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-   -   Adult bipolar son refuses to leave home (https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/showthread.php?t=348762)

  • May 2, 2009, 10:10 AM
    BlueMoodsNJustin
    Adult bipolar son refuses to leave home
    I don't know if "Family Law" is the right forum, if not please direct me to the approirate area.

    I am a single mother in Florida. My only child is a 20 year old young man who lives with me. I love him more than anything on the planet but his bipolar disorder and refusal to seek help, along with the way he treats me (bullying, verbally abusive, breaking/throwing/smashing my possessions when the bipolar rage gets the best of him) is taking its toll on me mentally, emotionally and even physically. I don't feel that I am helping him by allowing him to live with me under those conditions. But it seems like my hands are tied.

    Here's what I have found so far as to why it is next to impossible to get him out of my home:

    Police told me that I can't just tell him to "get out" or have him escorted out because it's "his home too." The fact that he contributes absolutely nothing to this household is beside the point apparently.

    Police told me I would need to give him a written eviction notice but I can't for the following reasons:
    1. I don't own my home, I rent. According to our local Clerk of Court I would need to get my landlord to do the eviction; a written eviction notice from me would have no legal standing in court.
      1. Even if an eviction notice from were legal and binding, my son has threatened to demolish everything I own in retaliation.
    2. My son's name is not on the lease therefore I'm not even sure that my landlord could legally evict him.
    3. Even if the landlord has the right to evict him I would be fined $100 for every month that he has been living in my home without his name on the lease. I've been here over a year so we're looking over $1000, which I don't have right now!


    A police officer had told me that my son could be arrested and/or Baker Acted (involuntary confined psychaitric evaluation) if he were hurting himself, or me, or damaging my property.

    Last night he broke a floor lamp by hurling it across the room in a rage. I have had to replace 3 lamps, 1 ceiling light fixture, and a stereo in the last year. Other things have been damaged as well but I haven't replaced them because they weren't essential items and money is tight. And some things can't be replaced, like my mother's china...

    At any rate I finally called the police; my son had left by the time they arrived and they said there was really nothing they could do unless he was physically abusing me. I was shocked. When I stated that he destroyed MY lamp, stereo, etc. they informed me that those things were HIS as well since he lives here and it's not against the law to destroy your own possessions. My son returned while the officer was still here and the officer told him that he should contact a mental health agency to see if he can get assistance with getting back on his medications and getting treatment (he has no insurance and currently no income) He agreed to make the calls but as soon as the officer was out of earshot told me he has no intention of calling anyone. He can't see where he has a problem and that I'm the one who probably needs psyciatric help.

    So like I said it seems to me that I am stuck and my hands are tied unless my son moves out voluntarily, which he won't do as that would mean he'd have to go out and find (and KEEP) a job. If what the police and Clerk of Court have told me then my son pretty much has free reign to live in my home, eat my food, use (and destroy) my possessions and there is little or nothing I can do about it. Yet at the same time I a living in a powder keg and never know from minute to minute or day to day when I will be verbally attacked, threatened, bullied, etc IN THE HOME THAT I PAY FOR AND MAINTAIN. I fail to see how that is right and fair to me as the head of this household and the sole provider.

    Would an attorney possibly be able to find some way to help me out of this mess? And if so what are the chances that I might be able to find one who would take me on Pro Bono? I have very little money and will be unemployed due to layoffs within the next two months.

    I just really need an advocate... I've heard everything I could ever want to know about my son's rights as a resident in my home but where do MY rights come into it?? And who will help me to assert and stand up for my rights??

    I do need to state that my son is savvy enough and "smart" enough to only use his bullying and verbal abuse tactics when there are no witnessess therefore it's basically his word against mine that these things actually do happen. I might be able to get more help from law enforcement if it was somehow documented...

