You had to google that, didn't you. *smirk* Btw, we're all going to be judged.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
Yes, you have. Often.Quote:
Never said it did.
Being facetious, are we???Quote:
Why would you want to do that?
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You had to google that, didn't you. *smirk* Btw, we're all going to be judged.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
Yes, you have. Often.Quote:
Never said it did.
Being facetious, are we???Quote:
Why would you want to do that?
Actually, only to make sure my spelling was right. I remember that word from my Greek class since our instructor made a really big deal out of it and wanted us to spell it "ev" rather than "eu". Don't recall why. At any rate, if you had ever studied Greek, then "evangelism" jumps off the page. It's a transliteration.Quote:
You had to google that, didn't you. *smirk* Btw, we're all going to be judged.
Find it. I have never said, "to raise one's voice as fundies are wont to do with their bullhorns and shouting into the faces of those they consider lost and doomed to eternal hellfire," or anything close to it. I don't use a bullhorn or shout into faces. I don't suggest others do.Quote:
Yes, you have. Often.
No. I am interested in your moral (or practical) reasoning for trying to lead women, in whatever manner, away from out of wedlock births. Why do you do that?Quote:
Being facetious, are we???
Your post #306: "It starts with me raising my voice."Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
I almost fell off my chair when reading this. Why indeed!Quote:
No. I am interested in your moral (or practical) reasoning for trying to lead women, in whatever manner, away from out of wedlock births. Why do you do that?
I've also led many workshops to help people job hunt, fill out job applications and put together resumes, and be comfortable during job interviews (by roleplaying and with skits).
Post 306 read, "It starts with me raising my voice. It could continue with you raising your voice. We could try and sway public opinion. That's where this kind of thing always starts." We were discussing social policy, not the gospel. You know, that is perilously close to flat out deceit. You know full well I was not talking about preaching with a bullhorn. Shame on you. Very disappointing.
Did you almost fall off your chair because, as usual, you are afraid to answer the question?Quote:
I almost fell off my chair when reading this. Why indeed!
I commend you. Really.Quote:
I've also led many workshops to help people job hunt, fill out job applications and put together resumes, and be comfortable during job interviews (by roleplaying and with skits).
I wonder if the ever declining membership of your Lutheran Church has to do with your rejection of evangelism?
The declining membership is because it's too literal and conservative, stuck in its ways, and outdated in its approach to younger people. For those reasons and more, I long ago left it.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
So you are no longer a Lutheran? You've been saying you are a Lutheran, but now you're saying you're not.
Just out of curiosity, what are your principles of hermeneutics when reading the Bible, in particular as it relates to when to take a passage figuratively or literally?
And you want to talk about Trump being dumb. Here's a new standard. "Seattle Mayor Durkan: CHAZ Has A 'Block Party Atmosphere," Could Turn Into "Summer Of Love'"
I wonder if the people in that neighborhood feel the same way?
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2020/06/12/seattle_mayor_durkan_chaz_has_a_block_party_atmosp here_could_turn_into_summer_of_love.html?fbclid=Iw AR3y3WNs7MLnsN3uVAmg4L8bC7wGYkZ2_fjKnhmu26BhduWgK3 _gBQEYP3E
Let the locals handle there own business. No looting, no burning, no deaths or injuries. Occupy Wall Street lasted months.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
Occupy Wall Street was confined to trespassing and vadalizing a public park and that was bad enough. These people are violating the rights of citizens who have their homes and their businesses in the occupied zone . It is completely different . They also have a right to have their life liberty and property protected . That is the primary function of government . Seattle has abdicated it's responsibilities as has the state .
Let the locals handle it!
I wonder if your response would have been the same if this had been handled by "Mayor Trump"?Quote:
Let the locals handle there own business. No looting, no burning, no deaths or injuries. Occupy Wall Street lasted months.
Let the locals handle it.
since there is no police presence ;as a resident I would have no option but to "handle it " . If the occupiers are not subject to the law ,am I ?
