Fester probably goes to chicken fights and bets on the fattest one:eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by Aurora_Bell
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Fester probably goes to chicken fights and bets on the fattest one:eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by Aurora_Bell
Alty, you're right. Re-reading it was Hondo he helped to pass. I still applaud him.
As for kids and dogs being property, are you responsible for them? Do you control what they do, where they live, what they eat? Are they "yours?"
One thing I did forget to add this morning: Property rights are not absolute. You cannot drive your car in an unsafe manner even on (some) private roads without being arrested and have it confiscated. You cannot beat or starve your children without facing lawsuits and having your children confiscated. No shirt, no shoes, no service: you can't even dress your own body the way you want to. There's a court case somewhere against a guy for being naked in his living room with the drapes open.
KitKat, further insulting posts, while cathartic, are violations and will be reported.
Mogrann, have Owen tested before deciding about breeding him. From what Binx has said he might be a valuable contribution to the breed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Catsmine
I hear you Boss...
I think we disagree on the word property Cats. To me property is something I own, something that has no feelings, something I can do with whatever I want. My house is my property. If I want to paint the interior lime green with pink polka dots, I can. My car is my property. If I don't want it anymore, I can sell it with no second thoughts that I'm not doing the right thing for the car.Quote:
As for kids and dogs being property, are you responsible for them? Do you control what they do, where they live, what they eat? Are they "yours?"
I do see were you're coming from, I guess I don't agree with the term "property". I am responsible for my kids and my pets. But, there are also laws protecting my kids and pets from harm, because they are living things. I cannot beat my kids or my dogs, I cannot abandon my kids or dogs on the side of the road. I have to make sure that both my kids and dogs are cared for and given the best care I can provide. I don't have to do that with my property.
My dogs own me.
A few weeks ago Brody managed to open the refrigerator and help himself to 1kg of chicken breast fillets and some mince. Needless to say he didn't feel like eating his dinner that night :rolleyes:
To the rest of the world my dogs are my property, they are registered to me, I paid for them, but to me they are family.
My questions were from John Locke's definitions of "property." I'm trying to illustrate the basis of Festoids' claims, or at least the naturalist one's from his Second Treatise. The later definitions involving one's labor being required I can't get behind.Quote:
Originally Posted by Altenweg
The Hurricane waits for me to cook the chicken, Shaz.
I do agree with Alty on this one. No it's not because we are friends, but if we treat our kids like how fester here says we should be able to treat our dogs, not only are we going to have a bunch of feral dogs running wild, but now we have children roaming the streets etc...
Yes I own my dog, I own my kid, they are mine, but they are not something I consider property. Kind of like marriage. You are each others spouses, but does that make you each others property?
Just like owning a dog, having child is a gift, a privilege, not a right. We are responsible for them for the rest of their lives. God knows there are days when I would love to sell my dog AND child to the gypsies for a case of beer (kidding... ) but would I ever do it? No. Never. Not even when Lady pushed my brand new air conditioner out of the window and hopped out. Not even when Lady got stuck by a porcupine not once but TWICE in one month, not even when my daughter broke my brand new fan, not even when she colored all over my freshly painted walls with black sharpie marker. (ok this is starting to make me sound like a neglectful mother :p ) l think Festoids here is spewing out dated PETA bull poopie.
Ad hominem. Telling when one has nothing left to stand upon.
I see where you're coming from Cats. I really do. :)
I think Shazzy said exactly what I wanted to (had to spread the rep), but she did it better. My kids and my dogs are family, and therefore they aren't property, not to me. Maybe they are my property where the rest of the world is concerned, but to me they aren't.
Bella, do you really think you could get a case of beer for both? I think that price may be a bit high on the days you're contemplating it. ;)
Cats and Shazzy. Your dogs get chicken! Spoiled puppies! ;)
Ok I'll settle for a six pack and a pack of smokes. ;)
The other day I had an entire moose roast on the counter, went to get the mail, and came back in, no more moose roast...
