Look, Mr. Trump is not Ronald Reagan, I said. Reagan served two full terms as the governor of a state so vast that if it were a country it would have been one of the important economies in the world. He was a union president who served seven terms during the most fraught time in Hollywood’s history and emerged respected by all sides. He was no novice.(Peggy Noonan ) .

I have followed this clown for years . He has endorsed policies to the left of Evita Hilary ,and almost to the left of Bolshevik Bernie Sanders . The Republican party in their desperation for a win has endorsed the biggest charlatan representing a complete repudiation to the values they have embraced since Reagan.

Did I read that right? You said the values they embraced since Reagan? Sadly I don't think they have. They don't seem to understand what is important anymore and keep shifting because the left paints them in a bad light. Reagan would not have done so. Was there compromise in the Reagan administration - Yes. But what he have here is beyond the "norm" for conservatives and the Republican Party. It is high time to shake things up. Could the part do better - Sure. But the idiots seem to want to vote Hilary in. That is absolute political suicide.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cdad

Did I read that right? You said the values they embraced since Reagan? Sadly I don't think they have. They don't seem to understand what is important anymore and keep shifting because the left paints them in a bad light. Reagan would not have done so. Was there compromise in the Reagan administration - Yes. But what he have here is beyond the "norm" for conservatives and the Republican Party. It is high time to shake things up. Could the part do better - Sure. But the idiots seem to want to vote Hilary in. That is absolute political suicide.

---

The low bar theory ;the lesser of 2 evils theory ..... I think both are toxic for the nation .

I get the argument about SCOTUS picks ,and maybe that would be convincing if I believed he'd select principled conservatives to the bench . But his politics tells a different tale. I

find it very disturbing that he is making no serious effort to united the party . Instead he has the quixotic vision of convincing Sanders voters that they should trust him because of his idiotic protectionist rhetoric .

Trump doesn't even have a well-organized campaign. How could we hand our country over to him?

"...values they have endorsed since Reagan?" Rather values they have given lip service to while continuing the same big government agenda as the Progressives across the aisle. In the words of the old Jackson Browne song: "You take Sally, I'll take Sue; there ain't no difference between the two."

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...5e&oe=57EDE78A

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Originally Posted by Wondergirl

Trump doesn't even have a well-organized campaign. How could we hand our country over to him?

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And you think that handing our government over to someone so stupid as to not even be able to handle nation secrets is a good idea? Or to the one that appears to take bribes through the back door of a foundation that they created?

Certainly not my cup of tea.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tomder55

The low bar theory ;the lesser of 2 evils theory ..... I think both are toxic for the nation .

I get the argument about SCOTUS picks ,and maybe that would be convincing if I believed he'd select principled conservatives to the bench . But his politics tells a different tale. I

find it very disturbing that he is making no serious effort to united the party . Instead he has the quixotic vision of convincing Sanders voters that they should trust him because of his idiotic protectionist rhetoric .

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The problem at this time is that this is what we have to deal with. I know he is hoping for the Sanders voters but I don't think that is going to come anytime soon. Those well dippers despise the rich and they don't think Hillary is rich enough. Our only other alternative is to have a multi tier system where we could end up with majority vote and only 10% of the people behind it.

He is correct in wanting to close the boarders but he has a tougher road with the tear up the contracts for trade that he is talking about. There is fluidity to our government and he simply cant do that just because he is President. I'm not sure that either candidate knows how government is suppose to function.

Only Regan was Regan.

At least Trump has been a successful businessman.

What has Hillary ever done that was successful outside of suckering liberals and conning them out of their money?

As a Senator she sucked, as a Secretary of State she was an horrific failure. In fact outside of Politics which is all Lies and Deception... she has really done nothing to be proud of, and nothing in Politics either.

smoothy, you know I love you dearly..
..

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Originally Posted by smoothy

Only Regan was Regan.

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Reagan, not Regan.

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At least Trump has been a successful businessman.