    Thanks for hearing me vent and any advice on whom I should contact is greatly appreciated.
  • May 2, 2009, 10:33 AM
    Wondergirl

    In this area, we have a pro bono/sliding scale law group that would listen to your plea and assign you a legal representative. Also, Catholic Charities or Lutheran Social Services would assign you a social worker as advocate and counselor.

    Where generally do you live? I'm a librarian and a counselor and would be willing to do some research for you.
  • May 2, 2009, 10:37 AM
    BlueMoodsNJustin
    I live in Daytona Beach, FL. In the searching/researching I've done I've seen everything from "It's your house, your rules, if he doesn't like it then tell him to get out" to "It's his house too and he has rights". But I tend more to believe what I've been told by law enforcement and court officials.

    But any concrete information you could find, from who I can turn to for help, guidance, advice and advocacy, to what exactly MY rights are as the sole provider of this home would be greatly appreciated.

    I gave my son an ultimatum this morning to get up and clean the mess he made with his rage last night, go with me to get a replacement lamp, and call the mental health facility or I will be calling Legal Aid come Monday morning. He refused so my next stpe is to do just what I said I would do. I'll also contact Catholic Charities to see if they can assist me at all. Thanks for that, I never would have thought of them. I always associate them with adoption and foster parenting issues.
  • May 2, 2009, 10:40 AM
    pathisfer
    Just a suggestion, but why don't you just move since you are renting? It may be less time consuming and less expensive than going through the courts and dealing with attorneys. Find another place to rent and you have a built in eviction notice from the landlord and don't give him the keys to your new place. He'll be forced to move out legally by the landlord (not you kicking him out) and he'll have to get help for his mental issues or a job on his own! It removes you from the whole process and seems like a lot less hassle overall.
  • May 2, 2009, 10:41 AM
    Sunflowers

    This is such a difficult situation to be in. I think it would help to look at this from the future. Long run he is always going to be your son and no matter how much he hurts you, you are going to still love him and that makes it all the harder.

    Sadly there are no laws that force bipolar people to take care of their mental health. You do need a lawyer. A lawyer could help you get him out of your house and into a hospital for treatment. The really sad thing is that your son is more likely than not to reject treatment and end up in jail. You could try legal aid or if you have a university nearby you could try the law department for possible pro bono.
  • May 2, 2009, 10:44 AM
    BlueMoodsNJustin
    I've actually considered doing just that but it's not practical or feasible at this time because I don't have the several thousand dollars I would need to move and also I'm in the middle of a year lease which I would have to buy out of.

    And then the fact that it really sticks in my craw that this person, son or no son, who thinks he is due free room and board at my expense, could have the "power" to drive me out of my little corner of the world which I truly love.

    I'm not saying it won't eventually come to that but only want to look at it as a VERY last resort.
  • May 2, 2009, 10:54 AM
    BlueMoodsNJustin
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Sunflowers View Post
    This is such a difficult situation to be in. I think it would help to look at this from the future. Long run he is always going to be your son and no matter how much he hurts you, you are going to still love him and that makes it all the harder.

    Sadly there are no laws that force bipolar people to take care of their mental health. You do need a lawyer. A lawyer could help you get him out of your house and into a hospital for treatment. The really sad thing is that your son is more likely than not to reject treatment and end up in jail. You could try legal aid or if you have a university nearby you could try the law department for possible pro bono.

    It is as you say a very hard situation. My heart breaks that I have to choose between my mental and physical health over the son I love so much. I'm in tears as I'm writing this.

    However, there's really not much more I can do to help him. Sure I could try to deal with the abuse he heaps on me and not react to it (which I do try but it always gets to the breaking point eventually), tiptoe on eggshells to try to avoid setting him off and silently be his "maid" to avoid confrontations over his unwillingness to even pick up after himself. And in the long run all that will do is reinforce in his mind that he has no responsibilities whatsoever, which at least for most of us is not the case in the real world.