I know, I didn't set her up for success, just too tempting.
I'm looking at her right now, and my daughter is building a fort with pillows and blankets and Lady is in the middle of all this sleeping soundly. When my daughter stands a little too close, Lady licks her ankle and E shifts over slightly. They have a connection I swear.
Jasper, my rescue mutt, is at this moment laying at my feet and licking my toes. Every time I try to move, he puts his paw on my foot to keep me in place. I guess my foot bath isn't finished. :)
Chewy is sleeping, on my bed, under my brand new blanket, using my pillow! In my next life I want to come back as my dog. Actually, strike that, I want to go to Cats house, his dog gets cooked chicken. ;)
I'd like to come back as Shazzy's dogs!
Since the discussion started with Henry Berghe, I thought John Locke's definitions of property would fit right in.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aurora_Bell
I avoid PETA bull whenever I can, so I wouldn't know about that.
Y'know, excon's right, this is fun.
Really? So if some 15 year old kid breaks into my house and steals one of my guns, then the next day goes into school and kills a couple kids, then that kid's parents should be charged with murder? That is your logic.Quote:
Have you ever been to an orphanage? Heard of one? It's where kids without parents go. They live there in small rooms, usually as a group, waiting to be adopted. Once you adopt a child, if it breaks the neighbors window, or does something else he/she shouldn't, you, as the parent, are responsible for those actions. Are kids property too? I guess maybe in your world they are.
On the flipside, you are once again lowering the value of human to that of a dog. Do you truly believe a dog and a human possess equal value?
Nooo, it's caused by people, the general populace and ACO's bringing animals into the shelter. Sure, animals are going to breed, the animal doesn't willingly walk through the door and into a kennel.Quote:
Are you really that daft? Overpopulation is not caused by shelters, it's cause by over breeding.
What you're saying here is that mixed breed dogs never, ever breed amongst themselves without the assistance or encouragement of backyard breeders? Got it. I think. But I gotsta call bull-dooky on it.Quote:
Duh! Use your head for just one minute and think about it. If backyard breeders didn't breed, there would be no animals in the shelters!
[QUOTE}Legit breeders do not adopt out to anyone that answers an ad. You have to sign a legal document stating that you'll not only spay or neuter your pet, but if you should choose you don't want the responsibility any more, the breeder (a real breeder) will take the dog back. You will never see a dog from a real breeder in a shelter. Ever![/QUOTE]
Got to call bull-dooky on this one. If the purpose of "legitimate breeding" is to:
1. Improve the breed according to breed standards and;
2. Improve the breeds genetic health.
Then a person who is willing to put down anywhere from 4-5 figures for an animal isn't going to want it altered. If they paying that amount for a dog with those traits they are going to want to breed it as well to another dog with those traits.
Now, if a breeder chooses to keep and not kill dogs of inferior standards (that does happen you know), then the breeder will either have the dogs altered before sale or will have the prospective new owners sign a contract stating they will have the dog altered to prevent the traits from being carried forward. On that note, according to your standards, if the breeder is putting out inferior animals along with superior ones, then he's a backyard breeder.
And yes, some breeders will put in the contract that they possess the right of taking the dog back if the owner no longer wants the animal. That clause is not worth the paper it's written on. Once the money passes hands and ownership transfers, the new owner can dump the dog off at the shelter two years later, put a bullet in it's head the next day and bury it and the breeder would never be the wiser and frankly, can't do a thing about it as the buyer has already paid the breeder the full value of the dog.
Humans cannot be property without due process. Refer above to my question about equating the value of humans and animals. Now, where have I stated children are property?Quote:
How many pieces of human property do you have? If you have kids, according to you, they're your property. If they're not, than you should set them free, let them fend for themselves, let them procreate and do as they please.
Now, let me make this simple for you. It's my house. It's my rules (and I'm a very laissez-faire father), if you were one of my kids and you can't follow my rules (which are an example of exericising property rights), then there's the door. Consider your clothes a gift. As an example, one of my rules when my kids were younger, do not pull the dogs tail, ears or hit him without valid reason (I determine the validity). If they did, then they were reprimanded. The dog is mine. Not theirs.