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Um, no he hasn't. Much of the wealth he inherited was wasted and lost. Most of his business endeavors crashed and burned.

I'm not terribly fond of Hillary for all sorts of reasons, but f I have to choose between her and Trump, she'll get my vote. And it'll be interesting to see who their running mates turn out to be,

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wondergirl

smoothy, you know I love you dearly..
..

Reagan, not Regan.


Um, no he hasn't. Much of the wealth he inherited was wasted and lost. Most of his business endeavors crashed and burned.

I'm not terribly fond of Hillary for all sorts of reasons, but f I have to choose between her and Trump, she'll get my vote. And it'll be interesting to see who their running mates turn out to be,

---

I blame my spellchecker for that one.

Yes Trump has been successful as a businessman... Its the left that tries to argue those points. Is every stock broker or commodities trader out there failures, because none of them ever made all the right choices 100% of the time, nor has any other business...

Apple has a long list of utter disasters, so does Microsoft, and every other business that been around more than a couple years has too. Yet those are among the biggest highest revenue business on the planet.

Also using that argument... Hillary along with Bill shafted their legal teams at the end of his last term out of Millions, they never got paid back. That makes them both huge losers too just on that one point alone.

A failure at business must imply one started with more than one ended up with... Trump has made far, far more money than he has lost. That is what defines success in business.

You can find many other successful business owners, that have failed on some endeavors before they hit it big, does that make them failures too? I don't believe so.

C'mon. He hasn't hit it big. And he's too big of an egomaniac to do so. He doesn't listen to rational people. Republicans have tried to calm him down and make him sound rational. You notice how well THAT is working. And convention speakers will be his family, Ditka, Christie, and Lyin' Ted Cruz.

He is a very successful business man ,especially in marketing his name .... much like the Kardashian's . Does that make him good Presidential material ? Herbert Hoover was also a very successful businessman. Hoover amassed a great fortune in his early thirties as a successful mining engineer. During the WWI years he saved millions of lives in Belgium ,Armenia ,Russia . But none of his past business expertise prepared him for the Presidency.

Trump like Hoover would opt for big government solutions . His wall, if he ever were to get funding for it (no Mexico would not pay for it ) ,and all the regulatory approvals .....if it survived all the court challenges ,would be a work program the likes we have not seen since Roosevelt's programs. He offers similar solutions to various infrastructure challenges ,and government entitlement programs . He talks about eliminating some government agencies ,but for the most part just promises to be a better manager of the Leviathan . Like Hoover he would choose a path of central government control .

FDR first campaigned against this aggressive intrusion by government, calling it socialistic .Then he copied and expanded upon Hoover's programs in formulating the New Deal.

But the biggest similarity between them would be trade policy. Hoover was complicit in the enacting of protectionists policies that turned a market crash into an outright world wide depression . Trump's 35% tariffs would be the biggest tax increase on American consumers in our lifetime. And his policies would not go without retaliation by other nations further increasing the costs of goods.

He correctly points out problems in our economy in stagnant growth ,stagnant wages ,and low job growth . But these problems are the cause of economic policies in Washington ...not Mexico or Beijing .To his credit ,he has a pretty good tax plan. But his protectionism would harm the economy not help it .

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wondergirl

C'mon. He hasn't hit it big. And he's too big of an egomaniac to do so. He doesn't listen to rational people. Republicans have tried to calm him down and make him sound rational. You notice how well THAT is working. And convention speakers will be his family, Ditka, Christie, and Lyin' Ted Cruz.

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Cruz was the best choice of the lot after they got rid of Scott Walker . The Repubics will regret this choice .Trump has doomed them to the fate of the Whigs.

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Originally Posted by tomder55

Cruz was the best choice of the lot after they got rid of Scott Walker . The Repubics will regret this choice .Trump has doomed them to the fate of the Whigs.

