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and Oregon was one of those blue state models that the rest of the country was supposed to model their plan after .
Must be one of those attacks I'm not supposed to take personally .Quote:
All you can do now is drink and do drugs and drown in your own FAILURE! Why should we even believe failures such a yourself?
But they have a really catchy jingle.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
I shall refrain from any more snark lest I get another red mark.Quote:
Must be one of those attacks I'm not supposed to take personally .
As opposed to shaping society in the image of a football match perhaps?Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
What is your definition of equity and how is it achieved?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuttyd
If you like your hospital ...you can't keep it.
New health plans sold through exchanges not accepted at some prestigious NYC hospitals - The Washington PostQuote:
As of this week, not one of the plans for sale on New York's health benefit exchange would cover treatment at Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center, one of the world's largest and most respected cancer hospitals.
That could mean that the 615,000 individuals and 450,000 small business employees expected to eventually get their insurance through the exchange would have to go someplace else for treatment, or pay the bill out of their own pockets.
Other premier city hospitals are in the networks of just a few of the new plans.
NYU Langone Medical Center has signed agreements with four of the 19 insurers doing business on the exchange.
NewYork-Presbyterian Hospital, which oversees the city's biggest hospital system, has signed agreements with six insurers.
The death panel will decide your fate .
Well, healthcare.gov certainly can't tell you your fate so someone has to decide.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Healthcare.gov can't tell consumers whether they can keep their doctors | Mobile Washington Examiner
There are many types of equities, none of which can ever be realized in total. The type of equity you guys promote is the type where social, political and economic equity is a complete package. It only has to be realized in its totality to create a better society.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
On the other side of the ideological coin no one should ever suggest that economic equity should be attempted. However, everyone should want to promote the idea that equity in health care is something worth aiming for.
Health care should be doled out according to needs, not the perceived needs of a society that believes in a level playing field best determines health outcomes for everyone.
Does Obamacare achieve that? Is it equitable?
Economics expert Steve Rattner explained yesterday how 80 percent of us are "unaffected" by Obamacare, the current talking point myth designed to make us feel better about getting screwed. He even had a nice little chart.
http://media.hotair.com/wp/wp-conten...WhoPayMore.jpg
My question would be what is the definition of "unaffected" seeing as how most of us had to change plans and many of those plans cost significantly more, raise deductibles, copays and out-of-pockets and no, won't let us keep our doctors.
So what part of "unaffected" am I missing here?
You had to change doctors, got higher premiums? Who is this "us" you keep referring too? How many is "US"?
Just asking.
I've still got my doctor. My private pay son still has his doctor and no change in cost or coverage. My other son who has health insurance through his job has experienced no change in cost or coverage. We are in Illinois.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
How many got to keep their plans they liked?Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
At our house, all four of us. I haven't done an Illinois survey yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
So you were "unaffected" by Obamacare, that makes four. Here's one woman's choice, and she's not happy about it.
Forced into a government handout she didn't want robbing her of her dignity. Good work Mr. President.Quote:
My mother is not one to seek attention by complaining, so her recent woeful Facebook post caught my eye: "The poor get poorer." It diverged from the more customary stream of inspirational quotes, recipes and snapshots from her tiny cottage in Pierce County, Wash.
The post continued: "I just received a notice: 'In order to comply with the new healthcare law, your current health plan will be discontinued on December 31, 2013.' Currently my premium is $276 and it is a stretch for me to cover. The new plan . . . are you ready . . . projected new rate $415.20. Now I can't afford health insurance."
The unaffordable ObamaCare-compliant plan that her insurer offered in a Sept. 26 letter is not what makes my mother's story noteworthy. Countless individually insured Americans have received such letters; many are seeing more radical increases in premiums and deductibles.
But most of these people are still being offered the chance to choose what health-care insurance they will receive, or to opt out before they are automatically enrolled in a state program. Not so my mother, Charlene Hopkins, as I soon discovered when I called after seeing her Facebook post.
Since she couldn't afford the new plan offered by her insurer, she told me she was eager to explore her new choices under the Affordable Care Act. Washington Healthplanfinder is one of the better health-exchange sites, and she was actually able to log on. She entered her personal and financial data. With efficiency uncommon to the ObamaCare process, the site quickly presented her with a health-care option.
That is not a typo: There was just one option—at the very affordable monthly rate of zero. The exchange had determined that my mother was not eligible to choose to pay for a plan, and so she was slated immediately for Medicaid. She couldn't believe it was true and held off completing the application.
...
Instead, almost mockingly, her "Eligibility Results" came back: "Congratulations, we received and reviewed your application and determined [you] will receive the health care coverage listed below: Washington Apple Health. You will receive a letter telling you which managed care plan you are enrolled with." Washington Apple Health is the mawkish rebranding of Medicaid in Washington state.
The page lacked a cancel button or any way to opt out of Medicaid. It was done; she was enrolled, and there was nothing to do but click "Next" and then to sign out.
Of course, Medicaid is not a new option for my mother; she knew that she was poor enough to qualify for cost-free health care. It was a deliberate choice on her part to pay that monthly $276 out of her own pocket. Clearly she had judged that she received a personal benefit from not being on Medicaid.
"I just don't expect anything positive out of getting free health care," she said. "I don't see why other people should have to pay for my care, whether it be through taxes or otherwise." In paying for health insurance herself—she won't accept help from her family, either—she was safeguarding her dignity and independence and her sense of being a fully functioning member of society.
Before ObamaCare, Medicaid was one option. Not the option. Before this, she had never been, in effect, ordered to take a handout. Now she has been forced to join the government-reliant poor, though she would prefer to contribute her two mites. The authorities behind "affordable care" had erased her right to calculate what she was willing to spend to preserve her dignity—to determine what she thinks is affordable.
That little contribution can mean the difference between dignity and despair.
98% of the population for sure. Now tell me the effects on YOU, please, and not an anecdote with no data.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
But she gets her abortion pills . What more can she ask for ?Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Won't know for sure until next year when the employer mandate kicks in. My premiums went up ,and many of my staff is now considering dropping to the lower tier option in our plan. I will suck it up and pay the increase .....but again.... the employer mandate will affect millions more .Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
I read through your anecdote again and saving 276 bucks a month where she struggled to pay her premiums before may take family to explain she did pay the right to free health care.
Took a year for my own mom to realize NOT driving anymore was in her best interest. Don't you agree that your elderly lady in your anecdote benefits from the new law, even if she doesn't realize she EARNED her benefits?
Her family should help her see that because it's NOT a handout in the first place.It's a benefit she EARNED from her years of being a responsible person! Bet she puts that $276 a month she save to good use.
Don't you agree?
Medicaid is sh*t care .Before she had a choice .. Now the emperor deems she must go on state managed care .... Won't be long before someone tells her take the red pill instead of the operation.
I'm not the one making claims of 80% and like you, 98% being "unaffected" The onus is entirely on you to back that up with data and not statistics pulled out of your backside. And yes, my plan has had to change, my wife's has changed and increased in price but I have yet to see the details on mine.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
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