it for free?

The scary thing is that the internet isn't regulated well enough. There is really no limit to what you can find. Child porn, hard core porn, videos of rape. It's a scary world and we're allowing it into our homes just by having internet access.

The regular porn, magazines, videos at the video store, although cheesy, they are mainstream and regulated. They go under scrutiny before being released to the public. The porn on the internet doesn't.

I think this is why we have so many people asking about porn and porn addiction, because we've made porn too available.

I posted this to another thread, but it seems relevant here, in terms of my question about organized crime.

Local News | Feds say prostitution rampant at strip clubs | Seattle Times Newspaper

Alty, are there surveys that show that a lot of women enjoy rape fantasies? I accept that some do. But I'm questioning whether there's actually good evidence that it's mainstream.

Quote:

Alty, are there surveys that show that a lot of women enjoy rape fantasies? I accept that some do. But I'm questioning whether there's actually good evidence that it's mainstream

I know it's a common fantasy, but mainstream, I'm not sure. I haven't seen any surveys, I'm just going by my friends, some of the posters on this site etc.

One thing that I find interesting when talking to people that do have this fantasy,there is one common theme. Although they're being raped, they are still in complete control of the situation.

Fantasy is fine, whatever floats your boat, but the reality of rape, I don't think many people understand it, unless they've lived through it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alty

Although they're being raped, they are still in complete control of the situation.

I find this hard to believe... :eek:

Thanks for the link asking! I'll check it soon.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unknown008

I find this hard to believe... :eek:

Thanks for the link asking! I'll check it soon.

That's their fantasy Unky, not the reality.

No one in their right mind would fantasize about an actual rape. Even a woman that hasn't been raped has some idea about what's involved.

The fantasy rape doesn't resemble a real rape. Most times it's just a man (always attractive, strong, a stranger) comes into your home and demands sex. You want to resist but you're also turned on. He rapes you but, in the fantasy you always have control. At least that's the common theme among the people I've talked to. Like I said, I don't have this particular fantasy, because I've experienced the reality of rape.

Ah, thanks for the 'enlightenment'. :)

I see that you're not as 'empty headed' as you said you are, but more like full of knowledge, fun and niceness ;). I know I know, don't look at me like that, I won't say it to anybody!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unknown008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alty
Although they're being raped, they are still in complete control of the situation.

I find this hard to believe... :eek:

Me, too. I don't get what that means. If they are "in control," how is it rape? Do they just mean an aggressive and enthusiastic male but the woman consents completely? That's not rape; that's fun!

I agree that it sounds like they don't really know what rape is...

Quote:

Originally Posted by asking

Me, too. I don't get what that means. If they are "in control," how is it rape? Do they just mean an aggressive and enthusiastic male but the woman consents completely? That's not rape; that's fun!

I agree that it sounds like they don't really know what rape is...

It's a rape fantasy, and because it's fantasy you are in control.

You're right, it's not really rape, not in the real sense of the word. It's a romantic version of rape, if there is such a thing.

It's not something I fantasize about so I really can't describe it, I can only tell you all what my friends that do have this fantasy say about it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unknown008

Ah, thanks for the 'enlightenment'. :)

I see that you're not as 'empty headed' as you said you are, but more like full of knowledge, fun and niceness ;). I know I know, don't look at me like that, I won't say it to anybody!

Empty headed? :confused: :eek:

I'm full of something, maybe it's knowledge. ;)

Now shhhh, don't tell anyone, it's our secret.

Alty, I didn't see your post explaining before I posted. I see better what they have in mind. Yeah, it is pretty far from a real rape. "They want to resist" sounds like they feel they should resist, which is pretty different. ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by asking

Alty, I didn't see your post explaining before I posted. I see better what they have in mind. Yeah, it is pretty far from a real rape. "They want to resist" sounds like they feel they should resist, which is pretty different. ;)

Exactly. It's a rape in the fact that it's a stranger, he's barging in, he's forcing himself on you but you're thrilled, know you should resist but you don't want to.