So you do support cruelty when you determine said cruelty is necessary. Ever ask the dog?Quote:
Have you ever been in the room when an animal is being euthanized at the shelter? I have, many times. It's a peaceful painless death. Maybe were you live it isn't, but here we have laws against unnecessary cruelty to animals, and the people that care about these animals make sure that they go peacefully.
Ever work around a carbon monoxide chamber? Certainly not peaceful. I've also done injections, personally. Sometimes that ain't pretty, no matter who does them. Ever hear a dog vocalize. Kind of ruins your friggin' day. Ever have a co-worker refuse to euthanize animals based upon some moral agenda and it gets put on you day after day?
Of course not. That's why I do.Quote:
You really are counting on the human race to do the responsible thing, aren't you?
Really? I've never allowed any of my animals to breed (if that's you're definition of irresponsible), I've never knowingly allowed my animals to roam, I've never allowed my animals to become a nuisance to my neighbors, I've kept all of my animals from acquisition to death and I've made it a point, when that time comes to end their lives, I'm the one pulling the trigger. With the exception of my current dog all my animals have been altered.Quote:
Take off your rose colored glasses and realize that you're not the only irresponsible person living on this earth, there are billions just like you, which is why we need shelters!
And you want to call me irresponsible. I'm responsible for my animals. Not yours or any others. When I voluntarily take your dog, say while you go on vacation, you can be rest assured you will get your dog back healthy, in one piece and happy. I'm responsible for your property and it's actions and I will respect your property while in my care.
Then with those that don't adhere to your standards, well, don't buy from them. Pretty simple, eh? Yet you seem to be the type that would have laws written that would infringe upon the property rights of people at the point of a gun when those people are causing you no harm.Quote:
Breeders I and my mindset approve of? What are you spewing about now? The only thing I require when breeding a dog is that you do the genetic testing to make sure that you're not passing down defects to the puppies, you learn what you have to do to ensure the safety of the mother and the puppies, you have enough knowledge and money to do everything you must to ensure their health, and you make all new owners sign a contract stating that they will not breed their puppy, and if they should wish to relinquish the dog, it goes back to the breeder.
That's not a huge list, and it should be the standard.
No, I didn't write sick dog. That's irrelevant. On the other hand you wrote:Quote:
You didn't say sick dog. If a dog is too sick to live, yes, it's put down. That's the humane thing to do. As for aggression, at our shelter we have behavioral experts that work with the dog. If the dog is too far gone, deemed unfit to adopt, that's when he/she is put to sleep. That decision takes months. It's not a one day thing to try to rehabilitate a dog.
Which means either you've:Quote:
I have never once seen a dog killed immediately upon arrival at our shelter.
A. Never seen a very sick or injured dog immediately put down upon entering the shelter, or,
B. You're being dishonest.
And that is relevant.
Soooo, if you have a personal problem with me training my dog to hunt animals you're going to interfere? I would love to see you try. You, personally. Not you calling the police.Quote:
If you want to take your couch into your yard and shoot it, go ahead. If you want to throw you shoe into the pond, go ahead. If you want to hang your raggedy andy doll in you tree, go for it. Those are all your property. They don't feel anything, they aren't breathing, living beings. What you do with your dog, that's my business, and I will make it my business as long as people like you exist in this world. That's a promise! (emphasis added)
And using that mindset, if I disagree with how you treat your animals, then you wouldn't mind if I took matters into my own hands and rectified the situation, eh?