    I know he won't seek out treatment without a court order, and even then he can't be "court ordered" to respond positively to the treatment. You can lead a horse to water...

    But at the same time I can't shelter him from the realities of adulthood and this sounds cold on my part but if he refuses to take responsibility for himself and his actions (instead of blaming me for everything that has ever gone wrong in his life) and then taking steps to improve his life not to mention our relationship, then I am spinning my wheels and wasting my money, time, and emotion and all three are right now in very short supply!
  • May 2, 2009, 11:04 AM
    Sunflowers

    You can't make him get help. You might be able to get him temporarily hospitalized, but long term he will most likely reject it. You are doing the right thing. You love him but you have to save yourself!! He can choose to ruin his life, don't let him ruin yours too. Of course it will hurt because you love him but it will hurt a lot more if you let him stay.
  • May 2, 2009, 12:50 PM
    stevetcg

    You can evict him. Give him a 15 day written notice of eviction (15 days in Brevard, check local laws) and then go to court for eviction.

    YOU are his landlord since he is not on the lease. Check out the real estate law board - there are many threads on this issue.
  • May 2, 2009, 02:16 PM
    Fr_Chuck

    Of course you can evict him, your name is on the lease, so you lease the home, your son is a sub lease or basically a renter from you, even if he does not pay rent, So you can as noted merely give him a notice ( in writing) to move.

    Also he should be in jail, and you could have gotten a protective order against him, which would stop him from returning to the home.

    The police can not do anything to make him move unless you evice.
    ** of course they can't do anything if you just lock him out either. Only he could sue you then for a illegal eviction.

    So time to stop talking to some police officer that has no idea.
  • May 2, 2009, 02:22 PM
    Wondergirl

    I'm wondering how punitive he will be, breaking and smashing her stuff in retaliation (as he has done before). What could safeguard her stuff and even her person, especially with an eviction?
  • May 2, 2009, 05:25 PM
    BlueMoodsNJustin
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by stevetcg View Post
    You can evict him. Give him a 15 day written notice of eviction (15 days in Brevard, check local laws) and then go to court for eviction.

    YOU are his landlord since he is not on the lease. Check out the real estate law board - there are many threads on this issue.

    That's what I would have thought. Actually I would have thought that since I am footing almost the entire bill to maintain a roof over our heads (not counting the $25 a week he was giving me during the short time he was acutally working) that no formal eviction would be necessary in the first place, but the Volusia County Clerk of Court herself told me that the eviction would have to come from the landlord and that an eviction notice from me would have no legal standing.

    That's why at this point I think my best option is to consult an attorney. I don't know what my legal options are but there has to be a way to get him out of my home without a lot of "bloodshed."
  • May 2, 2009, 05:29 PM
    cdad

    Another thing is that the next time he acts up have him committed for 72 hrs. Let them take him. Let them give him an evaluation. He needs it.
  • May 2, 2009, 05:36 PM
    BlueMoodsNJustin
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    I'm wondering how punitive he will be, breaking and smashing her stuff in retaliation (as he has done before). What could safeguard her stuff and even her person, especially with an eviction?


    I've wondered the same thing. In fact a while ago when we discussed the possibility of my evicting him he stated point blank that he would do everything in his power to wreak as much hell on my life as he could from the time the eviction was served until it was executed. I'm not totally worried about my physical safety, he's very cunning and knows just how far he can go without doing something he could be jailed for. He did specifically mention that he would make as much noise when I'm trying to sleep at night as humanly possible, that sort of thing. There's also the off chance that a stray flying object could strike me but beyond that I doubt seriously that he would harm me physically although I do feel he is capable of doing just that. He's a master at the passive-aggressive thing.

    He also is slick and smart enough to not make any kind of threats like that in someone else's hearing. So it could end up being a matter of his word against mine.

    I'm more worried about the wear and tear on my mental state and how that would affect my performance at work.

