My 5 yr old son was paddled by the principal I have several problems about this and would like any help or suggestions.
1.) I signed the form to allow him to be paddled but I wrote in very noticeable informing them that before he was to be paddled they must first call and tell me what he is being paddled for. I live 2 miles from the school.

2.) my son received a paddling by the principal which left a very red and raised mark on him 5 hours later. I do have pictures. The principal paddled him at nap time (after lunch). He got around to calling me to inform me he was paddled at 4:00 pm.

3.) he was paddled on Tuesday by the teacher for hitting a child and used the restroom on the wall. I went talked to the teacher on Wednesday and also sent a note telling her he was not to be paddled again. I made it very clear I expected to be called before hand.

4.) the principal had the teacher walk him over to the office on Friday and he was paddled again. This is when he left the marks. This is the best part the teacher never told him she already paddled him nor did she stop it. So the principal left marks on my 5 yr old child by accident. It took him 3 days to get around to handling it and he was 4 hours late on calling to get permission since they were told not to at all.

What should I do and how should I handle this?

You call an attorney. Explain all this. While you signed an authorization granting the paddling, you did not agree to excessive paddling and you say you also had stated you were to be notified before punishment was administered. Get a lawyer on this ASAP!

Take your child out of that school if you can, at the very least, rescind your authorization for the paddling.

Note: Did you take pictures of the marks? Did you take your son to a doctor? Use anything like that to bolster your argument and to provid evidence.

Your first step should be getting an attorney ASAP. Have you contacted the Superintendent? That should be your second step.

Thank you for your response. I have talked with the superintendent and the school board had a meeting tonight. I went to the meeting but with it being such last minute the board said it would be best to let them add me to the agenda for the next meeting. I agreed to do that. I figured that would give me time to find an attorney. I did send a note and told the teacher and principal that my son was not to be disciplined by anyone they could call me and I would handle the problem or bring him home. I did get a copy of the corporal punishment letter that I signed with my specific instructions. So that proves they are at fault and yes I did get pictures and emailed them to the superintendent.

Sounds like you have a good handle on the what is going on. Hope this all turns out well for your son and you. Are you going to look for a different school?

I live in a rural area there is not another school that he can go to unless I move to another school district. I'm going after the teacher and the principal changing schools. My son is doing great in his new classroom across the hall from the old teacher. Also the teacher helper is an old girlfriend and she baby sat my 15 yr old son. I feel a lot better knowing that she will look out for him.

Hopefully all will turn out well for your son. You are a good parent - some would have let it all slide.

Not to be insensitive, but why would you give anyone permission to paddle your child in the first place?
You may have said this already, but have you revoked your permission to do this in writing and made sure it was attached to the permission letter?

I agree with everyone's posts to contact an attorney.

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Originally Posted by NowWhat

Not to be insensitive, but why would you give anyone permission to paddle your child in the first place?

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Some schools do this. Especially here in the South. It is routine unless you sign a waiver stating that you don't want it done. Personally I think it is barbaric, so I have always signed for my children NOT to get paddled.

I just could not give anyone permission to lay there hands or paddles on my child. For situations just like this.
The teacher knew the kid had been punished but left that part out with the principal - so he got it again. Did the teacher get some sick enjoyment out of the kids pain?

My entire family is in Georgia - and I have never heard of this. I was paddled as a child, but I didn't think any school could legally do that anymore.

Oh my gosh, he is 5! Why is there the need to "paddle" a 5 year old, if I ever smack my children (which is very rare, as I can make them understand things by talking to them) I do it with my hand... what is a paddle (I'm assuming its like a stick)? I feel so sad that your son has had to go through this, I would be enraged if someone ever touched my kids... how do people cope down south?? I'm sure this is classed as child abuse...

A child needs to be paddled at times, and parents who act like this do the worst thing they can for the child, let the teaches and principal paddle a child who needs it, and stop trying to raise a child from the new age books on kids.

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Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck

A child needs to be paddled at times, and parents who act like this do the worst thing they can for the child, let the teaches and principal paddle a child who needs it, and stop trying to raise a child from the new age books on kids.