Let's talk about how many animals had to be killed to keep Boots around for two years.Quote:
You should up your meds. None of the dogs in my care are my property. Having a dog is not a right, it's a privilege! I have never euthanized a dog in "my" shelter. When I say "my" shelter I mean the shelter in my city. I'm the one that hold the dogs head, pets him, cries for him, when the needle goes in. I'm the one that wishes it was legal for me to have more than 3, because every single dog on the list to be killed would be coming home with me. Sadly the laws are such that I'm only allowed 3, and that's how many I have and always will have. When the day comes that I can have more, or I finally win the lottery and buy 30 acres of land, those dogs will be coming to live with me.
My mindset when I work somewhere is the business is mine and it's my job to do my job and be that damn good to keep the place in business and provide excellent customer service. Except when I worked as an ACO. I considered it my job to become unemployed, i.e. no more strays, bites, dangerous/vicious dogs, rabies quarantines and the like. I knew it was idealistic and unachievable, but it's that mindset that drives me. Take it as you will.
Once again, you're making a human equal to an animal. Lettuce answer that question. Are humans equal to a dog?Quote:
You think kids are property too, don't you? Everything you say leads to you owning children as well. Do you have kids? Is one of them a boy? Did you have him circumcised? If you did, did you ask your days old infant if he wanted to skin on his penis cut off, or did you just go for it? If you did, were you at least kind and put him to sleep for the procedure, or did you just let the doctor take a knife and start slicing away while he was fully conscious? Concede the point yet?
Example: That computer your hammering away on. During the molding process of the plastic pieces, to prevent damaging the plastic, the plastic pellets are coated in a very thin layer of animal fat.Quote:
Go for it. How do I use animals to benefit me? I'm dying to hear this.
Eat meat much?
Take medicines?
If you're a vegetarian/vegan, where does your food originate? And how many animals were displaced, injured, maimed, disfigured and killed during the plowing, tilling, planting, growing, protection, harvesting and storage of that food?
Hi Festoid. Please try and do your research properly before posting, the above passage is a complete contradiction to the truth about reputable breeders and why people buy from reputable breeders.Quote:
Got to call bull-dooky on this one. If the purpose of "legitimate breeding" is to:
1. Improve the breed according to breed standards and;
2. Improve the breeds genetic health.
Then a person who is willing to put down anywhere from 4-5 figures for an animal isn't going to want it altered. If they paying that amount for a dog with those traits they are going to want to breed it as well to another dog with those traits.
Now, if a breeder chooses to keep and not kill dogs of inferior standards (that does happen you know), then the breeder will either have the dogs altered before sale or will have the prospective new owners sign a contract stating they will have the dog altered to prevent the traits from being carried forward. On that note, according to your standards, if the breeder is putting out inferior animals along with superior ones, then he's a backyard breeder.
And yes, some breeders will put in the contract that they possess the right of taking the dog back if the owner no longer wants the animal. That clause is not worth the paper it's written on. Once the money passes hands and ownership transfers, the new owner can dump the dog off at the shelter two years later, put a bullet in it's head the next day and bury it and the breeder would never be the wiser and frankly, can't do a thing about it as the buyer has already paid the breeder the full value of the dog.
The buyer can take the dog out and shoot it in the head the next day?
Uhh no not quite, don't you think reputable breeders do research into their buyers? They aren't like pet stores, they actually care about who takes the puppies they have put so much hard work and love into. Most reputable breeders also either encourage or require regular updates on the puppy.
I have to agree with you her Fester, it is caused by people, irresponsible pet owners to be exact. And no a dog doesn't willingly walk into a shelter, but weren't you the one wagging your finger at Alty for making dogs equal to humans? Dogs don't have the same thought process as humans, we all know that Fester, but since we (well our ancestors before us) have taken it into their hands to domesticate dogs, it's up to us to take care of them.Quote:
Nooo, it's caused by people, the general populace and ACO's bringing animals into the shelter. Sure, animals are going to breed, the animal doesn't willingly walk through the door and into a kennel.
