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By law I believe the fed does have limits, and quite possibly they may not be able to render as much aid as possible to resolve this challenge without the aid of other sources, namely the congress. At best it's a temporary stopgap fix depending on the monetary policies needed on a more longterm basis.
What do you think it means?
I don't know. That's why I wouldn't bother to make reference to it. I don't link to issues to I don't feel like I understand.
Now the thoughtful person in charge of the Congress is suggesting we borrow and spend another 3 trillion. It is insanity on steroids. No talk of spending cuts. No talk of making a wiser and more efficient use of the money we do have. Just borrow, borrow, borrow. I hope Trump will have the backbone to oppose this.
You have a more thoughtful resolution/ What would you cut? If this reopining of the ecomomy results in more sickness and death how should we resolve that?
I would not spend money we don't have. I would not send money to people who don't need it. Think of this. We could send EVERY unemployed adult American a check for five grand right now and spend about 100 billion. They are talking about 3 trillion. For three tril we could send every American alive a check for 10 thousand dollars. If it's all just that easy, then why not do that every single year???
It is craziness.
I like your idea. Save money and send everybody cash. So what of the virus and it's effects on the economy? We are learning that some young people and children can be very adversely affected also, and a disproportionate number of infections and deaths are found in minority communities.
Maybe we should double your cash payments and still save until we get a vaccine or some better treatments.
If it's just a matter of borrowing and spending, then we are good to go. However, that is a big, big IF.
I added links to my last post, but as long as it just money then keep throwing it at the virus...and at ME!
Yes Tal, seems to be the current thinking, however, politicians are fickle
Wow. What a crazy statement. Amazingly, I think you actually believe it.Quote:
but as long as it just money then keep throwing it at the virus...and at ME!
can't you tell when someone is pulling your leg
Maybe JL swallowed the lysol instead of just gargling and spitting it out. Unless he sees the 8D then he takes things seriously and literally with enough fire and brimstones to scare the heathens.
Considering that you're the guy who said he didn't mind piling debt onto the shoulders of his grandchildren because, after all, every generation has its burden to bear, then I don't consider any statement of yours to be so outrageous as to be obviously spoken in jest.Quote:
Maybe JL swallowed the lysol instead of just gargling and spitting it out. Unless he sees the 8D then he takes things seriously and literally with enough fire and brimstones to scare the heathens.
The crap pile of debt has been piling up a long time and will continue to grow until some future generation cleans it up or does something about it. So until we humans rise above the challenge then we wallow in our own crap like we always have. The thing is we as a collective are so entrenched in our own narrow views we have a huge problem listening and reaching a good consensus, and formulating a plan that we can focus on executing, based on facts and not just feelings, or false choices of either or.
What would prevent us from doing something about it now other than an utter lack of intelligence and honor?Quote:
The crap pile of debt has been piling up a long time and will continue to grow until some future generation cleans it up or does something about it. So until we humans rise above the challenge then we wallow in our own crap like we always have.
You mean respect don't you instead of honor, for the opposite position? I think that's where consensus and compromise starts.
I mean honor. Honor in the sense that I would rather do without than pass on this kind of debt to my grandchildren. Respect for the "carelessly borrow and spend for anything and everything" crowd? Not on your life.
Is borrowing and spending in this health crisis worth it to you? What are you willing to do without?
To help my grandchildren??? Are you seriously asking that question?
Can't you just seriously answer the questions? I'm just curious about YOUR America, as opposed to mine. My America struggles for the meaning of the words in the constitution given to yours and not mine, which leaves very little to give up since we trying to get and have something for our grand kids. Mine were slaves a lot longer than we were free and still have to abide by the rich guy master crap that you seem only to willing to help perpetrate.
So your answers please. Sorry to be so blunt about it, but we still working hard to overcome, and you seem to keep your stubborn arse in the way!
I await your response.
Quote:
What are you willing to do without?
Right off the top of my head, I would begin by cutting every federal department by 2% a year until the budget was balanced with the exception of the military. I would cut them by something more than 2% the first year and continue until the military was a good bit smaller than now, and that would be accompanied by learning how to mind our own business better. I would give every federal employee a 5% pay cut. I would cut welfare payments by the same amount. I would establish a standard that no person healthy in mind and body would be eligible for welfare. I would give every federal forest a hard look to see if we really need to have a gazillion acres of forest land owned by the feds. I would do away with the ethanol subsidies. I would give our tax program a long, hard look and likely go with a flat tax. I would pass a law that, barring a legit national emergency, would establish harsh penalties for any congressman/woman idiotic and reckless enough to suggest new spending with no adequate means to pay for it.Quote:
So your answers please. Sorry to be so blunt about it, but we still working hard to overcome, and you seem to keep your stubborn arse in the way!