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Dump doesn't only doom the party to that fate he dooms his nation, but his plan to put Dilliary on the throne will succeed

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Originally Posted by paraclete

Dump doesn't only doom the party to that fate he dooms his nation, but his plan to put Dilliary on the throne will succeed

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there are good reasons to believe that theory .

The General that Trump is considering for his VP pick ;retired Lt Gen Mike Flynn is a pro-choice Democrat . Trump isn't even trying to get the Republican voter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_T._Flynn

It seems to be a game to him, he needs someone who will give him sound advice or maybe he's looking for someone who won't even try

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Originally Posted by tomder55

The General that Trump is considering for his VP pick ;retired Lt Gen Mike Flynn is a pro-choice Democrat . Trump isn't even trying to get the Republican voter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_T._Flynn

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I'm not so sure on the prochoice as you are. Mostly that seems to be a matter of opinion. Since the law allows it I stand by the law. But I don't condone it. Looks like the same case here.

From your Wiki link:


On a July 10, 2016 interview on This Week, when asked by host Martha Raddatz about the issue of abortion, Flynn stated, "women have to be able to choose."^{[SIZE=2][25][/SIZE][SIZE=2][26][/SIZE]} On July 11, 2016, he clarified to Fox News that he is pro-life.^{[SIZE=2][27][/SIZE]}

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Originally Posted by cdad

I'm not so sure on the prochoice as you are. Mostly that seems to be a matter of opinion. Since the law allows it I stand by the law. But I don't condone it. Looks like the same case here.

From your Wiki link:


On a July 10, 2016 interview on This Week, when asked by host Martha Raddatz about the issue of abortion, Flynn stated, "women have to be able to choose."^{[SIZE=2][25][/SIZE][SIZE=2][26][/SIZE]} On July 11, 2016, he clarified to Fox News that he is pro-life.^{[SIZE=2][27][/SIZE]}

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A lot has happened since this morning . Now the hot bet is Mike Pence. I would not complain with that selection .

Sounds like a case of round the Mulberry bush

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Originally Posted by paraclete

Sounds like a case of round the Mulberry bush

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in his case it is critical that he doesn't screw up the pick. Newt Gingrich is being floated because he is sorta an advisor to Trump (not that Trump consults with him before Trump puts his foot in his mouth). But Newt is as old as Trump and would probably do a better job as chief of staff is the electorate inflicts us with a Trump Presidency. The General ? Too many policy differences with the Republican base. He will cost Trump votes . Mike Pence is a Governor of an important state ,and was an influential Congressman in his time. I was for his selection to be on the Romney ticket and my opinion of him hasn't changes. Had he run for President I would have gladly supported him.

Each week Johnson gains ground. The question is whether there are enough weeks left until November.

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Originally Posted by Catsmine

Each week Johnson gains ground. The question is whether there are enough weeks left until November.

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He's picking up the disgruntled Bolshevik Bernie voters that Trump thinks he can win . If he does well he may get the same popular support that Perot got .

Now this is a wierd year so anything could happen ..... like having Congress decide the Presidency . But to be considered in that scenario ,Johnson has to get some electoral votes .Perot got none.

But let's say Johnson takes his home state of New Mexico ;and maybe an independent minded state like New Hampshire ? The goal is to take enough electoral votes to prevent Evita or Trump from getting the 270 electoral votes needed for a majority .... Then to Congress it goes (12th Amendment )! Each member of the House does not get a vote . State delegations would decide as a block ;1 state 1 vote . Right now on appearance it would look like a lock for Trump . Republican delegations are the clear majority(33 state delegations to the Dems' 14 with three split 50-50).
But hold the phone !! Trump has not exactly gone out of his way to even act like he wants the Republican "establishment " on his side . It isn't hard to imagine some of the state delegations bolting and throwing their support behind Johnson.

So it is possible he could win that way . That would be a fitting end to a bizzare campaign season. Instead of' a chicken in every pot' we would have' pot in every home' ?