The operative word is "can." Legally they have that right, at least under U.S. contract law. Possibility, not probability. They can drive off a bridge with the puppy so they'll have a dog in the afterlife.Quote:
Originally Posted by shazamataz
Festoids, you said
I'm afraid you got that just exactly backwards. De-sexing animals, or requiring it, with defects makes the breeder responsible.Quote:
Now, if a breeder chooses to keep and not kill dogs of inferior standards (that does happen you know), then the breeder will either have the dogs altered before sale or will have the prospective new owners sign a contract stating they will have the dog altered to prevent the traits from being carried forward. On that note, according to your standards, if the breeder is putting out inferior animals along with superior ones, then he's a backyard breeder.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Catsmine
The person in question here would be dead, but if they survived would they not be charged for animal cruelty? A woman in the states was just recently charged for making her Dalmatian ride in the trunk of her car.
Also if a person bought a dog, shot it the next day, and this was reported, you want to believe that person would be charged here in Canada. I am talking about a completely healthy animal here.
Everyone who wilfully and without lawful excuse, kills or injures dogs, birds or animals that are not cattle and are kept for a lawful purpose, or places poison in such a position that it may easily be consumed by these animals, is guilty of an offence punishable on summary conviction.
Every one commits an offence who
* wilfully causes or, being the owner, wilfully permits to be caused unnecessary pain, suffering or injury to an animal or a bird;
* by wilful neglect causes damage or injury to animals or birds while they are being driven or conveyed;
* being the owner or the person having the custody or control of a domestic animal or a bird or an animal or a bird wild by nature that is in captivity, abandons it in distress or wilfully neglects or fails to provide suitable and adequate food, water, shelter and care for it;
* in any manner encourages, aids or assists at the fighting or baiting of animals or birds;
* wilfully, without reasonable excuse, administers a poisonous or an injurious drug or substance to a domestic animal or bird or an animal or a bird wild by nature that is kept in captivity or, being the owner of such an animal or a bird, wilfully permits a poisonous or an injurious drug or substance to be administered to it; or
* takes part in any meeting, competition, exhibition, pastime, practice, display or event at or in the course of which captive birds are liberated by hand, trap, contrivance or any other means for the purpose of being shot when they are liberated.
Criminal Law Resources > Animal Cruelty Law (Canada)
Hmmm good point Cats... they can, but when going through a reputable breeder anyone wanting a dog just to shoot it in the head wouldn't bother going through all the hoops to get it.
Plus, when the weekly or monthly update from the owner doesn't arrive the breeder is going to contact them, find out the dog is dead and sue their @ss off for breach of contract as well as animal cruelty.
Catsmine, allow me to clarify my point.
You have two dogs of breed standard. The offspring they produce are a mixed collection of some that don't meet breed standards and some that meet breed standards. If the breeder continues to breed these dogs then he/she is in violation of the standards set forth. Whether the breed alters the inferior offspring or not, the trait for inferiority survives still in the offspring that have met breed standard.
This is where it gets tricky.
Even reputable breeders can breed dogs with faults, but reputable breeders rarely breed dogs with major problems.
Reputable breeders will do things like hip scores on their dogs before breeding so the puppies have a very high chance of having good hips.
Backyard breeders don't do the tests for hips so could end up with a whole litter of dogs with hip displaysia.
Reputable breeders can still end up with faults in their dogs but they are minor... things like the lay of shoulder not being quite up to standard, or depth of chest not enough, these faults do not hurt the dog in any way and does not affect the dogs quality of life.
Backyard breeders rarely even know what the breed standard is so could have a multitude of problems as above (shoulder and chest) plus other problems which can cause problems later in life such as short muzzels, extreme cow hocks, weak pasterns, all of which can affect the dogs quality of life as it grows.
Festoid, I really don't want to write another essay, going through your post point by point.
No, I've never seen a dog euthanized on it's first day in the shelter. I was trying to be fair by conceding that sick dogs are euthanized, and to be fair to the shelter, I wasn't there every day, and I not longer volunteer at the shelter. I'm too much of a soft heart to go there, see the dogs, walk the dogs, play with the dogs, bond with the dogs, and leave without them.