    Assuming the worst that 15 day notice would be a nightmare to say the least.
  • May 2, 2009, 05:43 PM
    stevetcg
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by BlueMoodsNJustin View Post
    That's what I would have thought. Actually I would have thought that since I am footing almost the entire bill to maintain a roof over our heads (not counting the $25 a week he was giving me during the short time he was acutally working) that no formal eviction would be necessary in the first place, but the Volusia County Clerk of Court herself told me that the eviction would have to come from the landlord and that an eviction notice from me would have no legal standing.

    That's why at this point I think my best option is to consult an attorney. I don't know what my legal options are but there has to be a way to get him out of my home without a lot of "bloodshed."

    You are the landlord.
  • May 2, 2009, 05:43 PM
    BlueMoodsNJustin
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by califdadof3 View Post
    Another thing is that the next time he acts up have him commited for 72 hrs. Let them take him. Let them give him an evaluation. He needs it.

    That's what I asked the officer to do last night. In Florida it's called the Baker Act... any officer of the law or the court has the power to have someone committed for a minimum of 72 hours if they are posing a threat to themselves or others.

    The officer told me that in order for him to Baker Act my son he would have had to witness his behavior first hand; and of course my son was long gone by the time the police got to my door. And when he did come home he seemed subdued and calm and therefore not a threat. Hence, no Baker Act.

    Oh and the police officer told me that I could take him to the hospital to Baker Act him myself but only if he went willingly. My understanding is that only an officer of the court or law enforcement has the authority to commit an adult against their will.
  • May 2, 2009, 05:53 PM
    BlueMoodsNJustin
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by stevetcg View Post
    You can evict him. Give him a 15 day written notice of eviction (15 days in Brevard, check local laws) and then go to court for eviction.

    YOU are his landlord since he is not on the lease. Check out the real estate law board - there are many threads on this issue.

    Steve I don't know if you are in Volusia County or not but would you happen to know if Community Legal Services of Mid-Florida (basically Legal Aid) handles these kinds of cases?
  • May 2, 2009, 06:42 PM
    Fr_Chuck

    First evictions are easy, normally the clerk has a fill in the blank form for you to file.

    And you are his landlord, and the property owner is your landlord.

    Each legal aid does different levels of service often depending on the amount of work load and their staffing, you have to contact them.
  • May 2, 2009, 06:55 PM
    Wondergirl
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by BlueMoodsNJustin View Post
    Steve I don't know if you are in Volusia County or not but would you happen to know if Community Legal Services of Mid-Florida (basically Legal Aid) handles these kinds of cases?

    According to their web site, they do this:

    Family Law
    Estate & Probate
    Landlord/Tenant Consumer Law
    Tort Defense Real Property
    Wills
    Pro Se Divorce Clinics
    Legal Clinics Bankruptcy
    Employment Guardianships
    Courthouse Assistance Projects
    Community Education Presentations
    Social Security
    Personal Injury
    Collections
    Family/Civil Mediation
  • May 2, 2009, 07:18 PM
    artlady

    I think you could get an order of protection anywhere in the U.S. as clearly ,you are being subjected to abuse.

    If you go to the court and petition the court for an order of protection they must act on it.

    I am giving you a link for social network to assist in elder abuse,abuse by children is included in this link.

    Please also link to the domestic violence hot line they will help you.They will also give you resources to help your son. I am so sorry for your pain.

    National Domestic Violence Hotline
    Elder Abuse Resources : The Zero 5.0laf - The Official Website of Andrew Vachss
  • May 2, 2009, 08:53 PM
    Sunflowers
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    According to their web site, they do this:

    Family Law
    Estate & Probate
    Landlord/Tenant Consumer Law
    Tort Defense Real Property
    Wills
    Pro Se Divorce Clinics
    Legal Clinics Bankruptcy
    Employment Guardianships
    Courthouse Assistance Projects
    Community Education Presentations
    Social Security
    Personal Injury
    Collections
    Family/Civil Mediation

    If she could get these people on her case it would be great. Sounds like they could help with all the problems she has. Including possibly getting the adult son into hosp/treatment and application for Social Security. If she could get him on Social Security he'd also qualify for affordable housing even if he was too irresponsible to be able to work.
  • May 2, 2009, 09:15 PM
    BlueMoodsNJustin
    I will be calling them as well as Catholic Charities this week. If not Monday then Tuesday because I am off on Tuesdays so can devote the entire day if need be.

