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According to Politifact, the government takeover of health care was the biggest political lie of 2010.
In walks John Conyers to tell us Obamacare is the platform for you guessed it, government takeover of health care.
Told you so. The biggest lie was that it wasn't a takeover of health care... followed closely by "net neutrality is not a government takeover of the internet."
There was more than one Dem that let the cat out of the bag during the debate .
PolitiFact sometimes gets it right :
PolitiFact | Bachmann's $105 billion charge: Was the funding secret?
I say these continuing resolutions have to end if Obamacare is still funded . Time to defund Obamacare .
Since you're in my territory here: define what you understand 'net neutrality" to mean.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Sorry, NK, you're not going to hijack my thread.
But you mentioned it here as the second biggest lie. Now you want to stop all discussions of that assertion?Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
I did indeed mention it and you and I have had that discussion about what "net neutrality" means. The issue is whether it is a government takeover of the internet, not a definition. I say it is.
The Net Neutrality Coup
We need to lock in this advantage
Hello tom:Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Yup.. The last sentence reads, "On balance, we rated Bachmann's statement Barely True."
I'm not interested in "barely true" stuff from my politicians. It might as well be a lie.
excon
Apparently you didn't learn anything from those threads if you post what you posted in your original question.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Hello Steve:Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
For me it was jobs, jobs, jobs, when they actually meant making abortion less available, stopping gay marriage, killing the unions, and making old people freeze in the winter.
But, that's just me.
excon
Neither did you. The courts and Congress both rejected "net neutrality" and Obama's FCC enacted regulations anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Mine was If I like my doctor and my insurance I can keep it and Obamcare wold save me money. Both my wife and my insurance changed and it costs us both more.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
Hello again, Steve:Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
I don't know. I went to the site you linked me to. Funny. It DIDN'T say what YOU say it said. Here's what Conyers said, "..platform for building a single-payer health care system in the United States."
So, if you're going to talk about political LIES, you better be right on about the lie you're complaining about. You weren't.
excon
It is indeed a truth that the Dems snuck in $105 billion of funding into the Obamacare bill.
Now if speaker Boner ever gets his weepy head out of his butt ,they could get on with defunding it instead of falling into the Dem trap of continuous resolutions that keeps the law intact .
Net neutrality has to do with no one, government or corporation, being involved in metering or policing or giving preference to any data that travels across the internet so it is the complete opposite of a government takeover of the internet, it seeks to keep the government out of dictating what can be done with the content. Yet you posted:Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
which the compete opposite of what net neutrality is. No one is arguing over what the FCC is trying to do (the US is less free than it thinks), I was correcting you on your original statement - saying "net neutrality is not a government takeover of the internet" would be a true statement.Quote:
The biggest lie was that it wasn't a takeover of health care... followed closely by "net neutrality is not a government takeover of the internet."
Hello again, tom:Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
If that's so, and I don't know if it is, what does that say about your Republican congress, who after all this time, couldn't find $105 BILLION? In fact, they STILL haven't found it, because she's the only one saying it.
But, back to the Republicans who missed $105 BILLION... And, you want us to trust them with our money... Bwa, ha ha ha.
excon
Since we're on definitions, what does he mean by "single-payer?"Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
Hello again, Steve:
He's talking about who's going to be paying the bills - not who's going to be in your doctors office.
If you want to talk about government in the doctors office, what do you think restricting abortion is??
excon
Funny how Politifact confirmed the numbers and yet says it's 'barely true'.Quote:
she's the only one saying it.
The CRS found it before her.
http://bachmann.house.gov/UploadedFi...0_11_PPACA.pdf
And before that former member of Congress Ishtook wrote about it in Heritage.
How Congress Can Limit the Damage Caused by Obamacare | The Heritage Foundation
He calls the funding like kudzo entwined in the bill .
The only difference is the wording . She calls it a slush fund.
He's correct in that now the Republicans have to go provision by provision and defund it. It won't get done in this continuing resolution process.
Hello again, Steve:Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
I'm not sure you know WHO Politifact said was LYING. In fact, he's saying the people who were using the term, "government takeover of health care", are the LIARS. That'd be YOU guys.
This is how the article concluded: "By selecting "government takeover' as Lie of the Year, PolitiFact is not making a judgment on whether the health care law is good policy. The phrase is simply not true."
excon
He's not getting the subtlety in the right-wing talking point being the problem here.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
BTW have a gander at the comments of the website he posted: Conyers: Obamacare Is ?Platform? for Creating Single-Payer System | CNSnews.com
Yikes!