It's very far from an actual rape but it's still considered a rape fantasy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Altenweg

Empty headed? :confused: :eek:

I'm full of something, maybe it's knowledge. ;)

Now shhhh, don't tell anyone, it's our secret.

Yes, well, you said it in another way:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alty

I've come to the conclusion that I know nothing, or very little anyway. ;)

From social groups ;)

Back in a few!

AHHH! Unky, are you stalking me? ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Altenweg

It's very far from an actual rape but it's still considered a rape fantasy.

I think it's important to make that distinction. It's easy for some men to justify rape (or at least considering or condoning it) because they think "women secretly want it."

(I wish you had not been raped. :()

Quote:

Originally Posted by Altenweg

Exactly. It's a rape in the fact that it's a stranger, he's barging in, he's forcing himself on you but you're thrilled, know you should resist but you don't want to.

It's very far from an actual rape but it's still considered a rape fantasy.

You've just summarized the plotlines of half the Romance section at Barnes & Noble.

To say nothing of Romeo and Juliette. They both know they should resist but don't want to. Forbidden fruit and all that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by asking

I think it's important to make that distinction. It's easy for some men to justify rape (or at least considering or condoning it) because they think "women secretly want it."

(I wish you had not been raped. :()

I wish it hadn't happened too, but as my mother always said "If wishes were horses then paupers would ride". ;)

It was a long time ago. I was 18. It was a friend of an ex boyfriend and it happened in my house, in my bed, while my parents were away. I didn't have a snowballs chance in hell.

In a twisted sort of a way that rape lead me to where I am now. Actually, it's amazing, if you look back at your life, all the things you regret doing, or having had happen, you'll realize that everything has lead you to now. I like now. Now is good. :)

I can't change it, so I live with it. It's a part of who I am, and I like who I am. It doesn't define me, it's just something that happened to me. There are so many other things that I am, I'm not a victim, I'm a survivor, and I survive every day with my head held high.

I'm also a survivor of child molestation, which was a lot harder to overcome. That was at the hands of my cousin and lasted for years. But still, that doesn't define me. It's a small piece of my past, not a big chunk of my future.

I've overcome a lot of obstacles and I'm here, ready to leap over any obstacle put in my way. No sense sucking my thumb and crying over it, that won't change anything and then I lose. I choose to win.

:)

You forgot I was in the conversation too and your words there sort of just clicked in my mind Alty, I was not stalking!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unknown008

You forgot I was in the convo too and your words there sort of just clicked in my mind Alty, I was not stalking!

LOL!

I was just pulling your leg Unky. You know me, I like to tease. ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Altenweg

sucking my thumb
:)

Let me do that for you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catsmine

Let me do that for you.

:eek: Wrong thread! :eek:

Oh, what the heck. Here it is. :: offers thumb::

FYI, I just picked up dog poo. Sorry. :o

Quote:

Originally Posted by Altenweg

LOL!

I was just pulling your leg Unky. You know me, I like to tease. ;)

Yes, I know quite a part of you by now :)

I too was saying that in joke, no worry :p

Quote:

Originally Posted by Altenweg

:eek: Wrong thread! :eek:

Oh, what the heck. Here it is. :: offers thumb::

FYI, I just picked up dog poo. Sorry. :o

T'is okay to suck thumbs here, I allow you to :D

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unknown008

T'is okay to suck thumbs here, I allow you to :D

The moment passed, Unky. Not to worry.

A good friend of mine is very into the whole 'rape fantasy' thing.
She has never done it but very much would like to.
Her and her husband have a very open relationship, they are both allowed to sleep with other people as long as they have permission. She wants her husband to organise a friend of his to sneak into their house and have his way with her.
She doesn't want to know the time, date or person that is doing it, she just wants some sort of indication that it is not real (guy in the mask has a bowtie or something)

I do understand the attraction to it but I personally could never do it.

To add my 2 cents there also seems to be a hell of a lot of confusion when it comes to porn and even fantasies of how far people are willing to go.