    I also saw when looking at the local Catholic Charities website they apparently have some mental health resources. I will find out what I can but whether my son pursues it is his decision and out of my hands.

    My situation still isn't good but it is sure seems a lot less hopeless tonight than it did last night. Thanks everyone for your informative and supportive messages! I will keep you posted on any progress or changes.

    And I'm sure I'll be back venting as well because I seem to get more support from forums like these than from my IRL friends.

    I'm locking up and going to try and get some sleep so you have a great night. Talk to you soon!
  • May 2, 2009, 10:32 PM
    artlady
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by BlueMoodsNJustin View Post
    I will be calling them as well as Catholic Charities this week. If not Monday then Tuesday because I am off on Tuesdays so can devote the entire day if need be.

    I also saw when looking at the local Catholic Charities website they apparently have some mental health resources. I will find out what I can but whether my son pursues it is his decision and out of my hands.

    My situation still isn't good but it is sure seems a lot less hopeless tonight than it did last night. Thanks everyone for your informative and supportive messages! I will keep you posted on any progress or changes.

    And I'm sure I'll be back venting as well because I seem to get more support from forums like these than from my IRL friends.

    I'm locking up and going to try and get some sleep so ya'll have a great night. Talk to you soon!

    Please know we will help you as much as we can and your son as well.
  • May 3, 2009, 08:06 AM
    cdad
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by BlueMoodsNJustin View Post
    I will be calling them as well as Catholic Charities this week. If not Monday then Tuesday because I am off on Tuesdays so can devote the entire day if need be.

    I also saw when looking at the local Catholic Charities website they apparently have some mental health resources. I will find out what I can but whether my son pursues it is his decision and out of my hands.

    My situation still isn't good but it is sure seems a lot less hopeless tonight than it did last night. Thanks everyone for your informative and supportive messages! I will keep you posted on any progress or changes.

    And I'm sure I'll be back venting as well because I seem to get more support from forums like these than from my IRL friends.

    I'm locking up and going to try and get some sleep so ya'll have a great night. Talk to you soon!


    Please keep us posted when you can. We appreciate the feedback.
    Good Luck !
  • May 3, 2009, 08:35 AM
    nitelight198073
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by BlueMoodsNJustin View Post
    i've wondered the same thing. In fact a while ago when we discussed the possibility of my evicting him he stated point blank that he would do everything in his power to wreak as much hell on my life as he could from the time the eviction was served until it was executed. I'm not totally worried about my physical safety, he's very cunning and knows just how far he can go without doing something he could be jailed for. He did specifically mention that he would make as much noise when I'm trying to sleep at night as humanly possible, that sort of thing. There's also the off chance that a stray flying object could strike me but beyond that I doubt seriously that he would harm me physically although I do feel he is capable of doing just that. He's a master at the passive-aggressive thing.

    He also is slick and smart enough to not make any kind of threats like that in someone else's hearing. So it could end up being a matter of his word against mine.

    I'm more worried about the wear and tear on my mental state and how that would affect my performance at work.

    Assuming the worst that 15 day notice would be a nightmare to say the least.