How about you? I'm hopeful to get an answer from you. The other two of the Three Amigos are reluctant beyond words to answer tough questions. I do hope that you don't base your plan on the idea that we can just tax the rich and balance the budget. That is impossible from a math point of view.
I await your response.
I don't think this virus will let us bring about a budgetary path to a more balanced budget, nor see one until we get this virus under control which makes an outlay of even more funding to that end almost mandatory. I don't see the economy anywhere near full recovery in order to pay the bills we are racking up which won't stop until we have a vaccine, or an aggressive treatment regime that allows people safely back to work full time.
We haven't gotten the bill for this yet, and until we do we can't know what we will have to do to restore any fiscal sanity to the country. Nearly half the country was poor before the bug, and I see that growing as long as it's making people sick and killing folks.
Sorry that's all I got as a response to what you posted, but I doubt the normal arguments even apply right now other than measures to ease the social disruptions that the shutdown has caused and fear any reopening will result in even more sickness and deaths and MO"MONEY on the credit card.
Just keeping it real!
a liberal talking about fiscal sanity, Tal, not something expected from that side of the fence. The government cannot cure poor, never has, never willQuote:
We haven't gotten the bill for this yet, and until we do we can't know what we will have to do to restore any fiscal sanity to the country. Nearly half the country was poor before the bug, and I see that growing as long as it's making people sick and killing folks.
I'm a Republican, but will answer, or rather, will ask a counter question. Are you willing to die from COVID-19?Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
So you don't answer the question, but want to ask one? Doesn't work that way.
Why can't women say "my body, my choice" when they want an abortion?Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
So, no, you can't say that.
Plus, it would be one of the most selfish, unloving actions that a person who claims to be a Christian could take.
Because it is not just about their bodies at that point. There are two lives at stake.Quote:
Why can't women say "my body, my choice" when they want an abortion?
If you are referring to abortion, then I agree completely.Quote:
Plus, it would be one of the most selfish, unloving actions that a person who claims to be a Christian could take.
It's disturbing to see cops use force to enforce social distancing guidelines just as it's disturbing to see the dufus trying to undermine Dr. Fauci,
https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...against-fauci/
You can take whatever moral stance you want regarding any issue, but it's YOUR moral stance and others have a right to theirs so comparing legal abortions to responses to a global health crisis is a totally false equivalency. Just as ignoring the sickness and death for economic reasons without safeguards is asking for more bad stuff to happen.
Sometimes the cure is worse than the disease, but if you want to be healthy, you endure it until you're cured.
a little smoke and mirrors going on here
You took the words right out of my mouth, and I've said so since Reagan and his low wage job creation claims. The practice has endured ever since, and been exported to other countries big time as well, making poverty a growth business for many who need cheap labor to turn a buck.
The foundation of the trickle down economic policy, and business model. Profits over people.
Except, of course, that the number of people making minimum wage is only about 2% of the population and that wages have grown over time.
Bear in mind that your view is a moral position itself. Your approach is exactly the same that many people took in the 1850's regarding slavery. It was reprehensible then, and it is reprehensible now to regard a concern for human beings as being nothing more than merely a "moral stance". The next time you want to raise your largely false narrative about the kids in detention on the southern border, should I refer to that as nothing more than a "moral stance"?Quote:
You can take whatever moral stance you want regarding any issue,
And btw, I am not advocating against wearing masks. I wear mine in public. The point was a great deal deeper than whether or not to wear a mask.
1. Even if true, the cost of living has also increased at a greater rate than some wages. You cannot ignore that part of the equation.
2. You can take my position any way you please. Mans cruelty to man is just a matter of history, as are his excuses for it. We make laws and people break them all the time. We change laws over time and people still break them. There is always the few against the many. Even doing the best we can, humans fall short of perfection.
So I take your point, but just don't agree with it. I see your narratives as false as you see mine, so what's the deal here? I doubt that changes anytime soon as long as we engage and interact on things beyond the flavor of donuts. Full disclosure, I have my favorite donuts, but love them ALL! I guess where I draw lines on my positions and the accompanying morality is the effects on others. On this and many issues we seem to have different approaches and abortions are just one of many. I get you want the laws changed and good luck with that, but until that happens actions within the law are accepted, as actions about slavery were accepted, since the first slave arrived here, and the laws were changed over time.