Ive been subjected to porn from a young age, and I also don't mind watching porn as shazamataz said but that's where the fantasy stops for lack of better wording.

We have some friends that are into some pretty weird stuff
But whether they would actually go through with them, that's another story entirety!

Oh, well thanks Shazzy and Bahamut! :)

Weird, isn't it how some people want to get raped, and think that is some kind of pleasant thing, or good thing for them, the way I see it anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unknown008

Oh, well thanks Shazzy and Bahamut! :)

Weird, isn't it how some people want to get raped, and think that is some kind of pleasant thing, or good thing for them, the way I see it anyway.

I think it's really a non-alcoholic way of shedding inhibitions. The old "It's not my fault, I was forced to" argument.

Hmm, I think I get your point...

Sort of want it, but not letting everyone else know that 'you' want it because this sort of 'downgrades' 'you', so 'you' look for some excuse to be able to experience it.

Exactly. If you have no choice but to have sex, then you are free to have sex without feeling guilty about it.

A solution to the Puritan attitude of repression.

Phew! I didn't think people had to do this kind of thing anymore.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catsmine

My children were exposed to porn as infants. It was on while they were going to sleep. To this day, it knocks them out faster than a political speech.

?

I'm sorry but I find this disturbing.
If it was anyone else everyone would have jumped all over it.
Exposing children to pornography is a form of child abuse and disgusting.
Infant or not growing minds do not need this exposure.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zippit

I'm sorry but I find this disturbing.
If it was anyone else everyone would have jumped all over it.
exposing children to pornography is a form of child abuse and disgusting.
infant or not growing minds do not need this exposure.

What do you find disgusting about naked people making love?

Quote:

Originally Posted by zippit

I'm sorry but I find this disturbing.
If it was anyone else everyone would have jumped all over it.
exposing children to pornography is a form of child abuse and disgusting.
infant or not growing minds do not need this exposure.

Are you thinking that Cats exposed his children to hard core porn?

I was raised with very German parents. In Germany nudity and sex aren't kept in the closet like they are in the States and Canada. Because of this most teens aren't that eager to have sex, because it's not something mysterious that has been hidden from them all their lives.

It's a lot like alcohol. The legal drinking age in Germany is 14 (not the hard stuff, but beer, wine etc) and because of this early exposure most teens get it out of their system by the time they're 18.

So let me ask you a question.

I don't run and hide if I'm naked and my 11 year old son is coming into my room. It's my body, there's nothing to be ashamed about. If he's uncomfortable with it then he knows not to come into my room when I'm just out of the shower or changing.

He isn't uncomfortable with it, because he grew up with it. After all, we all have a body, and underneath our clothing we're all naked. Because of this he's not one of those children that needs to make it his life mission to see a girl naked. A lot of people think that I'm wrong, that I should quickly cover myself if my son happens to walk in while I'm naked. Why, so I can teach him that the naked body is a scary thing? I don't think so.

No, I don't let my kids watch porn, nor do I invite them into the bedroom when my husband and I are having sex, but, if they have questions, I answer them. I'd rather they hear it from me then their friends that think that babies come from storks or the cabbage patch. Misinformation is the reason we have so many teens posting on AMHD about pregnancy and other sexually related things that should be common knowledge.

I have a video tape of my daughter being born. Around 2 years ago, when my son was 9 and my daughter was 5, I was watching the tape. We were going through our videos to put them on an actual video tape and I got all nostalgic when I saw the birth video, sat down to watch. My son walked in, I paused the tape. Not because I was ashamed, but because I thought it might upset him. I had an episiotomy and there was a lot of blood.

I told him what the video was, that it may scare him and that it was his choice to watch or not. He called his sister in. I told her the same thing. They decided to watch and I sat back with my hand on the remote ready to stop if they found it too disturbing. They loved it. They found it amazing. To this day they ask to see it every once in a while. My son is actually upset that we don't have a video of him being born. We didn't have a camera then. :(

Am I a bad parent? What's your opinion?