I'm not the left. What makes you think that I am?Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
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I'm not the left. What makes you think that I am?Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Private schools like private business are for profit, and is a solution that misses the root problem of failing schools in filing communities. Privatizing and closing public schools is profitable, and shifts money from communities to corporations and allows for changes in curriculum that push some misguided stuff that religions push.
The very thing that the right says the left is doing. No body has answered the question of what happens when the private seats are filled? Or those parents that cannot take kids to those private schools or pick them up when there is no free bus.
To bad for them huh? Louisiana is a good example of the problems in private companies sucking money from taxpayers for profit, and the kids are commodities. So its not really affirmative action, but a broken business model.
Who says you cut off busing ? Geeze ,the parents need to get something from their school tax money . They certainly isn't getting their kids educated with the money.
Neither are the private schools since it's a wash on who does a better job. I suspect it depends more on the parents than who builds and maintains the buildings. You talk of choices. Most of those choices are made by parents looking for a good neighborhood with good schools nearby. As the middle class shrinks, so do the middle class communities.
You still have the same problem, poor communities. Free bus or not. Its cost shifting, and leaves more people who cannot avail themselves of good schools are left behind to fend for themselves.
The trend is that those bussed students really do no better than when they weren't bussed and still go back to that same poor underfunded community. The trend is also on what does this experiment gains besides money in the private sector when religion and science is indistinguishable from each other as indeed as in Louisiana its shown through test result data that's what's acceptable in school tests, falls short of acceptable in a broader academic view.
That may be great for the south, but a student that moves somewhere else quickly learns that rigid thinking limits his/her options and opportunities for advancement just because they are not well prepared to compete on a higher level, with more competition, than they have been taught.
I wasn't referring to you. How's that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuttyd
First you complain about religious schools being included in the voucher program then you complain that private schools are in it for a profit. Uh, no. But even so, if they were in it for profit the way to make a profit is to furnish a quality product - but then I know how you lefties hate competition so I understand. And that is why public schools hate vouchers, they lose money for those students that jump their sinking ship.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
You are right I have issues with both that are in my view self serving unto themselves. It not a left or right thing that you apply to everything though, its and equal and fairness thing to me.
I would gladly zero the corporate taxes if they sponsored education, from pre K through college, and afforded everyone an opportunity to be trained and educated, and employed gainfully to contribute to the welfare of the whole and not the few.
Then you wouldn't need all those government safety net programs to service a growing number of poor people and disadvantaged.
Corporate sponsorship of public schools already happens... and the lefties pan that too.
You're all for corporate sponsorship of public schools?Quote:
and the lefties pan that too.
Certainly... what's the down side ?
So you're also OK the corporate sponsorship of your politicians?
Not the same thing.. it works out good for the schools and the corporations.. schools get computers... Apple gets future clientele . Schools get additional funding ,corporations get an educated work force .
Oh but it is very similar. This is why you guys are in the bind you are.Quote:
not the same thing .
Nonsense this is not a donation for writing favorable laws . This is an investment in the future .The only quid pro quo I see from the deal is that occasionally the corporation gets naming rights .
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Its exactly the same thing except the cost of doing business by buying politicians doesn't cover poverty and the working poor. They have no money, and no power.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Its no accident, its intentional. It's the second oldest game in history, buying power, and influence and ignoring the great unwashed masses.
Yeah like Apple giving away all those computers to schools.. your contempt clouds your mind.
The exception to the rule, but he also puts half his wealth into charities through foundations he runs and directs, and benefits financially from, and has encouraged others to do the same with their wealth.
Its called philanthropy and its rather profitable at tax time.
Wait a minute, you think it's just out of the goodness of their hearts?Quote:
like Apple giving away all those computers to schools
I can't speak for tom but probably not entirely, I believe he said something about getting future customers. But why does it matter if everyone benefits?Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
As opposed to the left that loves to be benevolent and philanthropic with other people's money .
Opm... hmmmmm!
What does that have to do with the discussion?Quote:
as opposed to the left that loves to be benevolent and philanthropic with other people's money
It was a direct answer to your question.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
So have we come to agreement that corporations can get their taxes zeroed if the finance the entire education system?
Corporations should not be taxed as it means that they pass on the price to the consumers. Economists recognize that the distribution of the burden of such taxation falls ultimately on individuals and not on corporations.
Besides they aren't people right ? How can they pay taxes if they are not people ?
That's not what SCOTUS said, and you know it. And they can be taxed, and you know that too, so keep it real.
Geez why are you balking at a solution that benefits all of us?
There is enough incentive for government and business to reach out and come to an agreement . As you see ;the opposition to this does not come from conservatives.
No such plan is before the congress, if you know of one that us liberals oppose link it please.
It is not a Federal issue. States and local governments should be making their deals with businesses because the Federal government has no constitutional mandate to get involved in education. Indeed ;where these deals are in process ,it was local goverments that made their independent deals .
I can go with such state experiments, but am seeing glitches to be solved as I pointed out in Louisiana and funding battles with their own state courts. So far not many have reached out to corporate financing, and are just shifting money from state budgets.
Again if you know different please provide some links.
Here's a few that only scratch the surface of the potential
How Corporations Are Helping To Solve The Education Crisis | Co.Exist | ideas + impact
Corporate-sponsorship program may ease school fund raising
Schools earning big bucks from corporate sponsors | Nashville City Paper
https://www.fairviewhs.org/sites/ban...te-sponsorship
Will Corporate Sponsors Help Save Education? | KPBS.org
https://corporate.target.com/corpora...lity/education
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Exactly. Makes good sense to me.
Brain washing!
Explain. Got links?Quote:
Originally Posted by mr.yet
Remember where Holder's DOJ sued Louisiana over their school voucher program? Well they graciously dropped their suit. Sort of. Now they just want to tie it up in red tape and regulations instead.
That's right, poor black children in Louisiana will have a chance and a choice to get out of a failing school over Holder's dead body!Quote:
BATON ROUGE – In a ruling today regarding a motion to intervene in the suit against the Louisiana Scholarship Program, United States District Court Judge Ivan Lemelle stated the Department of Justice has abandoned its previous request that the Court permanently stop the scholarship program. Governor Jindal said that the Department of Justice abandoning its attempt to halt the scholarship program is a victory, but he warned that the Department of Justice's new strategy could "red tape and regulate the program to death."
Governor Jindal said, “We are pleased that the Obama Administration has given up its attempt to end the Louisiana Scholarship Program with this absurd lawsuit. It is great the Department of Justice has realized, at least for the time being, it has no authority to end equal opportunity of education for Louisiana children.
“However, we will continue to fight, at every step, the Department of Justice’s new Washington strategy to red tape and regulate the program to death.
“The Department of Justice’s new position is that it wants bureaucrats in Washington to have the authority to decide where Louisiana children get an education.
“The centerpiece of the Department of Justice's 'process' is a requirement that the state may not tell parents, for 45 days, that their child has been awarded a scholarship while the department decides whether to object to the scholarship award. The obvious purpose of this gag order would be to prevent parents from learning that the Department of Justice might try to take their child’s scholarship away if it decides that the child is the wrong race.
“The updated Department of Justice request reeks of federal government intrusion that would put a tremendous burden on the state, along with parents and teachers who want to participate in school choice.”
Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Are you sure that doesn't work the other way around
I know what I said.Quote:
Originally Posted by paraclete
Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Yes I saw your emphasis, but it may just as easily mean they wanted to make sure that white students didn't receive a greater number of scholarships than their numbers warranted
The Louisiana system was designed to benefit minority students. So of course the Obots oppose it . Why?. because the teacher's unions don't like it.
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