That's a really good question.Quote:
If the occupiers are not subject to the law ,am I ?
Then there is this .... Dr. Deborah Birx, on a conference call with the nations governors disclosed that 70 c-19 testing sites had been destroyed during the Floyd peaceful protests, and there had been a resultant drop in testing. She said there will have to be a "scramble " to replace those sites because she believes cases of infections will spike in areas where the protests occurred .
What ? You didn't hear that as the lead story ?I bet you would've had this happened a week earlier when real peaceful protests by business owners who wanted to open up had destroyed the testing sites .
Same question I ask Tom, if the elite and elected and the badged and armed aren't subject to the law, then why am I?Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Those darn criminal elements.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Leaked to the Daily Caller is all I know, but for sure if it was business owners doing criminal acts we sure would have heard about it.Quote:
What ? You didn't hear that as the lead story ?I bet you would've had this happened a week earlier when real peaceful protests by business owners who wanted to open up had destroyed the testing sites .
no concern then that the loss of the sites in the minority communities, and the risks the protests have as stated by both Birx and Fauci ,will give the virus a boost in minority communities ? More deaths will result from that than police brutality .
The only minority deaths that count are the ones lost at the hands of the police. Otherwise, no one seems interested.
Is it a subtle form of racism at work when a completely innocent white woman is shot and killed by a black police officer in Minneapolis (2019) and not a single person turns out to protest the shooting or burn a building, but when a black man is killed by a white officer the protests are large and turn violent?
But jl surely you know black lives matter and the death of a white woman is of no concern to a blackQuote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
Here is the 'block party ''summer of love ' Mayor Durkan is talking about . If I'm a resident . I now have to put up with trespasser's noise 24/7 and the vandalism .This is what the good citizens of CHAZistan call their Communal Renewal and Art Program (CRAP)
https://external-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...BSU2KtS_vCK4ld
Now as a legitimate tax paying citizen of the community with all that implies (a compact with the government to protect my life liberty and property ) I know the idiot mayor won't do a damn thing about it ;and in fact approves the fact that the section of town has been invaded and occupied .The block party was clearly spray painting graffiti block by block . Get a closer look this is the future with a defunded police force.
I blame destructive behavior on destructive people no matter what it is they destroy, and reconcile the risks that protestors take the same way that states are choosing to reopen. We are all at risk because of our behaviors most fear driven.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
The black officer was duly convicted,Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
https://theintercept.com/2019/05/02/...ustine-damond/
Just in case the cable is out at your houses, we have another shooting in Atlanta to add more fuel to the fire.Quote:
According to data compiled by the Star Tribune, Noor’s case marks the first conviction out of 179 police-involved deaths in Minnesota since 2000.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/ra...?ocid=msedgntp
You know how the process works in communities, the mayor, chief decide the course of actions. I know Tom, you prefer a more dramatic head knocking, guns blazing approach, send in the troops and gas 'em all. I prefer a more peaceful solution. Much more peaceful than the NJ guy shot while waiting for a tow truck and ends up being shot to death. Or being shot in the back in a Wendy's parking lot.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
He resisted arrest after he failed a field sobriety test (after he had fell asleep on line at a Wendy's drive through ). He wrestled a tazer out of the hands of an officer ,ran and then turned to use the weapon on him .That is what the video shows (the officers body cam ;not the Wendy's cam .That is why he was shot. Are you saying the officer was wrong to defend himself ?Quote:
Or being shot in the back in a Wendy's parking lot.
and the incident in NJ is on video to see what really happened . He wasn't innocently waiting for a tow truck .His car broke down when he was travelling 110 mph. At first he followed the officers instructions . But when the officer went to get him a protective mask he attempted to get into the drivers side of the patrol car. A scuffle ensued and that is when the officer fired at him.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...ature=emb_logo
What was the officer defending himself over? A black man RUNNING AWAY from him? And aren't cops trained how to wrest a taser out of someone's possession without shooting and killing him?Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
And had the man been white, how would the cops have handled this incident? (If you can't figure THAT out, I've lost faith in you.)