Slavery is illegal, but putting a value on human worth is still done by humans who are deemed to be authorized and accepted as authority. You may be a better paid slave, but a slave to the system nonetheless, under the thin veneer of voluntary participation. Like there are other choices. When the boss says show up, he doesn't ask what else you rather be doing, or what your morality is, you better show up.
You have the same choices that slaves had back then when it was legal except the physical chains and beatings were replaced with economic ones, less physical but just as binding. More so even.
My statement is true, and this statement is not true.Quote:
Even if true, the cost of living has also increased at a greater rate than some wages.
I don't think you do. If you really did, you would support the right of unborn to live. Since their brutal deaths are done in secret, most people just yawn and make moral platitudes.Quote:
I guess where I draw lines on my positions and the accompanying morality is the effects on others.
I think if you had been a slave for even two weeks, you would never make such an absurd statement. Have you ever read of the slaves who fled north at the risk of their lives deciding to just go back and live in slavery again? Of course they didn't, and it just goes to show how crazy your statement is.Quote:
You have the same choices that slaves had back then when it was legal except the physical chains and beatings were replaced with economic ones, less physical but just as binding. More so even.
That's your belief. Others believe that it's not a real person until it's been born and is breathing.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
WG: Plus, it would be one of the most selfish, unloving actions that a person who claims to be a Christian could take.
No, as you well know, I was referring to not wearing a mask.Quote:
If you are referring to abortion, then I agree completely.
1. How convenient you ignore the rising pricings as you mention wages rising.
2. I don't have to pass your moral litmus test nor agree with your opinion on any subject. What you think seldom moves me.
3. The end of chains on black people was but the start of expanding the chains on all people. The moral thing to do? Progress? Evolution maybe? While you're reading you accounts of the past, take time to ask a black man NOW if his struggle is over yet. Let me know what they tell you.
The absurdity lies with you my friend if you think that the end of slavery ended subjugation, oppression, discrimination, suppression, racism, or any other excuse for man's cruelty to man.
It is not simply my belief that there are two bodies. That is as plainly evident as can be. As to the issue of "born and breathing", no one with any real knowledge of unborn children believes such a ridiculous idea. Brainwaves, heartbeat, and completely functioning body systems are all present months before delivery. The argument is ludicrous.Quote:
That's your belief. Others believe that it's not a real person until it's been born and is breathing.
It is my fervent hope that you will someday have to endure slavery for a few months in the hope that on some dark, hopeless night it will dawn upon you what a priceless possession you had with your freedom that you so easily dismiss as "chains". You live where you want. You work where you want. You decide when to leave and when to return home. You enjoy a standard of living most of the world yearns for, and yet you make such statements.Quote:
3. The end of chains on black people was but the start of expanding the chains on all people. The moral thing to do? Progress? Evolution maybe? While you're reading you accounts of the past, take time to ask a black man NOW if his struggle is over yet. Let me know what they tell you.
The absurdity lies with you my friend if you think that the end of slavery ended subjugation, oppression, discrimination, suppression, racism, or any other excuse for man's cruelty to man.
I didn't ignore rising prices. Go back and read my statement with a little more care. Wages have outpaced consumer prices in the years since Reagan.Quote:
How convenient you ignore the rising pricings as you mention wages rising.
It is my fervent hope you can walk in the shoes of a minority, and tell me how perfect the world is. Maybe it's better here than elsewhere in the world, no doubt, but don't try to feed me the crap sandwich about what I or any minority yearns for.Quote:
It is my fervent hope that you will someday have to endure slavery for a few months in the hope that on some dark, hopeless night it will dawn upon you what a priceless possession you had with your freedom that you so easily dismiss as "chains". You live where you want. You work where you want. You decide when to leave and when to return home. You enjoy a standard of living most of the world yearns for, and yet you make such statements.
Pure loony BS!Quote:
I didn't ignore rising prices. Go back and read my statement with a little more care. Wages have outpaced consumer prices in the years since Reagan.
But it isn't breathing.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
If you were female and had been impregnated by a selfish, demanding husband/boyfriend (especially one who had no interest in birth control), a rapist, a family member (incest), birth control failure, etc., you'll have little or no interest in nine months of nausea and vomiting, headaches, weight gain, backaches, frequent need to pee, constipation, swollen ankles, constant fatigue, being uncomfortable no matter the position, et al. (yeah, there's more).
Thus, abortion is the solution.
Response to tal:Yet Ahmaud Arbery was chased by white two guys in a truck and shot dead while out jogging. "Why?" they were asked later. "He was a black man running down our road," was the answer.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
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