All I can say in response to that scenario Tom is what happened to having an election and exercising the will of the people, you may as well go this road from the gitgo

We were never ,and hopefully never will be a direct democracy .The founders never uses the words Republic and Democracy interchangeably .

"Democracy is the most vile form of government. ... democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property: and have in general been as short in their lives as the have been violent in their deaths."
(James Madison )


"We are a Republic. Real Liberty is never found in despotism or in the extremes of Democracy.”
(Alexander Hamilton )

"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.”
( Thomas Jefferson)

"Democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine percent."
( Thomas Jefferson)

Benjamin Franklin defined democracy as “two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.”

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Originally Posted by tomder55

We were never ,and hopefully never will be a direct democracy .The founders never uses the words Republic and Democracy interchangeably .

"Democracy is the most vile form of government. ... democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property: and have in general been as short in their lives as the have been violent in their deaths."
(James Madison )


"We are a Republic. Real Liberty is never found in despotism or in the extremes of Democracy.”
(Alexander Hamilton )

"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.”
( Thomas Jefferson)

"Democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine percent."
( Thomas Jefferson)

Benjamin Franklin defined democracy as “two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.”

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Seventeenth century rhetoric not withstanding, democracies were rare on the Earth at that time and had not had the opportunity to mature
,and there was a great deal of faith in allowing the few to determine the will of the many. These ideas appealed to those who sought their god given right to rule and to overthrow what they saw as tyranny. Some of us have known a different system, where the rule of the gun wasn't necessary to bring about change. We have just seen the true democractic voice of the people in the BREXIT referundum in Britain. It produced what is, among the ruling elite, an unanticipated result and a rejection of the NWO. We continue to see 50.5% of the people rule 49.5% in your representative republic, and in my parliamentary democracy, and we rail against the injustice of it all, but of course, we know the day will come when the shoe will be on the other foot

Quote:

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Originally Posted by paraclete

We have just seen the true democractic voice of the people in the BREXIT referundum in Britain

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Yeah we have referendums here too .Sometimes they even become the law . I'll believe Brexit when I see it . The pushback has already begun. But let me ask you this ; when a referendum decision by the majority violates the rights of the minority ;should it become the law ? I ask that because our courts have struck down many such referendum.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tomder55

Yeah we have referendums here too .Sometimes they even become the law . I'll believe Brexit when I see it . The pushback has already begun. But let me ask you this ; when a referendum decision by the majority violates the rights of the minority ;should it become the law ? I ask that because our courts have struck down many such referendum.

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We don't have that problem and the next referundum we have will be very interesting, we are going to vote on gay right to marriage, or to put in another way, we are going to find a way to disenfranchise the majority and spit in their face, the gays are dreading it because you cannot bribe or threaten an entire population

Personally, I think they should just F**k off

Quote:

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Originally Posted by paraclete

We don't have that problem and the next referundum we have will be very interesting, we are going to vote on gay right to marriage, or to put in another way, we are going to find a way to disenfranchise the majority and spit in their face, the gays are dreading it because you cannot bribe or threaten an entire population

Personally, I think they should just F**k off

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Very mature, clete.

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Originally Posted by tickle

Very mature, clete.

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Yes, it's cultural but it is actually because my attitude to the whole issue is unprintable. It is just another of those tail wagging the dog issues

I'm from Canada but I also hope that Clinton will get elected in November. A Trump presidency would be a disaster for the economy and foreign affairs. I just hope Sanders' supporters grow up and do the right thing and vote for Clinton. I think Tim Kaine or Sherrod Brown would be the best VP picks for Clinton but I think she'll pick Kaine since a Democrat would choose his successor in the senate and Brown opposes NAFTA which could disqualify him since Clinton supports free trade. Kaine is also Catholic and speaks Spanish which could help gain some Hispanic votes.

The only real disaster is if a criminal like Hillary gets elected.