Yes, I have seen extremely sick dogs euthanized at the shelter, that's true, but everything is done to attempt to help the dog before that decision is made. If it's not possible to help, no alternative, than the dog is put to sleep. A sick dog is not adopted out, because a sick dog is... well... a sick dog. So, are dogs euthanized on their first day at the shelter? Possibly.
No animals were killed to keep Boots in the shelter. I posted a link for our local shelter, please read it. No healthy adoptable animal is euthanized. Ever! If there isn't room in the shelter, dogs are fostered out. The shelter has many wonderful volunteers willing to foster dogs for years (if need be) until they are adopted. Boots was euthanized because he was old, sick, and went senile. He was not adoptable.
Obviously you're in the US, and nothing against the US, but it seems that the shelters there are a disaster, at least according to the American people posting here. So to be fair, maybe the shelter system in the US is flawed. That's not the case in Canada. No disrespect intended to my US friends on this site, but the only people posting about terrible shelters, terrible euthanizing practices, etc. etc. are the people in the US.
Shazzy covered breeding practices and what legit breeders do, so I won't repeat any of that.
To address your "human = to dog" speech. No, humans and animals aren't equal, but, an animal in the care of a human, deserves the care of any living thing.
Having an animal in your life is a choice. If you choose to do so, you are responsible for making sure that the animal in your care is cared for. Part of that care means not putting the animal at risk. Backyard breeders as a group put every dog at risk, not only because they breed without testing, but because the majority of them don't know what they're doing when it comes to breeding. They put the female and the puppies at risk, and each litter puts other dogs at risk. To be a responsible owner means being responsible for every animal that comes into your home. Responsible owners don't breed. They leave that to the pros.
Yes, the amount of "my dog had puppies 2 days ago now 3 of them are dead what do I do?" questions on here is frightening.Quote:
Originally Posted by Altenweg
Or my favourite "my dogs is having puppies right now what do I do?"
Most of your comment Alty was correct, but I live in Canada. :P
LOL! Yes, but I've never seen you complain about shelters. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Sariss
True, I didn't complain per say, but I did tell my story about having to decide who gets to live and who gets to die out of a group of healthy young animals. But even at the capacity we were euthanising, we always did it humanely. Especially if I was the one euthanising, then at least I know it was going as nicely as possible.Quote:
Originally Posted by Altenweg
Or the "I put my dogs together and they won't mate, what's wrong?", or "my dog had puppies and they won't eat, what do I do?"Quote:
Originally Posted by shazamataz
A real breeder doesn't leave things to chance. They know what they need to do in any given situation, and if the puppies are in trouble, they rush to the vet, not the computer.
The shelters here are great. We got our cats from the Shelter. They don't put them to sleep the
First day or the first week, unless they are sick. We have two cats who were both fixed and declawed with microchip in the ears. They had one dog Sam, who hangs out at the desk. He's been there a long time.
My daughters' Friend and her fiancé have a shelter about twenty
Miles from here and it is wonderful.
Julie loves those animals as much as anybody could and each time someone takes one home she nearly crys.
Alty there are some horror stories from places in the states that make me sick.. but there are some great ones.
I've never had to choose amongst animals that were healthy and adoptable. The animals euthanized in the shelter where I am are only killed if there's no chance of adoption. That's not judged by the length of time they've been there, but by there overall health and disposition. They do their best to rehabilitate animals that have issues, but it doesn't always work.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sariss
My two rescue bunnies were problem kids. Both were scheduled for euthanasia. Thumper had been in and out of the shelter and even lived on the streets for a while. He had issues with biting, lunging, and was considered unfit to live with other rabbits, or humans. They had tried everything during his last stint at the shelter. After 4 months of him not improving, they had to make the decision. I got there the day before he was set to go in. They all know me there, and they know about my work with rabbits, so when I said I'd take him, they knew that no matter what, he wasn't coming back, he'd live with me until the end.
It took a lot of work, a lot of training, but he's now a wonderful pet. He gets along with my other 3 rabbits, doesn't bite, and is just a joy.