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Actually I'll raise my children as I see fit whether it includes 'paddling' or not. In my case it's not.

Normally it is societies issues, since from what I have seen those with liberal parents who do not paddle in a larger percent have worst manners and lack more self control. But how you deal with your children at home is your business, how the school deals with them should be the schools, and parents need to butt out and let the schools back to doing their jobs.

Are you joking me? I smack my children when needs be, I didn't learn that from a bloody book! Its common sense... And beating a 5 year old is doing what exactly?? Teaching him that hitting is wrong?? Take a moment before answering...

I am sorry, but it is not the schools job to hit my child. If they, as educators, those who have the "calling" to reach children - can't find a better way to discipline other than to hit a child, then they should find a new profession.

Their job is to teach - not hit.

Permission or not, a paddling should never get to the point that it leaves red marks. Especially ones that you could take pics of HOURS later. Child Protective Services take kids off parents for way less than that!

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Originally Posted by NeedKarma

Actually I'll raise my children as I see fit whether it includes 'paddling' or not. In my case it's not.

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Got to spread the love NK, while a pop on the tush from mom or dad may be appropriate if the situation deems (running out into traffic for example), paddling should not be done In my opinion.

Paddling is demeaning, degrading, and totally outrageous. I would never let another adult touch my children!!

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Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck

from what I have seen those with liberal parents who do not paddle in a larger percent have worst manners and lack more self control. But how you deal with your children at home is your business, how the school deals with them should be the schools, and parents need to butt out and let the schools back to doing thier jobs.

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Whoa, now I'm about in an uproar!! Man, I'm hot!!

I have raised 4 beautiful wonderful children and only 1 has ever been spanked, and only once. I take that back, 2 kids have, and only once each. My youngest one last year for SEVERELY acting up in school (popped on the booty by me). I now regret what I did. Every time he gets in trouble at school he gets tearful and asks "Mom, are you gonna spank me?" I will NEVER do it again, although the situation warranted action.

My 4 children are the most loving and respectful children you would ever meet. They have good manners and a TON of self-control.

Hitting does not equate good behavior. Intimidation does not teach good behavior. Good parenting equates good behavior.

The parents should butt out and let the schools do their jobs? He! No!! It is up to us as parents to know what goes on at school. It is us as parents to teach our children manners so that they behave at school, and when they don't it is our responsibility as parents to deal with the situation in an appropriate manner.

I know, as a parent, I visit my children's schools daily. Yes, I said daily. Yeah, I am the exception to the rule... but I don't paddle, spank, or hit my children. I am an active role model in their lives. I give respect and I get respect.

Wow, my blood pressure is high now!

First off, I can't understand why you would have said school officials could touch your child in the first place. School officials should not, under any circumstances, be hitting students no matter what the method. Restraining students, if they are armed for instance, is one thing, but not hitting. Yes, let the school discipline students while they are on campus, with parent notification and consent if necessary (i.e. suspension would not require consent (I don't think... )).

Secondly, with the general spanking issue... my parents were among those that thought it was okay to spank a child. My father never used anything other that his hand, my mother sometimes used a wooden spoon, I don't think it was ever bare bottom. I, however, do not believe it is okay to spank a child. Maybe it is because I experienced it but I see it as a form of child abuse. My parents did it right up until I was 17 (if you haven't seen me post in other threads, I'm now 23) and only stopped because the school psychologist stepped in and told my father he shouldn't be spanking a 17 year old after I vented to a teacher. Yes, I know the child at issue here is only 5 but if it is allowed to happen at all, who knows when it will stop.

Corporal punishment in schools was also outlawed many years ago. I don't know if this is just in New York, where I'm from, or just in public schools.

To wrap up, children should never be hit as punishment and remember that a child that was abused is more likely to abuse as an adult so it needs to stop now.

This is probably a Christian (independent Baptist?) school in the Bible Belt. If one of their discipline measures is paddling and if a parent signs a consent form, paddling is what happens if a teacher or school authority decides the child needs it.