There are Millions in Prison for doing less than Hillary has done... she SHOULD be in prison NOW for what she did over the email thing ALONE. Its Federal law that ALL correspondence produced by Government officials is REQUIRED to be archived and MAINTAINED by the Government, its all also REQUIRED to use government communications systems for the same reason, Accountability.

Nixon erased a few minutes of tape, when it wasn't even illegal to do so. Hillary has deleted HUGE amounts of emails when it IS illegal to do that and liberals feel she should be allowed to do it.

What Nixon has been crucified for was NOTHING compared to what Hillary did on just this. And that Ignores Benghazi, and many other things...

Hillary has never been successful at anything except escaping justice... Trump at least knows how to successfully run a business...

Trump might be arrogant... its REQUIRED to be arrogant to make it and be successful in NY... It's a trait of MANY people from NYC.

But he is a good arrogant... not the rude, condescending arrogant Hillary has always been. Its well known by the Secret Service and anyone else who has spent time dealing with the White House she's exceptionally rude, arrogant, a drunk, and an overall very, very unpleasant person to be around.

I may not have liked Bill politically, but at least he was somewhat likeable when you talked person to person with him. Not her...

I actually understood why Bill did what he did with all those women. Hell most guys that had a wife like her around would do it too. Unless they were totally emasculated.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by smoothy

The only real disaster is if a criminal like Hillary gets elected.

.

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There are two possible disasters smoothy and that is if either is elected. Since realistically there will only be a choice between two, Hobson's choice, even the status quo looks good. I think we will find very interesting Dump's response to the coup in Turkey, let us see if he has any sense.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by paraclete

There are two possible disasters smoothy and that is if either is elected. Since realistically there will only be a choice between two, Hobson's choice, even the status quo looks good. I think we will find very interesting Dump's response to the coup in Turkey, let us see if he has any sense.

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Do you have any doubt that the coup was engineered by JFKerry and Putin as part of their new cooperation in Syria ?

Don't get me wrong, I think Trump is far from perfect... but Hillary IS almost certainly even WORSE than Obama, and only He has managed to make Jimmy Carter look good. And we do only have those two choices.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by smoothy

Don't get me wrong, I think Trump is far from perfect... but Hillary IS almost certainly even WORSE than Obama, and only He has managed to make Jimmy Carter look good. And we do only have those two choices.

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We make our representative hurdle such low bars .

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tomder55

Do you have any doubt that the coup was engineered by JFKerry and Putin as part of their new cooperation in Syria ?

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Tom, despite the fact that the US interferes in the politics of many nations, Putin doesn't need your help, I have little doubt he is behind this. Turkey is supposed to be a US ally in the "fight" against Daesh although a little luke warm in that fight. I'm wondering if the US has shifted from opposing Assad to thinking of him as the best deal it can get

.. Turkey had apparently shifted its position in opposing Assad and this may have been the trigger

Quote:

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Originally Posted by smoothy

Don't get me wrong, I think Trump is far from perfect... but Hillary IS almost certainly even WORSE than Obama, and only He has managed to make Jimmy Carter look good. And we do only have those two choices.

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smoothy, after hearing seven years of nothing could be worse than Obama, I'm just proposing the "devil you know" scenario and the inevietable migration from republic to empire otherwise you will see Dump playing Vader to a Dilliary Empress

With a coup in Turkey I think it is time to ask;where are we going with this? The whole of the middle east region is destabilised, nothing new in that, but the situation is escalating. Attempts to scale down the conflict in Syria have destabilised Turkey and so what do we really have here, an attempted coup in Syria allowing the rise of Daesh, a bloodless coup in Iraq followed by some success in pushing back Daesh, now a coup in Turkey in a nation that fostered Daesh and fermented unrest in Syria. You have to see the hand of Russia in this, someone had to be let go and Erdogan got the DCM. It pays to have powerful allies instead of limp wristed muslim sycophants

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tomder55

We make our representative hurdle such low bars .

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Unfortunately... that's how it works out all too often.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tomder55

We make our representative hurdle such low bars .

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Which demonstrates you need a different selection process