Quote:
what does that say about your Republican congress, who after all this time, couldn't find $105 BILLION?
(Pelosi)Quote:
"We have to pass the bill so that you can find out what is in it."
The lame duck Senate passed it on Christmas Eve after last minute 383 pages of amendments were added to the already 2000+ page bill. They then went further and linked many of the provisions of the bill to the Reconciliaton bill that passed both Houses by simple Democrat majorities .They added automatic funding triggers that went into effect when the President signed to bill into law.
The whole thing is so entangled with other funding unrelated to the bill that the best thing to do is to completely defund any provisions of the bill. That would be at a minimum a $105 billion budget cut .
These clowns are nit-picking over $60 billion cuts and making it sound like it's a big thing . It's silly and Speaker Boner better start coming through on the campaign promises to end Obamacare.
Actually ;I'll go even further . Mr Speaker ;step down now . The Republicans should appoint Mike Pence as majority leader.
Now wait a minute, if I recall correctly - and I do - you said there is already someone in the doctor's office with us, the insurance company. So if the federal government becomes the "single-payer" they aren't going to be in the doctor's office with us? Bwa ha ha!!Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
Protecting life... you don't think the government already protects life elsewhere?Quote:
If you want to talk about government in the doctors office, what do you think restricting abortion is??
A couple of weeks ago we had massive grass fires because some idiot was using a grinder to cut open a gate to break into someone else's property on a day when the wind was blowing over 50 mph. Dozens of homes were burned to the ground. The authorities ordered an evacuation and wouldn't let anyone back in to their own property and homes. Some homeowners were led away in handcuffs. Were they wrong?
Then tell them dems to quit admitting it's a trojan horse for a government takeover.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
Hello again, Steve:Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Uhhhh, no.
After a committee member talked about a program that uses hunters in helicopters to shoot wild swine, Kansas Republican State Representative Virgil Peck, suggested that may be a way to control illegal immigration.
If Peck spies a pregnant illegal running away from his helicopter, he better shoot her in the head, cause you got to save her fetus.
excon
Ok, you made me laugh. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by excon
Hello again, Steve:
Hold on to your jodhpurs, fella. Here comes the answer you been waiting for. If we reel in out of control health care costs, we won't have to do any messing around with MY entitlements, or YOUR oil subsidy's... The only way to do that is a single payer system.
Obama's plan is a START - not an END.
excon
I'm all for reeling in health care costs. So far since Obamacare became law they've just gone up and up and up.
Just came across this jewel by Pelosi which tom brought to our attention earlier.
Pelosi's true agenda
Quote:
But she made a more subtle point, too. “Think of what it does to the other side, who do not believe in government,” Pelosi said. “This will now be the legitimate political debate in our country. What is the balanced role the government should have in controlling the cost, of expanding the coverage, holding the insurance companies accountable.” In other words, the full measure of this bill isn’t simply the impact it will have on lives in the short- to medium-term. It’s also the impact it will have on politics.
Republicans say they welcome this debate--because, they say, government’s inevitable failure will reinforce their worldview. But the historical record on this is pretty clear: One government makes a promise of something like health benefits, that promise never gets revoked. (This is why Bill Kristol famously advised Republicans to oppose Clintoncare in 1993 and 1994.) And if enacting reform manages to make more ambitious changes possible later on, Pelosi made clear she intends to seize that opportunity: “Now we go from here. We kick open that door and there will be other legislation to follow.”
Hello again, Steve:Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Yeah, she wants single payer, just like ALL the Democrats do.. What's the surprise?
excon
No surprise here, it's always been intended as a platform for single-payer. That's the whole gist of this thread.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
Thirty-two of the thirty-three developed nations have universal health care, with the United States being the lone exception.
List of Countries with Universal Healthcare True Cost – Analyzing our economy, government policy, and society through the lens of cost-benefit
^
You'll note that there is a dated comment on that website.
Hello again, Steve:
Then I'm missing something... The only political lie that's been reported here, is the Republicans calling the Health Care Bill, a government takeover... The Democrats NEVER lied about their desire/wish/intention/plan - whatever you want to call it, for single payer.. Now, you can call that a government takeover too, and I'm sure you will, but that would just perpetuate the lie.
What would be MORE akin to a government takeover, would be YOUR desire/wish/intention/plan for the GOVERNMENT to TAKEOVER every uterus in the nation.
excon
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