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Originally Posted by blondiechika05

Corporal punishment in schools was also outlawed many years ago. I don't know if this is just in New York, where I'm from, or just in public schools.

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This must be in New York, and the northern states. I grew up in Michigan and Ohio and it was not allowed. But now that I am in Tennessee, it is common practice here. I actually have to sign a paper at the beginning of each school year if I DON'T want my children paddled.

You see, I teeter and I totter about spanking. I believe there is a need for it if the circumstance calls for it, i.e. a dangerous situation (running out in traffic, playing with matches or a lighter), but not for basic general discipline. There are better ways to discipline a child, under normal circumstances, than spanking.

While I think it wrong for anyone other than a parent to discipline a child in this way (meaning anything other than verbally telling a child "no") I do not see an issue with spanking in general. Spanking is spanking , plain and simple. You don't do it to harm the child but to teach them. I was spanked and I am a good law abiding positive citizen. There IS a difference between child abuse and spanking. Spanking ddoes not require whelps, bruises, or smacking across a room.. I will pop my son on the thigh or hand if he disobeys me after an initial warning. Now is not the time for me to be my son's friend, it is the time for me to lead him in a good direction and teach him right from wrong. While Im not a person to tell another person that they are not being a good parent, I do have issues with people who do no type of discipline. Every child is different, no parent can tell another parent that they are dealing with their child incorrectly. I know my child, and I know that some of the current methods of discipline would never work appropriately on my son. I continuously get comments on the good behaviour of my child. I rarely need to spank him, and I think this is because it has happened in the past and helped him to see that I don't mess around when I tell him no to something. I don't play games and he knows that... You can call me a bad parent for this if you wish, but compared to some other children and young adults I have seen in the world who were raised in the current methods, I think my way is better... but I will never push that way on anyone else, and would expect the same from others.

As for the OP, I think you seem to be on the right track. I would be absolutely irrate with this school and the principal regardless of the paper I signed. There is a line that was crossed here. Good luck to you and your family.

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Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck

A child needs to be paddled at times, and parents who act like this do the worst thing they can for the child, let the teaches and principal paddle a child who needs it, and stop trying to raise a child from the new age books on kids.

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Have you actually raised children? I mean actively?

Yep 5 of them, always had a rule if they got paddled in school they got another one when they got home. Four of them are in their 30's and all in the plumbing business. In the south and rual areas a good spanking is the best think you can do for a child when they are very bad. It is actually child abuse not to, since you are not teaching a child right from wrong very well, esp with children going wild like they do now adays.

Schools should all go back to it, lucky the schools here still do.

With all the whack jobs out there - you would trust a virtual stranger to have the "power" to hit your kid? Why would you say it is okay for someone you barely know to hit your child? I just can't get past that. I was spanked in kindergarten (in Georgia, I was 5) for stepping in a mud puddle. Was that appropriate? Or did I just piss of the teacher?

Like I have said before, I am from the south, my entire family lives down there currently - your views are not shared by most southerners that I know.
My sister, who has to girls, would have someone's head on a platter if they paddled her kids at school. My brothers, with their kids would be the same way.

I will discipline my kids, thank you.

Boy, I'm glad we live where we do. My kids are great. They listen to us and when they don't they get time out and such. They feel bad when they overstep their boundaries and get punished because they enjoy our love and happiness and want that. They aren't cowering in fear which seems to be the american way in the household and the governing political way. (How does a Catholic minister have 5 kids?? )

Okay, NK, I don't know if it is an "american" thing.

I choose other forms of punishment with my daughter. (that is not to say she has never been spanked) She is respectful, knows and uses her manners. There is the OLD saying "spare the rod, spoil the child". I don't think that is true.

My kid does not live in fear of me or my husband. I would not want her or anyone to live that way.
I believe that, at school, discipline should not be physical. My daughters teachers KNOW what we expect out of her and they KNOW that if there is a problem, they can come to us and talk openly with out us getting all defensive. It is truly a partnership.
They don't have to paddle to get a point across.