There's an obvious answer to your comment.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
A white being killed by a black policeman is so rare that the Minneapolis citizens nevertheless let justice run its course. In this case, the officer was convicted of murder and sentenced to 12 and a half years in prison. The family of the Australian woman killed received $20 million from the city. There was no need for demonstrations and protests.
A similar case in the same area shortly before this one was that of a black man (Philando Castile) sitting peacefully in his car, acknowledging his ownership of a legal gun permit, who was shot seven times and killed. His passenger recorded it including the victim's words repeating he was not reaching for his gun. That video went viral as I'm sure you remember. The murderer cop was acquitted. Castile's family received $3 million from the city - a strong indication of a bad jury verdict.
The murder of a black man by a white cop is an occurrence too common to be ignored. Protests and demonstrations are an effective way to get attention - which has been successful in the current case globally - and to attempt to once and for all reform the criminal justice system in America - a system designed to disadvantage African-Americans.
Spare us your usual racist BS about wedlock and crime. These events are about deliberate judicial murder - so entrenched in police culture and police departments that the murdering police knew they were being taped on camera, and even that did not dissuade them from what they did.
I don't know the procedures or training .I do know what I saw which was the black man running away until he turned around and pointed the taser at the cop . I expect there will be an investigation and given the atmosphere in the country I am not sure there will be a fair hearing .Quote:
What was the officer defending himself over? A black man RUNNING AWAY from him? And aren't cops trained how to wrest a taser out of someone's possession without shooting and killing him?
all I can do in this case is cite facts to reply to your hypotheticalQuote:
And had the man been white, how would the cops have handled this incident? (If you can't figure THAT out, I've lost faith in you.)
In 2019 police officers fatally shot 1,004 people, most of whom were armed or otherwise dangerous. African-Americans were about a quarter of those killed by cops last year (235), a ratio that has remained stable since 2015. The police fatally shot nine unarmed blacks and 19 unarmed whites in 2019, according to a Washington Post database.
The black man was too far from the pursuing cop for the taser to be effective - assuming it was even loaded. The cop shot him needlessly. That's obvious from the video. He should have just chased him.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
The black man started the mess by refusing to be cuffed. But the shooting is an entirely different situation.
I think it's pretty obvious the cop was in the wrong. Unfair would be if the cop's action was approved by the authorities.Quote:
I expect there will be an investigation and given the atmosphere in the country I am not sure there will be a fair hearing .
These statistical citations need to be analyzed. For example, blacks, 12.5 % of the population, are 25% of the killed. That's not to say some or all of them weren't righteous. Point being, much more context is required to determine whether the stats tell us anything of value.Quote:
In 2019 police officers fatally shot 1,004 people, most of whom were armed or otherwise dangerous. African-Americans were about a quarter of those killed by cops last year (235), a ratio that has remained stable since 2015. The police fatally shot nine unarmed blacks and 19 unarmed whites in 2019, according to a Washington Post database.
If I'm a cop I don't have the luxury of determining in a split second if the guy I'm chasing is pointing a taser armed or unarmed ,or another weapon at me . All I know is that he is pointing a weapon at me . So it is not clear the shooting wasn't justified .Quote:
I think it's pretty obvious the cop was in the wrong. Unfair would be if the cop's action was approved by the authorities.................The black man was too far from the pursuing cop for the taser to be effective - assuming it was even loaded. The cop shot him needlessly. That's obvious from the video. He should have just chased him.
The taser flashed so I assume the guy fired it. I maintain the cop was too far so shooting the guy was not necessary. As to a "split second", this is the argument used by cops all the time. Second only to "I was in fear of my life". The juries love that one.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
I think the cop was trigger happy. Time will tell, I hope.