    Is there any record of his bi-polar and destrutive tendencies... if so the police and such are possobly more liable to believe you over him
  • May 3, 2009, 03:03 PM
    BlueMoodsNJustin
    It's not so much a matter of if they believe him or me but the officer said unless he witnessed it firsthand he couldn't take any action. I think maybe if there were a 3rd party witness maybe he cuold have but I'm not certain.
  • May 3, 2009, 04:21 PM
    nitelight198073
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by BlueMoodsNJustin View Post
    It's not so much a matter of if they believe him or me but the officer said unless he witnessed it firsthand he couldn't take any action. I think maybe if there were a 3rd party witness maybe he cuold have but I'm not certain.

    Wow that bites
  • May 3, 2009, 04:28 PM
    Fr_Chuck

    Domestic violence, if there is any sign, hole in a wall, item broken in the home, the police officer has a legal obligation to act. To arrest the suspected person.
  • May 3, 2009, 04:49 PM
    twinkiedooter

    Don't you have any immediate neighbors who have witnessed his performances before? Would any of those folks be willing to help you out with this eyewitness testimony?

    Living with a bipolar is worse than living with a volcano set ontop of a huge propane tank waiting to explode. I lived with one and I can very well comiserate with your perdicament.

    Right now he has no money with which to support himself. I am very surprised if he is cycling as quickly as he seems to be cycling that you have not applied for Social Security Disability for him a LONG time ago. He just didn't get like this overnight. It will take months to get approved, but if you have taken pictures of his "performances" of the broken items and present them at his administrative law judge hearing about his disability he would get a monthly disability check. It won't be a whole heck of a lot, but it will be his money he can use to live on.

    It also sounds like he's been doing illegal drugs as most bipolars who really perform like to take illegal drugs or alcohol to enhance their performances.

    You can't live your life continually walking on egg shells waiting for the next time he "blows up" and physically beats you to a pulp. You are very correct when you say that he is extremely smart and manipulative. They are.

    When you are laid off and have no income to keep replacing items that he trashes of yours, if he decides to trash out the apartment the landlord may just evict you regardless of what you say. Landlords don't like their apts trashed.

    If you are friendly with one or two of your neighbors talk to them about having them call the police when they hear him "perform" in your apt the next time he does and have them either come over to the apt and look in the windows or meet the police and have them tell the police about his trashing things. I am sure the police have your name and his name and address already in their system as him being a bipolar and know exactly what to expect when they show up.
  • May 3, 2009, 08:03 PM
    BlueMoodsNJustin
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by twinkiedooter View Post
    When you are laid off and have no income to keep replacing items that he trashes of yours, if he decides to trash out the apartment the landlord may just evict you regardless of what you say. Landlords don't like their apts trashed.

    If you are friendly with one or two of your neighbors talk to them about having them call the police when they hear him "perform" in your apt the next time he does and have them either come over to the apt and look in the windows or meet the police and have them tell the police about his trashing things. I am sure the police have your name and his name and address already in their system as him being a bipolar and know exactly what to expect when they show up.

    Actually I won't be totally without income as I am eligible for unemployment but still...

    But actually I'm not so worried about him doing physical damage to the apartment. That's not to say it can't or won't ever happen but he seems to be at least in enough control to limit his "trashing" to my personal belongings.

    As for witnesses there were none. Being the slick manipulator that he is he always manages to "lose control" when no one is around or within earshot.

    And I'm not completely sure if his frequent rages are real bipolar cycling or just extreme anger towards me that is just under the surface waiting to erupt at the least provocation. Maybe some of both?

    All I know is whatever the cause our relationship has deteriorated maybe beyond repair. He demonstrates practically no friendliness towards me unless he is "kissing up" because he wants something. He makes it obvious that he has little or no respect for me as a human being, let alone as his mother. It's very hard living in such a negative and hostile environment and the only way I can see to change is is to simply remove him from my home, possibly my life until/unless he a) does something constructive with his own life and b) decides he wants a relationship with me that is based on mutual love, friendship, affection and respect.
  • May 4, 2009, 06:26 AM
    stevetcg
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by BlueMoodsNJustin View Post
    As for witnesses there were none. Being the slick manipulator that he is he always manages to "lose control" when no one is around or within earshot.