Hello:

Children shouldn't be hit any more than adults should...

excon

PS> On second thought, I can think of a LOT of adults that need smackin...

Fr. I was raised in the dear old south and our teachers beat the hell out of us... maybe sometimes I deserved it. The one that hurt my feelings the most was when I was in first grade. When I was in eight grade I saw a teacher jerk a boy up out of his seat and smack the hell out of him with a leather strap... he cared less where he hit him just as long as he hit him. I have 3 kids in school that have never been touched by a teacher and had better never be touched by one or their mother would be in jail... I think the teachers in my children's school know this. I know for a fact that a lot of teachers abuse their power.

Do you live in a state where corporal punishment in schools is legal and/or does your child attend a private school? I can't quite understand your post regarding how many times your child was paddled and why. You mention something about your child hitting another student. I will say this, that bullying behavior in schools is not taken lightly these days and will be dealt with quite harshly under any circumstances. I do agree that you should have been notified first, especially since you stipulated that directive. At this point I'd rescind the agreement you signed and, as an alternative, stipulate that you are to be notified whenever your child misbehaves. If you are able to go to the school on a moment's notice, then do so whenever you're called. If not, then you need to stipulate some other type of disciplinary consequence to be imposed, such as a timeout period and loss of privilege (such as staying in at recess.) While I agree that a child should never be punished to the point of injury, I also believe that the parents have a responsibility to work with the school in matters of discipline and this is one instance where the parents and the school need to get together.

I'm shocked! I thought the OP was in some ELDC* not the USA! You learn something new every day. In the UK parents aren't allowed to smack children (although I think this is the nanny state going too far) and corporal punishment in schools was resigned to the seventies.

I remember getting told off at school for things that weren't my fault/ the teacher was having a bad day. I cringe to think what could have happened if they were allowed to hit me!

If I had children I wouldn't let anyone hit them. I wouldn't let anyone else hit my dog!

*Economically Less Developed Country

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Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck

Normally it is societies issues, since from what I have seen those with liberal parents who do not paddle in a larger percent have worst manners and lack more self control. But how you deal with your children at home is your business, how the school deals with them should be the schools, and parents need to butt out and let the schools back to doing thier jobs.

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A big part of the problem is that the parents don't do their jobs, so the schools are forced to do it for them. Worse yet, a lot of parents believe that the schools are solely responsible for disciplining and educating the children. Nothing could be farther from the truth. The fact is, both institutions, family and school, share the responsibility for educating children. There needs to be cooperation, not competition, between the two. A lot of parents don't want the schools butting into what they consider to be their business, where disciplining of the children is considered, but then they don't take it upon themselves to do it either. As a result, the child is unable to function effectively in school and disrupts his/her own education as well as that of his classmates. Now I'm not suggesting that the OP is guilty of this but a lot of people in our society don't understand that. The prevailing attitudes within our modern culture have served to sabotage our schools and render them largely ineffective. Instead of turning out upstanding, productive citizens with a sense of responsibility we're instead producing a generation of self-centered people with an entitlement attitude and absolutely no personal responsibility whatsoever. Admittedly, there's a lot more to it than the issue of whether students should be paddled in schools. But there is a danger in rationalizing everything and not wanting to hold young people accountable for their actions.

There are kids in our school that you can see that parents have lost control. And you think to yourself that proper discipline would handle that.
It always amazes me that parents don't get involved. I don't get it. I am completely opposite. I am almost sure that my daughter's teacher is sick of getting notes from me. I let her know when my daughter woke up on the wrong side of the bed just so she knows what she is dealing with.
We participate in every way we can.
So it baffles me when parents don't get involved.

But... I still would NEVER allow her teacher to get a paddle out. As much as I trust her, physically punishing her is not an option.

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Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck

In the south and rual areas a good spanking is the best think you can do for a child when they are very bad. It is actually child abuse not to,

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Wait a minute Chuck, I live in rural Tennessee too, so don't tell me that it is child abuse NOT to spank your child. Show me where in the Department of Child and Family Services it states that it is child abuse not to spank your child. This is utter nonsense.