Kilala was the same. She came from a rabbit house. Irresponsible owner who let her rabbits breed at will, live in filth, no care. Over 200 rabbits seized from her property. Over 30 had to be put to sleep within days, too feral, diseased, no way to help them. Kilala was a wild child when we adopted her. Days before we got her she had gone through a spay abort. She was lunging at everyone that came close to her, destroying her cage. She was considered unadoptable. She still hates being picked up, but other than that, she's a delight. She loves to sit in my lap and get cuddles. She gets along with my other rabbits, and she's a joy.
The only reason I was allowed to adopt these two rabbits that were considered unadoptable is because of my history with the shelter and with rabbits. They knew theses bunnies would have a good life, even if I couldn't rehabilitate them, they would have a forever home and a good life.
This isn't the case with most of the animals considered unadoptable, and the staff at the shelter don't make the decision to kill at a whim. A lot of consideration goes into it, and an animal that can be adopted will not be euthanized.
I wish where I worked was like that, but we were a municipal animal shelter who had more pets coming in than we could house. During the summer we would literally be bringing in 20 dogs a day and god knows how many cats.
Foster homes didn't really exist as most people were more interested in fostering for animal rescues or other no-kill shelters nearby. No one really thought of the high kill places like municipal shelters.
We would get purebreds or close mixes to rescues as much as we could and we would have rescues come in weekly to 'save' a few and bring them to their shelter. But all of that was still not enough to curb the fact that we had too many animals, and not enough spacce.
It was terrible, and it's why I'll never work in a shelter again.
Sariss, did you check out the link to my local shelter?
http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&source...C-3tFw&cad=rja
I have to say that I'm proud to have such a wonderful shelter in our area. They really do a wonderful job.
Oh darn, they have a beagle in the shelter right now. Almost the same age as Chewy.
Stop me from going down there!
No way Alty, I'm not stopping you :D
FYI, the house across the road is going to be for sale soon... just a thought.
FYI, R's moms house is up for sale and the price was just reduced by $30,000, huge yard, 5 minute drive from my place.Quote:
Originally Posted by shazamataz
Just a thought, now that we've officially hijacked this thread. ;)
I know, V told me about it, he was actually considering it but it's about twice what our place is worth.
Now if you came here you could have a lot of spare money (crap house) but spare money :D
LOL! But, half that house is mine. If I won the lottery, I'd buy it for you. So just pick the lucky numbers and it's a done deal. I'd buy an acreage (around 50 acres should do), than we can open a shelter together.Quote:
Originally Posted by shazamataz
Also, our dogs and bunnies could play together, along with the kids. This house has a gigantic backyard, great for pets, close to the mall and other amenities. Of course if I won the lottery I'd just build you a house on my 50 acres. :)
Just do it!
See how I incorporated shelters into the discussion. Not hijacking after all. Oh... wait... the original post was about breeding.
Um, great breeders here, also a lot of dog shows for Cyrus.
There. Done. :)
That would be my dream Alty.
If I won the lottery I'd either ship all you guys over here or move to Canada. Either way is fine with me.
We have a big show coming up in 2 weeks! I'm stressing about it already!
Every year we have the Royal Shows all over Aus. I don't really know how to describe them but think of a 3 day carnival with rides and games but also animal shows, livestock, cats, dogs, horses, everything and we fly in international judges.
And to throw in breeding... there are some dogs flying down here that were bred by the same lady that bred Cyrus. Competition from his own kennel :rolleyes:
Yeah.. it seems Edmonton's Animal Services unit is able to hold animals in their facility until they can send them out to an adoption agency like the Humane society or the other rescues in and around the city. Sadly where I was working it wasn't that easy. :(
Our SPCA holds dogs until they get placed, but the dogs get fostered out more often than not.
I have to say after reading this thread and another one here, Canada must have the best shelters going. I said it in a another thread, but thank Gawd our shelters aren't like the ones spoken of here.
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