    That is inconsistent with bipolarism. Sounds more to me like he is just abusive towards you and uses excuses that cause you to be more sympathetic than you would if he was just being insolent.

    My recommendation would be to file for a restraining/protective order and let the court sort out if he has an actual medical issue or not. Because frankly, a medical issue is no excuse.

    Sorry I was unable to answer your questions about legal aid. I am glad some of the other regulars were able to help you find the information you needed.

    Best of luck and keep us posted.
  • May 4, 2009, 02:28 PM
    Sunflowers

    The son's behavior is consistent with hypomanic phase of bipolar.
  • May 4, 2009, 03:36 PM
    BlueMoodsNJustin
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Sunflowers View Post
    The son's behavior is consistant with hypomanic phase of bipolar.

    I too have wondered for years how much of his behavior towards me is based on a mental disorder and how much is just anger and hostility.

    Sunflowers are you saying that his ability to somewhat pick when/where he loses it IS characteristic of bipolar disorder?

    He does go off sometimes on his friends, and he and his boyfriend fight like cats and dogs but never to the severity that he uses on me. But those episodes don't last and his friends seem better able to tolerate it, for several possible reasons. They don't live with him, they haven't been dealing with this for almost 20 years, and their relationships aren't as strained as his and my relationship. Although he did have a lenthy online friendship with a young man in NYC and last summer this young man was kind enough to fly my son up there for a two week visit, all expenses paid. Julio couldn't take any time off form work so at those times my son would explore the city and ended up meeting two or three other new "friends." Eventually he started blowing Julio off to hang out with his new buddies which of course caused a lot of friction and ultimately Julio told my son 3 days before he was to come home that he would have to stay somewhere else for the rest of his visit. I've talked with Julio and my son's behavior towards him was strikingly similar to what I get from him, and of course my son blames Julio completely (also typical)

    Here's another thought/question: can these outbursts be triggered by certain people, places, events, etc which would make sense to me so that he might be more prone to "go off" on me as opposed to someone else because of the anger and resentment towards me where he wouldn't be as prone to lose it in other environments?

    BTW I didn't get to call Legal Aid today as their office is closed during my lunch break which is the only time during the work day I can make lenghtly phone calls. I'm off tomorrow however and will be calling them first thing in the morning.
  • May 4, 2009, 04:00 PM
    Sunflowers
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by BlueMoodsNJustin View Post
    I too have wondered for years how much of his behavior towards me is based on a mental disorder and how much is just anger and hostility.

    Sunflowers are you saying that his ability to somewhat pick and choose when/where he loses it IS characteristic of bipolar disorder?
    I believe YES because in a hypomanic phase they have the ability to improvise easily, quickly on the spot.

    He does go off sometimes on his friends, and he and his boyfriend fight like cats and dogs but never to the severity that he uses on me. But those episodes don't last and his friends seem better able to tolerate it, for several possible reasons. They don't live with him, they haven't been dealing with this for almost 20 years, and their relationships aren't as strained as his and my relationship. Although he did have a lenthy online friendship with a young man in NYC and last summer this young man was kind enough to fly my son up there for a two week visit, all expenses paid. Julio couldn't take any time off form work so at those times my son would explore the city and ended up meeting two or three other new "friends." Eventually he started blowing Julio off to hang out with his new buddies which of course caused alot of friction and ultimately Julio told my son 3 days before he was to come home that he would have to stay somewhere else for the rest of his visit. I've talked with Julio and my son's behavior towards him was strikingly similar to what I get from him, and of course my son blames Julio completely (also typical)

    This is also typical hypomanic behavior and response of becoming impatient or hostile when questioned or not getting what he wants.

    Here's another thought/question: can these outbursts be triggered by certain people, places, events, etc which would make sense to me so that he might be more prone to "go off" on me as opposed to someone else because of the anger and resentment towards me where he wouldn't be as prone to lose it in other enviroments?