Spanking is not the best thing you can do when they are bad. Again, it depends on the age. As I stated earlier, when they are very young a little pop on the tushie or a little pop on the hand is okay, but when they are of an age to understand right from wrong, spanking is degrading. There are so many other forms of discipline that can be used that don't harm a child's psyche.

Just as beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I guess discipline is in the hands of the one wielding the power. You can beat your child if you want, I will raise mine with respect.

I agree with many others here; the school should not be touching anyone's child. Parents should only spank under dire circumstances, and as J_9 said, only up to a certain age where reason can take over. I've seen kids who are afraid of their parents - it's false respect, and it's not pretty.

Interestingly, from the other side of things, I had a professor who's son was a senior in high school on 9/11. The school went into "lock down" and they wouldn't allow students to call their parents or go home. My professor's son stood up and walked out of class because he knew his parents would want him HOME. A teacher stepped in his way and put her hand on his chest, telling him to stop. He took her hand, removed it from his chest and said, "My parents would want me at home. I'm going home." and he walked past her. He was suspended for five days for assaulting the teacher.

Double standard? I think so.

I, of all people, am at a loss for words. I ride both sides.

As a child... when it was time for a bath my mom would tell me to strip and lean over the tub (I had always done something). But normally she was right, I had and knew it. I was a conniving little b***h :) Lets see, she used belts; brushes; wooden spoons... whatever was convenient and least likely to break in her hands. She didn't beat me, but I got a good whoopin.
In kindergarten, I started getting paddlings. Started with a ruler to the hand and by eighth grade was getting "Big Bertha" to my a** for the whole school to hear me scream.
Now that I have a son (2.5yo with my temper and attitude) I don't know what to do. I try time out... he takes his time out chair and throws it across the room. You put him in his room, he literally almost breaks the door (yes they are hallow). So what does that leave? A good ole whoopin. I mean, I have never left a mark on him... but I feel like I have to put him in check every once in a while.
However, I would absolutely hurt someone if they ever put their hands on my baby. Heck, I get mad if my mom pops him on the heinie!

Anyhow, Cherie, sounds like you're doing good.

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Originally Posted by Wondergirl

This is probably a Christian (independent Baptist?) school in the Bible Belt.

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All schools down here paddle. Public and private. In most cases it is not the teacher that paddles, but the principal or vice principal. There must be a witness also, be it the teacher or another member of the staff, but there IS supposed to be a witness.

Again, I am the disciplinarian in my home, I am the one who teaches respect and deals with disrespect appropriately, and that does NOT mean spanking.

While we all raise our children in our own fashion, I personally do not believe in corporal punishment because I have seen it work opposite than the expected outcome.

I had an incident 2 years ago when my daughter, then 12 and in 6th grade, began her homework in math class a moment before the teacher told them to start. When I picked my daughter up that afternoon I learned that, because she did one problem of her homework prior to hearing the start bell, she was stood up with her nose in the corner for the remaining 35 minutes of class. I was OUTRAGED!! I turned that car around and went right into the principal's office and met with him. After interviewing the teacher and the other students, it seemed that this was a popular punishment for her. Suffice it to say she is no longer teaching at that school. ;)

J_9, I grew up in NC back when Noah was still floating around in the ark, and remember paddling and ruler smacking etc. in public schools, but didn't realize paddling is still being done there.

Is this an accepted thing? I'm surprised parents haven't risen up in protest!

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Originally Posted by Wondergirl

Is this an accepted thing? I'm surprised parents haven't risen up in protest!

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Yup it is still very accepted and actually EXPECTED by some parents. I, however, am not one of them. Maybe it is because I was raised in the North where it was not accepted. Some of my neighbors and friends think I am absolutely looney toons for not allowing my children to be paddled. The school's primary responsibility In my opinion is education not discipline. My responsibility is discipline.

I was raised in the South and proud of that - but I would in no way allow anyone to put their hands/paddles on my child.
My sister and brothers all have kids and live in the South, I think they share my feelings.