The cop knew it was his taser. As Athos mentioned, the distance between them was too great for the taser to do any harm to the cop. And yes, if you're a cop, you are (supposed to be) trained and ready to make split-second decisions. Otherwise, become a short-order cook or mail carrier instead.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Those facts can be pesky things. Consider these.Quote:
all I can do in this case is cite facts to reply to your hypothetical
In 2019 police officers fatally shot 1,004 people, most of whom were armed or otherwise dangerous. African-Americans were about a quarter of those killed by cops last year (235), a ratio that has remained stable since 2015. The police fatally shot nine unarmed blacks and 19 unarmed whites in 2019, according to a Washington Post database.
Black people in the United States are more likely to be victims of violent confrontations with police officers (per capita) than their white counterparts. But let’s dive deeper into why this is. Statistically, minorities come to police attention far more than their population would suggest.
- Black Americans make up about 13% of the population.
- But according to the FBI, they account for about 50% of murders, and about 38% of all violent crime overall.
According to 2016 FBI data, black men commit murder 572.8% more than white men. Rapes are committed at a level of 146.1% greater, robbery at 617.9% greater, aggravated assault at 203.3% greater and violent crime in total at 263.6% greater. (JL. The obvious conclusion from this is that a black man is more likely to be engaged by the police in the commission of a violent crime than are others.)
A 2016 study by Roland G. Fryer Jr., who is an economics professor at Harvard. He found that no racial bias could be detected in police shootings, in either the raw data or when accounting for controls. He also found racial bias was detected in lesser use of police force, but not deadly encounters. His recommendation?
“Black Lives Matter should seek solutions within their own communities rather than changing the behaviors of police and other external forces.” (JL. Described by Athos as "racist BS", but known to other people as "truth".)
https://www.lawenforcementtoday.com/...-race-numbers/
You never seem to get the point.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
When discussing the police murdering unarmed blacks, you bring up unrelated info about crime that is not the point. It is obvious your attempt to change the discussion away from bad police actions is rooted in your racism.
We're all getting tired of your repeated BS and your avoidance of contributing anything to the issue being discussed - an issue so important that the entire world is commenting on it.
I prefer you just skip over whatever you see posted under my name and stop replying to me when the police killing of blacks is being discussed.
guess that will be plan B when the fools who want defunding get their wish . Hate to burst the balloon but what will replace them will be privately hired security rather than midnight basketball referees . Y'all gonna miss the cops .Quote:
Otherwise, become a short-order cook or mail carrier instead.
I keep on going back to art references . In spaghetti westerns the people hate the sheriff and only tolerate him because he can do the job they don't have the backbone for.
That wasn't what I was talking about, and you know it! I had said and was referring to poor training cops are apparently getting, "And yes, if you're a cop, you are (supposed to be) trained and ready to make split-second decisions. Otherwise, become a short-order cook or mail carrier instead."Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
They are using a mis-understood word. By "defunding" is meant defunding non-police activities and put them to mental health workers or social workers. One has actually promoted dismantling the police and starting over. She is a victim of her enthusiasm.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Spaghetti westerns are art????????? Perish the thought!Quote:
I keep on going back to art references . In spaghetti westerns the people hate the sheriff and only tolerate him because he can do the job they don't have the backbone for.
Your complete rejection of any discussion of what can be done to assist black America in moving forward can easily be interpreted as racism. Violent behavior by the police is far away from being the chief problem in that regard.Quote:
When discussing the police murdering unarmed blacks, you bring up unrelated info about crime that is not the point. It is obvious your attempt to change the discussion away from bad police actions is rooted in your racism.
Please go away.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
I am here for discussion. I will be happy to avoid discussion with you if you are agreeable. Just let it be a two way street.
NY Times op-ed clears up 'Defund the police' confusion: 'Yes, we mean literally abolish the police'
https://www.foxnews.com/media/ny-tim...ish-the-police
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