    Yes its true, usually the parent or spouse is blamed by the bipolar for ALL or most of their problelms.

    BTW I didn't get to call Legal Aid today as their office is closed during my lunch break which is the only time during the work day I can make lenghtly phone calls. I'm off tomorrow however and will be calling them first thing in the morning.

    What age was your son diagnosed, just curious? Often times bipolar disorder is worse around the age your son is now.

    It is also possible he could be cycling between hypomania and mania.
  • May 4, 2009, 04:02 PM
    simoneaugie

    He goes off on you when nobody else can see or hear it? That is the typical behavior of someone who benefits from being abusive. If his manipulation and abuse were common knowledge, it would be much more difficult for him to exert control over you.

    If this were your life partner instead of your son would you react differently? If your next-door-neighbor came to you for help saying that her husband was behaving this way, what advise would you give?

    My ex-husband did this to me. He would also break things that he knew were precious to me. Then told me it was my fault because I had made him angry. My family and friends only saw what a nice guy he was in public. They couldn't believe that I was complaining about him or that it was really, really bad and escalating.

    I got one of those tape recorders that is activated by sound. After I'd recorded several episodes of his behind-closed-doors behavior, I played it for my family. They helped me get out of there immediately. The tape wasn't admissible in court of course but provided evidence that brought emotional support.
  • May 4, 2009, 04:04 PM
    Sunflowers

    Sorry that isn't easy to read

    I believe YES because in a hypomanic phase they have the ability to improvise easily, quickly on the spot.

    This is also typical hypomanic behavior and response of becoming impatient or hostile when questioned or not getting what he wants.

    Yes its true, usually the parent or spouse is blamed by the bipolar for ALL or most of their problelms.

    I hope that is easier.
  • May 5, 2009, 12:32 PM
    BlueMoodsNJustin

    Got some really good info today but he's at home right now so will update this evening or tomorrow.

    Just the info alone, without having even acted on it, has lifted a 2 ton weight off my shoulders.

    More later!
  • May 5, 2009, 07:03 PM
    BlueMoodsNJustin

    So here's what I found out today:

    First of all Legal Aid does provide free legal advice, but not legal representation. Thankfully I shouldn't need legal representation anyway.

    I'm not looking an an eviction because this is not a landlord-tenant situation. The action that suits my situation is called "ejectment" (never heard of that before today) which deals with an entitled person (home owner, renter, etc) vs. someone who is being allowed to live there but is not legally entitled.

    It's a legal process where I have to file the ejectment, my son would be served and have 20 days to answer the summons. If he doesn't answer or contest then the motion would be granted pretty much automatically. If he did contest then there would be a court hearing. And my landlord doesn't come into the equation at all. I made a point of asking that since if he became involved could possibly have repurcussions on me either being evicted or having to pay the fine I mentioned in my original post.

    Of course that isn't free, it's $275 to file and $20 to have the papers served. I'm taking up a collection, dontations may be sent to my email address and I take all major credit cards LOL.

    Dummy me forgot to ask what my recourse would be should my son after being served decide to retaliate by smashing all my belongings. Got to call them back asap for the answer on that one.
  • May 5, 2009, 08:51 PM
    Wondergirl
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by BlueMoodsNJustin View Post
    Dummy me forgot to ask what my recourse would be should my son after being served decide to retaliate by smashing all my belongings. Gotta call them back asap for the answer on that one.

    Yeah, that's the part that especially worries me. Let us know when you find out something.

    Great fact-finding work!
  • May 6, 2009, 06:13 AM
    stevetcg
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by BlueMoodsNJustin View Post
    Dummy me forgot to ask what my recourse would be should my son after being served decide to retaliate by smashing all my belongings. Gotta call them back asap for the answer on that one.

    Have him arrested and don't bail him out.

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